Me: Hey! Them: All right. Good morning. Me: Give me one second. I’m just going to change my speaker. Can you hear me now? Them: Yep. Me: Yep. Hey. Great to meet you. Happy Friday. Them: Nice to meet you as well. Yeah. So this is in the world. Me: I’m in Austin. Them: Nice. Me: It’s kind of like tropical weather here. I feel like this right now. It’s like very weird. It’s like raining every day. Them: Yeah, we’re, like, in a rainy cycle. Me: Yeah. Them: Well, I have Drake with me as well. I don’t know. The camera is, like, really on our team. And then we have our really sad case down here. Our dog got neutered yesterday, and so in his cone. Just sitting there, like, miserably. Me: Is he facing like the wall? Them: Under the desk. Hey, dude. He’s, like, literally the most dejected thing in the world right now. Me: Oh no. Oh. Gosh. Them: Yeah. So we have the pool team here. We got all of us. Me: It’s great to meet you. Thanks Clarence for setting us up. I feel like I’ve heard a lot about what you guys are trying to do. Hopefully there’s a few ways where I can be helpful. This week has been pretty interesting. We gave. An AI services conference here in town on Monday and we sort of took an opportunity sort of present on a lot of stuff that I’m working on. And I’ve just never seen this much reception after one of our talks. Then we saw it on Monday. Like it’s just been incredibly overwhelming, which is good. Them: Wow. Me: I haven’t slept all week, but it’s been really, really positive. I think. I don’t know, I think Clarence could probably tell you we’re pretty practical in our use of AI. We’re also, we’re big on dog fooding in our own business. In fact, the only reason we’re in the AI business is because we found that our data consultancy that we originally started was starting to run pretty smoothly. And we found that a lot of the ways of working and the things that we tried were working and then we decided to sort of. Get into marketing that as a service over the last two years. Them: Yeah. I’m. I’m really excited for you to meet Doak because Doak has a very unique vision as well on how he wants to weave skills into, like, the end to end life cycle and processes of his companies. And so that’s one project. And then he’s got. He’s got dreams, he’s got aspirations to figure out how we can transfer that, you know, process type life cycle into other industries. And. And find a foot in the door by creating things there. So, like, Doak, I kind of want you to share, you know, your vision with Uttam and see where we can plug in and help you and accelerate that, right, and help you get to the market. Perfect. I think. You know, kind of all the different things eating in the buffet of opportunity. I think let’s scope this conversation just on lenny. Okay. If that. If you’re okay with that, because that’s our quickest way to, like, I need something for to, like, start selling, like, as soon as possible and start getting some momentum. And that the other side of it is a lot longer term kind of project. But I need something quick. Sure. Sounds good. Okay, so we have been. So one of the lines of business that we have, we provide insurance products to community banks in the state of Texas. And our insurance product is like 50 years old and sucks. And so it’s a good product, but, like, it’s not a product like nobody cares about it. Like zero Bankers care about it. It’s. It’s outlived its life cycle, but it’s still a good product, but it just. It’s out. So. And we’ve never found, like, a new horse, really, to, like, champion in these Banks so that business has been stagnant and declining as banks, like, merge and whatever. Right. So it’s just. It’s not that great. But we have a lot of relationships there and there’s potential for a lot to do. So we started on a journey to kind of see, like, what would be something we could help and, like, get involved to do. And so we have this product that we’ve come up with called lenny. And what we’re trying to do is we were trying to figure out how to build this as absolutely cheaply and kind of simply as possible and get it where the banks are using it, where we can start marketing it. And then the long-term goal is to build a kind of a tool that the banks can use to streamline their process with AI. Right. So the banks have their systems. Their systems are, like, behemoths that they’re kind of enslaved to. And so figure out a way to, like, focus on that. So. But our gateway product into the banks would be lenie. And then once we’re in there, we would like, oh, by the way, we have this AI tool, and then we can, you know, because that’s just a more complex sale, in my opinion. So. So that’s kind of the step process that we’re looking to do. So I’m not sure if Clarence has shared much with you about linny. Me: Sure. Them: But. I can show you what we’re working with here. Me: Cool. Yeah, we’re seeing this. Them: Okay, cool. All right. So the premise is that if I go to a bank’s branch, when I walk in the door, they have, like, a really friendly receptionist. They put me with a loan officer. I had this great conversation. I get all my questions answered, and then I’m like, okay, cool. Let’s move forward with applying for a loan. Right. Well, like, on their website, that experience does not happen. So their website currently is basically a billboard. And then if you click on apply for a loan. It pops up a PDF or it basically says. Me: Very familiar. I went to frost like last year here in Texas. And yeah, it’s ridiculous because guess what? They’re losing they’re going to lose business because I went to chase and I just did it all very familiar. Yeah. Them: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So they have no, they have no. Me: And the terms are worse with chase. The relationship was worse with like the product is actually worse. But they just didn’t make it easy and I have like zero time to talk to bakers and sit in an office. Them: Yeah. No, I mean, that’s exactly it. And that’s the reality. And that. And that is the actual truth, is that the best products are with these community banks and with, like, a frostbank, but you’ve got your chases with massive I.T. departments. You have sofas of the world. Like, you actually have that you’re paying more interest, you’re paying everything, but you’re. But it’s ease of use. So lenie is what we see is, like, the step between the website and an application. So on the bank’s website, so picture this is like banks current shitty website. Me: Great. Them: And we have a couple different, like paths into lenie. One of them is through a loan calculator. Right. So that would be like if this is dating, this would be like your first date would be your loan calculator. So you could come in here and kind of get an idea of, like, can I even afford the loan that I’m looking to do? Me: Yeah. Great. Them: And then once you get, like, your next step is lead you into the borrower portal. Right. So this is the, this, in my opinion, is the heart of it. So I’m kind of torn on a loan calculator. I kind of want to. Like, we actually built the loan calculator into the portal so that when you click on anything from the website, it brings you immediately into this dashboard. And this dashboard is where you can see, like, okay, I’m going to live in this one easy spot to now go through my loan process. Me: Yeah I think that it’s a great like you know and what you’ll find in B2B and so our background at Brainforge we do a lot of work in e-commerce, CPG as well as a lot in like traditional service. Them: And. Me: B2B marketing and B2B products just like clone whatever’s working in consumer. Like everything you just see they just take the same tactics. Which is like you have to have like a little bit of a hook like whether it’s a quiz or a calculator I think like making that as forward as possible because ultimately it’s sort of like progressive when you like go all the way to get a quote. You know it’s a very similar tactic to that. Them: Yes, yes. Yeah, I know for sure. And so from our perspective, like the banks that we’re dealing with, if you look at their loan portfolios, the majority of their loans are real estate, not mortgage, but, like, real estate where they, they portfolio the loan, they don’t sell it off into the, you know, Fannie freddies of the world. Right. So real estate and then commercial agriculture. So those loan types are. They, some banks are more progressive with their, like, personal loans and auto loans. They have a better system. But those loan types, which is their bread and butter, most of them are over 90 of their loan types. Are literally like. And so that’s what we’re trying to do. And so the way we built this, obviously, is that you have direct messaging. It’s not live chat. It’s direct messaging like facebook direct messaging. And then you have an application. So the perfect world, you can start your application. Within the, you know, your, like at 10 o’clock night. You have your loan calculator that you can, like, play with. And then we built it to where if the bank doesn’t want to use our applications, so they have, like, their own custom applications on this one, this would be like a credit card. You know, they come in from the credit card page, the website into line. They come in here, they can ask their questions, but then the application is a button that opens up their actual credit card application that’s already connected to their system. Me: Great. Them: So, you know, the banks have, I would say eight to, like, 10 products. Like, they consider a loan type of product. So it’s not like there’s a hundred products. Like the bank has a manageable number of products to do this. And then on the bank admin, we built this kind of backend component where they could add a new, like they can add credit card, they can put in their own legal disclosure and then they can put in the link for where they want it to go so that they can be doing all this on their own and, like, we don’t, we don’t have to, like, babysit them. Me: Sure. Them: And then these, these are connected to the loan calculator. So if you look here at the loan calculator, it has personal auto mortgage commercial. And those are fixed paths. Over here in the, you know, like, we don’t. Me: Like so I think the analytics section you know that’s sort of a lot of my bias. I’m interested in because this is going to be stuff that you know what you’ll find I’m betting on their internal products is they have no analytics on funnel drop off like where people are clicking. Yeah. So ultimately like that is. Them: Zero. Me: Where you know if you think about it because so I built sort of like customer facing analytics most of my career. One of the things when you when it comes to enterprise like operational products you have two users right you have the people that are like configuring this and like using it to actually drive sales. And then you have like the administration who just wants to see the performance. Typically neither party I feel like at community banks have have a solution. They have like their internal IT or they buy something off the shelf. Right. So this kind of solves like the administration piece but the analytics is going to be the hook for like management. To be like okay we can actually see the funnel, we see where what products are sort of like getting more traction all the way from like views to clicks to applications to like successes. And I doubt that they have that and they probably just have the last which is like how much money came in the door right like. Them: Yeah. Yeah. How many loans? Yeah, they have no concept of, like, with their drop off is, right? I mean, they, they know, like, what they’ve learned. I mean, we, we sat in a meeting with a bank that has, like, eight, seven or eight branches, which is, you know, for, like, Texas community bank. And so it’s a good, like a, you know, upper small community bank, I guess, but it’s a good bang. Me: Yeah. Them: And they brought in their marketing person and their marketing lady was like, you know, we got two commercial loans through the website last week, and the guy’s like, really? He’s like, how did that happen? And they, they literally just found their contact form. And they, like, submitted, like, I want commercial loan click, like, through their form. Me: Yeah. Them: And, I mean, they just have no idea, like zero. Me: Yeah. Them: How much drop off. Me: And how are you. Them: And so. Me: Thinking about like training, onboarding and yeah I mean I’d be kind of interested in like. The rollout or like what is the yeah like what is the timeline and like what is an intended rollout that you’re thinking about. Them: What? Well, in the perfect world, we target banks that have what we would consider centralized lending. Right. So a lot of banks have, they have their loan officer team actually in a branch, and then they have centralized lending, which. So if they do consumer loans, whatever it is, like, that doesn’t happen to the branch level. It happens just in the big office tower they have. The world, we target banks like that, and they are going to assume because they, like, have no idea that this is going to be, like, personal loans and we start funneling in commercial loans into there, and then they have to like, oh, wow, we need to come up. Yeah. Like, we’re going to force them into understanding that, like, oh, there’s a lot more here. Me: Yeah. Them: Than we were expecting. So. And those teams are already in place and already receiving loan applications. You know, they receive them by, like, carrier pigeon. However, they get them right now. They process them. So, like, they’re going to be buying to, like, roll with it. And then. Yeah. And the perfect world, we go in, I mean, because we can see their website. We can, like, go and especially, like, on the onset, we can go and, like, prep their profile. You can basically give them. We can go on their website and see they have personal loans, auto loans. Like, we can see everything. That’s what makes this product so unique, different from previous things where we had to get all the information from the bank. It’s public. So, like, we just go and we see, okay, they got 10 products. We go in and pre create them all and then, like, give them the links and then say on your, each one of those pages, put this link and. And then, you know, be ready to receive your, you know, your, like, respect or your direct messages. So. And my goal would be to. So Clarence showed us railway. And, you know, that side of the house, like, would y’all deal with is, like, not our world rides, like, trying to get our arms around it now, but the perfect world, like, the banks have to have their data segregated. Right. So they need their own, I guess, like sass to orc2 level, like space that they operate in. And so the goal would be to kind of create all the bones and have it, like, ready to go. And we basically just deploy as the bank comes on. They, like, they get the base, like, all the functionality is just like, boom, new bank, boom, new bank, boom, new bank. Me: Yes. I guess like internal in the bank like who is the technical counterpart that we primarily be like interfacing with? Is it is there at MIT is that is it is it like. Yeah, I guess I’m just trying to get a lay of the layout on how much that person may know or how much that person may be capable of. Them: Okay, so a lot of times, like, their website is hosted by. Whoever. Me: Okay. Them: They have, like, a, you know, they’ll have, like, the local guy that hosts making their website. And so in that case, like, really, it’s just whoever their point of contact is telling that website hosting person to, like, put these links on there. And then on the other side of it, like, there’s no technical, like, we don’t actually have it right now where it’s flowing data actually into their computer system. Me: Well that’s actually more my question is like you know we’re used to working in hell and a few industries where like regulation wise it’s pretty heavy so I kind of interested in like the lay of the land in community banks. Them: So. Me: I’m like what the setup is like are they good with us coming in and sort of helping them set up? Because this requires an integration work right and. When I hear every customer is kind of different okay like we will have to do some like we have to sort of go in and understand what the setup is. And then kind of be able to say okay here’s like here’s a plan right like they’re using certain vendors for data certain vendors for hosting. What is the compliance environment and then here’s how here’s like a path towards deployment. Them: Yes, Doc, if I understood you right last time, though, I think, like, the, the speed to Market would be to say, hey, you have to come back into this portal, pick up all the lender information. And then we will, we will figure out, you know, like a different structure if you wanted a direct connection. That’s like another tier of opportunity that we have. Yeah. Because the banks right now, I mean, they’re used, like, they’re on their website giving you a PDF, so they’re used to, like, having to deal with. Me: They’re manually filling it out into some ERP or something. Them: Yes, exactly. So they’re, they’re keying it in. But all those banks have direct connections. Right. Like, we can go and we can, like, make that connection. Me: Okay. Them: We will have to pay. But the best part about it is that there’s, like, five. Like, if you go across all of our banks, there’s like five. Like, it’s. Me: Cool. Okay. Great that’s helpful. Them: Yeah. And, and if a bank has, like, a one-off we just move on. Like, or, like, you just have to, like. Or they can. Me: Yeah, we’ll figure it out but yeah, I just want to know that like there isn’t like. Them: Yeah. Like. Me: A hundred or a thousand. Now. Them: No, no, no, there’s not. And, I mean, that’s, that’s one of the features is that most of our banks are on, like, two, actually. Me: Okay. But I think your your plan of like hey this is the front end honestly what you said which is like if this starts working there’s no other option right and this is so obviously a better process for the end customer. That even if they’re keying it off the back end of this honestly we can make that process probably easier for them to and you know what we’re seeing if you capture the front end you can dictate what the back end looks like. You know and so that’s a great way of going instead of saying like oh we’re going to attack just the processing side if you own the customer it’s like you have way more leverage to be like you have to do it through you have to this stuff has to connect to this because you’re going to be the only person with like clean UI the analytics and the customers you’re going to see that the actual throughput go up. Them: And one of the components that Clarence, like, showed us as we were having the conversation about this. One of the things that the banks struggle with, like, the main barrier that they have to, like, engaging digitally is trying to, like, fraud prevention, trying to validate who people say they are. And so Clarence was showing us, I think, played has, like, a connector that it’s like a dollar per instance, whatever to do, like self, you know, facial recognition and with ideas. Me: Yeah. Yeah. Them: And, like. If that is built in, I, I would almost guarantee you that’s like, that’s the main selling point for them. Me: Okay. Them: Is that now Doak comes in and he’s applying. But in order for him to, like, truly submit his application, he goes, takes a selfie with his deal. And that goes, that’s. Like, that’s the real thing. Like. They care more that they’re talking to the person that thinks that they think they’re talking to. Me: Interesting. Them: And everything else can come, like everything else is they’ll figure out everything else. That’s their main focus is, like, fraud detection and prevention. Me: Okay yeah there’s a lot of solutions for doing that on the front end or doing that like right pre application or post application. Yeah okay. I mean I think my my push is probably your push is like this could really be streamlined through some great AI UX you know and I think I’m sure that’s like where this is going and I mean I think that’s like you’re going to see a lot of consumer and B2B apps start looking more like interacting with a chat interface because or honestly like you’re getting a phone call from an AI like we we I just think there’s a lot of opportunity once you’re able to capture the customer. To basically attack the drop off for example like hey can we finish this application over the phone I gotta run? The AI calls you right or it’s like or or it’s just streamlined where people aren’t clicking UI instead they’re just like sort of typing or talking into an interface those products don’t exist in this market and those are fairly simple interfaces that are actually you’re gonna see very common in consumer that I just think in B2B it’s it’s just not there certainly not. Them: Yeah. Yeah. Me: In lending. Them: And so, I mean, in the perfect world, like you’re saying, I mean, the. There’s so many aspects of it. Soft credit, soft credit pools for different loan types. You know, having the ability for the bank to do that. I mean, a lot of banks don’t like, we’re talking to base. They, they don’t do any soft credit. Like, it is a full application credit pool or nothing because they don’t have. They, like, don’t have a method to do it. Me: Yeah. Them: And so you, you know, that’s another feature. So the goal is that this product is so cheap. But go, we want the product to be 500 a month. Me: Wow. Them: Like, we want it to be so cheap that the banks can’t say no, that we are stacking banks. We turn around. We have 100 banks, and then we start rolling out these additional products that all of a sudden, like, that, like you’re talking about completing it by phone all these different things, but it’s based on, like, a completion success rate. So they’re fine to pay. Like, they’re like, the value prop of a loan is super high. Me: Yeah. Them: So. But, like, they don’t really understand. And, I mean, the banks that we’re talking to, they know this is a problem, right? They know, like, they, this, this is. Me: Sure. Yeah. Competing with JP Morgan like I have friends that work there they have a hundred thousand like engineers or whatever you know it’s like not possible it’s not possible yeah. Cool I yeah I get the vision so I guess like let me know our guys tell me how we can be helpful. Them: It. You got the product ready? Me: I need like five more minutes. Them: Okay. All right, perfect. That’s all we need. That’s really the question is like, how do we get a scope for an MVP so that you can price it so that we can, like, understand that it’s going to have the ability that, like, I do. And, and then also, like your role versus our role for actually deploying it. Right. So, like, if we have a new bank, is that something that we have a super admin that we can go at the new bank and it creates the new Railway, or is that, like, just don’t know that it’s like I’m coming to you? And, you know, each bank, you know, has, like, a whatever their fee is to, like, set up and, you know, y’all are getting a part of that. I mean, you know. Me: Sure. Them: I’m great with all that. I just wanted. Like, the banks that we’ve talked to are like, okay, when’s it ready? Me: Okay. Them: So we’re like, no, no, we need to, we, like, we would have banks on it right now if we had the. Me: Yeah so if if I like looking at this and I’ll kind of give you our traditional process I mean so we we would run this kind of the front end traditionally like how you typically do product building so we’ll just scope like what are the initial features that we’re we’re trying to roll out with and like what is sort of the the timeline to bang as much of that out I think we will parallel path as much as we can so if you get to like an MVP that you can actually start like showing people and then maybe onboard like a design partner like we could start to do that so we would just basically scope as far as as as we want to get to the first product that we feel comfortable doing so on our side that involves not only engineering but then like I know some of these some of these things as we engineer it there may be more opportunities there may be like hiccups and so there’s a lot of like working with you and your team basically on like we kind of work on like weekly sprints basically so to just like bang out features share things that are working and then get it to a state where you can start using it pitching it. Them: Right. Time. Okay. First. Responders. Me: And then ultimately start onboarding the deployment and the onboarding step is is kind of its own product in itself. Like thinking through the user journey of that and making sure that it’s really turnkey for you to go somewhere I mean part of this is like okay let’s see you bring on a new bank what information do we need to know about them? Are they opinionated about where like a frost I’m sure has like someone who’s like we need to deploy this on our like whatever system. Them: Yeah. Me: Some other like some other place maybe like you guys handle it and like or here we’re going to allow you to deploy we’re going to pay for the infrastructure but you can deploy on there. So part of that is going to be more like user specific. But I mean I think hearing the fact that this is like more of the front end is actually you know coming in I was like look compliance environment can be tough or you just don’t know yet but hearing that this is more the front end actually takes a lot of the edge off and instead it’s more like what are the core features that that we need to get out and and how fast? And the last question is like what do you guys as like lenie admin need to see about the entire like platform who’s logging in who’s using it? What are they doing? And you know getting that analytics back as well. So there is a product roadmap that’s that’s pretty clear that we would try to set up and then it’s sort of pricing on like yeah either you know we try to in sort of this new world we’re trying as hard as we can to price so that it’s fair and we can also say like we can try to do it more outcomes based. Right like let’s say if we’re able to hit a timeline on getting a certain set of features out or whether it’s on the number of deployments like I think we’re super open to actually working with with you on that it’s actually what I sort of talked about on Monday at this talk conference is like we’re interested in taking on the risk there because we want to drive towards like a really really big win-win instead of being like hey it’s a huge upfront amount or hey we’re just going to build it but we’re not going to be on the hook for it working. And so I’m totally interested in. Signing something that’s like more that direction for sure. Them: Okay. Me: And then in terms of like our team I mean I’m here in Austin. We have people scattered across like we have several people in LA in New York and then some people in like Europe sort of just scattered but all like Brainforged team members Clarence can attest pretty good people like pretty great engineers I mean I again I think the whole process for me is like I’m also as much as I’m interested in building the first version I’m so so interested in assisting with the AI efficacy of the whole thing you know and like that’s something that while we’re building the first version I think it would be helpful for you to even get like screens to have that because it’s going to make your pitch like there’s not going to be a product that even looks like that even if it is a stream or like kind of a fake demo just to have those ideas with you on hand I think is going to be tremendous and to compete I think this is going to already run laps around what exists. But with the AI embedded in it it’ll be like you’ll be much further. Them: Yes. Yeah. I mean, really, like, the, the concept is that you’re taking the website from a billboard to a digital branch. Me: You know. Them: And that’s how we have to, like, see it. I mean, ultimately, I see where they don’t even have a website. Like, we have the complete front end. Of our digital experience so that it’s. You’re not relying on their shitty web builder that, like, has this crappy website. Like, we’ve streamlined it. We understand, like, existing customers get to the, like, bank login. That’s all they really want to do. And prospects. We need to, like, take them through this journey, right? Like getting them to an application, like the way chase does. But we need to do it at scale because we got 100 banks on it. And so I see this, like, long term being a whole new set that they, like, don’t like. It doesn’t exist. Like, they’re not. They’re not there. It’s not even close to there, but that’s where I want it to be. Me: Yeah I mean you’re seeing this to give you a corollary like you’re seeing a lot of this in other services traditional services businesses whether it’s HVAC whether it’s tree trimming whether it’s pest control you’re seeing these types of like vertical specific more operations or marketing focused software tools coming out. Previously all those people could go to is like go to like a sales force or like a WordPress now people are able to actually deliver something that just that market needs like this is a product that only works in community banks right and that wasn’t possible that just wasn’t on the market before like we we have we work with like a large pest control company here and some of their software vendors aren’t that good but they’re like just for pest control. And if they’re like yeah these guys are the leaders in pest control booking software. Three people in that industry like who’s you know and so and the product isn’t that it isn’t good at all but they just like had this like vertical specific and so they won the business from like a traditional net suite or something. And like it’s really easy to displace and I feel like there’s a lot of parallels here and in fact yeah my experience at the community banks like I’ve seen it’s like totally not even close, you know? But of course like the revenue opportunity is really really large. Them: Yes. Yeah. Because there’s a lot of value in all these products. Me: For value is like incredible. Them: Yeah. And then all of our insurance products. If we’re on the front end, we’re baking all those into the user experience. So you’re basically, like, prepping them to want to add gap to the auto loan. You’re like, you’re controlling how they’re, like, understanding that the product is available. And they’re the revenue on that is immense, too. So, like. Me: Yeah. Them: That’s why this has to literally roll out is, like, absolutely cheap as possible so that we get the validation that, like, so the next banks we go to, we can show them, like, oh, these banks are. This is their rate that they’re getting. Yeah, it’s. Like we just. We got to get 100 banks. That’s our goal. We need 100 banks on this system rolling through it and we get all that data, and then we can just start, like, pushing products onto it. Me: Cool so I mean on our side like I think if I could get even a copy of this would help me just sort of click through this application. I’m happy to sign nda or I can send ours as well and then what I would try to do I mean hearing how fast you guys want to move what we’ll do is I’ll basically put together like okay what do we feel like is a good. When we feel like is a proof of concept that this group can start testing what is an MVP that you can take to like a first customer where you’re like hey we’re just building this can you start onboarding let’s build it with you and then what is like a proper like v1 where you’re like it’s all sort of buttoned up and I can go sell that’s like a pretty good product like development process that way we’re not just testing it internally and then we like miss a customer’s edge case. Of course we’re going to see things as they come but you know that’s that’s just relationship and that’s just making sure that people feel heard and they can submit tickets and things like that so I can work on that and then I think what I’ll do is I’ll just I’ll take a first pass and I can share like from my opinion okay these are the features that believe if you if you roll that with as part of that like MVP it would like. People would be able to drag it out to like the v1 versus it being like a shell I think analytics is like a big part of that I think the applications but for example things like user roles some of the more administrative things people may not be as like let’s just walk through the customer journey, you know the application process and see the data on the outside so we can put that together and then just sort of price like. Youe know what it would take for us to get to those milestones. Them: Doak, I have access to the repo. I just wanted to get you go ahead to. To share that code with you, Tom. Yeah, that’s fine. Okay. So I can. I can get you that piece, but, yeah, Doak. I’ll pass it back to you for the second part. Okay, well, then I guess do you do your evaluation when we’re ready on our end? Like. Keep the conversation going. Like, we were, like, ready. Me: Yeah, so this will be like Monday, Tuesday thing I’ll kind of call our team and sort of get it sort of scoped and then you’ll see like I think the way we try to again we try to be really specific in like what’s getting delivered and what the functionality is but ultimately we we run pretty fast and so that’s my goal here is like how fast can we get you to something that like that this goes from this to something like clickable to something like this group can use something like the first MVP like. And are we like weeks a month, two months away from that right and work backwards like that’s what I’m that’s what I’ll instruct the team. Them: And it is like we have to be able to produce a compliance package that is, like, saying that their data is sought to compliant. Like, it’s non negotiable. Me: Sure. Them: So that’s. Like we need to build that into the model however that gets reviewed, completed, done. Like, that’s has to happen. Me: Great so yeah I mean one thing on that side is that’ll be sort of how we decided on infrastructure and so that that’ll be we just have a couple of options like if we go to someplace where they don’t have any infrastructure how do they do it on a cloud environment that’s completely SOC 2 how are people handling PII? So we do a lot of data governance. And like we work with HIPAA really at clients we have BAs with certain clients so totally fine with that as well. Them: So we. I mean, in the perfect world, I don’t think it’s anything but a cloud solution at this point. Me: But. Okay. Them: Yeah, I don’t like if somebody wants to host it internally and do all that. Me: Okay. Cool. Them: Like, we’re not. We don’t want to get bogged down to do that versus getting five new banks. Like, we need. And what my experience with the banks and, you know, maybe they’re getting more progressive, but. Like, if you show up with a really great compliance package, they check the box and move on. Me: Do you have an exam do you have an example is that like a standard sort of like deliverable this like compliance package or is this something that just like make sure we check all the boxes it’s super super clear how they can verify. Them: We do not actually produce a compliance package, so the insurance carrier that we work with, they have their own compliance package, but they go like they don’t even share it with us. They have, like, an NBA that they sign with the bank and they, like, share it with the bank, administrator. Like, it’s. So the answer is. But what I found is just using copilot, it, like, really understands bank compliance. And so it, like, really helped produce. Kind of the nuts of bullet. Me: We just try to. Hook that insurance person up with like here’s exactly what’s going on here’s how to go verify here’s like all the tool set we’re using things like that. Them: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. If we, like, outline all of that and, you know, data segregation, I mean, this was kind of the conversation with Clarence was, you know, we have to, like, the bank’s data. Like, we can’t just set up one database. Like, each bank and that, like, defining that and being able to, like, show them that and, like, get getting them warm and fuzzy with that is. Me: Yeah. Them: Really important. And so, you know, from, like, an MVP perspective. Like, if we’re taking the application, right? So you’re back over here and, like, you’re on this, this piece where we’re taking the information, social security and everything. Obviously that, like, changes what needs to happen. But if it’s this version where it’s going into their existing system, which in some cases doesn’t exist. A lot of cases. Then, you know, like, if this clicks and this is actually a PDF, which sucks, but, like. You get my point. Like, we have to decide, like, are we going to. Me: We’re gonna be strong handed there not yeah. Yeah. Them: Yeah. And then one of the other kind of things to note is that the bank was really intent on secure document upload. Like, they have a very, they have very. They don’t have good document upload options. So they, like, come by the branch. Me: Okay okay yeah I mean for that I feel like there’s a lot of providers that. Yeah we almost should just like pick one off the shelf and be like this is our this is our typical provider for secure document upload. Them: That’s what my thought is. How much of this stuff can we do that’s off the shelf that already have, like, they have. So in my mind, like, we have the, their compliance package that we have, the compliance package for the facial recognition. And, like, we have ours. Well, that whole thing comes together as one complete compliance, like, package that shows. Okay. How’s the document? Like, how does all this function? Me: Yeah. Them: That’s how I see it going. Me: Okay. Yeah I think I think I have a good overview of sort of what you’re looking for. Them: Okay. Well, then we will be ready to have continue the conversation. And then what you’re going to get here with this version of lenie is like version 95 or whatever from, like, us refining it, you know, and having conversations with banks. This is as close to, like, not done, but this is as close to what we perceive as, like, checks a lot of the boxes. Me: Okay great great. Them: Yeah. And we focused on kind of the first four tabs, the bank admin and super admin kind of left because they, like, get the point across. But we didn’t dive into, like, the functionality of. Me: Yeah I would say on the analytics side like I feel like. Them: That. Me: We’re I will give you I’m not as worried about that as I am like the core application functionality and like the calculator you know those are gonna be the biggest pieces that. Yeah we’re gonna pay attention to. So. Them: Cool. Okay, great. Well. Me: Okay perfect so let’s lay out let me I guess Clarence if anything else I think next week I’ll bring this to team on Monday and then kind of give him a sense and send you back a timeline on you know when we can kind of have a first pass at a scope and you’ll see we’ll kind of break it down in the way that I described you know honestly try to do it by weeks and then kind of go from there. Them: Cool. Any other questions? I mean. Off the cuff. What type of timeline? Like, if we are able to scope it, like, I mean, obviously I’m not going to hold you to it, but, like. Just so we can kind of. There’s a lot of legwork we have to do on our end. What. Me: I mean end to end I feel like this is like less than three months of work it I think it could probably be done faster depending on what the cut of features that we’re gonna push out are like again a couple of things that you said is what’s cutting the timeline for me is like it’s completely cloud hosted okay that that was a big thing at the outset I was like okay we have to do integration to their systems and stuff. Them: S going on? Me: Second thing is like I said looking through all the set of features it’s mainly you know forums it’s mainly like display of information on a back end database and then I really think the the thing that we’re gonna be looking for is the the risks are the external vendors so the bank connections or the like the facial recognition connection secure document upload so those will be like we’ll call those out as risks like these are external things that we have to go identify and figure out. But I mean I feel like. I mean with what you already have here getting you like an actual version that is like clickable and that this team can start to walk through and use. I feel like it’s not it’s not gonna be more than like a month or two. And then more what I’m driving towards is like when can your team actually have something that is like hey this is working why don’t you guys try the demo version? And like we’re actually ready to sign I feel like three months is pretty. Fair. But I will tell you we will run as fast as we possibly can like there’s I we don’t say three months and I’m like cool like let’s not get it done before then like we will we will run as as fast as as possible we use a ton of AI internally on our engineering team to build pretty pretty quickly. But also we most of our team is familiar with all the major cloud all of the. You know all the more sophisticated ways of deployment and things like that so I’m actually not worried about the things you mentioned about the back end and deployment that’s actually like. I feel like fairly easy usually on these types of project is like can we get all the functionality and then once you start using it are there additional asks that you’re like okay this is a little bit different than I envision that’s where the additional like time typically comes from you know when we develop sort of like front end applications. Them: Scope. Grieve. Me: Yeah exactly so that’s like that’s the only thing it’s like I can’t promise faster because I’m like once you after building product for a long time once you show people it it just was like oh like can we have this little thing so that’s gonna be the relationship is like you guys are very practical I feel like most people aren’t as most people we do work. In this in this type of world are like way less opinionated. So it makes it really tough because we have to make decisions and then we become like more the product owners and like I like to support and we have a lot of product wisdom but you guys need to make the decisions on what the thing is you know so that’s helpful that that you’re actually like very forward on that. Them: Perfect. All right, well, then, yeah, I guess I’m. I guess why don’t you go ahead and send over your nda? Look at that. And then obviously you have my contact info and we’ll. Let’s just roll. Me: I’m here in austin too so I’m happy to meet I’m gonna be traveling a little bit next month but happy to. Them: With. Me: You know come come hang out over there or meet wherever. Them: Okay, perfect. I’ve been looking for a reason to have my tesla drive me around. Me: So. Yeah. You can ask Clarence whenever he comes visit we always just sit we sit have a meeting in his car and he just drives us around. Them: That’s so funny. I’ve been looking forward to doing that. I was like, I want to have a meeting in my car and, like, just like a loop and, like, let it just drive while. Me: Yeah just go south congress and like do the river and then go downtown and it’s like and it’s not stressful because you’re not driving it could like figure it out. Them: I’ve been. Yeah, I’m, like, so in on it. I, like, can’t wait. I’m down. Me: Perfect okay well thanks Clarence for setting this up yeah I’ll be in touch then with with nda and more details. Them: Okay. Me: Okay all right thank you. Them: And Doak, I’ll see you on, on Monday and Tuesday. Yes. Yes, yes. We’re just stacking it in here. Yeah, absolutely. All right. Me: Okay thank you bye. Them: Bye.