Meeting Title: Brainforge Project Updates and Planning Date: 2026-03-19 Meeting participants: Robert Tseng, Amber Lin
WEBVTT
1 00:00:21.460 ⇒ 00:00:25.829 Robert Tseng: Hi, Amber, sorry, I had a… had a sales call run long.
2 00:00:25.830 ⇒ 00:00:27.809 Amber Lin: I saw. Okay. That was good.
3 00:00:28.160 ⇒ 00:00:32.940 Amber Lin: Ivan, one covert. Do you wanna see… do you wanna see Hannah and Luke? I think they’re…
4 00:00:33.530 ⇒ 00:00:34.709 Amber Lin: They’re close by.
5 00:00:34.710 ⇒ 00:00:35.480 Robert Tseng: Oh, yeah?
6 00:00:35.760 ⇒ 00:00:39.379 Amber Lin: Yeah, I’m gonna… let me scoot over to… next to them.
7 00:00:41.120 ⇒ 00:00:48.139 Amber Lin: I know, it’s so fun. How do I… Video and Effect Settings.
8 00:00:48.670 ⇒ 00:00:53.690 Amber Lin: Virtual background… there we go. Okay, I’m gonna go up to find them.
9 00:00:54.280 ⇒ 00:00:55.050 Robert Tseng: Nice.
10 00:00:55.220 ⇒ 00:01:01.490 Amber Lin: Yeah. It’s nice to… I saw your… I saw your message about working in person. It’s really nice.
11 00:01:01.680 ⇒ 00:01:05.400 Amber Lin: It just takes a bit to get here and there.
12 00:01:06.240 ⇒ 00:01:08.970 Robert Tseng: Yeah, yeah, I mean, definitely.
13 00:01:09.290 ⇒ 00:01:20.559 Robert Tseng: were to happen, it would be something close. Like, yeah, one Culver is an option that I have Kayla looking into, like, just to get you guys a WeWork or something up there. But yeah, we’ll see.
14 00:01:20.780 ⇒ 00:01:21.700 Amber Lin: Yeah.
15 00:01:23.770 ⇒ 00:01:25.110 Amber Lin: Say hi to Harvard.
16 00:01:28.200 ⇒ 00:01:29.860 Robert Tseng: Hello.
17 00:01:31.510 ⇒ 00:01:32.010 Robert Tseng: Oh, what is it?
18 00:01:33.180 ⇒ 00:01:33.980 Amber Lin: Wait.
19 00:01:34.250 ⇒ 00:01:35.610 Amber Lin: Say again?
20 00:01:42.910 ⇒ 00:01:43.530 Robert Tseng: Huh?
21 00:01:44.220 ⇒ 00:01:46.840 Amber Lin: I think we’re all waiting for someone to say something.
22 00:01:46.840 ⇒ 00:01:50.520 Robert Tseng: Oh, I thought Hannah said something, and I was, like, leaning in, like, huh?
23 00:01:50.890 ⇒ 00:01:51.659 Robert Tseng: Oh, I agree.
24 00:01:51.660 ⇒ 00:01:52.150 Amber Lin: 30 o’.
25 00:01:52.150 ⇒ 00:01:54.530 Robert Tseng: You’re wearing pregnancy overalls?
26 00:01:55.050 ⇒ 00:01:59.379 Amber Lin: No, I wore this before, but you wanna see how pregnant I look? Not at all.
27 00:01:59.810 ⇒ 00:02:00.470 Robert Tseng: Oh, what!
28 00:02:00.470 ⇒ 00:02:03.380 Amber Lin: Kind of, maybe.
29 00:02:03.380 ⇒ 00:02:04.970 Robert Tseng: Yeah, that’s crazy.
30 00:02:06.170 ⇒ 00:02:10.370 Amber Lin: Couldn’t tell, it just looks like a food baby.
31 00:02:11.490 ⇒ 00:02:12.230 Robert Tseng: Nice.
32 00:02:12.230 ⇒ 00:02:13.910 Amber Lin: Already, like, 5 months.
33 00:02:14.270 ⇒ 00:02:15.360 Robert Tseng: I know.
34 00:02:15.650 ⇒ 00:02:16.830 Amber Lin: That’s crazy.
35 00:02:17.320 ⇒ 00:02:18.460 Amber Lin: Crazy.
36 00:02:18.580 ⇒ 00:02:19.360 Amber Lin: Okay.
37 00:02:20.040 ⇒ 00:02:21.490 Robert Tseng: Mama Hannah.
38 00:02:24.850 ⇒ 00:02:30.599 Amber Lin: Robert, I heard you wanted to move back to LA, and then we were talking about how Rachel would not like that.
39 00:02:30.600 ⇒ 00:02:36.099 Robert Tseng: No, she doesn’t want to. The Lord will have to do some miracles for that to happen, so…
40 00:02:39.830 ⇒ 00:02:40.470 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
41 00:02:40.730 ⇒ 00:02:50.199 Robert Tseng: But, I mean, we’ll see. I think, just, I’m… I’m… we’re gonna test it, see if it’s… see if it’s in the cards, but, yeah, I guess,
42 00:02:50.370 ⇒ 00:03:00.349 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I don’t know, I don’t want to early commit to anything, but that was an idea that kind of came out of my vacation. I was like, huh.
43 00:03:00.610 ⇒ 00:03:02.620 Robert Tseng: Maybe I should go back to LA.
44 00:03:03.300 ⇒ 00:03:11.839 Robert Tseng: It was good. I was, hanging out with my buddy on his boat, and… I mean, they…
45 00:03:12.070 ⇒ 00:03:14.240 Robert Tseng: I feel like he kind of…
46 00:03:14.430 ⇒ 00:03:29.030 Robert Tseng: he doesn’t run a business, he runs, like, a crew program for his boat. But yeah, it’s just, like, in person, and, you know, it’s way more intense than what we do, it’s like, they live together 24-7, so there’s, like, literally no boundaries that you can’t hide by anything.
47 00:03:29.120 ⇒ 00:03:43.589 Robert Tseng: But I was, like, very impressed with the culture that he’s built, and yeah, I think, like, it’s hard to quantify, like, on a balance sheet, like, what that… what the value of that is, like…
48 00:03:43.840 ⇒ 00:03:49.670 Robert Tseng: But, like, I don’t know, like, I think the culture of the boat is nice, and…
49 00:03:49.670 ⇒ 00:03:51.479 Amber Lin: Company lives on the boat.
50 00:03:51.770 ⇒ 00:03:55.539 Robert Tseng: Well, no, his company is the boat. Like, he lives on a boat.
51 00:03:55.540 ⇒ 00:03:55.920 Amber Lin: Beautiful.
52 00:03:55.920 ⇒ 00:04:01.580 Robert Tseng: His goal is not to… There’s no shareholder value, it’s just…
53 00:04:01.580 ⇒ 00:04:05.290 Amber Lin: Oh, that feels like a boarding school company?
54 00:04:05.290 ⇒ 00:04:06.250 Robert Tseng: Yeah, yeah.
55 00:04:08.830 ⇒ 00:04:16.190 Robert Tseng: Yeah, it’s a much smaller scale. Their annual expenses are $50,000 a year, so he just needs to…
56 00:04:16.320 ⇒ 00:04:23.130 Robert Tseng: sustain that. So, the crew come, and it’s all volunteer basis, none of them get paid.
57 00:04:23.130 ⇒ 00:04:41.920 Robert Tseng: Which I thought was interesting, because I thought he was paying them or whatever at first, but, and then they… they live on the boat, and they go and work local jobs. Like, they just help fix boats, and like, work at the marina, like, you know, do other things, and it’s like a self-sustaining lifestyle.
58 00:04:42.010 ⇒ 00:04:47.020 Robert Tseng: So… Yeah, I think it’s like…
59 00:04:47.250 ⇒ 00:05:06.180 Robert Tseng: it’s interesting, because people come, they come from all backgrounds, some of them are tech people, some of them are not, or whatever. And… yeah, I mean, everyone has, like, a honeymoon period where it’s like, oh, great, I’m living this boat life for a while, and then they’re like, oh wait, I’ve been here for 3 months, like, if I don’t go back home and continue my job, I’m gonna lose my career.
60 00:05:06.180 ⇒ 00:05:17.120 Robert Tseng: So, like, they go… they hit this, like, crisis moment on, like, do I really continue this? And I feel like he gave me good perspective. It’s like, he doesn’t try to force anyone to stay, like, it’s just like…
61 00:05:17.290 ⇒ 00:05:24.809 Robert Tseng: Let people go back to wherever they… they came from, and then, yeah, the people that want to come back for longer, they just, like.
62 00:05:24.940 ⇒ 00:05:40.669 Robert Tseng: they’ll be like, yeah, never mind, I’m ready to come back and be here longer. So, yeah, he’s just, like, has a very, like, open-door policy about, kind of, like, people coming and going, and, yeah, I think that… that felt… that made it feel like it was…
63 00:05:40.700 ⇒ 00:05:47.810 Robert Tseng: Like, that’s why he invests so much in the culture of the boat, because it’s, like, the relationships with his crew, and then…
64 00:05:48.060 ⇒ 00:05:57.139 Robert Tseng: The, you know, the people that do come back, that really believe in the vision, that, like, they’re… they’re really excited to be there for the longer term, or whatever, so…
65 00:05:57.140 ⇒ 00:05:58.390 Amber Lin: What’s their vision?
66 00:05:59.140 ⇒ 00:06:02.939 Robert Tseng: Well, I think the vision is just, like, why…
67 00:06:03.030 ⇒ 00:06:20.669 Robert Tseng: work until you’re, like, in your 60s, and then start living your life, but, like, where you can just, like, live and enjoy… you can enjoy and work, like, your life, like, now, is basically the meta, like, question, I think. Because, like.
68 00:06:20.870 ⇒ 00:06:35.460 Robert Tseng: you know, people think, like, boating is, like, for rich, old, retired people, which is most of the sailors that are in the harbor. He’s the only, like, 30-year-old with a boat there. And, like, yeah, I mean, he’s not… there’s no savings or whatever, but, like.
69 00:06:35.460 ⇒ 00:06:42.850 Robert Tseng: You know, they feel like their lifestyle is… it’s not stressful, they’re not hurried, it’s, like, sustainable enough that, like.
70 00:06:42.920 ⇒ 00:06:58.699 Robert Tseng: they don’t really worry about, like, having enough, but, like, they get a balance, like, working and having time to enjoy it as well. So, it’s kind of like seasonal work that’s mixed into, like, you just, like, doing your boating adventure kind of thing.
71 00:07:00.820 ⇒ 00:07:04.450 Robert Tseng: Very philosophically different from, like, what…
72 00:07:04.730 ⇒ 00:07:13.659 Robert Tseng: corporate America tells you, which is just, like, make a bunch of money, save as much as you can, and retire in your 60s, or whatever, so…
73 00:07:14.310 ⇒ 00:07:15.040 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
74 00:07:15.380 ⇒ 00:07:18.620 Amber Lin: The brain forged boat going.
75 00:07:18.620 ⇒ 00:07:29.450 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, I’m like, I want everybody at Rainforest, at least the US team, to go to the boat. Like, I feel like it’s… it would be a cool experience.
76 00:07:29.450 ⇒ 00:07:36.539 Amber Lin: We were talking about for the LA crew, we could go up to, like, Arrowhead for a field trip, or we can go somewhere.
77 00:07:36.880 ⇒ 00:07:45.509 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, that’s more realistic in the short term. I think the boat situation would not happen until we maybe raise money to, like.
78 00:07:45.750 ⇒ 00:07:54.370 Robert Tseng: stop feeling like we’re always in a rush, or, like, I don’t know, like, I feel like that’s… that’s not gonna happen, like, anytime soon.
79 00:07:55.370 ⇒ 00:07:55.900 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
80 00:07:55.900 ⇒ 00:08:00.740 Amber Lin: I’m having schools would be nice. Yeah. Yeah.
81 00:08:02.530 ⇒ 00:08:13.320 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think, like, LA office is on… is on my, like, mind for a Q2 thing, and then possibly if we end up moving back to LA to… to be a part of that, and then…
82 00:08:14.820 ⇒ 00:08:18.680 Robert Tseng: That’d probably be, like, as early… earliest would be summer.
83 00:08:19.450 ⇒ 00:08:24.819 Amber Lin: What? That’s so early. I was like, you have a lease, but… and you have to convince…
84 00:08:25.060 ⇒ 00:08:26.820 Amber Lin: Works in New York!
85 00:08:27.330 ⇒ 00:08:35.600 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I have to convince Rachel, I have to break the lease, I have to convince you guys to come to office, I have to get a lease in LA.
86 00:08:36.000 ⇒ 00:08:37.000 Robert Tseng: A lot of things that…
87 00:08:37.000 ⇒ 00:08:37.350 Amber Lin: Oof.
88 00:08:37.350 ⇒ 00:08:44.360 Robert Tseng: need to happen before that actually becomes a reality. But, yeah, I don’t know. I feel like, you know, it’s…
89 00:08:44.460 ⇒ 00:08:48.820 Robert Tseng: If it’s in God’s will, then it will… it will happen, yeah, so…
90 00:08:49.160 ⇒ 00:08:49.850 Amber Lin: Oh.
91 00:08:50.020 ⇒ 00:08:50.500 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
92 00:08:50.500 ⇒ 00:08:51.430 Amber Lin: Okay.
93 00:08:51.580 ⇒ 00:08:53.509 Amber Lin: Anyways, I just wanted to…
94 00:08:53.650 ⇒ 00:08:59.819 Amber Lin: I guess you guys say hi. That’s good, I don’t see him anymore. Really? Because everything is funneled to Luke.
95 00:09:00.690 ⇒ 00:09:02.670 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
96 00:09:03.510 ⇒ 00:09:04.240 Amber Lin: Hello.
97 00:09:04.390 ⇒ 00:09:05.330 Robert Tseng: Hello.
98 00:09:05.590 ⇒ 00:09:09.370 Amber Lin: Oh, no, it’s… it’s okay. Bye.
99 00:09:11.030 ⇒ 00:09:14.290 Amber Lin: Yeah, I’ll see you soon. I don’t know when, but…
100 00:09:14.930 ⇒ 00:09:20.299 Robert Tseng: We… yeah, I don’t… I can’t come to your, your preger showers.
101 00:09:20.580 ⇒ 00:09:22.579 Amber Lin: It’s okay, Rachel, can’t either.
102 00:09:22.580 ⇒ 00:09:23.520 Robert Tseng: What, really?
103 00:09:23.920 ⇒ 00:09:26.459 Amber Lin: I’m doing it on another date that she’s.
104 00:09:26.460 ⇒ 00:09:28.260 Robert Tseng: I see.
105 00:09:29.190 ⇒ 00:09:33.649 Robert Tseng: Yeah… Although I am dropping out of school, so, like, I kind of…
106 00:09:33.650 ⇒ 00:09:34.330 Amber Lin: bar?
107 00:09:34.730 ⇒ 00:09:35.330 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
108 00:09:35.330 ⇒ 00:09:37.080 Amber Lin: Oh, you made that decision.
109 00:09:37.360 ⇒ 00:09:38.070 Robert Tseng: I am.
110 00:09:38.070 ⇒ 00:09:39.729 Amber Lin: Okay. It’s just like…
111 00:09:40.890 ⇒ 00:09:43.200 Robert Tseng: I can’t do it. I think,
112 00:09:43.580 ⇒ 00:09:46.700 Robert Tseng: I think Brainforge is enough on its own, so…
113 00:09:46.700 ⇒ 00:09:50.800 Amber Lin: It was… it was already enough before you started law school, so…
114 00:09:50.800 ⇒ 00:09:56.269 Robert Tseng: Yeah. Yeah. So that was my other big takeaway from my trip last week.
115 00:09:56.270 ⇒ 00:09:57.090 Amber Lin: Oh, nice.
116 00:09:57.090 ⇒ 00:09:57.720 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
117 00:09:58.190 ⇒ 00:10:03.970 Robert Tseng: Okay, quitting is an overstatement. I’m gonna try to take a leave of absence. Like, I could see myself…
118 00:10:04.650 ⇒ 00:10:07.649 Robert Tseng: wanting to come back to it. It’s not because I don’t like it, it’s…
119 00:10:07.650 ⇒ 00:10:08.010 Amber Lin: Yes.
120 00:10:08.010 ⇒ 00:10:09.739 Robert Tseng: Because of a time, time thing.
121 00:10:09.740 ⇒ 00:10:10.390 Amber Lin: Yeah. Yeah.
122 00:10:11.040 ⇒ 00:10:21.990 Robert Tseng: But then, coming back, like, I was like, I have no motivation in classes now, because I feel like I’m, like… like, why am I even finishing this semester? So, I feel like this weekend, I need to, like.
123 00:10:22.520 ⇒ 00:10:33.619 Robert Tseng: search my heart to see if it’s something I actually even want to finish this semester, but I already walked out of class early the past two days, because I was like, well, I don’t know why I’m here.
124 00:10:34.820 ⇒ 00:10:35.850 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
125 00:10:36.050 ⇒ 00:10:36.770 Robert Tseng: So…
126 00:10:36.770 ⇒ 00:10:37.210 Amber Lin: Let’s see.
127 00:10:37.210 ⇒ 00:10:37.840 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
128 00:10:37.840 ⇒ 00:10:38.290 Amber Lin: Okay.
129 00:10:38.290 ⇒ 00:10:38.860 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
130 00:10:38.860 ⇒ 00:10:41.620 Amber Lin: That’s one step closer to moving to LA.
131 00:10:41.620 ⇒ 00:10:45.489 Robert Tseng: I know! So that’s… those are my life updates from…
132 00:10:45.490 ⇒ 00:10:46.000 Amber Lin: Oh, interesting.
133 00:10:46.000 ⇒ 00:10:47.420 Robert Tseng: weeks. Yeah.
134 00:10:48.670 ⇒ 00:10:49.470 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
135 00:10:50.000 ⇒ 00:10:51.470 Amber Lin: Dang, okay.
136 00:10:54.050 ⇒ 00:10:55.090 Robert Tseng: Yeah…
137 00:10:56.850 ⇒ 00:10:59.530 Amber Lin: Well, come to LA before I give birth.
138 00:11:00.230 ⇒ 00:11:03.550 Robert Tseng: Yeah, no, I’m gonna, I’m gonna be back,
139 00:11:03.880 ⇒ 00:11:06.219 Robert Tseng: I mean, VixelCon is in April.
140 00:11:07.450 ⇒ 00:11:22.620 Robert Tseng: Well, yeah, I mean, I don’t know, like… I mean, it’ll happen before I… before we go to Asia, so it’ll probably be May, is what I’m guessing. But if I quit… if I quit law school before then, like, then I think I will probably come before then, but… well, I mean, we’ll see. I have to kind of decide that.
141 00:11:22.770 ⇒ 00:11:23.510 Amber Lin: Okay.
142 00:11:23.510 ⇒ 00:11:24.120 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
143 00:11:24.420 ⇒ 00:11:25.280 Amber Lin: Okay.
144 00:11:25.460 ⇒ 00:11:30.060 Amber Lin: Fine. I’m gonna… Robert, I’m gonna take the rest of the time to talk about some work stuff.
145 00:11:30.060 ⇒ 00:11:31.849 Robert Tseng: Yes, yes, please. Okay.
146 00:11:31.850 ⇒ 00:11:33.920 Amber Lin: But I wanted you to say hi to them.
147 00:11:34.170 ⇒ 00:11:35.840 Robert Tseng: Okay. Hello, everyone.
148 00:11:38.270 ⇒ 00:11:39.250 Amber Lin: F.
149 00:11:39.650 ⇒ 00:11:49.389 Amber Lin: Okay. Just, like, high-level updates. I don’t want to talk about the specifics of work, because today has been a lot of specifics of work.
150 00:11:49.730 ⇒ 00:11:50.180 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
151 00:11:50.180 ⇒ 00:11:58.020 Amber Lin: Jasmine now, so I can… I talked to her about… Jasmine and Greg about, hey, what… what’s going on.
152 00:11:58.020 ⇒ 00:11:59.369 Robert Tseng: Great, yeah.
153 00:11:59.370 ⇒ 00:12:14.119 Amber Lin: So that’s nice. And, like, I agree, Jasmine raised very specific things, which sometimes I’m like, why are we talking about this? But that’s exactly what I’m missing, so it’s good that she makes me talk about those things.
154 00:12:15.120 ⇒ 00:12:16.110 Robert Tseng: Good, yeah.
155 00:12:16.110 ⇒ 00:12:16.600 Amber Lin: Yeah.
156 00:12:17.150 ⇒ 00:12:24.130 Amber Lin: So that’s on that side, but… Oh… I think… So right now, there’s Element.
157 00:12:24.320 ⇒ 00:12:36.390 Amber Lin: Eden, and a little bit of Amble, which I had zero time for this week. Yeah. Like, 2 hours for last week, so I apologize. That dock is not ready. That dock is, like.
158 00:12:36.960 ⇒ 00:12:43.400 Amber Lin: just a bunch of screenshots from my queries. I’ve not put any mind to it.
159 00:12:43.400 ⇒ 00:12:44.220 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
160 00:12:44.220 ⇒ 00:12:50.239 Amber Lin: when is the time you need it by? Because I think Element’s slowing down, so I have some time this week.
161 00:12:50.640 ⇒ 00:13:08.359 Robert Tseng: Yeah, well, so, like, more context on Element. Obviously, we’re still in negotiations of the deal, it is kind of annoying, like, I don’t… whatever, I don’t want to get into specifics of it, but I want, like, Advait to ramp up on Element, so I… hopefully you get, kind of, you can… I mean, I don’t think it’ll happen immediately, but…
162 00:13:08.360 ⇒ 00:13:13.430 Robert Tseng: If he does well, then, like, maybe he can take you off Element, is basically what I’m hoping for.
163 00:13:13.990 ⇒ 00:13:15.819 Robert Tseng: And that way…
164 00:13:15.820 ⇒ 00:13:23.640 Amber Lin: Any reason for, like, who takes what? Like, is it because of how we classify elements’ work versus other type of work?
165 00:13:25.190 ⇒ 00:13:38.540 Robert Tseng: Yeah, well, like, I think you’ve gotten really good feedback on Eden, and I think you should spend more time there, you know, especially in light of, like… maybe it’s not even, like, a time thing, it’s just, like, mind share. Like, if you can really hit…
166 00:13:38.540 ⇒ 00:13:47.509 Robert Tseng: kind of do the, you know, hit the strategic objective there. I think, like, there’s… there’s more of a path to growth there, whereas, like, you know, obviously Element, like, the…
167 00:13:47.600 ⇒ 00:14:04.450 Robert Tseng: I mean, you’ve been building the stuff, and, like, I don’t know, I just feel like, that what they require there is different from, like, from, from Eden. So, I think in Eden, you’re a lot… we have a lot more, like, runway to just go and
168 00:14:04.550 ⇒ 00:14:09.579 Robert Tseng: try things before I’m more willing to meet, but, like, everything and element that comes out needs to be, like.
169 00:14:09.990 ⇒ 00:14:21.259 Robert Tseng: like, an unreasonably, like, buttoned-up state. So, I think, like, I’m just trying to hedge against that by putting somebody who’s more senior there,
170 00:14:21.260 ⇒ 00:14:32.699 Robert Tseng: I mean, I don’t know if Advait will really, like, measure up to it, we’ll see. Like, maybe this will not actually work out, but that is why he’s here, so I would want him to spend as much time with you to…
171 00:14:32.700 ⇒ 00:14:42.930 Robert Tseng: like, try to see if we can get you off of that. I prefer you being in, like, kind of the first to a client, exploring new opportunities, like, I feel like that’s more your strength.
172 00:14:42.970 ⇒ 00:14:54.059 Robert Tseng: So I want you to be able to have capacity to do that for Amble, especially since you weren’t on the call, but they expressed wanting to continue to work with us. Like, they already… I already feel like the… the,
173 00:14:54.080 ⇒ 00:15:04.269 Robert Tseng: like, the extension is there, I just have to, like, figure out, like, how to articulate it. So, yeah, rather than, like, kind of just having you stuck on…
174 00:15:04.390 ⇒ 00:15:14.520 Robert Tseng: on Element, I don’t know if you enjoy it, doesn’t look like you are, I mean, obviously, in their size, Shivani is, like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, so, like, I’d rather just, like, not, like, have that,
175 00:15:14.520 ⇒ 00:15:15.190 Amber Lin: Yeah.
176 00:15:15.190 ⇒ 00:15:22.390 Robert Tseng: If I can… if I can move you to somewhere else that I feel like you’re gonna, like, thrive more in, I’d rather do that.
177 00:15:22.390 ⇒ 00:15:23.170 Amber Lin: Yeah.
178 00:15:23.170 ⇒ 00:15:24.680 Robert Tseng: I don’t know, what do you think about that?
179 00:15:24.870 ⇒ 00:15:26.000 Amber Lin: So…
180 00:15:26.320 ⇒ 00:15:39.120 Amber Lin: I think there’s… there’s kind of three types of work that I did, so one’s, like, ABCs have very… or AMBL-style very early discovery, and then it’s reporting, like, what we do for Element.
181 00:15:39.120 ⇒ 00:15:46.490 Amber Lin: And then there’s more strategic stuff of Eden and maybe a little insomnia that we were trying to get into. Yeah.
182 00:15:46.670 ⇒ 00:15:54.150 Amber Lin: And to me, all of them are kind of new, so… Yeah. I like learning about them, but in terms of…
183 00:15:54.150 ⇒ 00:16:10.560 Amber Lin: what I think I should… I want to get better at is the more strategic, or that overlaps with kind of the discovery, but overall, what can we deliver based on KPIs? Of course, all of them are kind of new, and I kind of, like, I don’t yet know exactly
184 00:16:10.780 ⇒ 00:16:21.720 Amber Lin: But that’s where I want to develop more, versus an element of, sure, I like learning how to do a… figuring out Omni, and learning… looking into the data models, but…
185 00:16:22.030 ⇒ 00:16:26.660 Amber Lin: Ultimately, it’s a lot of… it’s some… it’s a bit of gruesome work of just…
186 00:16:26.780 ⇒ 00:16:32.029 Amber Lin: this, and then go back requirements, and go back, and this, and this, and this. It’s more like a…
187 00:16:32.790 ⇒ 00:16:34.210 Amber Lin: Dashboarding?
188 00:16:34.590 ⇒ 00:16:35.250 Amber Lin: Excuse me.
189 00:16:35.250 ⇒ 00:16:35.930 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
190 00:16:36.120 ⇒ 00:16:53.020 Amber Lin: of completing tasks, instead of, say, I have this goal, that I’m going to drive us to. We’re playing a different role on Elements, so I would say he didn’t work as much more interesting, and I think that’s the type of…
191 00:16:53.270 ⇒ 00:17:03.170 Amber Lin: guidance or coaching I would like to receive of, how do I best work with stakeholders, how do I guide them?
192 00:17:03.490 ⇒ 00:17:15.659 Amber Lin: to think about their… their decisions of things they can impact, because Brad has some things he want to work on. Today, we call Rebecca, Rebecca has some things he wanna… she wants to work on, but…
193 00:17:16.210 ⇒ 00:17:25.270 Amber Lin: are they working on this right thing? Am I… am I in the right position to support them? And for our purposes.
194 00:17:25.480 ⇒ 00:17:30.129 Amber Lin: how do I quantify that and show our impact? So…
195 00:17:30.260 ⇒ 00:17:43.239 Amber Lin: like, what you talked about today in the Eden call is that, oh, I… I haven’t really thought about things that way, and that’s something that I want to… want to do, but it’s new, so… Yeah. I want to learn, and…
196 00:17:43.400 ⇒ 00:17:52.290 Amber Lin: I think Eden’s a good place to practice doing that. I’m talking a lot more with Brad and with their team, but I don’t yet have… I haven’t…
197 00:17:52.510 ⇒ 00:17:55.630 Amber Lin: Put together a roadmap in my mind is…
198 00:17:59.840 ⇒ 00:18:01.510 Amber Lin: Brad, so…
199 00:18:02.340 ⇒ 00:18:12.839 Amber Lin: I… I want to set a mental vision for myself of how I want to do this, how I want to guide people and guide teams towards there, so…
200 00:18:13.090 ⇒ 00:18:13.780 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
201 00:18:13.780 ⇒ 00:18:18.549 Amber Lin: All that to say, like, that’s… that’s interesting, challenging, and a little scary.
202 00:18:19.080 ⇒ 00:18:20.069 Amber Lin: That’s cool.
203 00:18:20.580 ⇒ 00:18:30.619 Robert Tseng: Yeah. Cool. I mean, sounds like we’re kind of aligned then on, like, where… where, like, how… how we want to see things kind of change, like, so yeah, I mean, I think, like.
204 00:18:30.860 ⇒ 00:18:45.449 Robert Tseng: as best as you can, like, get Advait up to speed, like, I’m basically telling him… I haven’t gone too much time with him, but I’m basically saying just to shadow… shadow you, and he’s gonna learn as much as he can about the element stuff, like, that’s the main client I want him to kind of pick up on.
205 00:18:45.550 ⇒ 00:18:55.440 Robert Tseng: Then that will allow me, you know, hopefully within, like, 2 to 4 weeks, be able to, kind of, have you… you can, you know, have more time to just…
206 00:18:55.670 ⇒ 00:19:11.100 Robert Tseng: spend more time on Eden, and also, also, I guess, Ambulus, assuming that we have the discovery work there. So, I mean, Eden is okay, because, like, we’re wrapping up the quarter, like, you know, there’s a lot of things that are going on, so you get to hide a little bit more there.
207 00:19:11.100 ⇒ 00:19:17.080 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so I would say, like, kind of prioritizing, if you can get me the ample discovery.
208 00:19:17.080 ⇒ 00:19:24.349 Robert Tseng: like, yeah, because I want to put that together next week, before the end of the month, I want to basically pitch them. So.
209 00:19:24.350 ⇒ 00:19:25.090 Amber Lin: suite?
210 00:19:25.410 ⇒ 00:19:38.279 Robert Tseng: Yeah, midweek next week’s fine. Like, I think I’m gonna schedule time with them late next week to, at least… at least put the… put the proposal forward, and… yeah, I mean, I know you have some stuff that’s ongoing, but, like, just in terms of, like.
211 00:19:38.590 ⇒ 00:19:42.869 Robert Tseng: You know, if you had the time to just choose what you could do, and like.
212 00:19:43.150 ⇒ 00:19:50.939 Robert Tseng: assuming you’re kind of… you’re good on all the other responsibilities, like, you know, I think just try to get… trying to get the, AMBL discovery.
213 00:19:51.390 ⇒ 00:19:53.810 Robert Tseng: hand off to me, I think would be… would be great.
214 00:19:54.590 ⇒ 00:19:59.549 Amber Lin: Yeah, I think two comments. First, just…
215 00:19:59.840 ⇒ 00:20:15.049 Amber Lin: generally on Eated, and then… and then I have a comment on amble, so just feed it. Yeah. What we talked about today, I think my fear of, like, am I… is that… am I going to deliver enough impact? But I do think helping to
216 00:20:15.050 ⇒ 00:20:20.069 Amber Lin: set those KPIs in the right way, having the discussion with you will be helpful, because right now.
217 00:20:20.070 ⇒ 00:20:20.440 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
218 00:20:20.440 ⇒ 00:20:34.630 Amber Lin: Doing these analysis, I don’t really know. I might just do analysis for analysis’s sake. Do Brad care about what I’m trying to do, or is Brad even the right person? Does he… is he thinking about saving, say.
219 00:20:34.630 ⇒ 00:20:42.600 Amber Lin: X percent on margin, or is he still at, hey, we don’t even track volume correctly, I need to get him there? Yeah. Like, I…
220 00:20:42.610 ⇒ 00:20:46.679 Amber Lin: I don’t yet have a clear set of
221 00:20:46.930 ⇒ 00:20:55.709 Amber Lin: things I can hit, because those are not defined and not aligned. So, once I do that, I think I’ll feel… feel better about the Eden Workstream.
222 00:20:56.130 ⇒ 00:20:56.560 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
223 00:20:56.560 ⇒ 00:20:58.159 Amber Lin: That’s a work in progress.
224 00:20:58.580 ⇒ 00:21:14.740 Robert Tseng: Yeah, and I think, like, you’re more in touch on, like, what’s possible, what’s not possible, than I am, or I guess at least you could tell me what’s missing, and I can debate with you on what’s possible or not. Like, I think a lot of things don’t have to be completely there in order for us to still hit the target, so…
225 00:21:14.740 ⇒ 00:21:25.860 Robert Tseng: Yeah, but I hear the reservation, and yeah, I think for the Q2 purposes, like, you can see, we didn’t hit, like, all of our KPIs, and ultimately, it’s fine. KPIs are directional.
226 00:21:25.890 ⇒ 00:21:27.750 Robert Tseng: And…
227 00:21:28.070 ⇒ 00:21:41.769 Robert Tseng: I mean, it’s not fine if we don’t do our work, but, like, it’s just a way to show that we kind of went above and beyond, I guess, like, kind of what we set out to do. Obviously, we’re still, as a team, doing good work there, and we want to keep that up, because
228 00:21:41.770 ⇒ 00:21:54.080 Robert Tseng: yeah, you know, it’s… it’s not easy, kind of, holding a client for a long time. So, yeah, I think those… the ad hoc things, what the clients are asking for, doing kind of the day-to-day management of that is… is like…
229 00:21:54.140 ⇒ 00:22:08.500 Robert Tseng: that should not ever be deprioritized, like, that’s always gonna be there. But, like, the bias that we should have is to, like, push them towards, like, the KPI, because, like, that’s, like, what we’re thinking of is going to really move the needle for the business.
230 00:22:08.500 ⇒ 00:22:24.550 Robert Tseng: And so when we are, like, that should just be in the back of your mind when you’re working on an analysis, like, that’s the end goal. Like, you want to know, like, how does this analysis roll up to this thing? And you should… you should be right to question it. And if you have a hard time connecting the dots to that, like, we can spend our time talking about that.
231 00:22:24.560 ⇒ 00:22:31.600 Robert Tseng: Or if you feel like, as you’re doing work there, you realize that, like, a KPI is just, like, not feasible, because
232 00:22:31.760 ⇒ 00:22:40.290 Robert Tseng: they’ve gone in a different direction, or whatever it is, like, I think that’s also worth discussing as well. But yeah, I think that’s… that’s really…
233 00:22:40.750 ⇒ 00:23:00.500 Robert Tseng: you know, how, at an organizational level, decisions are made. Like, internally, we do that too. We set OKRs for the team. Now, this is, like, the end of the quarter. We’re, like, making adjustments based on, like, how… how we performed against the KPIs we set as well. So, I’m, you know, this is universally kind of how every organization will… will end up making their decisions.
234 00:23:02.200 ⇒ 00:23:07.640 Amber Lin: Cool. Yeah. So on the AMBLE side, let’s see…
235 00:23:07.880 ⇒ 00:23:24.989 Amber Lin: I think what I have done now is I can replicate a lot of the dashboards or reporting that we have on Eden, and I can compare those numbers, but I think for your discovery… sorry, your, like, renewal expansion purposes.
236 00:23:25.710 ⇒ 00:23:32.860 Amber Lin: can you tell me what you’re looking for? Are you looking for to say, hey, you performed this, you’re…
237 00:23:33.110 ⇒ 00:23:38.460 Amber Lin: this percent off from Eden, this is your opportunity, or are you…
238 00:23:39.020 ⇒ 00:23:47.620 Amber Lin: Are you just looking for, like, ABC style of, hey, this is kind of your distribution, blah blah blah, like, a more observative, descriptive?
239 00:23:47.850 ⇒ 00:24:06.660 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so I think not the ABC one. So definitely more of the benchmarking against Eden, and, like, kind of using that. So, I mean, I already… I took your doc, and I used it to kind of pitch a few things to them already, and I guess, like, I can go find the transcript of that call, with Anvil to… to kind of put, like…
240 00:24:06.830 ⇒ 00:24:23.390 Robert Tseng: from what I recall, like, the operate… like, the margin reporting and, like, profitability, like, he says there’s nobody doing that right now, and they thought that that would be valuable. So, like, kind of similar to what you’ve already kicked off with… with Brad, I may have, like, kind of…
241 00:24:23.680 ⇒ 00:24:42.730 Robert Tseng: you know, talk more extensively about what… that we haven’t necessarily gotten there and eaten, but, like, I know what it should look like, so I was able to, like, kind of just blah blah blah at him, and he was like, okay, yeah, that’s definitely part of it. They don’t need intake reporting, so they don’t really need product analytics, mixed panel, that stuff is not important.
242 00:24:42.730 ⇒ 00:24:50.480 Robert Tseng: But they’re also interested in, like, the LTV and retention reporting stuff that we’ve done, on Eden. So, like, I feel like that’s…
243 00:24:50.560 ⇒ 00:25:00.729 Robert Tseng: they’re less interested in reporting for, like, top of funnel stuff, like, I think it’s… it’s a little bit backwards on Eden, but, like, they… they care a lot more about, like.
244 00:25:00.730 ⇒ 00:25:10.900 Robert Tseng: about their… trying to get a good sense of their margins of the business, and also, like, how do they, like, kind of retain customers? Like, I point… I pulled out one nugget where I said to them, like.
245 00:25:11.420 ⇒ 00:25:29.650 Robert Tseng: your… I think it was, like, Terzepatide, like, LTV is… is pretty low, like, you’re not… your customers aren’t saying you for very long. And, like, that got their attention, because they’re like, oh, like, what do you… why do you say that? Like, what do you think? So… so that’s what I’m saying, like, you know, that… that’s… whenever we can comment on, like.
246 00:25:29.850 ⇒ 00:25:41.100 Robert Tseng: hey, your patients are not behaving the way that we would expect for a business like yours. That will sound an alarm. Or like, hey, your, your,
247 00:25:41.100 ⇒ 00:25:52.949 Robert Tseng: like, you’re… you’re… like, we can… we can meaningfully reduce your COGS or, like, expand your margin. Like, those are all things that will directly, like, resonate with… with their… with… with, with, I feel like, most businesses.
248 00:25:52.950 ⇒ 00:25:53.690 Amber Lin: So…
249 00:25:53.690 ⇒ 00:26:10.659 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think that’s… that’s kind of, like, the direction I probably would take it in. Then there’s obviously kind of, like, the, hey, we basically rebuilt Basque for… for, for Eden, and, like, they want to get a proposal on that too, so I will pitch them on that as well. And,
250 00:26:11.140 ⇒ 00:26:21.160 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think those are… those are really the main things that they’ve really latched onto. But, like, the… it’s… the notes are on the platform. If you go back and fish for it, you could probably find it. Yeah.
251 00:26:21.810 ⇒ 00:26:24.490 Amber Lin: Gotcha, okay. That’s really helpful, because
252 00:26:24.640 ⇒ 00:26:35.760 Amber Lin: one of the… I was trying to balance in my head of what you’re pitching, because I was like, are we just pitching building them dashboards? Like, that… that’s… that’s okay, but that doesn’t have too big of an impact.
253 00:26:35.760 ⇒ 00:26:37.110 Robert Tseng: Yeah, no, no, no, yeah.
254 00:26:37.110 ⇒ 00:26:41.800 Amber Lin: We’re looking at the dashboards to see where things don’t…
255 00:26:41.920 ⇒ 00:26:43.490 Amber Lin: don’t match up. I think that.
256 00:26:43.490 ⇒ 00:26:44.090 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
257 00:26:44.250 ⇒ 00:26:52.629 Amber Lin: that’s where my, maybe, pretty rough discovery work can identify, versus, like, oh, I’ve got to build them a dashboard on this thing.
258 00:26:52.630 ⇒ 00:27:09.000 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so don’t worry about, like, the visuals and reporting. I mean, obviously, just, like, kind of be able to defend your conclusions a bit, like, maybe if the visual is helpful or whatever, but yeah, I think I want… I want to be able to do this type of comparative analysis. It’s like, hey, we’ve gone through, looked at your data.
259 00:27:09.000 ⇒ 00:27:17.619 Robert Tseng: Like, we’ve worked a business like yours before, and comparing to what we know, like, this is not… like, these are areas of opportunities that we would like to work with you on.
260 00:27:18.000 ⇒ 00:27:21.920 Amber Lin: Yeah. Gotcha. Okay. There he is,
261 00:27:23.870 ⇒ 00:27:32.920 Amber Lin: Cool. And on the BASC side, I can see if they have data on, for example, their BASC fees.
262 00:27:32.920 ⇒ 00:27:33.590 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
263 00:27:34.370 ⇒ 00:27:42.100 Amber Lin: I can check if there’s a field, but do you know what percentage they have with DASC? Is it also 0.5%, or is it, like, a…
264 00:27:42.650 ⇒ 00:27:45.239 Robert Tseng: Yeah, you can assume that it’s about the same if you don’t find it.
265 00:27:45.240 ⇒ 00:27:45.610 Amber Lin: Okay.
266 00:27:45.610 ⇒ 00:27:46.010 Robert Tseng: Which…
267 00:27:46.010 ⇒ 00:27:46.530 Amber Lin: time.
268 00:27:46.740 ⇒ 00:27:50.649 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, that’s… yeah, that, that’s.
269 00:27:50.650 ⇒ 00:28:03.869 Amber Lin: I think that will help, because they’re like, oh, you spend about a million with BAS, or you spend about this much with BAS per year, this is how much it costs built in an OS, and this is how much it costs to run, so… Yeah.
270 00:28:04.010 ⇒ 00:28:04.660 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
271 00:28:05.490 ⇒ 00:28:09.840 Amber Lin: Cool. Okay. This is really nice. I have…
272 00:28:10.110 ⇒ 00:28:18.260 Amber Lin: Amble, Element to do. I’ll prioritize Anvil stuff, and I’m meeting Abbott pretty frequently, so I’ll try to onboard him.
273 00:28:18.650 ⇒ 00:28:24.449 Robert Tseng: Okay, great. Yeah, I’m gonna just… I mean, I’m gonna meet with him officially tomorrow, so I’ll probably keep telling him to…
274 00:28:24.880 ⇒ 00:28:41.339 Robert Tseng: like, lean on you, for now to kind of get on board with the elements. Obviously, we’re trying to self-onboard him, too, by teaching him all the AI tools and stuff, but, yeah, just letting you know, like, he’ll probably keep trying to just, like, shadow you and try to learn things, yeah.
275 00:28:41.340 ⇒ 00:28:59.679 Amber Lin: I’ve onboarded him on the AI stuff, some of the AI stuff I used, but until now, I wasn’t sure when he was coming onto Element of, am I gonna finish full-sale Retail, and then he comes on, but I think right now, we want him to come on and take over as soon as possible.
276 00:28:59.870 ⇒ 00:29:10.599 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, like, he’s already here. Like, he came in a little bit earlier than I thought. I thought he was gonna come in a little bit earlier, but… I mean, yeah, I’d rather just… just try to get him in earlier than…
277 00:29:10.600 ⇒ 00:29:13.100 Amber Lin: Okay, because right now he doesn’t have anything to do, so…
278 00:29:13.100 ⇒ 00:29:17.069 Robert Tseng: He’s just kind of not doing much, so… Yeah, go ahead.
279 00:29:17.070 ⇒ 00:29:24.800 Amber Lin: Okay, sounds good. I will, like, task him with a ticket, I’ll ask Greg. Hopefully we start the transition there.
280 00:29:25.110 ⇒ 00:29:26.200 Robert Tseng: Okay, great.
281 00:29:26.840 ⇒ 00:29:28.410 Amber Lin: Cool. Thank you so much.
282 00:29:28.580 ⇒ 00:29:28.990 Robert Tseng: Sounds.
283 00:29:28.990 ⇒ 00:29:29.880 Amber Lin: Goodbye!
284 00:29:30.230 ⇒ 00:29:31.470 Robert Tseng: Bye-bye!
285 00:29:31.860 ⇒ 00:29:32.830 Amber Lin: Bye!