Meeting Title: [HOLD] Brainforge x Talisma Date: 2026-03-13 Meeting participants: Luke Scorziell, Aaron Schwarzberg, Uttam Kumaran
WEBVTT
1 00:00:19.920 ⇒ 00:00:21.379 Aaron Schwarzberg: Hey, Luke, how are you?
2 00:00:21.600 ⇒ 00:00:23.620 Luke Scorziell: Hey, good, how are you doing, Eric? Eric?
3 00:00:23.620 ⇒ 00:00:26.249 Aaron Schwarzberg: It’s nice to meet you. How’s everything going?
4 00:00:26.250 ⇒ 00:00:30.150 Luke Scorziell: Pretty good. Yeah, just, finishing out the week strong, so…
5 00:00:30.150 ⇒ 00:00:34.560 Aaron Schwarzberg: Nice, that’s great. Is UTM gonna be joining us, or do you think it’s gonna be just the two of us?
6 00:00:34.830 ⇒ 00:00:42.880 Luke Scorziell: I believe Utam will be here, I know he had, mentioned that, but let me just, let me slack him real quick.
7 00:00:43.010 ⇒ 00:00:44.300 Aaron Schwarzberg: Cool. Okay.
8 00:00:46.010 ⇒ 00:00:47.350 Luke Scorziell: Where are you calling from?
9 00:00:47.740 ⇒ 00:00:49.329 Aaron Schwarzberg: Palm Beach Gardens, Florida.
10 00:00:49.870 ⇒ 00:00:50.819 Luke Scorziell: Oh, really? Oh, nice.
11 00:00:50.820 ⇒ 00:00:55.020 Aaron Schwarzberg: How about you? I know you’re in California, you’re in Southern, right?
12 00:00:55.260 ⇒ 00:00:56.990 Luke Scorziell: Yes, yeah, I’m in Los Angeles.
13 00:00:56.990 ⇒ 00:00:58.289 Aaron Schwarzberg: Nice, very nice. Okay, great.
14 00:00:58.290 ⇒ 00:01:02.600 Luke Scorziell: So, Palm Beach, I guess, is a good education spot, right? But you guys have some of the larger…
15 00:01:03.190 ⇒ 00:01:14.739 Aaron Schwarzberg: So, I mean, not a lot of major, colleges and universities close by. I mean, we have University of Florida, we have FSU, we have,
16 00:01:14.740 ⇒ 00:01:26.860 Aaron Schwarzberg: University of Tampa, University of South Florida, but none of those are in the Palm Beach kind of area. We have some smaller schools, like PBA, Palm Beach Atlantic, and some other higher ed institutions, but nothing major in this particular area.
17 00:01:27.540 ⇒ 00:01:37.110 Luke Scorziell: Oh, cool. Well, I… so, are you guys more focused on… I’m still getting a little more up to speed. I started in January, I haven’t done too much with Delismo yet. Yeah.
18 00:01:37.420 ⇒ 00:01:41.540 Luke Scorziell: Is it mainly college and universities that you guys work with, or…
19 00:01:41.540 ⇒ 00:01:54.159 Aaron Schwarzberg: Yeah, so in the U.S, so our company started 22 years ago, and they started off as a… Talism started as a CRM company, and then about three… two and a half, three years ago, we pivoted to AI, because we saw where the market was headed.
20 00:01:54.160 ⇒ 00:02:03.500 Aaron Schwarzberg: So we still have a proprietary CRM, but we also built a proprietary small language model that we utilize with higher ed institutions and with health systems in the U.S.
21 00:02:03.530 ⇒ 00:02:11.580 Aaron Schwarzberg: So what we do is we kind of wrap around their existing tech stack. So for higher ed, it’s an SAS, a CRM, an LMS, usually.
22 00:02:11.580 ⇒ 00:02:29.829 Aaron Schwarzberg: We come in, they don’t have to rip and replace, they can utilize our platform to wrap around what they currently have, and instead of utilizing three disparate systems to make decisions at the student level, the administrator, the professor level, now they have the benefit of piecing all of those together and having one unified view. So for the student perspective, it’s hyper-personalized learning. So if
23 00:02:29.830 ⇒ 00:02:44.330 Aaron Schwarzberg: you are having… you and I are both in the same class, and you’re having trouble in a particular area. I’m having trouble in a different area. The professor has the ability to reach each of us where we are in the modes and modalities that are more helpful and supportive to you versus what’s more supportive to me.
24 00:02:44.330 ⇒ 00:02:50.980 Aaron Schwarzberg: And you can take hundreds of students, and through our AI, be able to help all of them at an individual level. So that’s from the student perspective.
25 00:02:51.000 ⇒ 00:03:10.080 Aaron Schwarzberg: From the professor’s perspective, if he sees that all the students in his or her class are struggling with the same topic within a course catalog, he or she knows that they need to build new assessments in that particular area to help the students. They can automate those assessments because we lock down their course content, and we can automate the assessments for them through our AI.
26 00:03:10.150 ⇒ 00:03:23.150 Aaron Schwarzberg: And then at the administrator level, it’s, you know, pre-enrollment and enrollment support by utilizing things like OCR and other automated capabilities that our AI brings to the table. So, that’s on the higher ed side, but we also work with hospitals and health systems.
27 00:03:23.610 ⇒ 00:03:26.759 Luke Scorziell: Oh, cool, okay. Yeah. Wow, that’s really, really awesome.
28 00:03:26.760 ⇒ 00:03:27.409 Aaron Schwarzberg: I know.
29 00:03:27.810 ⇒ 00:03:32.239 Luke Scorziell: That’s, like, a whole new layer of ed tech than what it seems like has been around.
30 00:03:32.240 ⇒ 00:03:44.780 Aaron Schwarzberg: It’s a whole new layer of ed tech. We have, you know, competitors who compete with us in particular areas, but not across the board, so none of them are able to do all of the things that we just kind of talked through at the level we’re able to do them.
31 00:03:44.780 ⇒ 00:04:07.829 Aaron Schwarzberg: So it’s interesting. What’s good about… what we love about the partnership with Brainforge is a lot of our prospective clients, they know they need AI, they know they need automation, they know they need this layer and level of support, but they don’t know how to start, they don’t know where to jump in, they don’t know what data they have to tap into, what data they need to start tapping into, and that’s where Brainforge can come in and kind of be that consultative layer pre-launch.
32 00:04:08.010 ⇒ 00:04:13.600 Aaron Schwarzberg: To say, hey, before we go live with the Lisma, before they come, you know, work with us.
33 00:04:13.600 ⇒ 00:04:18.310 Aaron Schwarzberg: start working with Brainforge. Let them uncover what you have, what you need.
34 00:04:18.310 ⇒ 00:04:34.250 Aaron Schwarzberg: maybe that is us, maybe that’s something else, right? Maybe it’s something different, but at least they have the ability to start with BrainForge and get that kind of level of visibility and analytics and data and insights, and then downstream, if we can be helpful, then we come in. So that’s kind of where the partnership comes in.
35 00:04:34.940 ⇒ 00:04:42.939 Uttam Kumaran: Hey, how are you? Sorry, guys, I just… it’s, like, packed day, and I’m just running, so I need, like, a quick coffee.
36 00:04:43.040 ⇒ 00:04:46.380 Aaron Schwarzberg: All good. Luke and I have it all figured out, so we’re all set.
37 00:04:46.380 ⇒ 00:04:57.739 Uttam Kumaran: Great, I feel like you guys will be fast friends. I think Luke is, like, really tasked with taking, you know, a lot… I think when we first started talking, you heard how we thought about the brand, and I think…
38 00:04:57.830 ⇒ 00:05:05.820 Uttam Kumaran: it’s a lot of that I think Luke now has a really clear perspective on, and is, like, the person that’s gonna kind of drive, I think.
39 00:05:05.820 ⇒ 00:05:22.220 Uttam Kumaran: the wins that we want to achieve from the marketing and the growth side. So, again, I’m just pumped that you’re getting to meet, like, a lot of the new folks, and, like, we’re growing too, so it’s, like, it’s really awesome that people are coming in and taking more on and, like, driving this forward, so…
40 00:05:22.680 ⇒ 00:05:46.480 Aaron Schwarzberg: It’s a beautiful thing, you know, I think Steve Jobs said, you know, we hire smart people so they can tell us what to do, not the other way around, so, like, you bring in all these wonderful people who are exceptional at what they do, you kind of unload some of those responsibilities and let them go and drive and do and be, and so it’s awesome. But, Luke, it’s great to, you know, like I said, it’s great to meet you. Utham, we were just kind of talking through, super high level what Teleisma does, and then
41 00:05:46.670 ⇒ 00:05:56.150 Aaron Schwarzberg: where the partnership, you know, is super valuable for us when we have clients who want to do more, or prospective clients who want to start to think about implementing AI,
42 00:05:56.150 ⇒ 00:06:14.320 Aaron Schwarzberg: we can bring you guys in early on, and you guys can help them with an assessment with, kind of, where they are from a data perspective. Do they have enough to make an informed decision as to what tools and resources they need? Are they on the precipice of potentially needing TLSMA, or is that something way down the line, and there’s 4 or 5 other things that they need to do first?
43 00:06:14.370 ⇒ 00:06:17.409 Aaron Schwarzberg: So we’re… literally, we just started diving into that when you joined.
44 00:06:17.790 ⇒ 00:06:27.249 Uttam Kumaran: Cool. Yeah, and I think on our side, too, we are starting to meet people that are asking us for, like, a variety of solutions. I think even our delivery team is getting better.
45 00:06:27.990 ⇒ 00:06:47.430 Uttam Kumaran: you know, trying to expand opportunities, so even compared to when we first started, I think we’re getting much better at seeing some of those opportunities where we can collaborate. And I think, Luke, sort of, like, our timeline and, like, what I think we’ve… we’ve sort of prioritized for the next, like, you know, month or so is, one, like, can we drive towards, you know, some type of formal partnership announcement?
46 00:06:47.430 ⇒ 00:06:54.569 Uttam Kumaran: Can we use Telisma’s expertise In, you know, like, the ed tech education sector as, like, a wedge.
47 00:06:54.570 ⇒ 00:07:11.999 Uttam Kumaran: you know, for us to, like, enter that, and also, for us to collaborate, given, like, our scope of capabilities. And so, we’ve… we’ve had… we have, like, a kind of co-marketing deck that I’ll share with you as well. I… I explained to Aaron, sort of, like, how our webinars are going, and I think ultimately, like.
48 00:07:12.020 ⇒ 00:07:19.050 Uttam Kumaran: we have a strong footing in e-commerce, CPG, B2B SaaS, but we’re always trying to look for the next
49 00:07:19.100 ⇒ 00:07:38.519 Uttam Kumaran: you know, venue, and, like, doing it through partners is the only way that we do these things. I think Luke has seen, sort of, how we are highlighting a lot of partners, and seeing how… I think… I don’t know, Luke, if you felt like before Brainforge, how important partners were going to be, versus just, like, raw, cold sales, you know?
50 00:07:39.300 ⇒ 00:07:50.079 Uttam Kumaran: like, you know, we do everything through partners, and so whether that’s vendor partners, whether that’s, like, agency partners, capability partners, right? So I think it’s, like, a huge part of our strategy.
51 00:07:50.180 ⇒ 00:07:54.449 Uttam Kumaran: But yeah, I don’t know, Luke, if you have any thoughts, or… Yeah. …sort of where we are.
52 00:07:54.620 ⇒ 00:08:08.380 Luke Scorziell: No, I mean, I came in, and no one… no one told… or I was explicitly told it would not be the same role, you know, for long, in the sense of, like, just being okay with adjusting and adapting, and so…
53 00:08:08.380 ⇒ 00:08:15.139 Luke Scorziell: yeah, as soon as I started getting on some calls with partners, I was like, oh, I really, like, like this, I think I’m a pretty relational person, and so…
54 00:08:15.140 ⇒ 00:08:22.770 Luke Scorziell: Like, that’s just been super fun, so I’ve been glad to get to shift, some focus there, too, and…
55 00:08:22.820 ⇒ 00:08:40.439 Luke Scorziell: Yeah, I mean, I think it’s interesting, just as we were talking about, like, education and higher ed, and just that’s where you’re focused, because I think that’s an industry that… I guess it’s… I don’t know if it’s an… you’d call it an industry, but, it’s an area that’s thinking a lot about AI and how
56 00:08:40.909 ⇒ 00:08:46.319 Luke Scorziell: How it will affect students and whatnot, and there’s probably some fear and… and angst,
57 00:08:46.540 ⇒ 00:08:50.189 Luke Scorziell: Probably as in most industries, so I think it’d be interesting to be able to, like.
58 00:08:50.800 ⇒ 00:08:52.389 Luke Scorziell: Bring in some of the…
59 00:08:52.710 ⇒ 00:08:56.599 Luke Scorziell: You know, but it’s also an industry where people are thinking a lot, and so…
60 00:08:57.630 ⇒ 00:09:06.400 Luke Scorziell: Being able to bring in people for events where we have… we can bring our smart people, you can bring your smart people, and they can ask smart questions.
61 00:09:06.780 ⇒ 00:09:11.390 Luke Scorziell: So, yeah, I guess maybe, like, diving in a little more, so…
62 00:09:11.980 ⇒ 00:09:15.359 Luke Scorziell: We’ve been doing the webinars,
63 00:09:15.800 ⇒ 00:09:18.889 Luke Scorziell: Which, totally happy to do one.
64 00:09:19.230 ⇒ 00:09:26.069 Luke Scorziell: with… with you guys, too. I know, I was in school during COVID, so, that…
65 00:09:26.290 ⇒ 00:09:33.339 Luke Scorziell: all of Zoom. That’s when Zoom blew up, so I’m sure people would be happy to be re-traumatized getting on a Zoom webinar.
66 00:09:33.340 ⇒ 00:09:36.380 Aaron Schwarzberg: A thousand percent, absolutely, yep, yeah, they are, yeah.
67 00:09:36.380 ⇒ 00:09:46.769 Luke Scorziell: But but yeah, so I… we’re kind of… kind of the strategy that we’re thinking is, like, doing webinars, or, well, office hours, so a little more engaging than webinars,
68 00:09:47.050 ⇒ 00:09:56.779 Luke Scorziell: Where we’re actually having a discussion with people and letting them answer… ask and answer questions, as… and kind of using that as, like, a data gathering phase of…
69 00:09:57.090 ⇒ 00:10:06.200 Luke Scorziell: what are the things that people in our… the target audience are really concerned about? Like, what questions are they asking? Yeah. How engaged are they?
70 00:10:06.310 ⇒ 00:10:14.170 Luke Scorziell: And… and then how can we kind of build off of that for either, like, maybe what you were saying, like, a more formal partnership announcement.
71 00:10:14.270 ⇒ 00:10:25.279 Luke Scorziell: Or a, like, throwing an in-person event. And so, that’s kind of the strategy, like, that we’ve been running, with a couple other partners, and so, yeah, I’d be curious to know.
72 00:10:26.710 ⇒ 00:10:33.029 Luke Scorziell: yeah, just how that maybe fits on kind of your roadmap, and then obviously we can brainstorm ideas together, too, so I don’t want to…
73 00:10:33.030 ⇒ 00:10:56.490 Aaron Schwarzberg: So it fits nicely, and Utham and I have been… Utham and I and our respective teams have been talking about what’s the right approach, one or two of those pieces, or some combination thereof. We’re open and receptive to where you guys have, you know, had people come to you and be receptive to the approach, where… and I shared this with Utham the other day.
74 00:10:56.530 ⇒ 00:11:15.220 Aaron Schwarzberg: we’ve been very successful, and we’ve had smaller groups where we’ve been able to ideate, right? So it’s less us talking at them, and more, like you said, it’s office hours, it’s collaboration, it’s coordination, it’s what are you doing, how are we doing it, what are we seeing in the market, what are you seeing in the market, what are the trends, and kind of having this open dialogue, then
75 00:11:15.220 ⇒ 00:11:21.650 Aaron Schwarzberg: Organically, people have been coming to us and saying, like, this makes a lot of sense, how can you help us kind of develop this plan further?
76 00:11:21.650 ⇒ 00:11:39.279 Aaron Schwarzberg: So I think the methodology and the approach is very similar between the two organizations and how we meaningfully connect with people, not just blast out and kind of throw pasta at the wall and see what sticks. It’s more kind of getting a smaller, intimate group of 15, 20, 30 people in a room, whether it’s a virtual room or a physical room.
77 00:11:39.280 ⇒ 00:11:40.379 Aaron Schwarzberg: and saying.
78 00:11:40.870 ⇒ 00:11:56.939 Aaron Schwarzberg: let’s talk about where the industry’s headed, let’s talk about what we’re seeing. The story and the dynamic between the two organizations is actually very fluid and easy to talk through, because what we see when we engage with clients is they’re at different places in their path.
79 00:11:56.940 ⇒ 00:12:03.899 Aaron Schwarzberg: Some higher ed institutions have been mandated by their board to implement AI this year without fail. If you don’t.
80 00:12:03.900 ⇒ 00:12:21.179 Aaron Schwarzberg: we’re gonna find people who will. It’s sometimes that direct. Other organizations are at the information gathering phase. One introduction we made to Utam and team is a school called Bay Path University. Their vice president of enrollment, who’s now become their chief strategy officer, a gentleman by the name of Frank Rojas.
81 00:12:21.180 ⇒ 00:12:33.829 Aaron Schwarzberg: he was tasked with implementing AI, but to do deep dive, and to make sure that he’s thinking about it the right way, and not use AI for the sake of using it. And when Utam and I met, I remember the conversation we had very vividly, I remember where I was sitting, we both were saying the same thing.
82 00:12:34.020 ⇒ 00:12:49.429 Aaron Schwarzberg: it’s like, there’s a lot of bullshit out there, and there’s a lot of talk and chatter about AI, because it’s a buzzword, and everyone’s thinking about it, but how can we meaningfully implement something? That’s what Frank and his team are looking to uncover. So, they weren’t ready to move forward with us, they knew…
83 00:12:49.430 ⇒ 00:13:02.860 Aaron Schwarzberg: Ultimately, at some point, they want to, but they need some organization on the front end to help to uncover where they truly are, what they truly need, how they can get there, based on their infrastructure, what type of support do they need from a technological and
84 00:13:02.860 ⇒ 00:13:07.149 Aaron Schwarzberg: human capital perspective, and that’s where BrainForge comes in, right? So.
85 00:13:07.150 ⇒ 00:13:07.700 Luke Scorziell: Yeah.
86 00:13:07.750 ⇒ 00:13:09.719 Aaron Schwarzberg: That, that story…
87 00:13:09.780 ⇒ 00:13:26.209 Aaron Schwarzberg: It hits everyone where they are, whether they’re further downstream and ready to dive in with our products and our capabilities, whether they need someone to hold their hand, uncover what data they already have that they’re not tapping into, what assessments can be made about their current tech stack, where you guys can come in and be impactful.
88 00:13:26.210 ⇒ 00:13:35.890 Aaron Schwarzberg: That, whether it’s a fireside chat, whether it’s an on-site and, you know, all together, whether it’s virtual and it’s, you know, in office hours.
89 00:13:35.890 ⇒ 00:13:53.449 Aaron Schwarzberg: it lends itself… our story, our collaborative story between the two organizations, lends itself well to all of those, I think. So, I blabbed a lot, but that’s my way of saying we are open and receptive to everything that you just described, Luke, and Utham and I have had those conversations as well. So, we’re looking forward to it, and we’re ready to jump in.
90 00:13:53.650 ⇒ 00:13:58.359 Luke Scorziell: Yeah, well, so tell me, a little more about the…
91 00:13:58.890 ⇒ 00:14:06.900 Luke Scorziell: like, target audience that you guys are going after? Because I imagine with some of the larger universities, it’s a slow, slow buying process.
92 00:14:07.580 ⇒ 00:14:20.370 Luke Scorziell: It would just be my gut instinct, so is it, like, are you kind of more going after, like, smaller private universities, or what’s the… who’s, like, who’s the buyer, and who are the, like, the people that we… who we would want to try to get in the room at an event?
93 00:14:20.640 ⇒ 00:14:33.020 Aaron Schwarzberg: So I’ll try to go, in order with the questions you asked. All of those are good questions. We do not have one target demographic in the higher ed space, and again, we also work with hospitals and health systems, but let’s stay on higher ed for a second, because that’s the one you asked about.
94 00:14:33.020 ⇒ 00:14:56.280 Aaron Schwarzberg: The higher… the larger institutions, 20,000 plus students, are very slow moving, but they need it just as badly as the small and medium-sized schools. So we have those on our, you know, 9-month to 12-month sales cycle kind of view. Then the medium-sized schools, they move at a medium kind of pace. The small liberal arts, faith-based schools, those move extremely
95 00:14:56.280 ⇒ 00:14:57.869 Aaron Schwarzberg: lightning quick. Like.
96 00:14:57.870 ⇒ 00:15:10.679 Aaron Schwarzberg: 1 to 2 or 3 months from the time we engage with them to the time where they actually start with implementation. So we have, kind of, short-term, mid-term, long-term sales cycles based on the size of the institutions.
97 00:15:10.680 ⇒ 00:15:22.019 Aaron Schwarzberg: or we’re going after all of them, because a lot of what we do, or a big part of what we do, is… can be ingestion-based. So if it’s, for example, using our OCR technology for pre-admissions document review.
98 00:15:22.040 ⇒ 00:15:26.740 Aaron Schwarzberg: We have one prospective client we’re looking to close that processes 100,000 applications a year.
99 00:15:26.880 ⇒ 00:15:39.650 Aaron Schwarzberg: And so, like, that takes us… that deal will take us longer to close, but it’s a behemoth. It’s a whale, right? It’s absolutely massive for us. So, we have deals that we’re closing very quickly, we have deals that are going to close in…
100 00:15:39.650 ⇒ 00:15:48.960 Aaron Schwarzberg: 4 to 6 months, and then we have deals that are gonna close in 9-12 months, and we’re equally interested in all of them. So the small ones are good, the medium-sized ones are good. I think we lost Luke.
101 00:15:49.990 ⇒ 00:15:51.169 Aaron Schwarzberg: Oh, there he is.
102 00:15:51.170 ⇒ 00:15:51.990 Luke Scorziell: Bye.
103 00:15:53.640 ⇒ 00:15:54.010 Uttam Kumaran: You back?
104 00:15:54.010 ⇒ 00:15:59.589 Luke Scorziell: The internet is, like, it works when it… when it wants to, and then when it doesn’t, it doesn’t.
105 00:16:00.770 ⇒ 00:16:20.160 Aaron Schwarzberg: All good. So, so that’s… I don’t know if you heard all of that or most of that, Luke, but essentially, to answer that first question, it’s across the board, small, medium, and large. Any type of institution, private, public, faith-based, there’s… any hired institution can benefit from some subset of our capabilities, or the full suite.
106 00:16:20.420 ⇒ 00:16:36.879 Aaron Schwarzberg: You asked a second question that I wanted to dive into. What was the one after the side? Oh, buyers. So the buyer persona. Utham and I have talked about this a few times as well. It runs the gamut. It really based… it’s dependent upon how the university is run. A lot of universities now have brought in
107 00:16:37.030 ⇒ 00:16:53.669 Aaron Schwarzberg: directors of AI. Those directors of AI work closely with admissions, they work with financial aid, they work across the board, but they’re the ones who are going to be tasked with vetting AI partners, whether that’s front-end data stuff with you guys, or whether that’s solutions, like, on our side and beyond.
108 00:16:53.960 ⇒ 00:17:00.750 Aaron Schwarzberg: Typically, we sell into a VP of Admissions, because that’s where we can be most impactful, is on the admissions side.
109 00:17:01.410 ⇒ 00:17:07.799 Aaron Schwarzberg: But financial aid processing can benefit from our OCR technology.
110 00:17:07.800 ⇒ 00:17:21.639 Aaron Schwarzberg: Professors and faculty senates can benefit from our ability to generate AI-based assessments based on course content and course catalogs, not opening up like a large language model would, but really hunkering down to what their specific course content is.
111 00:17:21.670 ⇒ 00:17:37.579 Aaron Schwarzberg: So, the answer to the question is, whoever is tasked with leading the charge with implementing AI, we try to ascertain who that person is or who that department is, and then we work closely with them. But invariably, what ends up happening is they pull in someone from admissions.
112 00:17:37.640 ⇒ 00:17:56.550 Aaron Schwarzberg: someone from financial aid, and someone from administration. Typically, it’s the college president who’s going to end up making the ultimate decision, but it’s some coordination with those individuals that gets it to his or her desk, his or her being the president, and that person deciding if and when they’re going to be moving forward.
113 00:17:56.550 ⇒ 00:18:15.719 Aaron Schwarzberg: So it’s not one persona type. What happens is as we go through our capabilities in our demo, they say, oh, we need Sally from financial aid, or we need John from Admissions, they need to see this, and then they both say, yeah, this is great. What’s then helpful is they each have budget, and everyone has the ability to chip in if they want to, so it doesn’t all have to fall under one department.
114 00:18:15.720 ⇒ 00:18:29.970 Aaron Schwarzberg: So, and our pricing is very, very competitive. Basically, the entire team, more or less, is located in Bangalore, and our dev is there, and we have in-house development capabilities, and so we have a lot of control over our costs.
115 00:18:29.970 ⇒ 00:18:39.329 Aaron Schwarzberg: So, I think institutions are typically surprised at how low our pricing is as well. So, I don’t know if that fully answers all your questions about buyers and institutions, but happy to dive in more.
116 00:18:39.990 ⇒ 00:18:49.039 Luke Scorziell: Yeah, yeah, no, that’s super helpful. I think I’m just trying to get a scope of, like, if we do an event, like, who would we invite, who would we try to target, and then also just, like.
117 00:18:49.470 ⇒ 00:18:55.500 Luke Scorziell: does an online event make the most sense? I know a lot of universities are… have it, you know, at least
118 00:18:55.630 ⇒ 00:19:04.690 Luke Scorziell: I went to USC, I guess I’m wearing my hat today, but, that, like, we would have events all the time between, like,
119 00:19:04.980 ⇒ 00:19:14.269 Luke Scorziell: like, the dean, or a professor, and… and then, like, some thought leader in a space. And so, to me, that’s interesting, of, like.
120 00:19:14.470 ⇒ 00:19:22.509 Luke Scorziell: Would it be more interesting to do, like, an on-campus event at some school that we identify together than it would be
121 00:19:22.890 ⇒ 00:19:28.219 Luke Scorziell: to do, like, a webinar, I guess, or an office hours, or is it…
122 00:19:28.790 ⇒ 00:19:37.550 Luke Scorziell: Or do we… yeah, start with… because I guess, like, I’m trying to… yeah, I’m trying to find the right way in, because… so we have, I guess, date-wise.
123 00:19:37.770 ⇒ 00:19:39.670 Luke Scorziell: We have office hours planned.
124 00:19:40.150 ⇒ 00:19:44.730 Luke Scorziell: We’re kind of thinking that we can cap out at about One every other week.
125 00:19:45.410 ⇒ 00:19:52.029 Luke Scorziell: Just in terms of, like, our team, and that might speed up, as we get more,
126 00:19:52.800 ⇒ 00:20:00.049 Luke Scorziell: like, you know, we’ve done a couple, and then it’s like, we’re learning, so we’re kind of in the learning cycle.
127 00:20:00.570 ⇒ 00:20:06.749 Luke Scorziell: And, yeah, kind of our, like… I mean, we might be able to do something soonerish, but we’re thinking, like.
128 00:20:07.710 ⇒ 00:20:13.100 Luke Scorziell: Like, probably the next one that we would have would be…
129 00:20:16.220 ⇒ 00:20:27.389 Luke Scorziell: Well, I mean, yeah, we can try to make a push sooner, but in May is kind of the, like, when… what we’ve currently got settled out to. So, I think if it makes sense to do, like, an announcement earlier, then maybe we can…
130 00:20:27.640 ⇒ 00:20:28.160 Aaron Schwarzberg: Yep.
131 00:20:28.160 ⇒ 00:20:32.700 Luke Scorziell: And then we have the GSV Summit, too, which I don’t know as much about.
132 00:20:32.700 ⇒ 00:20:41.969 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, so, Luke, on the GSV piece, like, Robert is right now emailing back and forth with someone on their biz dev side. I mean, I think we’re basically figuring out, like.
133 00:20:42.220 ⇒ 00:20:46.569 Uttam Kumaran: if there’s a play there, and if it’s, like, worthwhile. So, I think…
134 00:20:46.780 ⇒ 00:20:54.120 Uttam Kumaran: like, Aaron Roberts out this week, but I… I told him that, that, you’re in to sort of join that, and maybe you guys can…
135 00:20:54.240 ⇒ 00:20:57.029 Aaron Schwarzberg: Brief right before that, too. Just to see, like.
136 00:20:57.500 ⇒ 00:20:58.840 Uttam Kumaran: What they’re saying.
137 00:20:58.840 ⇒ 00:20:59.990 Aaron Schwarzberg: Yep.
138 00:21:00.070 ⇒ 00:21:02.999 Uttam Kumaran: But I think… Luke, just like everything.
139 00:21:03.270 ⇒ 00:21:15.090 Uttam Kumaran: The problem with GSV is that it’s just the biggest summit, and so it’s like, we could do something adjacent, but also it could be better for us to just do something we own, like, really with, like, a really accurate set of
140 00:21:15.730 ⇒ 00:21:19.090 Uttam Kumaran: ICPs or personas in the room.
141 00:21:19.090 ⇒ 00:21:19.580 Luke Scorziell: Yeah.
142 00:21:19.580 ⇒ 00:21:25.060 Uttam Kumaran: So, like, it’s kind of similar. I just think, compared to some of our other partners, I think Talism has a clear, like.
143 00:21:25.500 ⇒ 00:21:26.970 Uttam Kumaran: industry angle.
144 00:21:27.540 ⇒ 00:21:31.710 Uttam Kumaran: like, I think, Aaron, from partnering with, like, other, like, software vendors.
145 00:21:32.060 ⇒ 00:21:42.520 Uttam Kumaran: they are so broad that they’re relying on us for the, like, expertise in a given area, where I feel like we’re aligned, in one sector where we can actually be, like, really, really targeted.
146 00:21:42.520 ⇒ 00:21:43.600 Aaron Schwarzberg: Yup.
147 00:21:43.630 ⇒ 00:21:49.339 Uttam Kumaran: You know, so I think that I kind of tend to agree that, like, I want to do something where we own the narrative and, like.
148 00:21:49.510 ⇒ 00:22:02.589 Uttam Kumaran: it can be meaningful for the folks that are involved. I think a webinar is a good way to do a few and, like, test the waters. Like, can we invite some of those personas, and then maybe we can target a geo or whatever to then use that to…
149 00:22:03.320 ⇒ 00:22:05.440 Uttam Kumaran: You know, kind of roll into an event.
150 00:22:05.710 ⇒ 00:22:06.120 Aaron Schwarzberg: Yeah.
151 00:22:06.270 ⇒ 00:22:14.980 Luke Scorziell: I mean, like, I… not to over-promise or anything, but I feel like if we threw, like, an office hours, an initial event, with just
152 00:22:15.520 ⇒ 00:22:21.440 Luke Scorziell: Generally, like, faculty at universities to kind of say something that was interesting.
153 00:22:21.610 ⇒ 00:22:29.609 Luke Scorziell: To them, and to, like, the goals of that would be, like, understand how they’re thinking about it, understand a little bit, or be able to get content.
154 00:22:29.750 ⇒ 00:22:34.040 Luke Scorziell: That we can start using to, like, create a snowball effect.
155 00:22:34.190 ⇒ 00:22:38.169 Luke Scorziell: Because, like, with the last office hours we ran, it was a lot of people that were in my…
156 00:22:38.300 ⇒ 00:22:42.259 Luke Scorziell: Network, or adjacent to it.
157 00:22:42.600 ⇒ 00:22:47.739 Luke Scorziell: But now we have kind of these, like, cool videos that we were posting on LinkedIn to kind of show, like.
158 00:22:47.930 ⇒ 00:22:54.549 Luke Scorziell: you know, if you’re in the agency world and you want to, learn how to implement AI, then, like, come and check it out. So that’s…
159 00:22:54.890 ⇒ 00:23:06.430 Luke Scorziell: kind of the… the snowball, like, bet, I guess, that we’re making. Yeah. So, I… I guess, unless… if you guys have a list of people that are more in those, like, buyer profiles of
160 00:23:06.700 ⇒ 00:23:09.120 Luke Scorziell: Like, admissions…
161 00:23:10.380 ⇒ 00:23:16.019 Luke Scorziell: professors, I mean, we can do cold outreach, too. I think just the… the… .
162 00:23:18.080 ⇒ 00:23:24.200 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I don’t know if targeting, like, one geo is better, or targeting, like, what is, like, a good segmentation, Aaron, in, like.
163 00:23:24.700 ⇒ 00:23:25.300 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
164 00:23:25.300 ⇒ 00:23:26.870 Aaron Schwarzberg: If we…
165 00:23:26.970 ⇒ 00:23:38.210 Aaron Schwarzberg: we… it’s very easy to get lists of higher ed leaders. Those are aggregated all the time, so if we… if we wanted to, we could spend a couple hundred dollars and buy a list of
166 00:23:39.370 ⇒ 00:23:53.429 Aaron Schwarzberg: 750 or 800 VPs of enrollment, right? Like, that’s something we could get very easily. One of the… it was either GSV or another one from last year, we ended up getting a list of, like, 2,000 higher ed contacts.
167 00:23:53.430 ⇒ 00:24:00.589 Aaron Schwarzberg: And you’re able to kind of splice it by, you know, persona and profile and role and responsibility. And so…
168 00:24:00.730 ⇒ 00:24:08.949 Aaron Schwarzberg: blasting the outreach, from a relatively cold perspective, we have the ability to cast a wide net, and I think we’d get an interesting kind of mix.
169 00:24:09.310 ⇒ 00:24:18.119 Aaron Schwarzberg: it’s not geo-based if we’re doing virtual, right? Because what we talk about with one school is going to be interesting to schools all across the country.
170 00:24:18.120 ⇒ 00:24:31.079 Aaron Schwarzberg: And so, if we’re thinking… virtual is a lot easier to get, I think, a broader audience. If we go to a college campus, so for example, I have relationships at University of Denver, my alma mater, I have relationships at New England College with, you know.
171 00:24:31.170 ⇒ 00:24:36.889 Aaron Schwarzberg: different schools that… where we could be a part of their… we could do the actual,
172 00:24:36.890 ⇒ 00:25:01.370 Aaron Schwarzberg: fireside chat in their AI labs, for example, and they would love that. They would welcome us in to do it. And it’d be very cool. Whether we had a huge audience or a medium-sized audience, Luke, to your point about being able to use the footage and to be able to say, we’re… I’m making it up, we’re here presenting at the University of Denver Business School, AI lab, talking with this professor about what they’re… and then Utam and I, you know, engage with that person, or whomever, you, Luke, and whomever
173 00:25:01.370 ⇒ 00:25:02.760 Aaron Schwarzberg: it is, but…
174 00:25:02.760 ⇒ 00:25:27.449 Aaron Schwarzberg: there’s different value to it. Depends on what we want the outcome to be. If it’s a peer, who are our next few clients that aren’t currently in the pipeline that we can get to come to these events and then close those opportunities, that I would go virtual, and I’d go nationwide, and I would invite every VP of admissions, I’d invite every, you know, lead administrator for, student support, right? Like, we’d cast it out to 7,000 or 8,000 people.
175 00:25:27.450 ⇒ 00:25:47.160 Aaron Schwarzberg: and we get 70 people to go, right? Something like that. If what we said is we want to show our proficiency in the area, we want to show that we’re experts in higher ed AI, and if we had the background and the setup and the, kind of visibility of being in a university’s AI lab when we’re doing this kind of fireside chat.
176 00:25:47.160 ⇒ 00:26:04.919 Aaron Schwarzberg: there’s a tremendous value to that. We’re not going to close opportunities immediately because we didn’t have 70 people attending that, but it shows our, it shows our depth in that area. So, like you said, like, knowing… people knowing that you guys are either subject matter, subject matter adjacent experts in higher education because of the partnership with TLISMA,
177 00:26:05.040 ⇒ 00:26:18.149 Aaron Schwarzberg: I think there are different ways to look at it. So, again, we’re open and receptive to any and all of these, and I think there are different value propositions to each. So, based on that, what are you guys thinking? Does that make sense? Do you see it differently? What are your thoughts?
178 00:26:18.970 ⇒ 00:26:24.199 Luke Scorziell: Yeah, let me share…
179 00:26:28.190 ⇒ 00:26:36.180 Luke Scorziell: I’m always ambitious, so I always want to do, like, the biggest thing. But, I wonder if, like, starting with
180 00:26:37.200 ⇒ 00:26:42.339 Luke Scorziell: Like, with some of these, it’s just been, like, 10-ish people who come.
181 00:26:42.340 ⇒ 00:26:46.979 Uttam Kumaran: Share with Aaron, like, what we did, or we tried to do differently in the webinar.
182 00:26:47.120 ⇒ 00:26:47.960 Uttam Kumaran: Like…
183 00:26:47.960 ⇒ 00:27:05.130 Luke Scorziell: Yeah, so basically, like, most people get on a webinar, they turn off their camera, like, whoever’s leading it puts on, like, a deck, and then, like, walks through it. Like, half of the people leave midway through because, like, they’re not getting what they wanted, or they just think it’s, like, irrelevant, and then…
184 00:27:05.260 ⇒ 00:27:10.770 Luke Scorziell: Whatever. But what we did is we kind of curated, like, a list of people that Black crawl…
185 00:27:11.300 ⇒ 00:27:18.090 Luke Scorziell: Interesting, and… and then we said, like, we’re having… it’s gonna be cameras on, like, we’re kind of… we’re gonna do, like, the opposite of…
186 00:27:18.170 ⇒ 00:27:31.460 Luke Scorziell: of, like, it’s literally, I guess, like, office hours for universities, like, except you can stay the whole time. So, you… you come in, you turn on your camera, we… we… basically what we did is we had an introduction of, like, hey, this is who we are,
187 00:27:31.790 ⇒ 00:27:43.760 Luke Scorziell: This is our goal for today, and then we shared a demo that we built out of just, kind of, here’s the capabilities that this AI tooling has, and then,
188 00:27:43.990 ⇒ 00:27:57.609 Luke Scorziell: from there, just opened the floor and said, like, you know, what pain points are you experiencing when it comes to implementing AI, or where are you wanting to implement it that you’re currently stuck?
189 00:27:57.700 ⇒ 00:28:07.229 Luke Scorziell: And then does this demo, like, spark ideas? And then from there, we had, like, a really good conversation, for about 30… 30, 45 minutes about
190 00:28:07.370 ⇒ 00:28:26.199 Luke Scorziell: like, you know, data, and how does data work with AI, and certain workflows that people brought up that, like, they’re like, I wish I could automate this with AI, but since they’re not really living in it every day, they don’t know exactly how. And then the cool thing is, like, someone mentioned before the office hours.
191 00:28:26.260 ⇒ 00:28:30.510 Luke Scorziell: like, a problem that they had, so I just went and built, like, a quick little demo.
192 00:28:30.640 ⇒ 00:28:39.900 Luke Scorziell: That then we just showed in the office hours thing, like, oh yeah, this is how something like that would look like in Slack. So that, to me, was more,
193 00:28:40.110 ⇒ 00:28:44.649 Luke Scorziell: And then it’s… it’s kind of like a focus group, I guess, in some ways, more than a…
194 00:28:44.890 ⇒ 00:28:50.690 Luke Scorziell: Like, we get… like, if we got 70 to 80 people, I imagine it’d be pretty,
195 00:28:50.940 ⇒ 00:28:57.419 Luke Scorziell: like, not impersonal, per se, unless we strategized around, like, breakout rooms and stuff like that, but then I feel like people
196 00:28:57.590 ⇒ 00:29:01.600 Luke Scorziell: Get a little annoyed, but if we wanted to just try the waters with, like, inviting, like.
197 00:29:02.100 ⇒ 00:29:12.390 Luke Scorziell: 50 to 60 people that we kind of know are in one of these buying demographics, and we can just choose one, create messaging on the event page that’s very…
198 00:29:12.760 ⇒ 00:29:18.399 Luke Scorziell: like, speaks to a problem that they have, like, hey, you’ve been given an AI mandate, like, what now?
199 00:29:18.400 ⇒ 00:29:19.640 Aaron Schwarzberg: Right.
200 00:29:19.640 ⇒ 00:29:20.370 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
201 00:29:20.370 ⇒ 00:29:24.690 Luke Scorziell: And then… and then just go and invite and see what we can do.
202 00:29:26.670 ⇒ 00:29:27.770 Aaron Schwarzberg: So…
203 00:29:27.770 ⇒ 00:29:33.609 Uttam Kumaran: I like that. I like that, like, you have a mandate, what, now? That’s a great, like…
204 00:29:33.970 ⇒ 00:29:35.300 Aaron Schwarzberg: So, it’s a good one.
205 00:29:35.300 ⇒ 00:29:41.699 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, that’s something good. I think another, like, hitting on something that’s, like, a pain point that that person would be like, oh my gosh, that’s me.
206 00:29:41.700 ⇒ 00:29:45.160 Aaron Schwarzberg: I think some of this commentary and things I’m seeing is so broad.
207 00:29:45.300 ⇒ 00:29:54.810 Uttam Kumaran: that, like, I think if we can hinge it on something in education, like, I mean, again, I think we’ve talked a lot about, like, applicant processing, student outcomes.
208 00:29:54.980 ⇒ 00:30:02.739 Uttam Kumaran: like, like, things about donations, you know, so I think if we can hinge it on, like.
209 00:30:03.200 ⇒ 00:30:08.869 Uttam Kumaran: yeah, maybe it’s the AI mandate or AI-assisted goals and, like, what now? Could be good.
210 00:30:09.120 ⇒ 00:30:09.700 Aaron Schwarzberg: Yep.
211 00:30:09.920 ⇒ 00:30:20.950 Aaron Schwarzberg: I like that. I think if I were one of those people who had the mandate, I’d be crazy not to attend that, right? Like, you’re speaking directly to them. And everyone who’s in a leadership role
212 00:30:21.630 ⇒ 00:30:33.359 Aaron Schwarzberg: in higher education, to some degree, has some AI mandate. Whether it’s to research, or whether it’s to implement, they’re on that journey in some way, shape, or form, so I think that that is a nice call to action. It’s like.
213 00:30:33.770 ⇒ 00:30:34.910 Aaron Schwarzberg: Now what?
214 00:30:35.550 ⇒ 00:30:35.960 Uttam Kumaran: We’re.
215 00:30:35.960 ⇒ 00:30:53.130 Aaron Schwarzberg: walk you through kind of where, based upon where you are, what you should be thinking about, and how we could be helpful, right? So, less salesy than that, but for them to come across… for them to come into it saying, okay, they understand where I am, they understand what the university’s focused on, they understand that I need to do something. They’re not pushing a product.
216 00:30:53.240 ⇒ 00:31:07.689 Aaron Schwarzberg: they’re pushing an understanding of where AI can be and should be across the board in higher education, they can then self, kind of, select to say, okay, I’m at this phase, phase one or phase two or phase three, then they will want to reach out and say, okay, if I’m on phase one.
217 00:31:07.730 ⇒ 00:31:13.619 Aaron Schwarzberg: then I need Brainforge, because Brainforge is going to help me figure out what my issues are, and that’s where the Phase 1 is.
218 00:31:13.620 ⇒ 00:31:19.420 Uttam Kumaran: I wonder if it’s almost like what they can deliver to their, like, board or boss, and it’s like…
219 00:31:19.840 ⇒ 00:31:27.370 Uttam Kumaran: Like, it’s more of a discussion on, like, you have a mandate, you’re hearing about all these tools, but, like, maybe you don’t have, like.
220 00:31:27.440 ⇒ 00:31:40.009 Uttam Kumaran: you literally don’t have, Luke, that, like, ROI story. Like, can I show Aaron that, like, D&G thing? I just feel like I just keep reading this over and over again. But maybe I’ll show you this, SOW we wrote.
221 00:31:40.040 ⇒ 00:31:59.020 Uttam Kumaran: Aaron for, this potential agency client out of LA. And, like, one thing that I just… I’m, like, really enjoying how our, like, SOW process has evolved is that we’re really… and especially, really, AI pushed us, like, in the data world, you know, you could really, just
222 00:31:59.240 ⇒ 00:32:20.259 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t know, we’re going a little bit over… we could just really just say, like, this is the time and materials to do something. In the AI world, like, we’re… and everybody’s trying to understand, like, what is the outcome? And so, one thing that we’ve done, like, this is a media agency client, so, you know, assume kind of, like, what some of their issues are, but when we look at, like, when we go to them, we try to produce, like, what is the ROI story?
223 00:32:20.260 ⇒ 00:32:23.300 Uttam Kumaran: Like, hey, you have, like, 150 people.
224 00:32:23.300 ⇒ 00:32:25.090 Uttam Kumaran: They’re using this amount of time.
225 00:32:25.140 ⇒ 00:32:43.890 Uttam Kumaran: the average cost is this, and so, like, we’re gonna show you that, like, if you’re able to slim down, some of your account, management, like, your creative production, like, you’re… it’s, like, such an easy payback, like, display, and we break it down to, like, here are the workflows that we’re working on, and, like.
226 00:32:43.960 ⇒ 00:32:56.549 Uttam Kumaran: okay, and again, this isn’t, like, we’re not moving from, like, an hour to 60 seconds, like, but some of these, yes, it’s like, I need to find this document. Okay, yeah, that’s totally, like, a simple thing now.
227 00:32:56.570 ⇒ 00:33:09.129 Uttam Kumaran: Versus preparing for a climb, and yeah, it’s still gonna take 5 to 10 minutes, but compared to, like, 30 or 40 minutes in a day, and so when we look at, like, the ROI, the first ROI is just, like, hey, you’re gonna save this time.
228 00:33:09.130 ⇒ 00:33:11.049 Aaron Schwarzberg: In terms of people costs.
229 00:33:11.050 ⇒ 00:33:21.959 Uttam Kumaran: But, of course, this is an agency, and so the agency owners are not like, oh, people can just hang out now, like, those people go and bill more. And so, it’s… there’s such, like, an upside story here as well, you know?
230 00:33:21.960 ⇒ 00:33:31.129 Aaron Schwarzberg: The cost saving is only the first half of the equation, but additional revenue generation is the second half, because now they’re doing more, they’re being more productive, they’re closing more deals.
231 00:33:31.480 ⇒ 00:33:32.370 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, exactly.
232 00:33:32.370 ⇒ 00:33:35.790 Luke Scorziell: The anxiety that I think everyone’s feeling is, like.
233 00:33:35.810 ⇒ 00:33:53.500 Luke Scorziell: is AI gonna just produce the amount of work? But… and I think education is, like, a forefront of where this anxiety is probably living, because I see all the time, like, people are like, I don’t even know what to teach, because every time I teach something, it becomes irrelevant in, like, the next.
234 00:33:53.790 ⇒ 00:34:05.989 Aaron Schwarzberg: And that’s why, Luke, that’s exactly why professors are pushing against AI. And the analogy I gave them, I think you’ll like this, is when we had some pushback from some faculty about
235 00:34:05.990 ⇒ 00:34:23.299 Aaron Schwarzberg: implementing AI, and they say, I just don’t trust it, I don’t like it, I’m not gonna do it. So that’s fair, I hear you. But there were faculty 15 years ago who said, I don’t trust online learning, I don’t trust digital learning, and I’m not gonna do anything with it. And those faculty and those institutions
236 00:34:23.489 ⇒ 00:34:31.400 Aaron Schwarzberg: they fell by the wayside, and they were leap… leapfrogged by their competitors, who leaned into it. It doesn’t mean you go in with reckless abandon. You don’t go blindfed.
237 00:34:31.400 ⇒ 00:34:31.940 Luke Scorziell: M.
238 00:34:31.949 ⇒ 00:34:47.049 Aaron Schwarzberg: But you have to start engaging with it at some level. So it’s not okay, like, they can’t just turn a blind eye to AI, they can’t say, we’re not going to do it. If you turn a blind eye to digital learning, your school disappeared, right? Like, you’re a dinosaur, you can’t do that anymore. Digital learning is part of the process.
239 00:34:47.049 ⇒ 00:34:53.079 Aaron Schwarzberg: it’s usually blended with instructor-led training, but you can’t just push away against it. So, every time we have someone
240 00:34:53.079 ⇒ 00:34:59.989 Aaron Schwarzberg: kind of push back against AI because they’re not ready to lean into it. We give that analogy, and it kind of opens up for them and makes a lot of sense.
241 00:35:00.520 ⇒ 00:35:05.400 Luke Scorziell: Yeah. Well, I’ll, why don’t we… .
242 00:35:07.390 ⇒ 00:35:10.660 Aaron Schwarzberg: I love this SOW, though, Utam, it’s very…
243 00:35:10.660 ⇒ 00:35:20.100 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t know, I just think it’s, like, it’s… it’s sort of, when you go to a client, you have, like, this found revenue story, it’s really, really powerful, right? And I just don’t… I don’t think I…
244 00:35:20.340 ⇒ 00:35:26.489 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t think I’ve seen anything, anybody, like, discuss sort of this, and I’m almost like…
245 00:35:27.020 ⇒ 00:35:40.460 Uttam Kumaran: I’m wondering, like, Luke, did you do a webinar around, like, putting this together? Like, I sort of try to think about creatively, like, in enterprise sales now, a lot of stuff that I think about is, like, co-authoring SOWs with people, and how do you get buy-in from…
246 00:35:40.460 ⇒ 00:35:55.789 Uttam Kumaran: ultimately the person you’re trying to sell, is, like, you write the thing for them, and you write the thing for them and with them. And so, part of this could be, like, how to tell the ROI story. Like, you know, and maybe we walk through an example live with everybody.
247 00:35:55.850 ⇒ 00:36:02.220 Uttam Kumaran: about, like, how to basically put this together. Because I think people are… I think they’re…
248 00:36:02.360 ⇒ 00:36:09.309 Uttam Kumaran: Well, kind of what we mapped out is, like, there’s people that lead these organizations, that the noise is now getting really large, and they’re like, we need AI.
249 00:36:09.360 ⇒ 00:36:13.919 Uttam Kumaran: Then there’s someone directly beneath them that has to go, like, figure it out.
250 00:36:13.940 ⇒ 00:36:20.740 Uttam Kumaran: And then there’s, like, just a… there’s a gap where that person has, like, a mix of tools, people, but, like, can’t…
251 00:36:20.740 ⇒ 00:36:35.179 Uttam Kumaran: really wrap their head around, like, one pilot implementation, that isn’t just, like, buy this tool. And so I think it’s helpful for us to, like, instead of saying, like, I need to implement this, it’s like, let’s quantify, like, a problem right now. Like, okay, you’re…
252 00:36:35.190 ⇒ 00:36:50.359 Uttam Kumaran: walk through, like, a day, like, do, like, just do, like, a basic time study of, like, a day of the people you’re trying to affect. Take a workflow, let’s walk through this, let’s walk through the steps, but, like, ultimately, I think leaving everybody maybe with a doc, like, a mini-doc version of this.
253 00:36:50.460 ⇒ 00:36:57.870 Uttam Kumaran: Could be good to show them, like, how to even estimate, because ultimately, those people are trying to get the budget and trying to find a trusted partner.
254 00:36:57.870 ⇒ 00:36:59.200 Aaron Schwarzberg: And, like, even if…
255 00:36:59.200 ⇒ 00:37:00.249 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, and eat…
256 00:37:00.250 ⇒ 00:37:02.989 Aaron Schwarzberg: Exactly. If you turn this into a calculator.
257 00:37:03.090 ⇒ 00:37:08.260 Aaron Schwarzberg: Yeah. That would be very powerful. So forget the legalese and forget the contractual structure.
258 00:37:08.260 ⇒ 00:37:08.770 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
259 00:37:08.770 ⇒ 00:37:24.929 Aaron Schwarzberg: were this big, and it just had 5 inputs that we know every institution’s thinking about, where they say, number of employees supporting pre-enrollment. I’m making it up, right? And I’ll get… I’ll tell you why I’m thinking about that in particular, because it was an ROI kind of use case that we went through.
260 00:37:24.930 ⇒ 00:37:43.050 Aaron Schwarzberg: speed to lead on the lead gen side. Like, there are all these metrics that every single hired institution has to think about. They have no choice but to think about it. And they drive, kind of, enrollment, retention, financial aid processing, all of those pieces. If you could use this methodology to create that calculator, and that’s the leave behind
261 00:37:43.310 ⇒ 00:37:52.730 Aaron Schwarzberg: it’s beautiful, right? So, I’m making it up. At an investment of $15,000, if you have this number of students, or this number of applications, you’re saving, on average.
262 00:37:52.930 ⇒ 00:38:06.519 Aaron Schwarzberg: you know, 300,000. So on a $15,000, you know, investment, you have the ability to generate… either save half a million and generate another half a million, or… right, whatever the numbers are, it doesn’t matter.
263 00:38:06.520 ⇒ 00:38:16.419 Aaron Schwarzberg: But, Luke, for example, the higher institution that we’re looking at working with that has, 100,000 applications a year, they have 20 or 30 people who are dedicated to following up with students.
264 00:38:16.420 ⇒ 00:38:41.399 Aaron Schwarzberg: Because those applications weren’t filled out the right way. So, I’d be calling you as a pre-admissions advisor, saying, hey, Luke, you filled out this form, your social doesn’t match on page 2 as it does on page 7, I need you to kind of redo that. But I’m trying to reach out to you, you didn’t pick up the phone, I sent you a follow-up email, you didn’t respond to the email. By the time I finally get ahold of you, you’ve enrolled at another school, you decided you don’t want to move forward with your education. But, the way our OCR works is students fill out the application.
265 00:38:41.400 ⇒ 00:38:57.319 Aaron Schwarzberg: submit them, and they get immediate response as to whether or not everything was submitted correctly. And if not, we highlight the area through AI and tell them what they need to do and how they need to do it. So, now those 30 people at this institution processing 100,000 applications, they only need 3 or 4.
266 00:38:58.310 ⇒ 00:39:08.950 Aaron Schwarzberg: So if you think of a 75,000 savings times 27 people, that’s just on the savings side. Now, you’re not… we’re not saying let those people go. We’re saying now focus them on other things, like
267 00:39:09.110 ⇒ 00:39:25.290 Aaron Schwarzberg: student recruitment, or academic advising, or, right, like, that now we’re chipping into the retention side. So, Utam, it’s the same methodology, it’s the same approach, like, savings over here, additional revenue generation or enrollment over here. I think a calculator is a beautiful leave behind.
268 00:39:27.040 ⇒ 00:39:27.770 Luke Scorziell: Yeah.
269 00:39:27.980 ⇒ 00:39:34.019 Luke Scorziell: Well, maybe… Maybe what we can do…
270 00:39:35.020 ⇒ 00:39:45.869 Luke Scorziell: I want to talk with Utom, and maybe Robert, too, just about kind of our strategy overall with this, but is… I’ll work with the team, and we could try to put together, like, an event
271 00:39:46.260 ⇒ 00:39:54.949 Luke Scorziell: Brief for you, and then you could look at it and give us feedback, and then once we approve it, then maybe we can just settle in on a date.
272 00:39:55.060 ⇒ 00:40:03.800 Luke Scorziell: And then, I know we’re kind of wanting to hone in, like, a partnership, announcement, too.
273 00:40:04.190 ⇒ 00:40:08.760 Luke Scorziell: Seems like those two could go together well, or we do that first, and then do the announcement.
274 00:40:08.760 ⇒ 00:40:22.670 Aaron Schwarzberg: We talked about, and again, we’re opening to it being different, but our team is solidified on, kind of, one of the things we talked about with Tom a while back, which was doing the partnership announcement while also talking through the upcoming event. So, for example.
275 00:40:22.670 ⇒ 00:40:45.440 Aaron Schwarzberg: We’re very proud to announce our partnership with Brainfor… between Brainforge and Telezma, and we’re very excited about what we’re able to do. Now we have front-end analysis and data and analytics through Brainforge, plus the, you know, exceptional capabilities in the higher ed and healthcare space that, you know, Teleisma has, and here are some of them. And in that vein, we’re very excited to be, you know, you know, announcing that we’re going to be, jointly, at the
276 00:40:45.440 ⇒ 00:41:02.289 Aaron Schwarzberg: the University of Texas Austin, or, like, virtually, we’re going to be doing this, and we welcome anyone in the higher ed space who’s interested in, you know, ramping up, enrollment, recruitment, or, looking at whatever. You know, like you said, Luke, what was the… it was,
277 00:41:02.380 ⇒ 00:41:16.969 Aaron Schwarzberg: AI mandate, now what, right? So if you’re in the higher ed space, and you’ve been given an AI mandate, and you’re thinking, now what? Please, you know, come for the virtual meeting. So I think it’s the one leading into the other. So it’s the partnership announcement leading into the either on-site or virtual event.
278 00:41:17.910 ⇒ 00:41:19.629 Luke Scorziell: Yeah. Okay, cool.
279 00:41:23.290 ⇒ 00:41:24.130 Aaron Schwarzberg: What do you guys think?
280 00:41:25.170 ⇒ 00:41:27.529 Aaron Schwarzberg: And if you want to do it differently, that’s okay.
281 00:41:27.530 ⇒ 00:41:28.160 Uttam Kumaran: Nice.
282 00:41:28.300 ⇒ 00:41:30.770 Uttam Kumaran: I feel that’s… yeah, I think that’s great.
283 00:41:30.980 ⇒ 00:41:46.610 Luke Scorziell: Yeah, I like that. I think, I could, yeah, I could see the advantage of doing the event before, just to get, like, some kind of content announcing, like, oh, we’ve, like, it’s like we’ve already been dating, but now we’re going official type of thing, versus, like, here’s our first event, so…
284 00:41:46.810 ⇒ 00:41:49.760 Luke Scorziell: Let me… why don’t… I’ll send you the…
285 00:41:50.040 ⇒ 00:41:53.090 Luke Scorziell: like, a Luma page invite that we could do for this office hours.
286 00:41:53.480 ⇒ 00:42:01.430 Luke Scorziell: maybe I can try to slot it in earlier, just the thing is with our promotion, and that’s what I want to talk to Utam about, kind of strategize, like, how do we…
287 00:42:01.600 ⇒ 00:42:07.170 Luke Scorziell: what’s the best way to start thinking about, pacing on this? And then… and then we can,
288 00:42:09.570 ⇒ 00:42:12.119 Luke Scorziell: Yeah, but I guess we could, like, date-wise…
289 00:42:12.540 ⇒ 00:42:18.469 Luke Scorziell: I think that would probably be helpful. Or we can set up a… I know there’s, like, a bi-weekly check-in?
290 00:42:18.490 ⇒ 00:42:32.750 Aaron Schwarzberg: There’s a bi-weekly. We can look at early May. I’m okay with that, if that works for you guys, and then we can be very intentional over the next month and a half of kind of solidifying what that’s going to look like. Again, it’s a different approach, whether it’s virtual or in person, but I think that gives us enough time either way.
291 00:42:33.130 ⇒ 00:42:35.899 Luke Scorziell: Yeah, we could do, May…
292 00:42:39.120 ⇒ 00:42:42.450 Luke Scorziell: I would, like, theoretically May 14th work for, like, an office hours?
293 00:42:42.450 ⇒ 00:42:46.749 Aaron Schwarzberg: Sure, yeah. I think we can do that. I don’t think there’s anything to hold us back from that.
294 00:42:48.190 ⇒ 00:42:48.770 Luke Scorziell: Sweet.
295 00:42:50.460 ⇒ 00:42:52.370 Luke Scorziell: I’ll put that in our calendar, and then…
296 00:42:53.910 ⇒ 00:42:56.330 Aaron Schwarzberg: Uten, what do you think about that calculator leave behind for the event?
297 00:42:56.330 ⇒ 00:42:58.109 Uttam Kumaran: No, I love it. I mean, I’m… I…
298 00:42:58.850 ⇒ 00:43:03.080 Uttam Kumaran: I’m… Luke’s gonna tell you I’m gonna say co… go vibe code it, like, today.
299 00:43:03.280 ⇒ 00:43:03.810 Aaron Schwarzberg: Yeah.
300 00:43:03.810 ⇒ 00:43:04.980 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
301 00:43:05.700 ⇒ 00:43:06.059 Luke Scorziell: I think that’s.
302 00:43:06.060 ⇒ 00:43:10.890 Uttam Kumaran: That’s great, I think that’s great. That’s perfect, and I think it, like, is something that we can…
303 00:43:11.050 ⇒ 00:43:19.840 Uttam Kumaran: use in the call, and then leave… it’s a good rate, leave behind. You know, and if it’s focused on just… if it’s focused on all the people we’re presenting to, it’s really, really awesome.
304 00:43:19.840 ⇒ 00:43:20.950 Aaron Schwarzberg: Yeah. Like…
305 00:43:20.950 ⇒ 00:43:22.560 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I think that’s… that’s amazing.
306 00:43:23.230 ⇒ 00:43:35.529 Luke Scorziell: I think the one thing to be cautious of is not to frame it as replacing or diminishing headcount, which I know we talked about, but that was something that the… even the guys at this agency, they were like.
307 00:43:35.590 ⇒ 00:43:51.489 Luke Scorziell: as soon as we mentioned headcount, they were like, that’s not gonna go well. And then that was kind of when I, you know, I didn’t mention that, but it was, like, pivoting to, okay, no, no, no, it’s like, you have one large client now, imagine if you could have two, and not need to hire, like, a million more people.
308 00:43:51.570 ⇒ 00:43:55.300 Luke Scorziell: Right, so… Similar thing, and then just…
309 00:43:55.300 ⇒ 00:44:04.389 Aaron Schwarzberg: It’s efficiency and the ability to repurpose or have people wear multiple hats, because now they have the time and the energy and the resources and the support to do multiple things.
310 00:44:04.580 ⇒ 00:44:06.020 Luke Scorziell: Yeah. Yeah.
311 00:44:06.410 ⇒ 00:44:09.720 Luke Scorziell: So, okay, cool. Well, this is exciting. That’s good news.
312 00:44:09.720 ⇒ 00:44:18.859 Aaron Schwarzberg: Great. Yeah, so I’m looking forward to more conversations, so we’ll have the, the next touchpoint. Utham, is Robert going to be reaching out with a.
313 00:44:18.860 ⇒ 00:44:29.359 Uttam Kumaran: Yes, yeah, I’m… he’s just, like, he’s in Panama, like, on a boat, and I’m just… I just texted him. He’s just coming online, he’s flying out tomorrow, so…
314 00:44:29.490 ⇒ 00:44:37.280 Uttam Kumaran: No worries. Yes. He sent me a, the email on Monday, just to get your approval, so yeah, it’s on his list.
315 00:44:37.280 ⇒ 00:44:45.250 Aaron Schwarzberg: I’m out all next week, but I’m available on email and text, so if there’s something time-sensitive, shoot me a text.
316 00:44:45.250 ⇒ 00:44:57.960 Uttam Kumaran: I’ll have him just, like, do you have, like, a… so that’s all I’ll tell him. I’ll say you’re out next week, so if you can do the week after, if there’s a time you prefer, maybe I’ll… I’ll have him… just get us… I’ll just get us on an email thread or something for us to…
317 00:44:57.960 ⇒ 00:45:02.109 Aaron Schwarzberg: That would be great, and I’ll make any time the following week work.
318 00:45:02.110 ⇒ 00:45:02.830 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
319 00:45:02.830 ⇒ 00:45:19.320 Aaron Schwarzberg: I… I lied. I can’t do… probably can’t do any time. Raj is coming into the U.S, and I want to talk to you about that as well. Cool. I’ll give you a call either later today or tomorrow, because I thought it would be a great opportunity for us to connect, in person if possible.
320 00:45:19.320 ⇒ 00:45:22.239 Uttam Kumaran: In Florida, or, like, where we’re at?
321 00:45:22.420 ⇒ 00:45:31.139 Aaron Schwarzberg: We’re gonna be in different places. He’s flying into New York, and then we have meetings with clients in Boston, and then we’re gonna be down here, and then we might be in Kansas for a day. End of this month.
322 00:45:31.910 ⇒ 00:45:33.939 Aaron Schwarzberg: Yeah, the week of the 23rd.
323 00:45:34.970 ⇒ 00:45:35.600 Uttam Kumaran: Okay?
324 00:45:36.180 ⇒ 00:45:37.220 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, let me know.
325 00:45:37.220 ⇒ 00:45:54.310 Aaron Schwarzberg: wrong, but I’ll let you know, because… so maybe we can try to do something in Florida where you can come in for an afternoon, or we can try to come to you, maybe on our way back from Kansas. Sure. So we should have something solidified in the next day or two, and then I can… I’ll reach out to you, and we’ll talk, and we’ll kind of figure out what makes sense.
326 00:45:54.500 ⇒ 00:45:55.729 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, okay, perfect.
327 00:45:56.200 ⇒ 00:46:14.919 Aaron Schwarzberg: Awesome. Okay, guys, thanks for the time, I know we went over, really appreciate it. It’s super exciting, and there’s so many parallels between what we do, right? So, Utham, you showed the SOW, and then immediately, like, the calculator approach makes so much sense for this particular group. I think if we worked on that, in addition to all the other pieces, I think it’ll be really well received.
328 00:46:15.600 ⇒ 00:46:17.649 Luke Scorziell: Cool. Yeah, no, likewise.
329 00:46:17.650 ⇒ 00:46:18.220 Aaron Schwarzberg: Yep.
330 00:46:18.220 ⇒ 00:46:22.739 Uttam Kumaran: Alright, well, thank you guys, have a great rest of your day, and have a great weekend, okay? Thank you, Aaron. Appreciate it.
331 00:46:22.740 ⇒ 00:46:23.330 Luke Scorziell: I’m off next week.
332 00:46:23.700 ⇒ 00:46:24.269 Aaron Schwarzberg: Thanks, bro.