2026-04-17_brainforge_leads_weekly_retro_166479c3

Meeting Title: Brainforge Leads Weekly Retro Date: 2026-04-17 Meeting participants: Kaela Gallagher, Uttam Kumaran, Girang, Brylle Sean, Carandang, Robert Tseng

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WEBVTT

1 00:00:09.590 ⇒ 00:00:10.830 Uttam Kumaran: Hello.

2 00:00:11.110 ⇒ 00:00:13.170 Kaela Gallagher: Hello, your power’s on!

3 00:00:13.390 ⇒ 00:00:14.100 Uttam Kumaran: Crazy day.

4 00:00:14.100 ⇒ 00:00:15.830 Kaela Gallagher: Finally.

5 00:00:15.830 ⇒ 00:00:20.059 Uttam Kumaran: How brutal. I guess it’s, like, it’s a good reminder that, like.

6 00:00:21.050 ⇒ 00:00:25.809 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t know what… it’s a reminder of something, I’m trying to figure out what is a good reminder of, but

7 00:00:26.000 ⇒ 00:00:33.199 Uttam Kumaran: I, yeah. I, yeah, I just, like, I went to the coffee shop, like.

8 00:00:33.480 ⇒ 00:00:35.899 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, I don’t even have my cord, like, I’m…

9 00:00:36.200 ⇒ 00:00:39.469 Uttam Kumaran: I’m just the best, like, smartest person of all time.

10 00:00:41.500 ⇒ 00:00:43.370 Kaela Gallagher: humbling day.

11 00:00:43.730 ⇒ 00:00:45.810 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, so I called Ray…

12 00:00:46.020 ⇒ 00:00:50.159 Uttam Kumaran: Talked a little bit about this video that I could get some help with, and…

13 00:00:50.920 ⇒ 00:00:56.070 Uttam Kumaran: ranted some notes to the L&D team, and then… Hey, Mom.

14 00:00:56.470 ⇒ 00:00:58.199 Uttam Kumaran: Whatever I could do for my foe.

15 00:00:58.350 ⇒ 00:00:59.470 Uttam Kumaran: Basically.

16 00:01:01.100 ⇒ 00:01:02.930 Kaela Gallagher: Cool.

17 00:01:06.610 ⇒ 00:01:07.610 Kaela Gallagher: Hey, B.

18 00:01:08.090 ⇒ 00:01:08.940 B: Hello?

19 00:01:19.800 ⇒ 00:01:27.750 Uttam Kumaran: I had a good call with Amber, so I… B, I kind of, like, mentioned basically what I was talking to you about, so I think she’s on board,

20 00:01:30.300 ⇒ 00:01:31.410 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, and I…

21 00:01:32.470 ⇒ 00:01:37.890 Uttam Kumaran: I think, basically, I’ll have some updates on, sort of, how I’m thinking about delivery after this week.

22 00:01:38.400 ⇒ 00:01:55.390 Uttam Kumaran: It’s just getting tighter. I think it’s just gonna get really tight for people, like, some people are doing a bang-up job, like, I think Greg’s doing a bang-up job. I think Pranav is kind of getting let down on the technical side, but, like, is really, really trying to… he’s, like, she’s just dealing with whatever he can deal with.

23 00:01:55.540 ⇒ 00:02:04.019 Uttam Kumaran: I think Amber, Advait, Jasmine, are doing really well.

24 00:02:04.470 ⇒ 00:02:12.859 Uttam Kumaran: like, Awash and Demi… Awasht and Demi… Awashia’s doing well, but they both need to, like, become, like, really, like, lead shit.

25 00:02:13.130 ⇒ 00:02:21.140 Uttam Kumaran: But, like, yeah, I don’t… like, Sam is struggling, I think Zoran is… Struggling…

26 00:02:21.810 ⇒ 00:02:24.070 Uttam Kumaran: Ashwini’s kind of struggling.

27 00:02:24.760 ⇒ 00:02:28.269 Uttam Kumaran: So… Just trying to, like.

28 00:02:29.150 ⇒ 00:02:35.399 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, it’s just gonna get hotter for people in here, like, they’re not doing the stuff that we talked about, like, it’s…

29 00:02:36.250 ⇒ 00:02:40.749 Uttam Kumaran: there’s nowhere to go, like, and it’s so clear. I’ve never been in a company where it’s…

30 00:02:41.720 ⇒ 00:02:44.799 Uttam Kumaran: It’s, like, so written down, what to do.

31 00:02:45.030 ⇒ 00:02:48.820 Uttam Kumaran: And how to win. And nobody’s ever come to me and been like.

32 00:02:49.580 ⇒ 00:02:54.060 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, you actually overstepped, you wrote this down, I did that. No one’s ever said that to me.

33 00:02:55.100 ⇒ 00:03:03.960 Uttam Kumaran: Like, no one’s ever been like, oh, you actually, like, were wrong, you… you said this thing over here, and… I mean, it happens, like, here and there, small things, but never, like…

34 00:03:04.530 ⇒ 00:03:11.009 Uttam Kumaran: oh, like, you’re… it’s mostly people are like, oh, I don’t know, I didn’t… I had no idea that these were the expectations. I’m like, yo…

35 00:03:12.160 ⇒ 00:03:17.610 Uttam Kumaran: I’m like, dude, just be a professional, like… Fucking what?

36 00:03:18.620 ⇒ 00:03:20.310 Uttam Kumaran: Close the gap, like…

37 00:03:20.570 ⇒ 00:03:28.630 Uttam Kumaran: And… and it’s also obvious… and this is where, but this is where we’re gonna see, because Greg messaged me, like, I don’t know, like, some people are just not, like, closing the loop.

38 00:03:28.750 ⇒ 00:03:34.599 Uttam Kumaran: Like, Pranav also feels that. And so, the risk for us is, like, we risk saving those folks.

39 00:03:34.890 ⇒ 00:03:38.920 Uttam Kumaran: And risking, like, the motivation of the people at the top, right?

40 00:03:39.320 ⇒ 00:03:42.030 Uttam Kumaran: Thus, I can’t… I can’t let that happen, yeah.

41 00:03:42.530 ⇒ 00:03:45.300 Kaela Gallagher: What was Greg’s concern about specifically?

42 00:03:45.740 ⇒ 00:03:49.700 Uttam Kumaran: No, I mean, he messaged me basically, like, like…

43 00:03:51.150 ⇒ 00:03:55.100 Uttam Kumaran: he’s like, it’s just managing people’s timelines. He’s like…

44 00:03:55.990 ⇒ 00:04:02.030 Uttam Kumaran: just people saying, I’m working on this, and then… Not get… not doing anything.

45 00:04:02.300 ⇒ 00:04:10.310 Uttam Kumaran: And it’s also funny, because people will just say, I’m working on it, instead of, like, it will be done on this date. It is late. I’m super aware it’s late. This is late.

46 00:04:10.450 ⇒ 00:04:11.270 Uttam Kumaran: Like.

47 00:04:12.350 ⇒ 00:04:17.110 Uttam Kumaran: that is something I’m, like, really… like, I just don’t like, because I’m like, just say it’s late, like, what…

48 00:04:18.000 ⇒ 00:04:21.160 Uttam Kumaran: What? Like, you know what kind of crew this is?

49 00:04:21.519 ⇒ 00:04:22.710 Uttam Kumaran: And…

50 00:04:24.630 ⇒ 00:04:31.390 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, and then there’s just, like, some general, like, sloppiness, which is, like, okay, that’s, like, slop on the wrist stuff, like…

51 00:04:31.910 ⇒ 00:04:45.360 Uttam Kumaran: that’s fi- I’m not… I’m less worried about, because ultimately, like, if we’re on time, and then the slide is shitty, okay, whatever. But, like, if we’re off time, and the work is, like, not great, or people are slow, or people aren’t communicating.

52 00:04:45.680 ⇒ 00:05:04.389 Uttam Kumaran: So, but for me as a leader, like, for Greg and for some of these folks, like, I’m putting people on their team that I said are going to deliver for them on time, as long as they get the linear and stuff organized. And the people are not doing that for those people that I said. I take responsibility, because ultimately, like.

53 00:05:05.510 ⇒ 00:05:10.310 Uttam Kumaran: like, that’s… that’s our team. So then I’m like, okay, you’re right. Like.

54 00:05:10.500 ⇒ 00:05:20.809 Uttam Kumaran: You set linear up, you set milestones super, super clearly, you have a roadmap, and they’re handling the account management, the technical team dropped the ball.

55 00:05:21.590 ⇒ 00:05:22.390 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

56 00:05:22.390 ⇒ 00:05:23.110 Kaela Gallagher: So…

57 00:05:23.110 ⇒ 00:05:29.740 Uttam Kumaran: That’s… But you could tell it… some of these issues are… are gravitating around certain people.

58 00:05:30.340 ⇒ 00:05:36.270 Uttam Kumaran: Right. So I don’t… I tend to be really blameless until… There’s no other, really, like…

59 00:05:36.490 ⇒ 00:05:37.620 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah. A word.

60 00:05:37.780 ⇒ 00:05:38.660 Kaela Gallagher: Right?

61 00:05:38.660 ⇒ 00:05:49.690 Uttam Kumaran: these issues… like, some people will… some people will ultimately stay awake all night and get it done. Like, Demi’s one of those people, where he’s not really well organized, but we’ll bang it… we’ll bang it out, right?

62 00:05:49.820 ⇒ 00:06:00.380 Uttam Kumaran: he may say, like, yeah, I’m not a time, blah blah blah, but I just think, like, he’s sort of this… he has, like, a rebellious energy, and is, like, kind of will bank it out, but I also think, like, he has to work within…

63 00:06:00.560 ⇒ 00:06:01.929 Uttam Kumaran: You know, our system.

64 00:06:02.210 ⇒ 00:06:09.129 Uttam Kumaran: I think, like… Sam is just… doesn’t… they’re completely dropping the ball, and it’s like…

65 00:06:09.600 ⇒ 00:06:13.109 Uttam Kumaran: I think he works on stuff, but then he’ll be like, oh, it’s 5PM, I gotta go.

66 00:06:13.490 ⇒ 00:06:17.140 Uttam Kumaran: And then I’m like, dude, you were… like, Pranav is on the hook.

67 00:06:17.530 ⇒ 00:06:20.110 Uttam Kumaran: And we’re not gonna get the renewal.

68 00:06:20.470 ⇒ 00:06:29.710 Uttam Kumaran: Robert’s like, hey, the couple of the AI engagements are not… we’re feeling kind of shaky on. He’s not helping me on any platform, I couldn’t rely on him for anything.

69 00:06:30.230 ⇒ 00:06:32.729 Uttam Kumaran: And then I’m like, okay, it’s starting to, like…

70 00:06:32.930 ⇒ 00:06:37.840 Uttam Kumaran: like, the ball… the magnets are starting to, like, circle around certain people, right? Where I’m like…

71 00:06:38.230 ⇒ 00:06:41.620 Uttam Kumaran: The answer is always something around what you touched.

72 00:06:42.320 ⇒ 00:06:44.369 Uttam Kumaran: So you tell me what you want to do.

73 00:06:44.510 ⇒ 00:06:47.789 Uttam Kumaran: You know, and then the last thing I’ll tell B, I told Bea is, like.

74 00:06:48.520 ⇒ 00:07:01.159 Uttam Kumaran: sometimes I will let things fail on purpose, because it’s a good… it’s a good learning opportunity, and do… I do this very willingly. Like, I see everything that’s going on, and I will be like, this person is gonna get jammed.

75 00:07:01.290 ⇒ 00:07:03.090 Uttam Kumaran: I’m gonna let them get jammed.

76 00:07:03.990 ⇒ 00:07:11.730 Uttam Kumaran: Then there’s some times where I’m like, client is gonna say that we’re not worth it, and I’m not gonna let that happen. So I’m gonna intervene.

77 00:07:12.790 ⇒ 00:07:15.879 Kaela Gallagher: When this person’s getting jammed, is that on the SL?

78 00:07:17.350 ⇒ 00:07:27.449 Uttam Kumaran: No, I mean, everybody gets jammed occasionally, like, some… they miss… they missed the deadline because they said it was going to be easy. The CSO, like, presented on something they didn’t have full awareness on. Those are just, like.

79 00:07:27.450 ⇒ 00:07:28.270 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah. Okay.

80 00:07:28.270 ⇒ 00:07:30.040 Uttam Kumaran: Yo, you just gotta tighten up.

81 00:07:30.560 ⇒ 00:07:32.810 Uttam Kumaran: your own stuff. It’s when, like.

82 00:07:33.790 ⇒ 00:07:40.330 Uttam Kumaran: it’s when it’s almost, like, borderline, like, you’re kind of lying. Like, these things are not getting out.

83 00:07:40.800 ⇒ 00:07:43.690 Uttam Kumaran: The product is not that great.

84 00:07:43.920 ⇒ 00:07:50.049 Uttam Kumaran: And… and then you’re like, I’m busy, I had other priorities, like… What other priorities?

85 00:07:50.430 ⇒ 00:07:54.879 Uttam Kumaran: Don’t talk to me about having other pri- like, I’m not really, like, I don’t really like that.

86 00:07:55.330 ⇒ 00:08:04.860 Uttam Kumaran: I’m like, no, you know, you can’t be like, I have other prior… what? Like, you’re lucky, you only have two priorities. Like, wake up and do the job. Like…

87 00:08:05.010 ⇒ 00:08:06.420 Uttam Kumaran: And so…

88 00:08:06.660 ⇒ 00:08:14.789 Uttam Kumaran: then I’m like, I don’t… then I’m like, okay, I’m gonna intervene, I’m gonna take over. And so now, before, I didn’t think we had as much leverage to do that, I had to really coach people. Now.

89 00:08:14.900 ⇒ 00:08:18.339 Uttam Kumaran: I’m getting faster, I’m able to do work faster.

90 00:08:18.890 ⇒ 00:08:25.799 Uttam Kumaran: I’m finding that, like, B, you’re actually gonna be able to do some of this stuff without very little context. Your work’s gonna just go to other people.

91 00:08:26.180 ⇒ 00:08:30.190 Uttam Kumaran: Right? And then you’re gonna move out. And then I think if you want the shot.

92 00:08:30.420 ⇒ 00:08:34.559 Uttam Kumaran: You can show that you’re able to do it, Right? But…

93 00:08:35.520 ⇒ 00:08:40.759 Uttam Kumaran: like, otherwise, I don’t know, I just… I’m trying to be better at, like, tightening up for our team, you know?

94 00:08:42.590 ⇒ 00:08:43.419 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah.

95 00:08:43.750 ⇒ 00:08:44.520 Kaela Gallagher: Okay.

96 00:08:48.480 ⇒ 00:08:56.999 Uttam Kumaran: But, like, see, for example, Gary gets a pass. Gary, it’s his first 30 days. I’m not gonna not put pressure. Same with Jasmine. I’m not gonna message him, be like.

97 00:08:57.250 ⇒ 00:08:59.380 Uttam Kumaran: you missed this? I’m not gonna not do that.

98 00:08:59.840 ⇒ 00:09:02.550 Uttam Kumaran: But I’m also gonna be like, Do you have time?

99 00:09:02.550 ⇒ 00:09:04.919 Kaela Gallagher: You’re not gonna knot, so you are…

100 00:09:04.920 ⇒ 00:09:06.000 Uttam Kumaran: I am gonna do that.

101 00:09:06.000 ⇒ 00:09:06.910 Kaela Gallagher: I…

102 00:09:06.910 ⇒ 00:09:08.020 Uttam Kumaran: I… meaning…

103 00:09:08.140 ⇒ 00:09:15.080 Uttam Kumaran: Meaning, for some people… so, yes, I am gonna message and be like, yo, you completely missed this, I know it’s your second week.

104 00:09:15.840 ⇒ 00:09:19.540 Uttam Kumaran: But what? This is, like, we’re… this is a serious group. You missed it.

105 00:09:19.670 ⇒ 00:09:23.569 Uttam Kumaran: So, this is how it should feel. You should feel like, oh, damn.

106 00:09:24.100 ⇒ 00:09:28.519 Uttam Kumaran: There’s accountability, and there’s, like, a real open communication culture here.

107 00:09:28.680 ⇒ 00:09:30.989 Uttam Kumaran: This is not like, oh, it’s your third week.

108 00:09:31.330 ⇒ 00:09:34.400 Uttam Kumaran: like, you’re off the hook. It’s like, no, it’s your third week.

109 00:09:34.530 ⇒ 00:09:36.980 Uttam Kumaran: This is… so next time, just do it right.

110 00:09:37.220 ⇒ 00:09:43.550 Uttam Kumaran: So that’s why, for Gary, for Jasmine, I’m like, they’re ramping up. I’m actually… that’s why I’m really happy we wrote that down, because it’s super clear in that doc.

111 00:09:43.930 ⇒ 00:09:44.490 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah.

112 00:09:44.490 ⇒ 00:09:51.109 Uttam Kumaran: That’s actually great. It’s super clear. In fact, the only thing that’s not clear is the Eden thing, but ultimately, it’s actually really well laid out.

113 00:09:51.490 ⇒ 00:09:58.830 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah, I’m excited about that, because it’s like, if you are accomplishing what’s in this document, you are

114 00:09:59.170 ⇒ 00:10:01.060 Kaela Gallagher: Almost guaranteed to be doing well.

115 00:10:01.060 ⇒ 00:10:01.889 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, and that’s why.

116 00:10:01.890 ⇒ 00:10:02.690 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah, exactly.

117 00:10:02.690 ⇒ 00:10:05.309 Uttam Kumaran: Exactly. If someone’s like, hey, I actually did all this stuff in the dock.

118 00:10:05.440 ⇒ 00:10:06.940 Uttam Kumaran: I’d be like, oh, my bad.

119 00:10:07.180 ⇒ 00:10:10.989 Uttam Kumaran: That’s what I’m telling you, it’s never happened in my life, it’s never happened.

120 00:10:12.030 ⇒ 00:10:12.889 Kaela Gallagher: I don’t know.

121 00:10:12.890 ⇒ 00:10:26.699 Uttam Kumaran: You know? And there’s… the doc goes out the door if things are going well. It’s like, not like… it’s… I feel like maybe we should, but it’s not often we call people, we’re like, you literally did everything, here’s a star. I’m usually like, yo, you’re great, here’s more, like, stuff, let’s go. Right.

122 00:10:26.700 ⇒ 00:10:27.860 Kaela Gallagher: Here’s what’s next.

123 00:10:27.860 ⇒ 00:10:31.920 Uttam Kumaran: two weeks, I easily identify people that crush it around here and pull them up.

124 00:10:32.220 ⇒ 00:10:36.260 Uttam Kumaran: It’s the other stuff that’s, like, where we have to have all these checks, and so…

125 00:10:37.490 ⇒ 00:10:41.110 Uttam Kumaran: But, like, yeah, and so that’s why I think… but for Sam, for example, I’m like.

126 00:10:41.340 ⇒ 00:10:47.709 Uttam Kumaran: I’ve tried for 4 months for him to sort of ramp and care about this new leadership role, and

127 00:10:48.060 ⇒ 00:11:00.639 Uttam Kumaran: even if he’s trying or not, it’s… he’s not doing it, so I don’t have an impatience anymore, because the AI stuff is our premier service. It’s what’s gonna allow us to charge hundreds of thousands of dollars a month.

128 00:11:00.930 ⇒ 00:11:01.640 Uttam Kumaran: For this work.

129 00:11:01.640 ⇒ 00:11:03.130 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah. And…

130 00:11:03.130 ⇒ 00:11:05.170 Uttam Kumaran: He’s completely dropping the ball.

131 00:11:05.430 ⇒ 00:11:09.979 Uttam Kumaran: And I got… I don’t… I don’t… it doesn’t make any sense.

132 00:11:10.350 ⇒ 00:11:11.959 Uttam Kumaran: How it’s possible.

133 00:11:12.360 ⇒ 00:11:20.600 Uttam Kumaran: like, yeah, I just don’t understand how it’s… how this has gone this far, and I think B, seeing your message, I don’t understand

134 00:11:20.800 ⇒ 00:11:33.409 Uttam Kumaran: ultimately where the miscommunication is, you know, because I have done nothing but communicate what the expectations are, what I ask is for them, I’ve… I’ve put this structure so there are other people for you to ask.

135 00:11:33.540 ⇒ 00:11:37.500 Uttam Kumaran: And if you just don’t have a sense that this client is on fire, and you’re in the house.

136 00:11:37.860 ⇒ 00:11:40.800 Uttam Kumaran: Like, yo, like, what can I do, you know?

137 00:11:42.450 ⇒ 00:11:46.339 Kaela Gallagher: B, how do you feel about the SAM situation?

138 00:11:46.840 ⇒ 00:11:59.319 B: Yeah, well, the main point of me calling him is just to make sure that we… I get his side of the story, and one thing that I was… one thing that I did not appreciate during our call is that

139 00:11:59.540 ⇒ 00:12:18.819 B: he turned out to be a little too defensive, and that’s why his answers were like that with him. I specifically called out that one of the main problems that we have is that there’s really no communication that’s happening. Like, if something’s getting jammed, we don’t know about it unless Bernav calls it out.

140 00:12:19.040 ⇒ 00:12:24.899 B: And… His main reason is that it was expected because of async communication.

141 00:12:25.390 ⇒ 00:12:28.510 B: And he didn’t know that things were getting jammed.

142 00:12:28.710 ⇒ 00:12:29.820 B: And it was like…

143 00:12:30.680 ⇒ 00:12:39.790 B: you were the SL, and Pranav shouldn’t be the one, like, calling this out, and the call-out should come from you if things are getting jammed.

144 00:12:40.230 ⇒ 00:12:40.680 Kaela Gallagher: So…

145 00:12:40.900 ⇒ 00:12:44.199 B: That was the main point, that was actually breaking the trust.

146 00:12:44.200 ⇒ 00:12:46.299 Uttam Kumaran: I see… that’s an IC mindset, dude.

147 00:12:46.680 ⇒ 00:12:48.150 B: Yeah, exactly.

148 00:12:48.510 ⇒ 00:12:52.239 Uttam Kumaran: for you to be like, oh, I wasn’t told things are going wrong, it’s like…

149 00:12:52.690 ⇒ 00:12:54.520 Kaela Gallagher: That’s not high-level ownership.

150 00:12:54.880 ⇒ 00:12:57.630 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, it’s like, dude, don’t… Yeah.

151 00:12:58.100 ⇒ 00:12:58.490 Kaela Gallagher: Hmm.

152 00:12:58.890 ⇒ 00:12:59.450 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.

153 00:12:59.660 ⇒ 00:13:05.379 Kaela Gallagher: Okay. Well, yeah, it seems like that point has been, like, communicated to him multiple times.

154 00:13:05.570 ⇒ 00:13:11.950 Kaela Gallagher: times. And I know I sent over, like, the GROW framework and everything like that, so…

155 00:13:12.150 ⇒ 00:13:14.750 Kaela Gallagher: I’m sure we can check in with him again next week.

156 00:13:16.640 ⇒ 00:13:22.560 B: Yeah, actually, we do have, like, a scheduled call with him. Do you want Ella to be there with him?

157 00:13:23.670 ⇒ 00:13:26.039 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I would like to be there on Monday, for sure.

158 00:13:26.550 ⇒ 00:13:27.200 B: Okay.

159 00:13:27.330 ⇒ 00:13:28.960 B: Gotcha.

160 00:13:28.960 ⇒ 00:13:34.200 Uttam Kumaran: I think that… like… Knowing him, Again.

161 00:13:34.240 ⇒ 00:13:51.739 Uttam Kumaran: Sam is a very patient person, but I think… I don’t think… I don’t know if he has the personality to be this type of leader we need at this company. Because, yes, as a technical leader, sure, there’s a lot of software companies where I think his skill set in terms of communication would pass. Here is… you have to be so forward, and we have to…

162 00:13:51.780 ⇒ 00:13:58.930 Uttam Kumaran: put out fires for clients all the time. And if you don’t have an ability to, like, Lead…

163 00:13:59.050 ⇒ 00:14:02.140 Uttam Kumaran: Casey and Mustafa, and be a great technical partner.

164 00:14:02.320 ⇒ 00:14:03.860 Uttam Kumaran: to Pranav.

165 00:14:03.970 ⇒ 00:14:15.050 Uttam Kumaran: and lead what is going to be a really high-stakes service, because this is something that I know really, really well, and it’s something that we… it’s, like, why our company is different.

166 00:14:15.330 ⇒ 00:14:19.070 Uttam Kumaran: can’t sign up for this job. Maybe I should just say that super clearly.

167 00:14:19.580 ⇒ 00:14:22.859 Uttam Kumaran: But ultimately, at this point, I’m just gonna do this.

168 00:14:23.120 ⇒ 00:14:28.249 Uttam Kumaran: And then, in a month, or whenever, you and him can come to me and be like.

169 00:14:28.540 ⇒ 00:14:32.690 Uttam Kumaran: Hey, here’s, like, I feel like I’m now ready to do this.

170 00:14:33.210 ⇒ 00:14:37.370 Uttam Kumaran: Or he can shadow me, or whatever, but, like, I’m gonna step in.

171 00:14:37.470 ⇒ 00:14:42.339 Uttam Kumaran: And do it, because I can’t let this fail, this will take, like, a big chunk of our company.

172 00:14:42.560 ⇒ 00:14:49.759 Uttam Kumaran: And so, it’s, like, not a debate. That’s not a debate for me on Monday, whether I’m gonna be in the seat.

173 00:14:49.870 ⇒ 00:14:55.700 Uttam Kumaran: the debate over the next some period of time, through, like, hopefully the grow plan, is, like.

174 00:14:55.890 ⇒ 00:15:03.850 Uttam Kumaran: can he come back to that, right? But coming back to that, I just… it’s not gonna… for me, my bar is actually gonna be higher to get back in.

175 00:15:04.240 ⇒ 00:15:13.669 Uttam Kumaran: You know, it’s one thing to be part of the kind of crew, and be picked by me, and been like, you’re in the delivery leads, but to… to kind of mess it up.

176 00:15:13.860 ⇒ 00:15:16.279 Uttam Kumaran: And then come back, you can’t just hit the floor.

177 00:15:16.440 ⇒ 00:15:31.909 Uttam Kumaran: Like, I’m gonna need to see him do allocations, to do all of the technical roadmaps, to come in and do the defect measurement, to have linear setup. Like, you have to hit… you have to hit that excellent bar to get back in the door.

178 00:15:32.130 ⇒ 00:15:37.719 Uttam Kumaran: Right? Because right now, I’m finding people that are not able to hit the floor, and I’m gonna get them out.

179 00:15:38.170 ⇒ 00:15:41.950 Uttam Kumaran: Right? And I’m making sure that I’m doing my best to get people to hit the floor.

180 00:15:42.910 ⇒ 00:15:49.760 Uttam Kumaran: But if you’re out, and you’re coming back in, I’m gonna give any IC a fair chance at coming into the party.

181 00:15:49.920 ⇒ 00:15:55.420 Uttam Kumaran: Right? But what that’s gonna look like is, like, you have a path to hitting excellent, you’re close to doing that.

182 00:15:55.680 ⇒ 00:15:58.189 Uttam Kumaran: Right? And so that’s what I…

183 00:15:59.730 ⇒ 00:16:01.589 Uttam Kumaran: That’s what I want to see, you know?

184 00:16:01.970 ⇒ 00:16:02.580 Kaela Gallagher: Yep.

185 00:16:02.580 ⇒ 00:16:09.950 Uttam Kumaran: Like, it’s not… it’s not about some people’s interest in doing it, it’s… everybody should be interested. There’s no, like, how do you get… there’s the only way to get promoted here. Duh.

186 00:16:10.150 ⇒ 00:16:19.510 Uttam Kumaran: You know? Or don’t. Or don’t. Or just say, like, I’m good with being IC. There are people at the company who are like that. They’re like, I’m good, this is a cushy job, I’m just doing my job, fine.

187 00:16:20.740 ⇒ 00:16:21.720 Uttam Kumaran: That’s fine.

188 00:16:21.940 ⇒ 00:16:24.389 Uttam Kumaran: Also… You know?

189 00:16:25.690 ⇒ 00:16:26.230 B: Yeah.

190 00:16:27.080 ⇒ 00:16:34.099 Uttam Kumaran: It’s also, like, what I… I don’t think people understand that there’s, like, there’s, like, $30,000,$40,000, $50,000 on the line.

191 00:16:34.870 ⇒ 00:16:38.870 Uttam Kumaran: And what do I want me to tell them? Hey, if this goes south, I’m gonna fire this whole team.

192 00:16:39.960 ⇒ 00:16:58.929 Uttam Kumaran: nobody… you can’t… I can’t… that’s not something I’m interested in saying. I’m not interested in anybody leaving. I’m not interested in anybody… I’m not… I’m interested in our clients winning. And so, if… if you’re not… if it’s not, like, clicking, that, like, that’s what we’re talking about, I can even say that. I’ll be like, yo, there’s literally, like, hundreds of thousands of dollars in contract value.

193 00:16:59.210 ⇒ 00:17:03.910 Uttam Kumaran: on the line, because you didn’t wake up and do the things that I wrote down, I don’t know.

194 00:17:04.210 ⇒ 00:17:09.059 Uttam Kumaran: So… It’s just, like, it’s that crazy, but it’s also that simple.

195 00:17:10.349 ⇒ 00:17:10.879 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.

196 00:17:11.250 ⇒ 00:17:14.489 Kaela Gallagher: You just reminded me of the Justin Bieber meme.

197 00:17:14.490 ⇒ 00:17:16.770 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, it’s not clocking with you. Yeah, it’s not clocking with you.

198 00:17:17.339 ⇒ 00:17:20.249 Uttam Kumaran: I was about to say clocking, but I was like, this is too on the nose.

199 00:17:20.499 ⇒ 00:17:23.289 Uttam Kumaran: I just watched his Coachella set, like, the other day.

200 00:17:23.290 ⇒ 00:17:33.819 Kaela Gallagher: Me too. Apparently, he sold, like, the most merch anybody’s ever sold at Coachella, and it all said it’s not clockin’ to you, and I’m staying.

201 00:17:33.820 ⇒ 00:17:35.270 Uttam Kumaran: Wow.

202 00:17:36.320 ⇒ 00:17:43.660 Uttam Kumaran: My girlfriend is such a fan, because I just… I… I don’t… I like, some of the songs, but I wanted to watch the… I liked the performance.

203 00:17:43.860 ⇒ 00:17:44.440 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah.

204 00:17:44.440 ⇒ 00:17:47.389 Uttam Kumaran: He’s, like, that’s kind of… I think it’s, like, absolutely legendary.

205 00:17:47.510 ⇒ 00:17:52.799 Uttam Kumaran: That, like, Sabrina Carpenter and these people do this, like, they spent, like, probably $30 million, and…

206 00:17:53.200 ⇒ 00:17:57.849 Uttam Kumaran: I think it’s so legit, like, it’s… that’s, like, the coolest thing to me.

207 00:17:57.850 ⇒ 00:18:05.270 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah. I just loved that he was, like, harmonizing with his younger self. Like, it was just so… it was just, like, so heartwarming.

208 00:18:05.270 ⇒ 00:18:10.610 Uttam Kumaran: I know, I know. And the fact that he’s like, you forget, he’s been in the business for a long time.

209 00:18:10.610 ⇒ 00:18:11.600 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah…

210 00:18:11.600 ⇒ 00:18:14.979 Uttam Kumaran: And it’s such a legend. Yeah, just an absolute legend.

211 00:18:14.980 ⇒ 00:18:18.439 B: The trajectory of this discussion is really funny.

212 00:18:20.310 ⇒ 00:18:21.850 Robert Tseng: We’re all trying to.

213 00:18:22.230 ⇒ 00:18:28.129 Uttam Kumaran: Talking about Justin Bieber Coachella set. But you missed it, it was very, it was very not, like, lighthearted for a while.

214 00:18:28.680 ⇒ 00:18:29.200 Uttam Kumaran: Literally.

215 00:18:29.200 ⇒ 00:18:29.700 Robert Tseng: Oh, yeah.

216 00:18:29.700 ⇒ 00:18:30.750 Uttam Kumaran: seconds ago.

217 00:18:30.750 ⇒ 00:18:36.039 Robert Tseng: I kind of forgot that we were having this. I was still talking to you guys on Slack, and I was like, I should just jump in here.

218 00:18:37.500 ⇒ 00:18:43.499 Kaela Gallagher: We were talking about how it’s not clocked to some of the team members, and then that turned into Justin Bieber.

219 00:18:43.500 ⇒ 00:18:45.050 Robert Tseng: Oh.

220 00:18:45.880 ⇒ 00:18:47.090 Kaela Gallagher: Doing it.

221 00:18:47.090 ⇒ 00:18:50.250 Robert Tseng: He got paid double what they paid Beyonce, that’s ridiculous.

222 00:18:50.250 ⇒ 00:18:55.079 Kaela Gallagher: That’s ridiculous. I would argue Beyonce’s performance was more iconic.

223 00:18:55.450 ⇒ 00:18:56.080 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

224 00:18:56.540 ⇒ 00:19:00.369 Uttam Kumaran: The Beyonce hasn’t… but Beyonce performs every year 100 times a year, like…

225 00:19:00.470 ⇒ 00:19:12.110 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, she’s been performing every month for the last, like, 4 years. Like, she’s released, like, 100 albums, won the everything. Like, Justin Bieber hasn’t done… isn’t doing stuff, like… like, it’s, like, been, like, 5 years, right?

226 00:19:12.400 ⇒ 00:19:14.290 Robert Tseng: Yeah, this is his comeback, yeah, yeah.

227 00:19:14.290 ⇒ 00:19:27.430 Uttam Kumaran: Well, I just think it’s like… it’s just one moment, like… it’s like… it’s like Drake has never performed, right? So, like, if Drake performs, what are their… you think they’re gonna give him what they gave Beyonce? No. But Beyonce can get that every year.

228 00:19:27.700 ⇒ 00:19:31.539 Uttam Kumaran: You see what I mean? So, like, LTV-wise, like, I… yeah, of course.

229 00:19:31.980 ⇒ 00:19:32.450 Kaela Gallagher: Okay.

230 00:19:32.450 ⇒ 00:19:43.559 Uttam Kumaran: Also, Beyonce, what they’re gonna… what people do at Coachella is they overspend… I was just listening to something about this… they overspend because they’re gonna make it back on all the ticket sales when they do the world tour and everything.

231 00:19:43.560 ⇒ 00:19:53.249 Kaela Gallagher: Oh, yeah! The artists will spend a ton of money on their own set, because it’s, like, an investment. Yeah, I was hearing about that, too.

232 00:19:53.460 ⇒ 00:19:54.070 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.

233 00:19:55.960 ⇒ 00:19:57.040 Kaela Gallagher: Anyway…

234 00:19:57.250 ⇒ 00:20:03.139 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, we should do… I wanna… I… you know, I was… I was… I almost got a deal with this, like, really famous, like, rap…

235 00:20:03.560 ⇒ 00:20:06.460 Uttam Kumaran: label when I was first starting the company.

236 00:20:06.660 ⇒ 00:20:17.880 Uttam Kumaran: Because a friend of mine is friends with this guy who was, like, sort of technical at this, like, big, big label. Doing stuff in music would be fun, yeah. I feel like they’re… they’re getting more sophisticated.

237 00:20:18.180 ⇒ 00:20:20.180 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah, that’s so cool.

238 00:20:24.700 ⇒ 00:20:41.699 Kaela Gallagher: I was thinking, if we do an off-site, we should gather samples from all of our clients. So, like, we’ve all tried Element before. That would be crazy if we worked with the music company, though. I wonder if we could get, like, tickets to something.

239 00:20:42.020 ⇒ 00:20:42.630 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.

240 00:20:43.270 ⇒ 00:20:44.150 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.

241 00:20:47.050 ⇒ 00:20:49.960 Kaela Gallagher: Utomo, I like this new, okay.

242 00:20:49.960 ⇒ 00:20:50.810 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, our thing?

243 00:20:50.810 ⇒ 00:20:52.400 Kaela Gallagher: You built out. Yeah.

244 00:20:52.400 ⇒ 00:21:01.130 Uttam Kumaran: I’m glad it’s working. I think it’s a little bit noisy, but I… I like it. I think it allows us to be a little bit more public, and…

245 00:21:01.680 ⇒ 00:21:04.270 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t know, I’m just… I’m just trying things.

246 00:21:04.820 ⇒ 00:21:14.100 Kaela Gallagher: I have a question for you about it. Sure. Because I was going through and, like, marking each of mine, and I’m curious when…

247 00:21:15.010 ⇒ 00:21:19.159 Kaela Gallagher: Like here, for example, it says April 3rd, it was on track.

248 00:21:19.500 ⇒ 00:21:23.160 Kaela Gallagher: But, like, how do I mark today, April 17th?

249 00:21:24.470 ⇒ 00:21:29.130 B: You, you press the buttons, like, weekly check-in on track, or weekly check-in off track.

250 00:21:30.520 ⇒ 00:21:36.800 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, so then we’re missing data from… last week.

251 00:21:36.800 ⇒ 00:21:39.820 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, if you push that, it should… it should…

252 00:21:41.770 ⇒ 00:21:43.669 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, so I just pushed it.

253 00:21:44.490 ⇒ 00:21:48.049 Uttam Kumaran: For… oh, I pushed it for Rico’s thing, but she’s off track.

254 00:21:49.070 ⇒ 00:21:59.000 Uttam Kumaran: And it should update to, like… yeah. So we’re… so yeah, we… I don’t… maybe I didn’t backfill it for last week, or it was… this was based on what was in the spreadsheet, probably, like.

255 00:21:59.130 ⇒ 00:22:06.780 Uttam Kumaran: a week ago. Maybe, like, a week… Okay. Like, 8 days ago or something, so… I need… I could re-pull it and just, like, do that, but… I mean, I…

256 00:22:07.280 ⇒ 00:22:13.549 Uttam Kumaran: Robert does… Robert’s gonna tell me I hate the OKR shit. I don’t hate the OKR shit, I’m just trying different things with backend databases, so…

257 00:22:13.840 ⇒ 00:22:19.849 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, and then, like, do I ever need to change this status here on the side?

258 00:22:21.260 ⇒ 00:22:26.879 Uttam Kumaran: No, actually, I should just remove that and just make these two butt… two big buttons. That’s actually a good point. I’ll just.

259 00:22:26.880 ⇒ 00:22:29.760 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, because when I went through, I went and changed this.

260 00:22:29.760 ⇒ 00:22:37.300 Uttam Kumaran: So, originally, it wasn’t… originally, I didn’t do the big buns, but actually, I thought the big buns literally were, like, good. It was, like, off… on, right? It’s like…

261 00:22:37.300 ⇒ 00:22:38.030 Kaela Gallagher: You can just…

262 00:22:38.180 ⇒ 00:22:40.160 Uttam Kumaran: I’ll just… let me just… I’ll just do that.

263 00:22:40.570 ⇒ 00:22:41.970 Kaela Gallagher: Okay. Okay.

264 00:22:41.970 ⇒ 00:22:42.590 B: beep.

265 00:22:42.840 ⇒ 00:22:45.670 B: Actually, I’m thinking if we could just, you know.

266 00:22:45.790 ⇒ 00:22:51.500 B: Have the buttons directly, connected with, like, the status update?

267 00:22:52.180 ⇒ 00:22:56.900 B: So, maybe the post can be, like, a status update, so… all of our…

268 00:22:56.900 ⇒ 00:22:58.289 Uttam Kumaran: So you can do it more often.

269 00:22:58.740 ⇒ 00:23:09.959 B: Yes, exactly. So, the status will just be updated on a weekly basis, and it should also come with an actual update, not just, you know, not just a status update, but something that has

270 00:23:10.470 ⇒ 00:23:12.090 B: That is, notes our value.

271 00:23:13.430 ⇒ 00:23:17.940 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, so every time you give a status update, every time you give

272 00:23:18.200 ⇒ 00:23:22.720 Uttam Kumaran: A on-track, off-track, it has to come with a note.

273 00:23:23.260 ⇒ 00:23:23.920 B: Yes.

274 00:23:25.750 ⇒ 00:23:27.190 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, cool, I can do that.

275 00:23:27.670 ⇒ 00:23:33.980 B: Yeah, I might create a linear ticket for that, and then I’m just going to get the approval of, like, everyone else.

276 00:23:34.260 ⇒ 00:23:34.890 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

277 00:23:37.670 ⇒ 00:23:44.750 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, cool. So then… I think Rico must have done this… the same thing too, like…

278 00:23:44.910 ⇒ 00:23:49.370 Kaela Gallagher: He said that he updated his, but I think he must have just done the drop-downs on the side.

279 00:23:51.140 ⇒ 00:23:53.489 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, that’s what he did, yeah.

280 00:23:53.490 ⇒ 00:23:54.140 Kaela Gallagher: Okay.

281 00:23:54.290 ⇒ 00:24:03.019 Uttam Kumaran: But also, like, this is something I just, like, whipped together, so, like, it’s… it could use some more work, I think, to make it probably, like, just more compact, but…

282 00:24:03.980 ⇒ 00:24:07.060 Uttam Kumaran: I… yeah, I think it’s…

283 00:24:08.570 ⇒ 00:24:13.430 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I just kind of wanted… I was just trying some… a couple new things. So, I mean, we could go through this if we feel good.

284 00:24:14.220 ⇒ 00:24:20.209 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah. Okay. I can… I can run through… Mine quickly, I guess. Okay.

285 00:24:20.480 ⇒ 00:24:22.270 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, so…

286 00:24:22.470 ⇒ 00:24:34.799 Kaela Gallagher: First one here, weekly people culture recruiting content generates inbound leads. I wanted to clarify, if I’m posting in, like, Slack forums, and candidates reach out, and we get them in the pipeline, does that count?

287 00:24:34.800 ⇒ 00:24:36.160 Uttam Kumaran: I think so, yeah.

288 00:24:36.330 ⇒ 00:24:42.329 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, so this would be on track. I did have a post scheduled to go up this week, but just didn’t get…

289 00:24:42.570 ⇒ 00:24:46.719 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I should… so, so on that… yeah, so on that,

290 00:24:47.560 ⇒ 00:24:51.039 Uttam Kumaran: So, basically, I still want to see every post that comes out.

291 00:24:51.040 ⇒ 00:24:51.780 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah.

292 00:24:52.000 ⇒ 00:24:58.030 Uttam Kumaran: But usually, yeah, Hannah will, like… we would just batch it, so I think maybe when Hannah’s back.

293 00:24:58.850 ⇒ 00:25:03.779 Uttam Kumaran: especially with a post like that, we can just plan and I can pre-approve. I just… just missed your message, so…

294 00:25:03.780 ⇒ 00:25:12.429 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, yeah, no worries, like, I still was able to gather candidates through, Slack, and we can make that post next week, so…

295 00:25:12.430 ⇒ 00:25:15.090 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I think this… I think this is great.

296 00:25:16.140 ⇒ 00:25:23.159 Uttam Kumaran: yeah, I feel like this is, like, a really side door avenue that a lot of people don’t do, and I think there’s more. We can do more with universities.

297 00:25:23.170 ⇒ 00:25:36.159 Uttam Kumaran: like, there’s a lot more we could do to sort of, like, drum up stuff. I think… I think the goal here is just, like, we’re not just waiting or going purely referral, you know? Like, and actually, the content helps us sell.

298 00:25:36.270 ⇒ 00:25:40.319 Uttam Kumaran: Because when you post a recording post, not only did, like.

299 00:25:40.470 ⇒ 00:25:48.119 Uttam Kumaran: 50,000 people DM me, like, all those people liked, and then, like, a bunch of people commented, and then, like, it just boosts, like.

300 00:25:48.230 ⇒ 00:25:56.659 Uttam Kumaran: Those are some of the most… those are the highest performing posts on my account, is the recruiting ones. And then also, it signals to sales and, like, other people that we’re, like.

301 00:25:57.230 ⇒ 00:26:01.109 Uttam Kumaran: big machine, you know? So, I think they’re… it’s a great piece of content, like…

302 00:26:01.110 ⇒ 00:26:15.619 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah. Yeah, and something we talked about, too, in, like, the recruiting retro is, Slack has been really effective, because, like, if somebody’s in a Slack forum for DBT, like, they’re probably pretty passionate about it, or at least really knowledgeable.

303 00:26:15.620 ⇒ 00:26:16.230 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.

304 00:26:16.230 ⇒ 00:26:17.180 Kaela Gallagher: It’s…

305 00:26:17.180 ⇒ 00:26:38.599 Kaela Gallagher: you’re already kind of vetting their skill set in a way. So, yeah, that’s been great. I actually, did some outreach to universities as well, specifically, like, data clubs at UT Austin, or, like, Abdullah got us on the mailing list for Carnegie Mellon alumni, and so.

306 00:26:38.600 ⇒ 00:26:41.710 Uttam Kumaran: We’ll have some UT connections to make, also.

307 00:26:42.520 ⇒ 00:26:43.200 Kaela Gallagher: Cool.

308 00:26:43.200 ⇒ 00:26:43.650 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.

309 00:26:43.650 ⇒ 00:26:52.750 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah, so our… our name is getting out there in a few different ways right now, so that’s been… that’s been good.

310 00:26:53.280 ⇒ 00:26:58.099 Kaela Gallagher: Cool. And then here, I marked this one as untracked because,

311 00:26:58.440 ⇒ 00:27:04.020 Kaela Gallagher: We just need to build something that can measure this. Yeah, okay. So, I would say that that is…

312 00:27:04.680 ⇒ 00:27:14.529 Uttam Kumaran: So I guess my… my ask, I guess for this group is, like, are we married to Notion, like, overall? Or does no one care? Because, meaning, not, not Notion.

313 00:27:14.690 ⇒ 00:27:20.540 Uttam Kumaran: or no Notion. Notion, or it’s, like, a different version that’s, like, easier for me to pull data out of.

314 00:27:20.940 ⇒ 00:27:24.899 Kaela Gallagher: I love Notion, I live in it every day. I pro-.

315 00:27:24.900 ⇒ 00:27:26.300 Uttam Kumaran: But are you married to, like, the…

316 00:27:26.770 ⇒ 00:27:35.849 Uttam Kumaran: concept of, like, the app, or are you married to, like, the brand, and, like… because I… I… there’s another tool called Obsidian that’d just be easier for us to, like.

317 00:27:36.170 ⇒ 00:27:38.589 Uttam Kumaran: Build, and for me to get some data out of.

318 00:27:38.690 ⇒ 00:27:42.509 Uttam Kumaran: like, Notion’s incredibly… like, there’s no API for analytics, or like…

319 00:27:43.150 ⇒ 00:27:50.779 Uttam Kumaran: It’s anything, so I’m proposing we move. I can move your portion and show you.

320 00:27:51.040 ⇒ 00:27:54.300 Uttam Kumaran: And if you’re, like, this is the exact same functionality, which is, like.

321 00:27:54.590 ⇒ 00:27:57.120 Uttam Kumaran: I’m telling you, it will be exactly the same.

322 00:27:58.790 ⇒ 00:28:03.509 Uttam Kumaran: Are you, like… if it’s exactly the same, would you be like, okay, that’s fine?

323 00:28:04.090 ⇒ 00:28:05.070 Kaela Gallagher: I think…

324 00:28:05.440 ⇒ 00:28:08.639 Uttam Kumaran: You can say… you can hold me to that, I don’t mind.

325 00:28:08.780 ⇒ 00:28:13.790 Kaela Gallagher: I think potentially, like, yes, it would need to, day one, operate.

326 00:28:13.790 ⇒ 00:28:14.170 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

327 00:28:14.170 ⇒ 00:28:26.419 Kaela Gallagher: same level as what we have built in Notion, because Notion is my entire applicant tracking system right now, performing system, job descriptions, people database, like.

328 00:28:26.740 ⇒ 00:28:28.210 Kaela Gallagher: everything I do is.

329 00:28:28.210 ⇒ 00:28:28.780 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

330 00:28:28.880 ⇒ 00:28:34.389 Uttam Kumaran: So let me see what’s easier for me to do, either get you this measured, because there’s other reasons I want to move it.

331 00:28:36.500 ⇒ 00:28:45.160 Kaela Gallagher: The other risk I would call out on the people side for switching away from Notion is that right now, our career site and what we have been…

332 00:28:45.160 ⇒ 00:28:46.129 Uttam Kumaran: It’s all on the table for me, too.

333 00:28:46.130 ⇒ 00:28:46.710 Kaela Gallagher: hosting…

334 00:28:46.710 ⇒ 00:28:47.090 Uttam Kumaran: Public.

335 00:28:47.090 ⇒ 00:28:54.080 Kaela Gallagher: public is a Notion site, so any, like, previous messages we have out there, if somebody finds that and clicks it.

336 00:28:54.800 ⇒ 00:28:55.480 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

337 00:28:55.480 ⇒ 00:28:57.790 Kaela Gallagher: They might not get directed to a new page.

338 00:28:58.200 ⇒ 00:29:01.479 B: But Utang can build an ATS in a day.

339 00:29:01.480 ⇒ 00:29:04.219 Uttam Kumaran: No, that’s not what I’m saying, it’s just more like…

340 00:29:04.520 ⇒ 00:29:13.410 Uttam Kumaran: more of, like, Notion is, one, extremely expensive, and, really clunky to, like… it’s purposefully, like, their wallet off.

341 00:29:13.610 ⇒ 00:29:25.080 Uttam Kumaran: Because then… it’s just like, if you’ve used Notion for, like, any amount of time, you know they want you to do everything in Notion. Like, if we call them, they say, run your whole company in Notion, use our dashboards.

342 00:29:26.240 ⇒ 00:29:26.590 Kaela Gallagher: No.

343 00:29:26.590 ⇒ 00:29:33.170 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, you know what I mean? So, if… I think that’s a good bar to hold me to. On day one, it has to have every functionality that you use.

344 00:29:33.430 ⇒ 00:29:38.589 Uttam Kumaran: Or I’m gonna figure out the tracking for this, whatever I can do.

345 00:29:38.930 ⇒ 00:29:44.309 Uttam Kumaran: First, 90% pipeline, pass, and… yeah, I gotta… yeah, I’ll think about it.

346 00:29:44.790 ⇒ 00:29:46.529 Kaela Gallagher: Okay. Okay, cool.

347 00:29:50.450 ⇒ 00:30:02.829 Kaela Gallagher: Whoa. Okay, next here, let’s see. Maintaining a complete org chart, covering 100% of current team members, this is on track, and as we’re bringing people in and making sure that the job.

348 00:30:02.830 ⇒ 00:30:06.959 Uttam Kumaran: I didn’t… did you… I didn’t see if you… I think you did an org chart, I didn’t end up looking at it.

349 00:30:07.300 ⇒ 00:30:08.090 Kaela Gallagher: Good morning, Sherry.

350 00:30:08.090 ⇒ 00:30:08.900 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.

351 00:30:10.800 ⇒ 00:30:16.550 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, so I built in, like, a Figma,

352 00:30:16.900 ⇒ 00:30:19.869 Kaela Gallagher: plugin to the People and Culture page.

353 00:30:20.140 ⇒ 00:30:24.520 Kaela Gallagher: So then, anybody can just pop in here, you can zoom in.

354 00:30:24.520 ⇒ 00:30:25.340 Uttam Kumaran: Nice.

355 00:30:25.510 ⇒ 00:30:35.169 Kaela Gallagher: We got Utam and Robert at the top, and then it’s broken down by team, so the entire delivery team is here in the center in different buckets, data, AI, strategy.

356 00:30:35.330 ⇒ 00:30:55.040 Kaela Gallagher: We got me and Bea over here on the people side, Rico, operations, sales, and then we even have the advisors on here as well. Great. So, this is something where I should be able to update Figma when we bring new people in, and then this plugin will, like, reflect that automatically.

357 00:30:57.420 ⇒ 00:30:58.590 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, awesome.

358 00:31:00.520 ⇒ 00:31:05.500 Kaela Gallagher: So… Yeah, that’s the, work chart. Cool.

359 00:31:05.650 ⇒ 00:31:19.659 Kaela Gallagher: And then, yeah, the job descriptions are all up-to-date as well. Those were all, like, reviewed by either the person themselves or the leader. There were a lot that were, probably from a year ago and, like, 3 rolls ago for some people, so…

360 00:31:19.910 ⇒ 00:31:21.440 Kaela Gallagher: We’re all good on those now.

361 00:31:22.140 ⇒ 00:31:27.999 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, great. Yeah, and the one thing on my side, in terms of org chart as well, is I have all of our, like.

362 00:31:28.170 ⇒ 00:31:35.329 Uttam Kumaran: internal, like, database also set up. So Ricoh kind of maintains, some of this.

363 00:31:35.580 ⇒ 00:31:41.199 Uttam Kumaran: And, like, I just kind of made things a lot… a lot clearer, so a good example of this…

364 00:31:41.530 ⇒ 00:31:46.530 Uttam Kumaran: It’s like, we have tables now for,

365 00:31:47.090 ⇒ 00:31:49.270 Uttam Kumaran: Like, everybody on our, on our team.

366 00:31:49.400 ⇒ 00:31:53.860 Uttam Kumaran: So you can actually… there’s one table with everybody, first name, department.

367 00:31:54.140 ⇒ 00:32:12.110 Uttam Kumaran: all of their, like, linear user ID, their GitHub username, and so on… when we onboard people, Ricoh has been adding to this, and so this is, like, gonna power, like, all of our platform. Like, this isn’t in Snowflake, because this is, like, more, like, operational for… for data product stuff, but you can see we have, like.

368 00:32:12.870 ⇒ 00:32:18.219 Uttam Kumaran: all of Bea’s L&D stuff is here, like, I think your,

369 00:32:18.980 ⇒ 00:32:25.949 Uttam Kumaran: I feel like this should have worked, but the HeyReach stuff is here, some Slack stuff is here.

370 00:32:26.760 ⇒ 00:32:39.200 Uttam Kumaran: all of our, like, files and things. So this is, like, basically, like, the database that’s gonna power, like, the platform. So this also should match, Kayla, your org chart, but one thing hopefully we can do is, like.

371 00:32:39.410 ⇒ 00:32:46.420 Uttam Kumaran: have some more dynamic org chart that, like, populates or something, right? So, like, when people… when Ricoh adds someone to this, or there’s a role change.

372 00:32:47.130 ⇒ 00:32:49.230 Uttam Kumaran: That’s something more alive, so that’d be great.

373 00:32:49.230 ⇒ 00:32:50.600 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah. Okay.

374 00:32:50.600 ⇒ 00:32:56.439 Uttam Kumaran: That’s great, but that’s great that we have it, and I think even showing that on day one for people that join.

375 00:32:56.680 ⇒ 00:32:57.819 Uttam Kumaran: Would be good, too.

376 00:32:58.110 ⇒ 00:33:01.360 Kaela Gallagher: Oh, I like that. Yeah, I can add that.

377 00:33:01.360 ⇒ 00:33:03.040 Uttam Kumaran: We’re small enough, so…

378 00:33:05.400 ⇒ 00:33:09.349 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah, I can add that to orientation. I did,

379 00:33:09.540 ⇒ 00:33:15.249 Kaela Gallagher: show the team the org chart during the call today as well, too. So, cool.

380 00:33:16.300 ⇒ 00:33:24.910 Kaela Gallagher: And then in terms of… quarter-bound deliverables, so converting from 1099 to W-2,

381 00:33:24.990 ⇒ 00:33:39.429 Kaela Gallagher: Megan sent over the JustWorks information today with, like, 20 different healthcare options, and then Yvette told me that by Monday, she should have the… the other,

382 00:33:39.430 ⇒ 00:33:45.570 Kaela Gallagher: estimates. So, next week, we should be able to, like, dig in a little bit deeper on cost for this.

383 00:33:45.800 ⇒ 00:33:46.380 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

384 00:33:47.160 ⇒ 00:33:50.210 Kaela Gallagher: So that’s the latest update there.

385 00:33:50.560 ⇒ 00:33:57.829 Kaela Gallagher: And then, for engagement, morale, and retention, we do need to onboard.

386 00:33:57.830 ⇒ 00:33:58.490 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.

387 00:33:58.490 ⇒ 00:34:02.239 Kaela Gallagher: to track this, which she said she would extend our discount.

388 00:34:02.240 ⇒ 00:34:02.900 Uttam Kumaran: It’s the end of the month.

389 00:34:02.900 ⇒ 00:34:03.780 Kaela Gallagher: This month, yeah.

390 00:34:03.780 ⇒ 00:34:04.300 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.

391 00:34:04.910 ⇒ 00:34:14.310 Kaela Gallagher: And then, developing a team off-site program. I wanted to ask… Before I, like, really… dive in here

392 00:34:14.420 ⇒ 00:34:23.930 Kaela Gallagher: Do you guys want to do this as, like, a Q3 kickoff or a Q4 kickoff? Like, something that’s kind of in junction with, like, a milestone, and we can…

393 00:34:24.239 ⇒ 00:34:27.179 Kaela Gallagher: I don’t know, kind of centered around that.

394 00:34:31.469 ⇒ 00:34:32.179 Uttam Kumaran: For who?

395 00:34:33.199 ⇒ 00:34:34.889 Kaela Gallagher: For the off-site?

396 00:34:36.460 ⇒ 00:34:38.540 Robert Tseng: Yeah, she’s saying, like, when do we do the off-site?

397 00:34:38.540 ⇒ 00:34:39.370 Uttam Kumaran: Whoa.

398 00:34:40.719 ⇒ 00:34:52.770 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I mean, just like anything around here, I gotta see price before I can com… no comment until price is clear for me. Because we do probably need at least 3 months lead time.

399 00:34:52.770 ⇒ 00:34:58.779 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think… I think Q3 is a fair target. We will… we will do it this year, but if it’s not…

400 00:34:58.780 ⇒ 00:35:11.560 Uttam Kumaran: I’m like, I’ll come to LA, and, like, LA people is half the company, so, like, but for something more formal for everybody in the US, and then… I mean, this is where I want to offer this to, like, people international, so that’s why I’m, like…

401 00:35:12.640 ⇒ 00:35:15.540 Uttam Kumaran: I want to think about making that happen as part of this.

402 00:35:15.810 ⇒ 00:35:18.149 Uttam Kumaran: Or at least this… I would like to see, like, a…

403 00:35:19.040 ⇒ 00:35:27.790 Uttam Kumaran: I just feel bad, like, I want that… I want people to show up, so, but, like, I have to think about something that we can do there, but I would prefer to go bigger.

404 00:35:27.970 ⇒ 00:35:28.910 Uttam Kumaran: Once?

405 00:35:29.360 ⇒ 00:35:30.440 Uttam Kumaran: been, like…

406 00:35:30.860 ⇒ 00:35:35.879 Uttam Kumaran: Have an offset where, like, half the company isn’t able to come, or at least wasn’t given the opportunity.

407 00:35:36.240 ⇒ 00:35:39.240 Uttam Kumaran: Okay. So…

408 00:35:40.620 ⇒ 00:35:41.100 Kaela Gallagher: Okay.

409 00:35:41.100 ⇒ 00:35:43.039 Uttam Kumaran: What do you think? I don’t know, that’s how I feel.

410 00:35:43.860 ⇒ 00:35:56.329 Robert Tseng: I feel like our non-US people, not everyone can travel, like, you know, visa-wise, just pretty secure. So, you know, I feel like it makes more sense to…

411 00:35:56.540 ⇒ 00:35:59.780 Robert Tseng: I mean, we should… we should consider offering two. One for…

412 00:36:00.240 ⇒ 00:36:05.629 Robert Tseng: one that they can go to that’s probably in Asia, and then one that’s here, kind of thing.

413 00:36:09.170 ⇒ 00:36:16.320 Kaela Gallagher: Robert, what… what, passports do you think would have a hard time getting to the US?

414 00:36:18.100 ⇒ 00:36:22.410 B: The pH passport, definitely. Yeah.

415 00:36:22.410 ⇒ 00:36:24.650 Uttam Kumaran: You have to apply for a tourist visa?

416 00:36:25.330 ⇒ 00:36:28.010 Robert Tseng: It’s literally all of them right now, I think.

417 00:36:28.010 ⇒ 00:36:32.590 Uttam Kumaran: I think all, I think all of them, except for, like, like, EU countries, basically.

418 00:36:32.810 ⇒ 00:36:33.330 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

419 00:36:33.330 ⇒ 00:36:33.730 Kaela Gallagher: So.

420 00:36:33.730 ⇒ 00:36:35.130 Uttam Kumaran: Or India.

421 00:36:35.340 ⇒ 00:36:37.159 Kaela Gallagher: Did we all go to the Philippines?

422 00:36:38.170 ⇒ 00:36:40.669 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, yeah, I’m trying to go. Philippines.

423 00:36:40.780 ⇒ 00:36:43.990 Uttam Kumaran: For sure. But also, like, we could do it in Dubai.

424 00:36:44.090 ⇒ 00:36:50.380 Uttam Kumaran: But again, I just, like, I would like to see, like, for example, I would offer it to B, but then I would be like, let’s figure out…

425 00:36:50.950 ⇒ 00:36:55.989 Uttam Kumaran: what the process is, like, that’s… that’s what I would do. I would offer to be in Rico, for sure.

426 00:36:58.320 ⇒ 00:37:00.930 Uttam Kumaran: But then, yeah, then it’s a visa situation.

427 00:37:01.650 ⇒ 00:37:06.120 Uttam Kumaran: then it’s a visa situation, right? But then I would at least like to extend it to…

428 00:37:08.460 ⇒ 00:37:09.649 Uttam Kumaran: To you guys.

429 00:37:10.070 ⇒ 00:37:12.280 Kaela Gallagher: So my initial thought was…

430 00:37:13.290 ⇒ 00:37:20.479 Kaela Gallagher: If it’s just the US-based team, something driving distance from LA is gonna be the most cost-effective, because…

431 00:37:20.870 ⇒ 00:37:26.550 Kaela Gallagher: we’re eliminating paying for flights for, like, 5 or 6 people.

432 00:37:27.310 ⇒ 00:37:39.390 Kaela Gallagher: So, yeah, what I had kind of looked into originally was, like, a Palm Springs, or, like, a Santa Barbara, or something like that. And the price estimate ranges from, like, $16Kto$35K.

433 00:37:39.530 ⇒ 00:37:42.000 Kaela Gallagher: But that’s just the US-based team.

434 00:37:42.990 ⇒ 00:37:45.939 Uttam Kumaran: Well, because you don’t… I guess it goes closer to LA?

435 00:37:46.670 ⇒ 00:37:51.639 Kaela Gallagher: Right, because then we wouldn’t have flights for all the LA people. LA people can just carpool.

436 00:37:55.490 ⇒ 00:37:58.409 Kaela Gallagher: But, I don’t know, if we’re talking about…

437 00:37:59.240 ⇒ 00:38:01.350 Uttam Kumaran: 15 attendees, 15 rooms…

438 00:38:04.250 ⇒ 00:38:08.199 Uttam Kumaran: So, it’s basically, it’s a mix between, like, do you want to pay for people flying.

439 00:38:08.450 ⇒ 00:38:10.410 Uttam Kumaran: Because if you come to Austin, it’ll be cheaper.

440 00:38:11.310 ⇒ 00:38:17.020 Kaela Gallagher: Well, the quote that it gave me for Texas Hill Country…

441 00:38:17.960 ⇒ 00:38:20.650 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, we don’t want to go to… we don’t need to go to… we could go to Hill Country.

442 00:38:20.650 ⇒ 00:38:21.530 Kaela Gallagher: Lower.

443 00:38:22.790 ⇒ 00:38:25.960 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah, I mean, it’s a little bit…

444 00:38:26.150 ⇒ 00:38:28.129 Uttam Kumaran: That’s so nice, so nice. I’ll…

445 00:38:28.590 ⇒ 00:38:36.720 Uttam Kumaran: Now I’m like, I should just go, like, this weekend. It’s so nice there, but it’s not like Napa, it’s, like, Texas version, so it’s, like…

446 00:38:37.220 ⇒ 00:38:44.099 Kaela Gallagher: The other thing is, like, if we’re doing a Q3 kickoff in July, I think Santa Barbara is a better place than Texas.

447 00:38:44.100 ⇒ 00:38:53.079 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, I mean, Santa Barbara’s obviously the better place than anywhere in Texas, but it’s like… I just think it’s, like, Austin’s dirt, like, it’s dirt cheap here.

448 00:38:53.510 ⇒ 00:38:54.240 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah.

449 00:38:54.240 ⇒ 00:39:01.210 Uttam Kumaran: getting, like, 30 people or whatever to Santa Barbara. I was just near there. It’s brutal right now. It’s like…

450 00:39:01.980 ⇒ 00:39:04.879 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, gas is, like, $9,000.

451 00:39:06.550 ⇒ 00:39:07.400 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah.

452 00:39:08.670 ⇒ 00:39:09.870 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, yeah, I…

453 00:39:12.030 ⇒ 00:39:12.730 Kaela Gallagher: Hmm.

454 00:39:17.440 ⇒ 00:39:19.489 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, this was good, I’m gonna think about it.

455 00:39:20.240 ⇒ 00:39:20.870 Kaela Gallagher: Okay.

456 00:39:20.870 ⇒ 00:39:23.989 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t really have, like, I don’t really have a… I don’t really have a good answer.

457 00:39:24.250 ⇒ 00:39:32.240 Uttam Kumaran: I’m not a great event planner, but I can ask… you should ask… we should ask Artie, Robert, because Artie used to do really big events for, like, tech events, actually.

458 00:39:32.760 ⇒ 00:39:33.310 Robert Tseng: Hmm.

459 00:39:34.030 ⇒ 00:39:37.499 Uttam Kumaran: He should actually throw something furrain for… yeah, we should ask him.

460 00:39:38.150 ⇒ 00:39:42.490 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, cool, that’s great.

461 00:39:42.490 ⇒ 00:39:45.449 Kaela Gallagher: Anyway, something for everybody to just kind of…

462 00:39:45.570 ⇒ 00:39:55.759 Kaela Gallagher: sit on, let me know what your guys’ thoughts are. But yeah, I’m thinking a Q3 kickoff or a Q4 kickoff, so either, like, July or October, would be…

463 00:39:56.440 ⇒ 00:39:57.769 Kaela Gallagher: Good timing.

464 00:39:59.460 ⇒ 00:40:01.589 Kaela Gallagher: July’s a little bit tight.

465 00:40:01.790 ⇒ 00:40:04.720 Kaela Gallagher: to plan it in 3 months, I will say.

466 00:40:05.270 ⇒ 00:40:06.279 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I agree.

467 00:40:07.830 ⇒ 00:40:16.119 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, I think that’s it for my OKRs. I guess just some…

468 00:40:16.730 ⇒ 00:40:31.149 Kaela Gallagher: people updates. So, offers extended to Artie and Lisa, and accepted. Artie will start next week, Lisa will start the following, but I’ll do their orientation together.

469 00:40:31.540 ⇒ 00:40:37.410 Kaela Gallagher: Who do you guys think should be Brainforge buddies to each of them?

470 00:40:40.420 ⇒ 00:40:42.410 Uttam Kumaran: For Lisa…

471 00:40:49.670 ⇒ 00:40:54.980 Uttam Kumaran: Good question. I feel like I… I just always just think about saying, like, 5 or 5 people.

472 00:40:55.400 ⇒ 00:40:57.920 Kaela Gallagher: That’s a… I mean, that’s okay. We want to give them a good…

473 00:40:57.920 ⇒ 00:41:00.920 Uttam Kumaran: I would say, like, I would say…

474 00:41:02.290 ⇒ 00:41:04.090 Uttam Kumaran: it should be, like, B, because.

475 00:41:04.090 ⇒ 00:41:05.590 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I would say B.

476 00:41:05.590 ⇒ 00:41:09.780 Uttam Kumaran: Roberts, our concern was that she’s not, like, that deep in AI.

477 00:41:10.560 ⇒ 00:41:10.960 Kaela Gallagher: Okay.

478 00:41:10.960 ⇒ 00:41:15.660 Uttam Kumaran: you would basically easily show her the practical things to start with on AI.

479 00:41:15.830 ⇒ 00:41:18.670 Uttam Kumaran: That’s, like, what I would… yeah, that’s probably what I would say.

480 00:41:18.900 ⇒ 00:41:25.190 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, and then do you guys want one for Artie as well, or since he’s an advisor… Maybe not.

481 00:41:25.860 ⇒ 00:41:29.660 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, is there anyone, like, he can talk to…

482 00:41:30.070 ⇒ 00:41:33.659 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, I would probably say Hannah, so you can learn a little bit about marketing.

483 00:41:33.910 ⇒ 00:41:38.900 Uttam Kumaran: Otherwise, like… I don’t know, I mean, I’m, like…

484 00:41:39.060 ⇒ 00:41:43.790 Uttam Kumaran: Artie’s actually proposing to his girlfriend, this Sunday.

485 00:41:43.990 ⇒ 00:41:44.560 Uttam Kumaran: So…

486 00:41:44.560 ⇒ 00:41:45.560 Kaela Gallagher: Perhaps.

487 00:41:45.560 ⇒ 00:42:02.389 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, and it’s under the guise of a picnic, because it’s under the guise of a picnic that I wanted to do another picnic, so I’m, like, we’re, like, fake texting in our group chat with them. But, sorry, this is sort of left field. I can… I’m, like, gonna talk to Artie anyways fairly often. I feel like…

488 00:42:02.480 ⇒ 00:42:07.099 Uttam Kumaran: it’s okay. Otherwise, I would say something that’s, like, helpful for him to understand

489 00:42:08.490 ⇒ 00:42:13.180 Uttam Kumaran: Either, like, what we do, maybe, like, yeah, I mean, otherwise it’s gonna be Greg, or it could be Pranav.

490 00:42:13.530 ⇒ 00:42:16.650 Uttam Kumaran: Pranav could be good, because Pranav’s also gonna be moving here, so…

491 00:42:17.710 ⇒ 00:42:23.080 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah, okay, that’s a good point. I feel like it can’t hurt, like, really the time commitment is, like.

492 00:42:23.700 ⇒ 00:42:24.140 Uttam Kumaran: No.

493 00:42:24.140 ⇒ 00:42:27.800 Kaela Gallagher: And it’s good for them to just have somebody.

494 00:42:27.980 ⇒ 00:42:29.400 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I think As Pranab, Prabh.

495 00:42:29.400 ⇒ 00:42:29.750 Robert Tseng: That was awesome.

496 00:42:29.750 ⇒ 00:42:32.220 Uttam Kumaran: learn a lot of sales, and I’m gonna… I was gonna make…

497 00:42:32.220 ⇒ 00:42:32.820 Kaela Gallagher: Okay.

498 00:42:32.820 ⇒ 00:42:37.829 Uttam Kumaran: I was gonna basically say, call Artie and learn how to sell, and then I was gonna do this, sell me this pencil.

499 00:42:38.040 ⇒ 00:42:44.370 Uttam Kumaran: thing every day until people sell me the pencil, so… Yeah, that would be good.

500 00:42:44.370 ⇒ 00:43:02.630 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, okay, cool. Okay, yeah, exciting for both of them. Update on Abdullah is that his visa is changing to a different status in a couple months, and so I want to make sure we can accommodate that status, so I’m partnering with, like, Tina and

501 00:43:02.750 ⇒ 00:43:08.930 Kaela Gallagher: Megan right now to try and figure that out. So, I’ll keep you guys posted as soon as we get an update on him.

502 00:43:09.790 ⇒ 00:43:11.649 Kaela Gallagher: And then…

503 00:43:11.990 ⇒ 00:43:23.539 Kaela Gallagher: pending decisions that we have. Robert, I’m curious if you looked at Jaden’s, ghostwriting, like, if you were interested in her at all.

504 00:43:23.750 ⇒ 00:43:26.429 Robert Tseng: Well, I mean, I see what she writes for data culture.

505 00:43:26.430 ⇒ 00:43:30.380 Uttam Kumaran: Well, so one thing is, can we send an NDA to her?

506 00:43:30.850 ⇒ 00:43:37.169 Uttam Kumaran: I’m gonna re… it’s really gonna be bad news bears for me if they find out we’re working with her.

507 00:43:37.300 ⇒ 00:43:42.650 Uttam Kumaran: Or it’s just gonna be, like… so I used to work… okay, I used to work for DataCulture, briefly.

508 00:43:42.650 ⇒ 00:43:44.460 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, so did Demi, right?

509 00:43:45.010 ⇒ 00:43:55.219 Uttam Kumaran: Yes. So I used to work for DataCulture, but even before that, I used to work with the people that run DataCulture. I also… the company I was at before this.

510 00:43:55.350 ⇒ 00:44:00.780 Uttam Kumaran: I was the founding employee, and it was started by the two people that run, or, like, are the owners of Data Culture.

511 00:44:01.020 ⇒ 00:44:05.639 Uttam Kumaran: And then, yeah, I just had, like, a not-so-solid separation out of that company.

512 00:44:05.780 ⇒ 00:44:11.009 Robert Tseng: We can steer clear of her if you feel like it’s too messy. I just thought that her stuff’s pretty good, and like, you know.

513 00:44:11.010 ⇒ 00:44:14.180 Uttam Kumaran: I would rather you shop… I would rather you shop it…

514 00:44:15.070 ⇒ 00:44:18.440 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. I’d rather… I’d rather you do an honest shop.

515 00:44:18.580 ⇒ 00:44:35.240 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, I would just say what… I’ll just say what I’m… so one is, like, I don’t want to come across like we’re poaching their people, although I… I’m totally… that’s what I’m trying to do. Like, I took Demi. Demi used to work there. All the people that have been in and out of that company, I have relationships with. In fact, Robert, Samantha…

516 00:44:35.240 ⇒ 00:44:35.880 Robert Tseng: Nothing’s new.

517 00:44:35.880 ⇒ 00:44:38.150 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, Samantha, who just joined Mother Duck.

518 00:44:38.260 ⇒ 00:44:42.299 Uttam Kumaran: She used to be there, so I know everybody, they all know me, but like…

519 00:44:43.320 ⇒ 00:44:46.640 Uttam Kumaran: I know Brittany, who runs that company now.

520 00:44:46.980 ⇒ 00:44:52.150 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t… she… she tries… they try to call… she tries to call me a few times, and I don’t talk, because I’m like, we’re, like.

521 00:44:52.650 ⇒ 00:45:01.609 Uttam Kumaran: I’m, like, not trying to really help that company, I guess, let’s put it that way, but I would say if you’re looking for a copywriter, I would just like us to do a fair, like, canvas.

522 00:45:01.890 ⇒ 00:45:07.470 Kaela Gallagher: And she said what she does for them is, like, less than 10 hours a week.

523 00:45:07.470 ⇒ 00:45:08.060 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

524 00:45:08.060 ⇒ 00:45:13.399 Kaela Gallagher: She’s working, like, async, and she just has a certain number of posts, and then she also does…

525 00:45:13.940 ⇒ 00:45:18.330 Kaela Gallagher: Case… case studies, for clients for them, so…

526 00:45:18.760 ⇒ 00:45:22.209 Kaela Gallagher: she’s like, I’m down to do that for Brain Forge. She’s like…

527 00:45:22.210 ⇒ 00:45:23.550 Uttam Kumaran: Where did you find her, Robert?

528 00:45:24.370 ⇒ 00:45:33.210 Robert Tseng: Well, I follow the ag culture people. I’m just like, there’s no way Brittany’s writing this stuff herself, and I’ve seen her grow a lot over LinkedIn. I’m like, this stuff’s pretty good. Who’s her copywriter?

529 00:45:33.210 ⇒ 00:45:33.740 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, God.

530 00:45:33.740 ⇒ 00:45:34.920 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

531 00:45:34.920 ⇒ 00:45:35.520 Uttam Kumaran: Nice, nice.

532 00:45:35.520 ⇒ 00:45:36.600 Kaela Gallagher: So she’s…

533 00:45:36.600 ⇒ 00:45:46.960 Robert Tseng: If Jaden comes in and starts the thing, then, like, you know, at least we have, like, a good repo of what good looks like, then we can go to Growth Assisted and go get another person, or whatever. Like, you know.

534 00:45:46.960 ⇒ 00:45:47.650 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

535 00:45:48.000 ⇒ 00:46:07.540 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah, so she… yeah, she’s at, like, 32 an hour, or she said she can do $1,200 a month and, like, have a certain number of posts or deliverables tied to it. She’s down to do either way. The only thing is, she works a 9-to-5, so she can’t get on calls during that time, but she can be on Slack, and then she can get on calls from 5 to 7 Eastern.

536 00:46:08.500 ⇒ 00:46:14.620 Robert Tseng: Which is, like, afternoon for, you know, the Pacific people, and I might be Pacific soon, so, you know.

537 00:46:14.620 ⇒ 00:46:15.250 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah.

538 00:46:15.370 ⇒ 00:46:22.420 Kaela Gallagher: So, yeah, I thought she was great, like, her personality’s very, seems easy to work with.

539 00:46:23.330 ⇒ 00:46:23.880 Kaela Gallagher: So…

540 00:46:23.880 ⇒ 00:46:27.059 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, off to you. I just, like…

541 00:46:27.210 ⇒ 00:46:31.589 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. It’s gonna… it’s gonna be drama if they find out, so…

542 00:46:32.910 ⇒ 00:46:38.019 Kaela Gallagher: Do you want me to schedule a call with you and her and send her an NDA?

543 00:46:38.590 ⇒ 00:46:46.160 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, I think it… I feel like it’s clean if it’s just… she’s just doing, like, 10 hours a week with us, and just, like, writing some stuff.

544 00:46:46.400 ⇒ 00:46:50.960 Robert Tseng: And, like… Yeah, I feel like I should be okay.

545 00:46:50.960 ⇒ 00:46:51.550 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

546 00:46:51.940 ⇒ 00:46:59.710 Uttam Kumaran: I also… I will also… I’m just gonna say, like, I have no clue. I don’t know, this person just… someone… we just hired them, I have no clue where they came from.

547 00:47:00.020 ⇒ 00:47:05.199 Uttam Kumaran: this is just… I don’t have a… I haven’t talked to those people in a while, it’s just, like, I’m so close to, like…

548 00:47:05.560 ⇒ 00:47:11.600 Uttam Kumaran: I’m trying to distance myself from that whole company and their whole ecosystem, because

549 00:47:12.240 ⇒ 00:47:25.419 Uttam Kumaran: I just don’t fuck with them as business people, so I’m like, I’ve tried… like, we don’t even… a lot of… but you’ll find that, you know how I know Greg from Omni? I know them, I know him through those guys, I know Clint through, like…

550 00:47:25.650 ⇒ 00:47:29.870 Uttam Kumaran: there’s, like, this whole data stuff in New York that I just, like, am, like, out of now. But…

551 00:47:30.000 ⇒ 00:47:31.849 Uttam Kumaran: Let’s just do it, I don’t… whatever.

552 00:47:32.340 ⇒ 00:47:33.139 Uttam Kumaran: That’s fine.

553 00:47:34.250 ⇒ 00:47:43.990 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, cool. I’ll have her put time on your calendar next week, Robert, and I’ll tell her to aim Wednesday through Friday, later in the week.

554 00:47:44.520 ⇒ 00:47:48.709 Robert Tseng: I mean, I will tell her, like, it has to be an NDA, she cannot, like, she’s basically writing for a competitor.

555 00:47:48.710 ⇒ 00:47:56.959 Uttam Kumaran: I basically just say, like, she doesn’t… she’s not allowed to talk about, like, yeah, there’s no… she shouldn’t put a case study, she shouldn’t talk about that are working. Those are standard terms we can do.

556 00:47:57.850 ⇒ 00:48:00.789 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, we could write that in, too.

557 00:48:01.280 ⇒ 00:48:06.629 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, cool. And then… other pending decision would be Hussein, so…

558 00:48:08.360 ⇒ 00:48:09.820 Kaela Gallagher: Tom, it’s up to you.

559 00:48:11.030 ⇒ 00:48:16.590 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I mean, I don’t know, like… I just think, like.

560 00:48:16.850 ⇒ 00:48:19.070 Robert Tseng: Wait, what’s his rate? We kept saying he was expensive.

561 00:48:19.070 ⇒ 00:48:20.030 Uttam Kumaran: 180.

562 00:48:20.230 ⇒ 00:48:21.810 Robert Tseng: Oh, okay.

563 00:48:22.630 ⇒ 00:48:29.499 Uttam Kumaran: His rate’s 180, and also, like, my original thinking about why we needed him was, I was like, okay, Demi.

564 00:48:31.370 ⇒ 00:48:33.380 Kaela Gallagher: He can do DE and AE.

565 00:48:38.130 ⇒ 00:48:41.969 Kaela Gallagher: was… was… I think your original train of thought.

566 00:48:43.880 ⇒ 00:48:44.650 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.

567 00:48:44.930 ⇒ 00:48:51.150 Kaela Gallagher: My… Robert, my take here is, if we can’t do a 180, that’s okay.

568 00:48:52.060 ⇒ 00:49:04.249 Kaela Gallagher: I don’t think we should just turn him down, though. Like, I feel like we should at least come in with an offer that’s more in normal range, and see how he responds. Like, it can’t hurt to just do that.

569 00:49:04.540 ⇒ 00:49:05.190 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

570 00:49:06.780 ⇒ 00:49:07.370 Kaela Gallagher: Like, we…

571 00:49:07.370 ⇒ 00:49:08.430 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

572 00:49:09.790 ⇒ 00:49:18.390 Robert Tseng: I mean, is there a world where we would take him? Like, what… he… is there… I mean, I know he’s expensive, but I… you know, is there a world where he kind of…

573 00:49:18.710 ⇒ 00:49:22.570 Robert Tseng: basically, it’s just, like, I kind of view him as… could he be, like, a…

574 00:49:22.700 ⇒ 00:49:25.639 Robert Tseng: better Ashwini, I don’t know if that’s it.

575 00:49:25.640 ⇒ 00:49:28.669 Uttam Kumaran: Well, yeah, I mean, right now, Ashwini is, like, sort of on the block.

576 00:49:28.820 ⇒ 00:49:29.550 Uttam Kumaran: So…

577 00:49:29.550 ⇒ 00:49:33.359 Robert Tseng: like, if we swap him out, Ashwini Plus, he’s got…

578 00:49:33.360 ⇒ 00:49:35.170 Uttam Kumaran: But Schwini’s not that expensive.

579 00:49:37.080 ⇒ 00:49:43.380 Robert Tseng: Yeah, but if he could do that plus DE work, he’s like, he’s replacing Ashwini’s work and doing… doing some more.

580 00:49:43.380 ⇒ 00:49:44.490 Kaela Gallagher: to team up.

581 00:49:44.690 ⇒ 00:49:45.290 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

582 00:49:45.290 ⇒ 00:49:49.849 Kaela Gallagher: Utham, did you think he could potentially be, like, even CSO in the future?

583 00:49:50.080 ⇒ 00:49:53.350 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I’m just more interested, actually, just because he’s US.

584 00:49:53.510 ⇒ 00:49:57.620 Uttam Kumaran: And we don’t have any U.S, like, Near A’s.

585 00:50:02.760 ⇒ 00:50:06.620 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, if you want to take the weekend to sleep on it, that’s fine.

586 00:50:06.620 ⇒ 00:50:15.959 Uttam Kumaran: I would just wish… I wish that one guy who we interviewed… I forgot what his name was. It’s like a mid-level AE. He, like, interviewed really well, but then he, like.

587 00:50:16.950 ⇒ 00:50:18.200 Kaela Gallagher: I just didn’t know.

588 00:50:18.200 ⇒ 00:50:19.750 Uttam Kumaran: I think so.

589 00:50:19.750 ⇒ 00:50:21.419 Robert Tseng: Like, talked over everyone, that guy?

590 00:50:21.420 ⇒ 00:50:25.229 Uttam Kumaran: No, no, no, this is for AE. He, like, he got to the end, but just…

591 00:50:25.380 ⇒ 00:50:27.399 Uttam Kumaran: was not good enough at DBT.

592 00:50:27.660 ⇒ 00:50:28.420 Uttam Kumaran: David…

593 00:50:28.420 ⇒ 00:50:29.789 Kaela Gallagher: I think, yeah.

594 00:50:29.790 ⇒ 00:50:31.329 Uttam Kumaran: We need to find, like, a Demi.

595 00:50:31.820 ⇒ 00:50:35.540 Uttam Kumaran: like, mid-level, Guy just gonna muscle.

596 00:50:35.540 ⇒ 00:50:37.550 Robert Tseng: Another one from Data Culture?

597 00:50:38.650 ⇒ 00:50:46.049 Uttam Kumaran: No, you don’t think I… you don’t think I know… I know all those… I know everybody that’s been in there and left, there was not anybody worth… there’s no one else right now.

598 00:50:46.050 ⇒ 00:50:46.820 Robert Tseng: Okay.

599 00:50:46.820 ⇒ 00:50:54.409 Kaela Gallagher: When I was finding all the founders for those small data consultancies, I was seeing their AEs and their DEs profiles.

600 00:50:54.410 ⇒ 00:50:55.530 Robert Tseng: Good, yeah.

601 00:50:55.530 ⇒ 00:50:56.480 Kaela Gallagher: And I, like.

602 00:50:56.810 ⇒ 00:51:01.679 Kaela Gallagher: I was going to target all of them, but then I was like, if we are trying to…

603 00:51:03.230 ⇒ 00:51:04.310 Uttam Kumaran: We’re not gonna buy all of them.

604 00:51:04.630 ⇒ 00:51:16.740 Kaela Gallagher: and do a deal, and reach out, and, like, they see Brainforge reaching out, like, oh, like, let’s work together. Meanwhile, their engineer gets poached at the same time, like, it might not make the greatest.

605 00:51:16.740 ⇒ 00:51:22.920 Uttam Kumaran: No, the people… the people we’re going after are people whose businesses are already struggling. So, their engineering get poached.

606 00:51:23.310 ⇒ 00:51:25.610 Uttam Kumaran: They may be, like, Yeah.

607 00:51:26.210 ⇒ 00:51:26.679 Kaela Gallagher: my phone?

608 00:51:27.860 ⇒ 00:51:39.620 Kaela Gallagher: My follow-up to this was gonna be, Robert, like, if those fall through or aren’t responding, or you just say, oh, it’s not a good fit for us, like, let me know and I will go target their entire engineering team.

609 00:51:39.830 ⇒ 00:51:54.360 Robert Tseng: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I’ve only kind of floated it… I mean, 2 for 2 are both interested, so, you know, like, under 10 people, agency, been around for, like, at least 3 years, like, I think these guys are all, like.

610 00:51:54.540 ⇒ 00:51:57.170 Robert Tseng: They’re feeling the heat of the grind, like.

611 00:51:57.170 ⇒ 00:51:59.279 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, this thing is hella hard. I think you’ve

612 00:51:59.700 ⇒ 00:52:06.829 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t feel any mind on poaching whoever from anywhere, you know, so I don’t… I think you should do it.

613 00:52:07.340 ⇒ 00:52:11.139 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I think that’s, like, again, this is where I think Kayla, like.

614 00:52:11.390 ⇒ 00:52:16.810 Uttam Kumaran: Going into the market, just posting, you’re gonna see the applicants, but the best people are not often, like.

615 00:52:17.090 ⇒ 00:52:17.949 Uttam Kumaran: In the market.

616 00:52:17.950 ⇒ 00:52:19.070 Robert Tseng: The one’s looking, yeah.

617 00:52:19.070 ⇒ 00:52:23.930 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, and so go take them, because we’re a much better place to work than any of those places.

618 00:52:23.930 ⇒ 00:52:24.350 Kaela Gallagher: Right.

619 00:52:24.350 ⇒ 00:52:33.299 Uttam Kumaran: Not only from, like, a learning perspective, like, even, like, you may see that ours, like, we work really, like, hard, and things are, like, seem on fire, but…

620 00:52:33.440 ⇒ 00:52:37.040 Uttam Kumaran: Not like… this is a different type of fire than it is there.

621 00:52:37.530 ⇒ 00:52:42.089 Uttam Kumaran: Like, you’re work there, you’re working with people that are bad, you’re working for clients that are mean.

622 00:52:42.380 ⇒ 00:52:49.369 Uttam Kumaran: You’re like, it’s like a real… there’s no intermingling in the consultancy, like, we should go after those people 100%, yeah.

623 00:52:49.370 ⇒ 00:52:50.410 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

624 00:52:50.410 ⇒ 00:52:53.470 Uttam Kumaran: In fact, I prefer that they have agency background, like.

625 00:52:53.470 ⇒ 00:52:55.129 Kaela Gallagher: No, I know.

626 00:52:55.130 ⇒ 00:52:56.099 Uttam Kumaran: You know, so I…

627 00:52:56.100 ⇒ 00:53:01.010 Robert Tseng: Navy has been good, because he’s had this background before. Yeah. Yeah.

628 00:53:01.470 ⇒ 00:53:03.329 Kaela Gallagher: Well, that’s how I found, like.

629 00:53:03.490 ⇒ 00:53:08.089 Kaela Gallagher: Hussein, too, or Mojave, or these people that made it to finals, so…

630 00:53:08.350 ⇒ 00:53:12.510 Uttam Kumaran: No, this was a strat… this was… I was gonna do this… we’ve actually done this in the past.

631 00:53:13.090 ⇒ 00:53:20.259 Uttam Kumaran: I DM’d, like… yeah, we ran some DM campaign for my account to a bunch of competitors, so… I think it’s totally fair.

632 00:53:20.560 ⇒ 00:53:21.990 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah. Okay.

633 00:53:21.990 ⇒ 00:53:25.230 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t have, like, we don’t have non-competes with these random companies, right? Like…

634 00:53:25.720 ⇒ 00:53:26.650 Kaela Gallagher: I’m the.

635 00:53:27.560 ⇒ 00:53:32.669 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I don’t know, it’s the individual’s decision, what’s I gotta do? Yeah, I think you go for it.

636 00:53:32.840 ⇒ 00:53:41.760 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah, okay, cool. And then, last people thing would be Miranda, her… Trial ends today.

637 00:53:45.710 ⇒ 00:53:47.449 Robert Tseng: What do you think? Did she turn around?

638 00:53:47.770 ⇒ 00:53:53.769 Uttam Kumaran: No. I haven’t… there hasn’t been anything. I haven’t gotten anything. I’m doing… dude, I’m the one doing all this stuff.

639 00:53:54.820 ⇒ 00:53:58.029 Uttam Kumaran: So, you can look in the platform team to see

640 00:53:58.210 ⇒ 00:54:02.120 Uttam Kumaran: basically all the messages. So, from my perspective, I don’t…

641 00:54:02.790 ⇒ 00:54:06.199 Uttam Kumaran: see that anything’s changed. I haven’t received any, like, deliverable.

642 00:54:07.000 ⇒ 00:54:21.869 Uttam Kumaran: Ultimately, my ask for her was, go meet with all the people who gave feedback last week, get their sign-off on the plan, and then deliver me the plan. Because ultimately, I’m gonna take the plan, and I’m just gonna hand it to the AI, and be like, build the thing.

643 00:54:22.260 ⇒ 00:54:27.580 Uttam Kumaran: It’s like the old… that would be really nice, because then I don’t have to go build the PRD, so…

644 00:54:28.040 ⇒ 00:54:33.869 Uttam Kumaran: But… Yeah, otherwise, I… I don’t know, I didn’t really see, like, anything beyond…

645 00:54:34.720 ⇒ 00:54:41.739 Uttam Kumaran: I think she listened in that she gave daily updates on Slack, but it was a little bit too, like, okay, you want Slack updates? I’ll give you Slack updates, like…

646 00:54:42.060 ⇒ 00:54:43.650 Uttam Kumaran: You know what I mean?

647 00:54:44.240 ⇒ 00:54:44.990 Uttam Kumaran: I…

648 00:54:45.510 ⇒ 00:54:50.710 Uttam Kumaran: It’s also… it’s also tough, dude. This is, like, really kind of advanced, and I think, like, even B…

649 00:54:50.880 ⇒ 00:54:53.170 Uttam Kumaran: You’re seeing it, like.

650 00:54:54.290 ⇒ 00:54:58.000 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t know, I think there’s just levels on the AI side, but I don’t know, what do you think?

651 00:55:00.260 ⇒ 00:55:13.920 B: Well, I think that, you know, I agree with you, that it felt like she was checking the box when it comes to the async communications, but I still feel like when it comes to speed and execution, it didn’t improve that much.

652 00:55:14.150 ⇒ 00:55:22.380 B: My main call-out is that I was asking her to, like, record the demo since Monday, and then it’s not yet out.

653 00:55:22.810 ⇒ 00:55:30.829 B: Today, and I feel like she doesn’t really understand open work that much, and considering that it is her only project right now.

654 00:55:34.030 ⇒ 00:55:36.939 B: I just didn’t see that much progress this week.

655 00:55:43.860 ⇒ 00:55:49.070 Uttam Kumaran: What was… yeah. So, I mean, I don’t know, I think this is tough. I think it had at least seen, like.

656 00:55:49.270 ⇒ 00:56:03.790 Uttam Kumaran: someone that’s, like… like, I think with Garrett, I’m seeing that he has the chops to do it. I’m just seeing that, like, he doesn’t get, like, how fast and how serious it is here. Like, it’s my perspective. This is what happens to a lot of people, like, it happened with Greg.

657 00:56:04.040 ⇒ 00:56:07.800 Uttam Kumaran: You kind of, like, shake… you just shake people, and then they, like…

658 00:56:08.080 ⇒ 00:56:18.929 Uttam Kumaran: they wake up again, and, like, what it’s like to be a really awesome employee. They forget, because you’re at Disney or wherever the fuck you’re at, you know? And that’s great, because then we turn them into rock stars, right?

659 00:56:19.260 ⇒ 00:56:21.510 Uttam Kumaran: I think with Miranda, I’m like, the pro…

660 00:56:21.620 ⇒ 00:56:24.370 Uttam Kumaran: The core product management skillset is in there.

661 00:56:25.200 ⇒ 00:56:28.460 Uttam Kumaran: And they, I think, is, like, re… I think it’s…

662 00:56:29.670 ⇒ 00:56:35.790 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t know, I think it’s really tough, like, even if you had core product management instincts, it would take time, but…

663 00:56:36.090 ⇒ 00:56:43.519 Uttam Kumaran: I think the first part is super necessary, like, how do you write a PRD? What are user stories, like, doing… conducting user interviews?

664 00:56:43.980 ⇒ 00:56:47.189 Uttam Kumaran: And, like, I just didn’t… didn’t see that, you know?

665 00:56:49.210 ⇒ 00:56:55.669 Kaela Gallagher: But yeah, I think you should add that to our official learning and development plan. Shake people until they wake up.

666 00:56:56.880 ⇒ 00:57:04.509 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, no, we should… these have to be manu- this has to be a manufactured process in our onboarding, I think, like…

667 00:57:06.220 ⇒ 00:57:08.390 Uttam Kumaran: Startup people kinda get it.

668 00:57:09.580 ⇒ 00:57:14.079 Uttam Kumaran: Startup people, because they have this frantic energy, they’re used to, like, messy situations.

669 00:57:14.420 ⇒ 00:57:18.750 Uttam Kumaran: They’re good, but then what they lack is they push out half-baked stuff.

670 00:57:19.810 ⇒ 00:57:24.990 Uttam Kumaran: So then you have to correct that piece. With people who are just, like, at bigger companies.

671 00:57:25.490 ⇒ 00:57:28.800 Uttam Kumaran: And clearly, like, want to be around folks like us that are serious.

672 00:57:29.430 ⇒ 00:57:32.350 Uttam Kumaran: Their thing is execution timing, you know?

673 00:57:32.990 ⇒ 00:57:33.360 Kaela Gallagher: I feel it.

674 00:57:33.360 ⇒ 00:57:36.139 Uttam Kumaran: Like, you know, sometimes execution timing and, like.

675 00:57:36.330 ⇒ 00:57:39.570 Uttam Kumaran: oh, I’m really gonna, like, get called on, like, I’m gonna have to talk…

676 00:57:40.750 ⇒ 00:57:47.770 Uttam Kumaran: What is that, like, what is that, like, a speech? Matt, what is the speech group where you, like, give speeches about stuff?

677 00:57:48.200 ⇒ 00:57:48.570 Robert Tseng: Toastm.

678 00:57:48.570 ⇒ 00:58:01.890 Uttam Kumaran: Toastmasters? Toastmasters, yeah, it’s like Toastmasters, right? You’re like, okay, every day you’re gonna come out with, like… like, Greg, like, Garrett was like, hey, Jasmine, you’re already talking to Shivani, can you just send this? It’s like, no, dude. Like…

679 00:58:01.990 ⇒ 00:58:16.120 Uttam Kumaran: The goal is you are talking to Shivani, and Greg is talking to Shivani, and Jasmine is talking to Shivani. There’s no gap for her to, like, talk to anybody else. This is a design choice, like, you have to say something. Don’t optimize that piece.

680 00:58:16.120 ⇒ 00:58:16.599 Kaela Gallagher: Oh my god.

681 00:58:16.600 ⇒ 00:58:20.599 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, it’s just funny, I just think those are some things we have to teach sometimes, so…

682 00:58:21.930 ⇒ 00:58:27.420 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah. Okay, well, I think we definitely had, like, learnings from…

683 00:58:27.880 ⇒ 00:58:28.390 Uttam Kumaran: Totally.

684 00:58:28.390 ⇒ 00:58:30.750 Kaela Gallagher: Miranda, regardless.

685 00:58:30.750 ⇒ 00:58:38.649 Uttam Kumaran: I think she, like, yeah, in a year or whatever, if she goes somewhere and actually does product stuff, she’s gonna… she’s gonna realize what it was we’re looking for.

686 00:58:39.140 ⇒ 00:58:44.879 Uttam Kumaran: And so I don’t think… I don’t… I don’t feel… I think we should… if anything, we should try to help her find her role or something.

687 00:58:46.660 ⇒ 00:58:48.660 Robert Tseng: Can I, like.

688 00:58:49.270 ⇒ 00:58:50.590 Uttam Kumaran: Or you make a pitch.

689 00:58:50.960 ⇒ 00:59:04.339 Robert Tseng: Can I bring her over and go to marketing? Just tell her, alright, you’re done with the product management thing, if you’re gonna have a role here, you gotta do… you gotta send… you gotta… yeah, you gotta… you gotta help me send campaigns, like… That’s…

690 00:59:04.340 ⇒ 00:59:12.799 Uttam Kumaran: And that’s a fool-me-twice conversation that you can… you can… you can take on. Ivan, like, we’ve done this before, we’ve been here before.

691 00:59:13.060 ⇒ 00:59:14.270 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

692 00:59:14.890 ⇒ 00:59:21.829 Uttam Kumaran: Why do you always want to go-to-market to get, like, the second… the second… the second round for people? You think they’re gonna, like…

693 00:59:22.570 ⇒ 00:59:26.389 Uttam Kumaran: they’re gonna be like, whoa, I awoken, I’m like a seller. It’s like…

694 00:59:26.600 ⇒ 00:59:30.600 Kaela Gallagher: At least in this case, like, she… her background is go-to-market, right?

695 00:59:30.600 ⇒ 00:59:42.510 Robert Tseng: Yeah, it’s, like, a little bit more in her realm, like, I feel like the stakes are lower, like, what the worst thing she does is, like, message my old boss on accident in LinkedIn, like, I don’t care, like, you know?

696 00:59:42.510 ⇒ 00:59:47.599 Uttam Kumaran: No, but dude, it’s just another, like… it’s just another person, another, like…

697 00:59:47.940 ⇒ 00:59:56.220 Uttam Kumaran: I’m feeling that pain, and that, like, having people… although I love employing and having people on the team, it’s just another, like…

698 00:59:56.390 ⇒ 01:00:00.220 Uttam Kumaran: Piece to manage, or if it’s… you’re not managing, someone is gonna have to manage it.

699 01:00:00.470 ⇒ 01:00:04.789 Uttam Kumaran: Right? Yeah, I mean… I mean, now you have Lisa and Miranda on the same team, it’s like…

700 01:00:05.190 ⇒ 01:00:05.730 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

701 01:00:05.730 ⇒ 01:00:09.649 Uttam Kumaran: Just give Miranda… just give Lisa whatever you’re gonna ask Miranda to do.

702 01:00:11.850 ⇒ 01:00:18.100 Robert Tseng: Well, I mean, so, like, there’s a particular channel, she’s, you know, I’m basically shooting you off messages here and there to, like.

703 01:00:18.270 ⇒ 01:00:31.800 Robert Tseng: Help me get the thing where I can do some cold outbound. Outbound will only be, like, 20% of our sales, I mean, well, at least for now. So she just needs to help run some outbound. Like, if she can do that, then I think that’s…

704 01:00:31.900 ⇒ 01:00:51.370 Robert Tseng: That’s fine, like, she… she just has to know… yeah, between that and, like, Artie is there hardening, kind of, the systems. He’s very reasonable cheap. His goal is, like, within 3 months, we bring in a full-time seller. I don’t expect Miranda to be a seller. She is kind of, like, whatever, RevOps, go-to-market engineering, like, whatever she can do to help…

705 01:00:51.370 ⇒ 01:00:55.530 Uttam Kumaran: But the problem with RevOps go-to-market engineering, that’s just engineering.

706 01:00:55.890 ⇒ 01:01:15.229 Uttam Kumaran: None of… I literally built the… like, I get… I understand that, yes, it’s taking some time to build, but I don’t like Rev… I think RevOps, go-to-market engineering, would just kill that. There’s… we’re not gonna… I think we’re done with that, dude, because, like, what is that, managing HubSpot, creating campaigns? Just get an engineer, like, call Mustafa for 5 hours, have him do whatever.

707 01:01:15.510 ⇒ 01:01:16.680 Uttam Kumaran: Late go-to-market.

708 01:01:16.680 ⇒ 01:01:19.889 Robert Tseng: Well, I mean, that’s what I’m… I mean, I have 50,000 leads in HubSpot, I need somebody to.

709 01:01:19.890 ⇒ 01:01:23.500 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, but like, then let’s talk about… then you can yell at me for about that.

710 01:01:23.840 ⇒ 01:01:27.410 Uttam Kumaran: But, like, getting someone to do go-to-market engineering, that’s just a bad engineer.

711 01:01:31.050 ⇒ 01:01:39.289 Uttam Kumaran: Meaning, like, this is just, like, these are just simple systems someone needs to build. Okay, like, that’s a different conversation than, like, this person comes in as, like.

712 01:01:39.800 ⇒ 01:01:42.150 Uttam Kumaran: Go-to-market engineering, because, like.

713 01:01:42.370 ⇒ 01:01:51.760 Uttam Kumaran: I would rather solve that for you. I’d rather get yelled at and be like, okay, that’s on me, we haven’t gotten that for you. Well, I did get, like, a pretty, like, 80% version of, like, the one-pager builder.

714 01:01:51.770 ⇒ 01:01:52.670 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

715 01:01:52.670 ⇒ 01:01:59.340 Uttam Kumaran: So, like, you can see, and I… that didn’t take, like, so… so you can see, like, we’re… we’re working towards some of the things, but…

716 01:01:59.570 ⇒ 01:02:09.849 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t want to put someone in a go-to-market engineering seat, because I think that’s a fake… I think that’s just a made-up rule. We found… we found this out, like, I think that’s not what we need, actually, more of.

717 01:02:09.850 ⇒ 01:02:16.540 Robert Tseng: Yeah, not a HubSpot specialist, just somebody who’s got, like, some, you know, principles around how, like, sales.

718 01:02:16.540 ⇒ 01:02:22.480 Uttam Kumaran: But how do you know, does she know copywriting? Like, does she know hooks and, like, stuff like that? Like…

719 01:02:23.850 ⇒ 01:02:24.280 Robert Tseng: Right?

720 01:02:24.280 ⇒ 01:02:30.069 Uttam Kumaran: Ryan is nasty at that, but Ryan just never learned our business, like, super well. Wait, dude, the guy, like…

721 01:02:30.420 ⇒ 01:02:31.030 Uttam Kumaran: All he does.

722 01:02:31.030 ⇒ 01:02:37.209 Robert Tseng: We brought her in because we felt like she came from the industry, like, she had some… I mean, you’re saying she kind of like…

723 01:02:37.210 ⇒ 01:02:42.640 Uttam Kumaran: My suspicion is that… my suspicion is she just rode the train… On that startup.

724 01:02:42.940 ⇒ 01:02:43.849 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I don’t know exactly…

725 01:02:43.850 ⇒ 01:02:44.469 Uttam Kumaran: And her phone.

726 01:02:44.470 ⇒ 01:02:59.119 Robert Tseng: market role was before. So, like, I don’t know, like, I mean, I never asked her direct questions about where she would plug in. I think, like, I want to have a conversation with her, and if I’m convinced that, you know, she can really just, like.

727 01:02:59.910 ⇒ 01:03:16.830 Robert Tseng: take… go from idea to creating campaigns and then executing it, then, like, that still is… Hanna can’t do that, like, nobody I brought into the go-to-market… I mean, Ricoh can’t do that, like, nobody else can really do that other than,

728 01:03:18.510 ⇒ 01:03:20.469 Robert Tseng: It goes right now, so…

729 01:03:21.440 ⇒ 01:03:22.560 Kaela Gallagher: Question.

730 01:03:23.260 ⇒ 01:03:26.329 Kaela Gallagher: Robert, do you see this as a…

731 01:03:27.070 ⇒ 01:03:37.339 Kaela Gallagher: Like, something you just need short-term support with until an account executive comes in, or do you see this as a long-term need for your team?

732 01:03:37.630 ⇒ 01:03:39.720 Kaela Gallagher: The reason I’m asking is because…

733 01:03:40.310 ⇒ 01:03:53.970 Kaela Gallagher: we could decide to give her a go-to-market trial and sign a new contract for a month with the go-to-market team. Like, we could work this in a couple different ways.

734 01:03:55.280 ⇒ 01:04:09.239 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, I think with the same hours, I mean, I will try to be as intellectually honest as I can when I talk to her, and just, like, try to… when I’m trying to actually probe her on what she can actually do for, you know, the side.

735 01:04:09.240 ⇒ 01:04:15.560 Uttam Kumaran: I just wouldn’t ask her to vibe code stuff or code stuff. Like, I would ask her to set the strategy, or like.

736 01:04:15.770 ⇒ 01:04:21.249 Uttam Kumaran: yeah, write the copy, or whatever, like, you know, things like that. But if you’re like, hey, build me this…

737 01:04:22.060 ⇒ 01:04:24.699 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t see that happening, you know?

738 01:04:26.460 ⇒ 01:04:27.290 Robert Tseng: You see what I mean?

739 01:04:28.580 ⇒ 01:04:35.370 Robert Tseng: But she becomes basically the PM for me to, like, kind of pass the requirements. I’m just shooting you off random HubSpot messages.

740 01:04:35.370 ⇒ 01:04:36.290 Uttam Kumaran: It’s fair, but then…

741 01:04:36.290 ⇒ 01:04:49.459 Robert Tseng: the engineer, and then she’s also, like, you know, hopefully she can come up with… I mean, best case scenario, she’s able to take just, like, my half-baked ideas and turn them into real campaign briefs.

742 01:04:49.930 ⇒ 01:05:00.250 Robert Tseng: And then, like, that can just be executed… that can be executed on. Once she has the campaign brief, then Rico and Hannah can run it. But, like, if I’m saying…

743 01:05:00.800 ⇒ 01:05:02.829 Robert Tseng: I mean, yeah, like, I just…

744 01:05:03.290 ⇒ 01:05:13.339 Robert Tseng: 50,000… I have 50,000 leads in this legal industry. We have a few different angles that we can… that we can go and hit them. I’m not gonna hit them all at the same campaign. Know what should…

745 01:05:13.340 ⇒ 01:05:27.459 Robert Tseng: pitch… pitch the contextual offer, pitch the, the open code offer, like, kind of split it up into a series of campaigns, and, like, start to sequence them. Figure out how many… how many you’re gonna put into each one. Like, I just need her to…

746 01:05:27.460 ⇒ 01:05:30.140 Robert Tseng: to… if she can… if she can do that, I think that’s…

747 01:05:30.220 ⇒ 01:05:48.299 Robert Tseng: That’s… that’s helpful. I don’t need her doing lead list building, enrichment, or… or whatever, and… and then if I have requirements for, like, you to build on the go-to-market size, she can keep me more organized on… on… on that. That’s the role that I have. I have… I… I would like to.

748 01:05:48.300 ⇒ 01:05:51.619 Uttam Kumaran: If she reads those two books I gave her, she’ll become a product manager.

749 01:05:51.780 ⇒ 01:05:52.170 Robert Tseng: Yeah, and then…

750 01:05:52.170 ⇒ 01:05:53.240 Uttam Kumaran: It’s like, it’s alright.

751 01:05:53.240 ⇒ 01:05:54.639 Robert Tseng: Maybe she will learn…

752 01:05:54.640 ⇒ 01:06:11.970 Uttam Kumaran: Literally what I did. Those two books, I literally read, I said, okay, I learned, I just did… and I just did that, and I was better than every product manager. I just did what the fucking book… that book said. And so, if she does that, she could… I think she could be a good P… she could basically be a PM for, like, sales, but I also… I don’t know, I also am like…

753 01:06:12.650 ⇒ 01:06:26.679 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t know if we’re gonna need that longer term, so put her in… get her into something where you could see her joining, like, longer term, you know? I think if that’s, like, campaign… yeah, some… something. And yeah, I think she’s, like, yeah, I think you kind of get the deal. So, okay, I’m okay with that.

754 01:06:27.450 ⇒ 01:06:28.140 Robert Tseng: Okay.

755 01:06:29.180 ⇒ 01:06:30.919 B: Wh-wh-what does she want?

756 01:06:31.390 ⇒ 01:06:34.530 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, that’s a… that’s… I mean, I would say…

757 01:06:34.530 ⇒ 01:06:39.450 Robert Tseng: Unless you’re gonna give her the feedback, hey, you know, you’re off this team, she may be like, well.

758 01:06:39.450 ⇒ 01:06:58.360 Uttam Kumaran: Well, I would just say she’s… I would just give her… I’d be positive. I would just say, like, it’s really early, it’s clear, like, I think you have a lot to learn about real product management. Also, this is really difficult, like, you’re doing product management for, like, an emerging technology, working, like, with… under me. It’s, like, the worst nightmare. So I think, like, that’s, like, what you should tell her.

759 01:06:58.360 ⇒ 01:07:00.180 Robert Tseng: Yeah, of course, that’s why I will sell her.

760 01:07:00.180 ⇒ 01:07:08.599 Uttam Kumaran: Well, yeah, we still really want her, we still think she has skill set, we have this role on go-to-market. I think she can take advantage of all the stuff she’s learned.

761 01:07:09.660 ⇒ 01:07:15.320 Uttam Kumaran: And then ask her if that’s, like, kind of what she wants to do, but… I would say…

762 01:07:15.470 ⇒ 01:07:19.830 Uttam Kumaran: The job that she… she was in is that… is the really gold-ticket job.

763 01:07:20.300 ⇒ 01:07:22.460 Uttam Kumaran: Product management on emerging AI tech.

764 01:07:23.580 ⇒ 01:07:25.680 Robert Tseng: Yeah, but she’s just not… maybe she’s not there yet.

765 01:07:26.020 ⇒ 01:07:30.140 Robert Tseng: Instead, doing, like, lighter product management for, like, one… For the sales one.

766 01:07:30.140 ⇒ 01:07:30.620 Uttam Kumaran: team.

767 01:07:30.620 ⇒ 01:07:36.980 Robert Tseng: And also, she’ll be doing stuff for some sales demos, like, instead of me, like, kind of translating that into, like.

768 01:07:37.050 ⇒ 01:07:53.080 Robert Tseng: you’re, like, basically PMing for some half-baked demos, like, I mean, that’s… at least that’s, like, to me, that’s more entry-level product manager. Entry-level product manager, you go into a company, your first thing is you’re just, like, moving button from here to that, and you’re, like, A-B testing that, you know?

769 01:07:53.080 ⇒ 01:07:57.340 Uttam Kumaran: But dude, I will… like, why do we have that here? Like, what?

770 01:07:57.340 ⇒ 01:08:09.569 Robert Tseng: I’m not equating it to that, but I’m just saying, she cannot come in and understand, like, the whole vision for what you’re doing. It has to be, like, a smaller slice. And what this would be is a smaller slice.

771 01:08:10.420 ⇒ 01:08:13.029 Kaela Gallagher: Robert, do you think having her…

772 01:08:13.230 ⇒ 01:08:18.569 Kaela Gallagher: on go-to-market would help fill Hannah’s mat leave gap.

773 01:08:19.330 ⇒ 01:08:22.159 Robert Tseng: I mean, that would also be ideal, yeah, so…

774 01:08:22.160 ⇒ 01:08:22.710 Kaela Gallagher: Okay.

775 01:08:25.620 ⇒ 01:08:27.340 Kaela Gallagher: Copy that.

776 01:08:27.340 ⇒ 01:08:39.829 Robert Tseng: Tom’s already automating… kind of automating a lot of the design, like, any of the ops stuff. Like, there’s a creative eye that Hannah has, like, that maybe Miranda doesn’t, but as far as everything else that Hannah does to support.

777 01:08:39.830 ⇒ 01:08:55.910 Uttam Kumaran: But one thing I worked with Hannah on is templatizing everything. We templated everything, because I knew that something like this would happen at some point, and I was like, we… we can’t be, like, just vibing and making design. It has to be, like, this is the deck template, this is the one-pager template, this is the white paper template, we have those.

778 01:08:55.910 ⇒ 01:09:04.499 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. So, I feel like we’re close. The biggest thing, I think I asked Rico for this, is I said, Rico, like, before Hannah goes, like, give me the list of, like, all of the tasks.

779 01:09:04.540 ⇒ 01:09:06.669 Uttam Kumaran: So I can start to build a little bit of a roadmap.

780 01:09:06.779 ⇒ 01:09:15.930 Uttam Kumaran: And ideally, when Hannah gets back, she’s more steering, and she’s doing more creative work, like, actually, like, thinking about, like, how to think about brand and stuff like that, you know, broadly.

781 01:09:16.390 ⇒ 01:09:17.160 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah.

782 01:09:17.270 ⇒ 01:09:26.209 Kaela Gallagher: Okay. So, Robert, since her trial ends today, and so does, like, our existing contract with her, if you can let me know…

783 01:09:26.649 ⇒ 01:09:29.639 Kaela Gallagher: I don’t know, maybe over the weekend. Yeah.

784 01:09:29.649 ⇒ 01:09:35.819 Robert Tseng: I’ll try to give her a call. I mean, I will give her a call, over the weekend. I gotta run in a few minutes, but yeah.

785 01:09:35.819 ⇒ 01:09:43.689 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, okay. And then for Garrett, too, I know you were messaging in the chat, but let me know if you want me to give him

786 01:09:43.969 ⇒ 01:09:48.049 Kaela Gallagher: a ring. Like, I’ve known him for a while, so maybe if stuff comes from me, it’ll hit… it’ll.

787 01:09:48.050 ⇒ 01:09:52.390 Uttam Kumaran: No, I… yeah, yeah, I think that could be good, but Robert, like, how did a call go? And, like, yeah.

788 01:09:53.060 ⇒ 01:10:00.830 Robert Tseng: Well, I mean, I see you responding to him on the thread. I delivered your message to him in a little softer way, and then also, like.

789 01:10:00.930 ⇒ 01:10:06.410 Robert Tseng: I mean, you can… like I said, I think he… he didn’t take the feedback well at first, I think he was… I think…

790 01:10:06.640 ⇒ 01:10:14.439 Robert Tseng: I think he’s just a little bit like, oh, like, you know, like, everyone is when they first kind of get some feedback.

791 01:10:14.440 ⇒ 01:10:16.960 Uttam Kumaran: Feedback on your second week, that’s, like, not typical, yeah.

792 01:10:16.960 ⇒ 01:10:18.190 Robert Tseng: Yeah, yeah, and it’s also.

793 01:10:18.190 ⇒ 01:10:28.330 Uttam Kumaran: So, like, my feedback is not gonna be like, hey, you did so well, and, like, I love this. If you just make this small tweak, it’s gonna be like, you didn’t do this, you didn’t do this, you didn’t do this, but on the side, you already know me.

794 01:10:28.570 ⇒ 01:10:31.120 Uttam Kumaran: Like, it should… you should see that that’s, like.

795 01:10:31.650 ⇒ 01:10:34.400 Uttam Kumaran: that’s the case, right? But I’m surprised that he didn’t, like.

796 01:10:34.860 ⇒ 01:10:39.430 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I feel like he would be like, oh yeah, yeah, that makes sense, like, I’ll… You know?

797 01:10:39.430 ⇒ 01:11:03.350 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think he put… his pushback was, like, I’m getting pulled in too many directions, like, oh, I, like… and, like, he… I was like, alright, pull up your linear, show me, like, what… how you’re thinking about it. Show me his open tickets, he showed me what his priorities were. Like, a lot of it is platform stuff, you know, and it’s, like, platform and default, and then, like, something about, I mean, I don’t know, just, like, I don’t think he knows how to prioritize. We’re just, like, chucking him tickets, and then he’s just…

798 01:11:03.350 ⇒ 01:11:05.320 Uttam Kumaran: Dude, no, I told… I told him, don’t…

799 01:11:05.320 ⇒ 01:11:06.619 Robert Tseng: He’s not prioritizing it, you know what I mean.

800 01:11:06.620 ⇒ 01:11:12.660 Uttam Kumaran: No, no, I was… I did exactly what I told you guys I would do on Monday. I did that. I said, element…

801 01:11:13.110 ⇒ 01:11:17.239 Uttam Kumaran: is a number one. That doesn’t close, do not do any of this other stuff.

802 01:11:17.370 ⇒ 01:11:22.969 Uttam Kumaran: I literally said that, and I told Greg, I said, this is also what I’m telling him. I said, his job is to get element done. I said.

803 01:11:23.390 ⇒ 01:11:33.210 Uttam Kumaran: you’re gonna get… I’m gonna just throw tickets into a backlog for a platform, which is… it’s a platform… it’s actually nothing on platform, it’s… it’s… it’s like, create the data documentation.

804 01:11:33.210 ⇒ 01:11:35.209 Robert Tseng: Standards or templates, yeah, yeah, yeah.

805 01:11:35.210 ⇒ 01:11:39.350 Uttam Kumaran: Man, I said, I’m just gonna create these, you take them if you have… when you have… you have time.

806 01:11:40.400 ⇒ 01:11:44.329 Robert Tseng: Yeah, it’s only, like, 20% of your time should be on that stuff. 80% should be…

807 01:11:44.330 ⇒ 01:11:49.240 Uttam Kumaran: Nothing should happen until, like, yo, every day, everybody on Element… like, Element is cruising.

808 01:11:50.140 ⇒ 01:11:53.200 Uttam Kumaran: I was like, I tried to make that pretty clear, too, you know?

809 01:11:53.580 ⇒ 01:11:54.210 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

810 01:11:55.260 ⇒ 01:11:58.880 Robert Tseng: Well, yeah, I mean, I just don’t think that’s really sunk in. Okay, okay.

811 01:11:58.880 ⇒ 01:11:59.300 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

812 01:11:59.300 ⇒ 01:11:59.940 Robert Tseng: O.

813 01:12:00.460 ⇒ 01:12:02.800 Kaela Gallagher: Robert, when’s your next one-on-one with him?

814 01:12:02.800 ⇒ 01:12:07.740 Robert Tseng: I meet with him on Tuesdays. It seems like he talks to Utam and me both on Tuesdays, so maybe we need to.

815 01:12:07.740 ⇒ 01:12:15.450 Uttam Kumaran: No, no, I’m not doing… I’m not doing any recurings anymore with any… so I’m just… I call people when I just get a chance to call people.

816 01:12:15.580 ⇒ 01:12:20.350 Uttam Kumaran: So I call him, and I call the CSOs, like, every other day or so, just, like, randomly.

817 01:12:20.900 ⇒ 01:12:21.470 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

818 01:12:22.090 ⇒ 01:12:27.559 Robert Tseng: I mean, I meet with him on Tuesdays, yeah. That’s the only day I do one-on-ones with people.

819 01:12:27.560 ⇒ 01:12:28.090 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah.

820 01:12:28.140 ⇒ 01:12:28.810 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

821 01:12:30.280 ⇒ 01:12:32.799 Kaela Gallagher: Okay, keep me posted how it goes on Tuesday.

822 01:12:33.040 ⇒ 01:12:33.770 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

823 01:12:33.770 ⇒ 01:12:45.399 Uttam Kumaran: I think it’s worth calling him, Kayla, and, like, just… I don’t know, I think it’s worth being, like, how’s it going? Like, how’s… I don’t know if you already are asking him, sort of, like, how’s it going, but, like… Yeah. I think you can give him some insight into, like, how we think, and maybe, like.

824 01:12:45.790 ⇒ 01:12:52.150 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t… I… I really… I couldn’t see him being defensive, I think he’s probably open to it, but it is probably a shock.

825 01:12:52.300 ⇒ 01:13:03.669 Uttam Kumaran: to get really direct feedback, and it is telling in that moment, like, how people deal with it. But you also can mention, like, yo, if you just hit the things, like, gonna be in a good spot, so…

826 01:13:03.840 ⇒ 01:13:08.990 Uttam Kumaran: ask for help if the one thing’s not clear. I would much rather be like, yeah, we were unclear, here’s what

827 01:13:09.360 ⇒ 01:13:11.819 Uttam Kumaran: Versus, like, we just keep rolling.

828 01:13:12.300 ⇒ 01:13:25.240 Kaela Gallagher: Yeah, I’ll just give him a ring and frame it from, like, a, oh, like, how’s your ramp-up plan going? Like, like we said, if he’s hitting everything in the ramp-up plan, like, he should be on track, like…

829 01:13:25.240 ⇒ 01:13:25.770 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

830 01:13:25.770 ⇒ 01:13:36.369 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, but you can even ask him candidly, like, what do you think so far, like, does he like it here, all this stuff. I don’t… I don’t mind, I just… I… I explicitly messaged him being like, yo, the feedback is gonna come like this.

831 01:13:36.480 ⇒ 01:13:42.209 Uttam Kumaran: No matter what. I’m not gonna change that. But, we want you to win, and so that may be a different…

832 01:13:42.470 ⇒ 01:13:47.740 Uttam Kumaran: That may be different than you’re used to when… usually when you get this type of feedback, the person’s trying to get you out.

833 01:13:47.960 ⇒ 01:14:05.700 Uttam Kumaran: Right, right. I’m not trying… I’m actively trying to be like, you need to win. Do these things, please. Like, wake up and send the tickets. And then B knows this, I’m like, dude, just do the thing, like, just do… wake up and send people tickets. Wake up and say, these are the tickets, guys, and then do what Greg does, which is like, I’m not hearing anything, I’m not hearing, like…

834 01:14:05.900 ⇒ 01:14:06.889 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, just like…

835 01:14:07.670 ⇒ 01:14:08.460 Uttam Kumaran: Rhythm!

836 01:14:08.620 ⇒ 01:14:24.999 Kaela Gallagher: Well, I did do it… I did do a one-week check-in with him on… on Monday, so I’m doing one-week and 30-day check-ins with everybody that onboards, and he was saying he feels like it’s going well so far, so… yeah, I’ll just give him another ring this afternoon.

837 01:14:25.000 ⇒ 01:14:28.830 Uttam Kumaran: No, I think it’s… I think it’s going well. I think this is… this is what Well looks like, I just think.

838 01:14:28.830 ⇒ 01:14:30.600 Kaela Gallagher: Sometimes it’s, like, people.

839 01:14:30.600 ⇒ 01:14:40.690 Uttam Kumaran: aren’t useless. If this was day 60, then yeah, it would be a not-well category, you know? I feel like we are good at… we’re giving feedback early and earlier, like, I feel like we’re doing better.

840 01:14:40.690 ⇒ 01:14:42.179 Kaela Gallagher: We’re developing a ramp-up plan.

841 01:14:42.180 ⇒ 01:14:50.110 Uttam Kumaran: Usually, me and Robert would call, and then we’d be like, I don’t know, and then, like, we’d be like, maybe we’re the assholes, and then we’d shut off, like…

842 01:14:50.110 ⇒ 01:14:51.130 Kaela Gallagher: Oh, God.

843 01:14:51.130 ⇒ 01:14:56.890 Uttam Kumaran: You know, now I’m like, yo, this is like a pattern, I think we see it, let’s just be direct with people, and…

844 01:14:57.430 ⇒ 01:14:58.310 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.

845 01:14:58.780 ⇒ 01:14:59.809 Kaela Gallagher: This is great.

846 01:15:00.820 ⇒ 01:15:10.330 Kaela Gallagher: Cool. Well, that was a lot, but thanks for listening to all my people things, guys. I think that’s all I have. And we can start the book club later.

847 01:15:10.330 ⇒ 01:15:10.920 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

848 01:15:11.050 ⇒ 01:15:14.380 Uttam Kumaran: V, do you have anything from L&D? Yeah.

849 01:15:14.380 ⇒ 01:15:21.069 B: Yeah, we launched, like, basically everything, all the courses that we have right now, the axillary…

850 01:15:21.070 ⇒ 01:15:22.969 Uttam Kumaran: Rob, have you seen this stuff in the platform?

851 01:15:22.970 ⇒ 01:15:25.800 Robert Tseng: Well, he demoed it during the meeting missed.

852 01:15:26.020 ⇒ 01:15:26.430 Uttam Kumaran: Dude, I.

853 01:15:26.430 ⇒ 01:15:26.790 B: Yeah.

854 01:15:26.790 ⇒ 01:15:28.609 Uttam Kumaran: My whole power went out.

855 01:15:28.610 ⇒ 01:15:34.149 Robert Tseng: While you were riding… while you were horseback riding. I took a picture of your… of what you sent me, and I sent it to the team.

856 01:15:36.180 ⇒ 01:15:37.210 B: Yeah, so, like.

857 01:15:37.210 ⇒ 01:15:39.740 Uttam Kumaran: That was my dressage lesson.

858 01:15:41.750 ⇒ 01:15:44.120 B: All the standards are there, so it will be, like.

859 01:15:44.340 ⇒ 01:16:00.240 B: we can… we can create courses now within 3 minutes, within… within 30 minutes the next time around, so it’s going to be much easier. I kind of focus on, actually, like, teaching stuff and being on the ground, like, 80% of the time. Okay. Certifications for Omni, 3 over 6,

860 01:16:00.240 ⇒ 01:16:06.320 B: I’m not hearing anything from Jasmine, and I think Amber is pushing her on that one, on that side.

861 01:16:06.830 ⇒ 01:16:19.790 B: But, yeah, Advait and Amber are taking the time with the studies, because they didn’t want to mess it up, and they’re not as courageous as you three when it comes to, like, submitting the exams as up.

862 01:16:19.790 ⇒ 01:16:28.430 Robert Tseng: Garrett got the same score as me, Greg is gonna get the same score! We’re all using the AI, it’s just, like, not even… I mean, I like…

863 01:16:29.090 ⇒ 01:16:30.010 Robert Tseng: I mean.

864 01:16:30.010 ⇒ 01:16:32.900 Uttam Kumaran: I wasn’t gonna use it, yeah, I was gonna try to do it honestly.

865 01:16:32.900 ⇒ 01:16:45.409 Robert Tseng: Yeah, there’s a few things where AI is literally wrong, but I had, like, I’m like, this doesn’t make any sense. I’m like, I will change… I’ll change my answer. So I, like, I kind of just hustled my way to the… I just thought it was funny that Garrett got the same score.

866 01:16:45.890 ⇒ 01:16:48.050 Uttam Kumaran: I have, like, a deep down, like…

867 01:16:48.240 ⇒ 01:16:55.699 Uttam Kumaran: I’m anti-certi… I’m anti, like, someone else stamping me that I’m good. You know, I just don’t… I don’t want…

868 01:16:55.810 ⇒ 01:16:57.009 Uttam Kumaran: The title, I don’t want…

869 01:16:57.010 ⇒ 01:16:59.359 Robert Tseng: I can’t believe that. We need, we need the certs.

870 01:16:59.360 ⇒ 01:17:00.030 Kaela Gallagher: No.

871 01:17:00.030 ⇒ 01:17:01.730 Uttam Kumaran: No, me personally.

872 01:17:02.250 ⇒ 01:17:08.249 Uttam Kumaran: No, I’ve been telling you, I’ve been asking people to do these for a long time. It’s also for them, for their resumes.

873 01:17:08.250 ⇒ 01:17:09.700 Robert Tseng: a week. Not for…

874 01:17:09.700 ⇒ 01:17:13.539 Uttam Kumaran: Their resume, it’s really good. So, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

875 01:17:13.540 ⇒ 01:17:14.180 B: Yeah.

876 01:17:14.220 ⇒ 01:17:24.139 B: But I think, you know, Omni’s going good so far. For AI and data, Snowflake, I think it’s the other way around, with Mustafa being out, and…

877 01:17:24.160 ⇒ 01:17:41.190 B: with the leaders not actually, like, pushing the certifications, and the IC’s not seeing it from their leaders. It’s a slower, it’s a slower progress, but I’m still confident that, you know, we’ll get the Snowflake certifications sooner or later.

878 01:17:41.190 ⇒ 01:17:59.989 B: When it comes to the DoorDash workflow, I think that’s, like, the most important piece that I’m also pushing, and I think that’s, like, the answer to most of the problems right now with learning and delivery. I just sent, like, 3 packages this week when it comes to DoorDash, then I’m just going to continue doing that.

879 01:18:00.950 ⇒ 01:18:03.060 B: Within the next few days.

880 01:18:03.540 ⇒ 01:18:05.060 B: That, that’s for L&D.

881 01:18:08.970 ⇒ 01:18:20.959 Uttam Kumaran: Cool. Yeah, I wanna, like, I think the convers… well, last piece I’ll just say about delivery, one is, yeah, I mean, I feel like I’m gonna move Sam out of SL, at least temporarily, and…

882 01:18:21.150 ⇒ 01:18:25.280 Uttam Kumaran: I basically… the way I’m gonna construct it is, like, him and B,

883 01:18:25.740 ⇒ 01:18:36.790 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, like, anyone who, like, sort of drops out or is struggling goes through Grow, goes through Kayla, B, and then with whoever their manager is. In this situation, though, like.

884 01:18:36.930 ⇒ 01:18:42.269 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t know, I’ve been pretty clear, I’m not gonna… I don’t really feel like I need to meet with him.

885 01:18:42.430 ⇒ 01:18:50.530 Uttam Kumaran: Except outside of Monday, because I just don’t have time to, so B, you are… you’re really… you have… you have an understanding of, like, expectations for SLs.

886 01:18:50.530 ⇒ 01:18:51.080 B: Yeah.

887 01:18:51.080 ⇒ 01:19:05.419 Uttam Kumaran: So, like, he should work with you, and if he doesn’t work with you, then it’s just not gonna work out. So it’s like, I’m not gonna come over the top. Been really, really explicit with what I want to see. Like, I just need the AI stuff to, like, work, and we can’t be messing that up.

888 01:19:05.650 ⇒ 01:19:17.939 Uttam Kumaran: Pranav is good as a CSO, but he’s not as good technically. And so, like, this is where I want him to just be able to go on and just, like, deliver, and trust his technical counterpart can, like.

889 01:19:18.100 ⇒ 01:19:20.589 Uttam Kumaran: Actually put something together, creatively.

890 01:19:20.840 ⇒ 01:19:25.239 Uttam Kumaran: Like, I’m not really happy with what’s been done for Eden AI so far, like, it’s…

891 01:19:25.420 ⇒ 01:19:41.940 Uttam Kumaran: It’s, like, damn slow, like, how fast, like, what’s… what’s been happening, so I’ll get more involved there, and sort of work with Casey and Mustafa more. And then the other feedback I gave… so I’m also thinking about similarly for… for, Zoran, like, I don’t know if he’s gonna be able to, like.

892 01:19:42.350 ⇒ 01:19:50.570 Uttam Kumaran: I think he has a small slice, but I think he can do that as a senior IC. He hasn’t really leaned in on anything that we’re doing, like, team-wide.

893 01:19:50.730 ⇒ 01:19:56.859 Uttam Kumaran: He hasn’t reached out. I gave him this feedback, like, and Kaylee, you know that, so…

894 01:19:57.060 ⇒ 01:20:01.969 Uttam Kumaran: I’m also gonna basically kind of say the same thing, like, hey, I’m not seeing this, but for both of them, like.

895 01:20:02.190 ⇒ 01:20:10.720 Uttam Kumaran: that’s the only path up. Like, there’s no, like, super senior IC. They can go sell work. So if Zora actually has probably a good shot at helping Robert just sell work as an IC.

896 01:20:10.870 ⇒ 01:20:12.360 Uttam Kumaran: You should just make money that way.

897 01:20:12.360 ⇒ 01:20:12.710 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

898 01:20:13.380 ⇒ 01:20:27.459 Uttam Kumaran: he’s not… he’s not, like, thinking about owning that service line, and so that service line, frankly, is not… it’s just… he’s gonna have a hard time, like, growing it, because ultimately, if you sell the work and it’s not gonna get standardized or packaged, like, what are you gonna do? So…

899 01:20:28.480 ⇒ 01:20:35.800 Uttam Kumaran: I gave him the feedback, he just seems to lean in and spend time, and he’s not doing that, so… I think it’s… that’s fine there, so…

900 01:20:37.610 ⇒ 01:20:38.290 Kaela Gallagher: Chrome.

901 01:20:38.290 ⇒ 01:20:42.980 Uttam Kumaran: And so I may give that… so I may give that service line scope to, like, a WASH.

902 01:20:43.310 ⇒ 01:20:46.819 Uttam Kumaran: And then I’ll take the AI piece. I think Jasmine’s gonna do fine.

903 01:20:47.000 ⇒ 01:20:58.300 Uttam Kumaran: I think Demi, demi and Awash are… are gonna do fine. I think Greg is taking it really seriously, Pranav is taking it super seriously, and then I think Garrett, we’re gonna… we’re gonna kinda see where he fits in.

904 01:20:59.900 ⇒ 01:21:05.459 Uttam Kumaran: But, like, that crowd in there needs to be the loudest people at the company, outside of this group.

905 01:21:05.560 ⇒ 01:21:09.100 Uttam Kumaran: And so, if you don’t talk, you’re gonna get kicked out of the party.

906 01:21:09.300 ⇒ 01:21:18.940 Uttam Kumaran: I’m, like, really… I’m, like, really not happy. Like, if people are like, I’m a leader at the company, and you’re not, like, doing leadership, it’s not… it’s not… we’re not just skate by.

907 01:21:19.250 ⇒ 01:21:23.380 Uttam Kumaran: You know, so I’ll just lean in on the AI stuff and try to take that.

908 01:21:23.800 ⇒ 01:21:24.490 Uttam Kumaran: So…

909 01:21:26.360 ⇒ 01:21:28.290 Robert Tseng: Congrats on the promotion to SL.

910 01:21:28.290 ⇒ 01:21:29.560 Uttam Kumaran: Thanks, thanks.

911 01:21:30.210 ⇒ 01:21:34.550 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, so that’s my other piece, is, like, I also feel like for…

912 01:21:34.680 ⇒ 01:21:41.720 Uttam Kumaran: the L&D team, I’m gonna try to spend more time with them, get them up to speed on all the AI stuff, and then you guys…

913 01:21:41.950 ⇒ 01:21:48.589 Uttam Kumaran: are sort of gonna be the backstop for everybody. I think it’s both the upskilling and, like, when people get on Bro.

914 01:21:48.900 ⇒ 01:21:55.850 Uttam Kumaran: I think they also go through you. It’s like… what is, like… when you… it’s like summer school, not detention. It’s like, that’s summer school.

915 01:21:56.170 ⇒ 01:21:59.790 Uttam Kumaran: If you flunk out of, like, whatever you’re being paid to do here.

916 01:21:59.940 ⇒ 01:22:03.960 Uttam Kumaran: maybe you go through mandatory 30-day summer school with L&D,

917 01:22:04.460 ⇒ 01:22:06.109 Uttam Kumaran: And then you come out, like…

918 01:22:06.830 ⇒ 01:22:13.469 Uttam Kumaran: you come out, like, 10, 30 pounds lighter, and, like, you know, renewed life, renewed view on Brainforged life.

919 01:22:13.630 ⇒ 01:22:16.950 Uttam Kumaran: You know?

920 01:22:17.360 ⇒ 01:22:21.369 Uttam Kumaran: I think that’s great, not many companies provide that either, like, so…

921 01:22:22.300 ⇒ 01:22:27.489 Uttam Kumaran: they just go through the curriculum again. And… but B, this is where, if people pass your curriculum.

922 01:22:27.660 ⇒ 01:22:30.809 Uttam Kumaran: You should be, like, they’re, like, locked and loaded, you know?

923 01:22:31.150 ⇒ 01:22:31.470 B: Yeah.

924 01:22:31.470 ⇒ 01:22:34.240 Uttam Kumaran: So, it’s a good… it’s a good test of your curriculum as well.

925 01:22:35.780 ⇒ 01:22:42.419 B: Yeah, I also mentioned this in the chat, but I think the best thing that I need help from you is, like.

926 01:22:43.220 ⇒ 01:22:49.169 B: stopping yourself from, like, trying to teach them, and I think you’re being tempted to do that, like, at the.

927 01:22:49.170 ⇒ 01:22:51.409 Uttam Kumaran: Wait, to do what? Oh, yeah.

928 01:22:51.410 ⇒ 01:22:51.980 B: vintage, though.

929 01:22:52.350 ⇒ 01:22:54.890 B: I know, I know, it’s really time.

930 01:22:54.890 ⇒ 01:22:58.740 Uttam Kumaran: I’m staring at tens of thousands of dollars getting fried.

931 01:22:58.740 ⇒ 01:22:59.460 B: Yeah.

932 01:22:59.460 ⇒ 01:23:07.180 Uttam Kumaran: I’m literally, like, imagine, like, I’m talking to somebody, and they’re like, oh, yeah, I haven’t opened Cursor in, like, a few weeks. I’m…

933 01:23:07.350 ⇒ 01:23:14.770 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t look… see them. I see, like, a… like, a vault of money just getting… Lit on fire.

934 01:23:14.960 ⇒ 01:23:22.229 Uttam Kumaran: So, it’s kind of hard for me to not be like, well, why don’t we just pull this up together, and, like, I can show you how to, like.

935 01:23:22.690 ⇒ 01:23:23.530 Uttam Kumaran: Access.

936 01:23:23.530 ⇒ 01:23:24.160 B: Yeah.

937 01:23:24.160 ⇒ 01:23:27.220 Uttam Kumaran: But I heard, I heard you, I’m trying, I’m trying.

938 01:23:27.220 ⇒ 01:23:46.340 B: Yeah, yeah, but yeah, I feel the same way, like, if someone’s not using our tools or platforms, it’s, like, wasted money, but I want to take full ownership of that, and we’re going to try and cover, like, all fronts, but I know that, you know, there are going to be things that you’re going to be seeing that might be invisible on our ends, but…

939 01:23:46.340 ⇒ 01:23:47.640 B: That’s where I need help.

940 01:23:47.640 ⇒ 01:23:54.059 Uttam Kumaran: I’ll just send… I’ll just send notes to the channel, to Ellen, and I’ll try to stay away. Yeah, yeah. Okay.

941 01:23:55.000 ⇒ 01:23:56.270 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, cool.

942 01:23:56.750 ⇒ 01:23:58.729 Uttam Kumaran: I’m with you, it’s just… it’s just tough.

943 01:23:58.730 ⇒ 01:23:59.949 B: Like a lot of… Yeah, yeah.

944 01:23:59.950 ⇒ 01:24:09.489 Uttam Kumaran: Johnny’s very big right now, it was much, much bigger than it’s ever been, so it’s… like, sometimes it’s like… I mean, I’m gonna do more of what I just did, which is, like.

945 01:24:09.670 ⇒ 01:24:13.050 Uttam Kumaran: If it gets to a point where it’s risking things, I’m just gonna step in.

946 01:24:13.150 ⇒ 01:24:32.290 Uttam Kumaran: But then, we’re gonna give people, like… I’m watching Top Chef, and there’s Last Chance Kitchen, right? So you don’t get kicked off the show. You can go to, like, an even more grueling competition with everybody that’s been kicked off the show, and other people that are trying to get on the show mid-show, to then try to get one slot.

947 01:24:32.300 ⇒ 01:24:35.059 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, that’s, like, the excellent thing, right?

948 01:24:35.080 ⇒ 01:24:38.539 Uttam Kumaran: So, I feel like that’s a good… that’s a good way of doing things.

949 01:24:39.290 ⇒ 01:24:39.880 B: Yeah.

950 01:24:39.880 ⇒ 01:24:41.440 Uttam Kumaran: Giving people another shot, you know?

951 01:24:45.770 ⇒ 01:24:46.500 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.

952 01:24:49.380 ⇒ 01:24:52.980 Uttam Kumaran: Cool, and then I’ll think about the benefits stuff, Kayla, this weekend.

953 01:24:53.140 ⇒ 01:24:58.800 Uttam Kumaran: And then, yeah, I think Rico and I, I delivered him sort of a finance and legal roadmap for him to start driving.

954 01:24:59.220 ⇒ 01:25:05.039 Uttam Kumaran: And then we did the successful… we got us our virtual mailbox this week.

955 01:25:05.290 ⇒ 01:25:09.489 Uttam Kumaran: We’ll be moving stuff to there, so, like, mail doesn’t just pile up at my house.

956 01:25:12.360 ⇒ 01:25:19.040 Uttam Kumaran: And then, yeah, I think, Robert, just continue to lean on Bend and stuff for legal, like, where we need it, so…

957 01:25:19.720 ⇒ 01:25:21.480 Robert Tseng: Did the BAA get there? I don’t know.

958 01:25:21.480 ⇒ 01:25:23.020 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, yeah, it came, it came.

959 01:25:23.020 ⇒ 01:25:25.079 Robert Tseng: I haven’t looked at it. Okay, cool.

960 01:25:28.100 ⇒ 01:25:34.640 Kaela Gallagher: Anything I should prep for VixelCon? Did… is my slide okay? The people slide that I made?

961 01:25:37.120 ⇒ 01:25:45.340 Robert Tseng: Oh, oh yes, so the VixelCon slide, yes, that slide was great. I know we still have to do some slide tweaking, I’ll probably be doing that on my flight tomorrow.

962 01:25:45.370 ⇒ 01:25:46.380 Kaela Gallagher: Okay.

963 01:25:46.560 ⇒ 01:25:53.809 Robert Tseng: But yeah, I mean, the general outline is there. I kind of put it… updated it with, what Otter had said, like, outline-wise, and then…

964 01:25:54.210 ⇒ 01:25:57.219 Robert Tseng: I don’t know if you’ve looked at it, Uten, but I tried to, like, at least.

965 01:25:57.220 ⇒ 01:25:57.720 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I did.

966 01:25:57.720 ⇒ 01:25:58.740 Robert Tseng: Outline applies.

967 01:26:00.680 ⇒ 01:26:05.569 Uttam Kumaran: Do you want… I can… we can just send… I can just send that to Vishnu now, and then we can edit it over the weekend.

968 01:26:06.710 ⇒ 01:26:07.530 Robert Tseng: Yeah, that’s fine.

969 01:26:07.820 ⇒ 01:26:12.829 Uttam Kumaran: Because I think they’re just trying to get their thing locked, like, they’ll be scrambling until the end, I think, too.

970 01:26:14.150 ⇒ 01:26:14.730 Robert Tseng: Hmm.

971 01:26:14.910 ⇒ 01:26:16.189 Kaela Gallagher: If there’s…

972 01:26:16.190 ⇒ 01:26:20.080 Uttam Kumaran: You know what, I’m getting us a video. I’m getting us a video with Ray. I called him today.

973 01:26:20.080 ⇒ 01:26:20.800 Kaela Gallagher: Oh, yay.

974 01:26:20.800 ⇒ 01:26:24.900 Uttam Kumaran: And I… I want him to make us sort of a video, like,

975 01:26:25.220 ⇒ 01:26:30.620 Uttam Kumaran: like, a… have you guys seen the linear, like, product launch? Probably not. It’s such a, like, a…

976 01:26:31.280 ⇒ 01:26:32.879 Uttam Kumaran: Stupid thing that I watched.

977 01:26:33.050 ⇒ 01:26:39.959 Uttam Kumaran: When Linear announced agents. But I’ll show you guys what it looks like, because the design was good.

978 01:26:40.560 ⇒ 01:26:54.050 Uttam Kumaran: Let’s see… Linear AI agents… Yeah, this is it. Exactly, yeah.

979 01:26:54.550 ⇒ 01:26:59.559 Uttam Kumaran: That’s exactly right. It should be like that. People should have nightmares, like, going to that.

980 01:26:59.560 ⇒ 01:27:00.790 Robert Tseng: Have you guys.

981 01:27:00.790 ⇒ 01:27:04.260 Uttam Kumaran: Have you guys seen… there’s another… have you seen Next Level Chef on Hulu?

982 01:27:04.260 ⇒ 01:27:06.140 Kaela Gallagher: I have seen that one, actually.

983 01:27:06.140 ⇒ 01:27:07.419 Uttam Kumaran: This is the basement.

984 01:27:07.420 ⇒ 01:27:08.719 Kaela Gallagher: Yes, yes.

985 01:27:08.720 ⇒ 01:27:13.789 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, this is the basement. I think that’s… I don’t… I don’t particularly like that cooking show, I think it’s gonna, like…

986 01:27:13.950 ⇒ 01:27:17.730 Uttam Kumaran: too Gen Z, but it’s, you know… Thanks.

987 01:27:18.040 ⇒ 01:27:19.700 Kaela Gallagher: More modern, yeah.

988 01:27:19.980 ⇒ 01:27:22.969 Uttam Kumaran: It’s more modern. Cooking’s also worse.

989 01:27:23.630 ⇒ 01:27:28.150 Uttam Kumaran: But… yeah, this is, like, the linear… Video.

990 01:27:30.310 ⇒ 01:27:33.239 Uttam Kumaran: So I sent this to Ray, and I said I would like something like this.

991 01:27:33.680 ⇒ 01:27:36.819 Uttam Kumaran: And he said, okay, I’ll be working this weekend. I said, alright, call me.

992 01:27:36.820 ⇒ 01:27:40.170 B: For… for what? For… for… Oh, yes.

993 01:27:40.260 ⇒ 01:27:46.150 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, so, basically… I’m…

994 01:27:46.710 ⇒ 01:27:52.199 Uttam Kumaran: Sorry, this may be a little small. I basically… I’m kind of, like, just taking a first pass at branding of, like.

995 01:27:52.340 ⇒ 01:28:04.790 Uttam Kumaran: we’ll have Brainforge work, Brainforge Code, Brainforge Analytics, the Assistant, and then, like, a cloud version. I think that roughly maps to, like, the work platform. I’m gonna ship, like, a style version of OpenCode.

996 01:28:04.910 ⇒ 01:28:08.240 Uttam Kumaran: I have the open panel set up, we have a Slack assistant, and…

997 01:28:08.840 ⇒ 01:28:12.500 Uttam Kumaran: you can now sign tickets to Brainforge Platform.

998 01:28:12.500 ⇒ 01:28:13.639 B: research platform.

999 01:28:13.640 ⇒ 01:28:14.600 Uttam Kumaran: in linear.

1000 01:28:14.920 ⇒ 01:28:17.690 Uttam Kumaran: in addition to codex and cursor, so…

1001 01:28:18.150 ⇒ 01:28:21.269 Uttam Kumaran: I was like, make a montage of all these.

1002 01:28:21.520 ⇒ 01:28:30.830 Uttam Kumaran: And then I’m gonna give them a fine… and then, you know on Apple, like, at the end of, like, they’re like, and that was Mac Mini. And then they, like, have all the different stats, like.

1003 01:28:31.340 ⇒ 01:28:36.010 Uttam Kumaran: 5 hours more battery, blah blah blah. Like, I said, do a version of that at the end.

1004 01:28:36.190 ⇒ 01:28:42.020 Uttam Kumaran: And then I’m gonna try to get him to show, like, the Brainforge core, which is, like, memory, context, something like that.

1005 01:28:42.930 ⇒ 01:28:50.329 Uttam Kumaran: We’ll see, I kind of rambled for, like, half an hour, and then Ray went silent for, like, 10 minutes. I was like, alright, I think I… I think I know what you’re talking about, so…

1006 01:28:51.640 ⇒ 01:28:53.749 Uttam Kumaran: I… but Ray’s really good, so…

1007 01:28:54.060 ⇒ 01:29:01.219 Uttam Kumaran: I… he already pulled up some versions of, like, templates for, like, some of these, like, where… yeah, so I’m gonna try to have a good video going.

1008 01:29:01.530 ⇒ 01:29:02.839 Uttam Kumaran: For… for Monday.

1009 01:29:03.570 ⇒ 01:29:04.390 Kaela Gallagher: Cool.

1010 01:29:05.490 ⇒ 01:29:07.680 Kaela Gallagher: If there’s any, like.

1011 01:29:07.830 ⇒ 01:29:14.280 Kaela Gallagher: talk track that you guys want me to emphasize, or certain people that are attending that I should

1012 01:29:14.390 ⇒ 01:29:17.359 Kaela Gallagher: Make sure to talk to, or anything like that, let me know.

1013 01:29:17.520 ⇒ 01:29:20.489 Robert Tseng: Yeah, we’ll, we’ll, we’ll brainstorm when we’re all together.

1014 01:29:20.490 ⇒ 01:29:21.620 Uttam Kumaran: We’re all together, yeah.

1015 01:29:21.620 ⇒ 01:29:22.200 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

1016 01:29:22.860 ⇒ 01:29:29.019 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t think it’s that serious, it’s mainly, like, people are gonna be there, and I think as many people as we can talk to Brainforge about.

1017 01:29:30.880 ⇒ 01:29:32.450 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, that’s it.

1018 01:29:32.640 ⇒ 01:29:36.539 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, that’s a… that’s a big win. And then we’re gonna have a little booth area.

1019 01:29:37.190 ⇒ 01:29:44.300 Uttam Kumaran: to, like, show some of our… some of these products and just talk to people, so I don’t know exactly how that’s gonna work. I think, like, after the morning session.

1020 01:29:44.640 ⇒ 01:29:49.619 Uttam Kumaran: People go somewhere, and we’re gonna get a slot, so… But we’re talking second.

1021 01:29:50.550 ⇒ 01:29:55.850 Uttam Kumaran: And… Actor told me that, us, along with,

1022 01:29:57.500 ⇒ 01:29:59.960 Uttam Kumaran: Who’s the other guy that’s doing the medical company?

1023 01:30:00.320 ⇒ 01:30:01.400 Uttam Kumaran: for.

1024 01:30:01.800 ⇒ 01:30:02.120 Robert Tseng: Oh.

1025 01:30:02.120 ⇒ 01:30:03.240 Uttam Kumaran: Javais, Java?

1026 01:30:03.240 ⇒ 01:30:03.900 Robert Tseng: Yeah.

1027 01:30:03.900 ⇒ 01:30:07.330 Uttam Kumaran: He said, us and Javaid are, like, the highlights of the conference.

1028 01:30:07.570 ⇒ 01:30:08.459 Uttam Kumaran: So that’s very nice.

1029 01:30:08.460 ⇒ 01:30:11.370 Robert Tseng: us behind Umair. Umair is doing pretty well, too.

1030 01:30:11.870 ⇒ 01:30:16.479 Uttam Kumaran: See, this is where I don’t think any of these people are doing anything at all. He’s with Postgres, like.

1031 01:30:16.840 ⇒ 01:30:19.860 Uttam Kumaran: they’re not… I don’t even know, but I said at least, like.

1032 01:30:20.180 ⇒ 01:30:26.720 Uttam Kumaran: And I don’t even think Ontar really knows a lot about what we’re really doing underneath the hood, like, I think if he knew…

1033 01:30:27.380 ⇒ 01:30:29.919 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I think we’d be, like, pretty far, but…

1034 01:30:30.550 ⇒ 01:30:33.260 Uttam Kumaran: For what we’ve shared, for sure, yeah.

1035 01:30:33.430 ⇒ 01:30:34.459 Uttam Kumaran: Damn right.

1036 01:30:34.710 ⇒ 01:30:40.800 Uttam Kumaran: We’re gonna hit that… I want that number one slot. I want the keynote next year.

1037 01:30:44.340 ⇒ 01:30:45.639 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, cool.

1038 01:30:47.610 ⇒ 01:30:50.189 Kaela Gallagher: It’ll be my first time in Austin. I’m so excited.

1039 01:30:50.190 ⇒ 01:30:55.520 Uttam Kumaran: That’s great, yeah, I’ll have barbecue, so we’ll do barbecue at that, we’ll do… I’ll get barbecue at my house on, Monday.

1040 01:30:55.900 ⇒ 01:30:56.630 Kaela Gallagher: Amazing.

1041 01:30:56.630 ⇒ 01:31:01.979 Uttam Kumaran: We’ll do dinner at the house, and it’s, like, cozy here. We don’t have to go anywhere fancy or anything. If people want to, but yeah.

1042 01:31:02.500 ⇒ 01:31:04.989 Uttam Kumaran: Dude, what are you using for this? Are you using Gemini?

1043 01:31:05.610 ⇒ 01:31:07.410 Robert Tseng: Hold on, I’m just using OpenAI.

1044 01:31:07.410 ⇒ 01:31:09.279 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. It is pretty solid.

1045 01:31:11.320 ⇒ 01:31:15.280 Robert Tseng: I’m trying to figure… I’m trying to figure out what’s a more appealing way to…

1046 01:31:17.030 ⇒ 01:31:19.159 Uttam Kumaran: Dude, this is horrifying, though, low-key, like…

1047 01:31:19.160 ⇒ 01:31:20.479 B: I showed him.

1048 01:31:20.480 ⇒ 01:31:21.800 Uttam Kumaran: eating, and it was like…

1049 01:31:22.160 ⇒ 01:31:25.819 Uttam Kumaran: It was, like, just this on a slide, and it’d be like, get ready, like…

1050 01:31:25.820 ⇒ 01:31:27.700 Robert Tseng: Wait, which one? The Bees Kiss Hidden.

1051 01:31:27.700 ⇒ 01:31:28.280 Uttam Kumaran: minutes.

1052 01:31:28.820 ⇒ 01:31:33.400 Uttam Kumaran: to make chocolate fondant cake with, like, a raspberry thing, I’d be, like, freaked out.

1053 01:31:35.690 ⇒ 01:31:37.849 Robert Tseng: smiling in this one. I like this one better.

1054 01:31:38.710 ⇒ 01:31:40.389 Uttam Kumaran: It’s not too long at these kids.

1055 01:31:40.390 ⇒ 01:31:41.010 B: Valley.

1056 01:31:41.010 ⇒ 01:31:43.970 Uttam Kumaran: Dude, where data gets cooked is hilarious!

1057 01:31:45.990 ⇒ 01:31:48.240 Uttam Kumaran: So amazing.

1058 01:31:48.240 ⇒ 01:31:50.779 Kaela Gallagher: Sounds late to the chat.

1059 01:31:50.780 ⇒ 01:31:51.210 Robert Tseng: Hmm.

1060 01:31:51.210 ⇒ 01:31:52.370 Uttam Kumaran: This is so awesome.

1061 01:31:53.150 ⇒ 01:31:54.150 Kaela Gallagher: Mmm…

1062 01:31:54.150 ⇒ 01:31:56.399 B: This is… this is Pecan County Valley.

1063 01:31:57.190 ⇒ 01:31:58.299 B: What the hell?

1064 01:31:59.680 ⇒ 01:32:01.250 Uttam Kumaran: We gotta animate this next.

1065 01:32:02.130 ⇒ 01:32:06.640 Uttam Kumaran: We’ll do internal AI slop videos.

1066 01:32:07.420 ⇒ 01:32:08.470 Kaela Gallagher: Okay.

1067 01:32:08.470 ⇒ 01:32:14.549 B: By the way, Utam, I shared with you the seminar with the university students.

1068 01:32:14.960 ⇒ 01:32:19.589 B: That’s going to be later. Like, it’s going to be in 4 hours.

1069 01:32:19.590 ⇒ 01:32:20.140 Uttam Kumaran: Today!

1070 01:32:20.140 ⇒ 01:32:22.190 B: to represent Brainforge there.

1071 01:32:22.190 ⇒ 01:32:24.870 Uttam Kumaran: Did you… did you… did you get help with anything for that?

1072 01:32:25.250 ⇒ 01:32:31.740 B: Well, actually, no, I just used Visual Explainer, I think it’s going to be, like, a good… it’s going to be a good presentation of how… Wait, did you talk?

1073 01:32:31.740 ⇒ 01:32:34.150 Uttam Kumaran: All these, did you tell these guys what it is?

1074 01:32:34.580 ⇒ 01:32:48.379 B: Not yet! So, I was invited to, like, speak as an alumnus in my university. So, it’s an electronics engineering, you know, these are electronics engineering college students, and I’m pretty sure that

1075 01:32:48.710 ⇒ 01:32:50.669 B: All they know is ChatGPT.

1076 01:32:50.830 ⇒ 01:32:57.749 B: For now, so I just gotta try and, you know, get them up and make sure that once they graduate, they know what

1077 01:32:57.950 ⇒ 01:33:03.160 B: what the floor should be. Maybe we get some interns next year.

1078 01:33:03.160 ⇒ 01:33:04.170 Robert Tseng: Oh!

1079 01:33:04.170 ⇒ 01:33:05.130 Kaela Gallagher: Yay!

1080 01:33:06.070 ⇒ 01:33:06.810 Kaela Gallagher: That’s awesome!

1081 01:33:06.810 ⇒ 01:33:09.139 Uttam Kumaran: Get someone to… please, try to ask someone to film it.

1082 01:33:09.660 ⇒ 01:33:18.749 B: Yes, yes, yes, I will. I will also have photos, especially in the slides where I’m going to be showing the Brainforge logo, so… Right.

1083 01:33:19.080 ⇒ 01:33:20.160 B: That’s how it goes.

1084 01:33:20.160 ⇒ 01:33:20.800 Kaela Gallagher: Dang.

1085 01:33:20.800 ⇒ 01:33:34.000 Robert Tseng: When I go to Asia in a few weeks, I’m gonna… in a month, not a few weeks, I’m gonna get… I’m gonna make Brainforge swag. I tried to do it last time, but we gotta ship stuff to people, so when they go to events, they can actually, like.

1086 01:33:34.140 ⇒ 01:33:34.990 Robert Tseng: They can…

1087 01:33:34.990 ⇒ 01:33:35.940 Uttam Kumaran: What’s the budget?

1088 01:33:36.650 ⇒ 01:33:37.790 Uttam Kumaran: Do you have a budget?

1089 01:33:38.240 ⇒ 01:33:51.220 Robert Tseng: Oh, it’ll… it’ll be cheap. I mean, I… at least I want to get, like, a full set, like, a bag, like a… I mean, I want to… I always want to do, like, a more, like, luxe gym bag thing, and then, like, some outerwear, some inner layer.

1090 01:33:51.220 ⇒ 01:33:53.099 Uttam Kumaran: Tijuana, I’ll just ask her, I just didn’t…

1091 01:33:53.370 ⇒ 01:33:57.140 Uttam Kumaran: I told her at some point we’ll have her do it, because she’ll do all the… she’ll do all, like.

1092 01:33:57.320 ⇒ 01:33:59.439 Uttam Kumaran: Heavyweight merch, or whatever.

1093 01:33:59.440 ⇒ 01:34:06.910 Robert Tseng: Yeah, the outerwear, I want to use the same kind of, like, source as the Montclair stuff that I… that you see me wear, so that’d be cool.

1094 01:34:06.910 ⇒ 01:34:08.290 Uttam Kumaran: Dude, it’s like…

1095 01:34:08.560 ⇒ 01:34:13.209 Kaela Gallagher: I built merch into our budget for the off-site, so that we could, like…

1096 01:34:13.210 ⇒ 01:34:17.750 Robert Tseng: It’s gotta come from China, because otherwise it’s too expensive. It’ll be 10% of whatever you think it is, you know, so…

1097 01:34:17.750 ⇒ 01:34:18.110 Kaela Gallagher: Amazing.

1098 01:34:18.110 ⇒ 01:34:20.009 Uttam Kumaran: No, but the design, I think…

1099 01:34:20.010 ⇒ 01:34:25.680 Robert Tseng: Design, yeah, I’ll rely on you guys for… I will… I’ll source the material from time to time to do it.

1100 01:34:25.860 ⇒ 01:34:31.370 Uttam Kumaran: Dude, you didn’t even bring me any Montclair last time. You know that’s, like, one of my favorite brands, I only have one thing.

1101 01:34:31.370 ⇒ 01:34:36.019 Robert Tseng: I wasn’t there long enough last time. This time, I’m gonna… I’m gonna make time to go and…

1102 01:34:36.020 ⇒ 01:34:40.390 Uttam Kumaran: said, look at the website, tell me what you want. I said, this is impossible, like… What?

1103 01:34:40.730 ⇒ 01:34:43.339 Uttam Kumaran: It’s, like, impossible.

1104 01:34:43.600 ⇒ 01:34:48.079 Uttam Kumaran: One thing, what’s, like, the left glove is, like, $800, like…

1105 01:34:51.370 ⇒ 01:34:52.569 Kaela Gallagher: That’s so funny.

1106 01:34:53.530 ⇒ 01:35:03.729 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, cool, I’m looking forward to seeing you guys, and then, I have all your flights and my stuff, so we’re gonna… we’re gonna be cleaning the house and going Costco stuff today to prepare, so…

1107 01:35:04.140 ⇒ 01:35:04.630 Kaela Gallagher: Aww.

1108 01:35:04.630 ⇒ 01:35:05.290 Uttam Kumaran: I’m excited.

1109 01:35:05.290 ⇒ 01:35:06.210 Kaela Gallagher: Thank you.

1110 01:35:06.540 ⇒ 01:35:07.710 Kaela Gallagher: I can’t wait.

1111 01:35:08.460 ⇒ 01:35:09.300 Robert Tseng: Alright.

1112 01:35:10.090 ⇒ 01:35:10.610 B: Cool.

1113 01:35:10.800 ⇒ 01:35:11.390 B: Thanks, everyone.

1114 01:35:11.390 ⇒ 01:35:12.440 Robert Tseng: y’all. Okay.