Meeting Title: Creative Collaboration Discussion with Donovan Date: 2026-03-13 Meeting participants: Uttam Kumaran, Donovan Griffin
WEBVTT
1 00:00:05.590 ⇒ 00:00:06.730 Uttam Kumaran: Hello!
2 00:00:06.990 ⇒ 00:00:16.399 Uttam Kumaran: So sorry for delay and all this, like, logistics. I am usually not this bad, but…
3 00:00:16.830 ⇒ 00:00:21.010 Uttam Kumaran: It’s just, like, an insane… it’s just insane.
4 00:00:21.010 ⇒ 00:00:22.030 Donovan Griffin: No worries.
5 00:00:22.030 ⇒ 00:00:22.790 Uttam Kumaran: Sorry.
6 00:00:22.790 ⇒ 00:00:26.820 Donovan Griffin: No worries at all. Were you… so you were in Austin for a little bit?
7 00:00:26.820 ⇒ 00:00:28.519 Uttam Kumaran: I am in Austin right now.
8 00:00:28.520 ⇒ 00:00:29.170 Donovan Griffin: Oh, let’s.
9 00:00:29.170 ⇒ 00:00:35.580 Uttam Kumaran: Because when Luke says… when Luke’s… I think one of us said coffee, or Luke said coffee, I was like, oh, maybe you’re here for South By?
10 00:00:35.580 ⇒ 00:00:36.519 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, yeah.
11 00:00:36.520 ⇒ 00:00:37.729 Uttam Kumaran: That would be convenient.
12 00:00:37.730 ⇒ 00:00:47.369 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, I have a couple buddies there right now, so… Cool. Sick, yeah. That’s awesome. It’s so nice to meet you. It’s been.
13 00:00:47.370 ⇒ 00:00:49.720 Uttam Kumaran: Tell me how you know Luke, like, originally.
14 00:00:49.720 ⇒ 00:00:56.969 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, Luke, so I, we met at this networking event
15 00:00:57.150 ⇒ 00:01:06.280 Donovan Griffin: It’s actually a really great one with a bunch of creatives, in LA, and I was presenting
16 00:01:06.280 ⇒ 00:01:30.070 Donovan Griffin: It was, like, a month or two before my feature film was getting released on Tubi in the States. Yeah. So before that, it was super exciting. We got world distribution, and, like, we were on, like, United and American Airlines, it was, like, super fun, and we were waiting for the longest time to release here, because we’re trying to find buyers for exclusive.
17 00:01:30.090 ⇒ 00:01:50.910 Donovan Griffin: deals, but the market was hard, and like, in other areas is better, so we’re just like, alright, well, let’s… I was like, we need to get it out somewhere. People are asking, so we were like, let’s go 2B all the way. And but I didn’t know that much about marketing, and because it wasn’t an exclusive deal.
18 00:01:51.370 ⇒ 00:02:14.919 Donovan Griffin: we basically, our reps were like, yeah, well, let’s get it on Tubi, but we can’t put in, like, a big marketing push for it, so anything that, you know, you do will be on your end, and I’m like, okay, great, that sounds so fun. And so I presented it at this event, I was, showed the trailer for the first time, it was really fun, exciting, and then I was like, hey everyone, like.
19 00:02:14.920 ⇒ 00:02:23.740 Donovan Griffin: I love filmmaking. I don’t know anything about marketing. If anyone knows anything and wants to, like, help out, or just, like.
20 00:02:23.740 ⇒ 00:02:31.849 Donovan Griffin: you know, I can… I can talk to, you know, I’m all ears, and then Luke came up after, and that’s how we met, and then we grabbed.
21 00:02:31.850 ⇒ 00:02:32.290 Uttam Kumaran: Great.
22 00:02:32.290 ⇒ 00:02:43.210 Donovan Griffin: And then I feel like it was an instant friendship, and I was like, hey man, like, we have this, but, you know, are you… do you want to help out? He was like, dude, let’s do it, let’s all in.
23 00:02:43.210 ⇒ 00:02:44.140 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
24 00:02:44.140 ⇒ 00:02:48.699 Donovan Griffin: Since then, we’ve been, like, helping each other out on whatever, and it’s been really fun.
25 00:02:48.700 ⇒ 00:02:56.460 Uttam Kumaran: Amazing. Yeah, I, I feel like that’s how business goes, like, I am, I think…
26 00:02:56.870 ⇒ 00:03:04.529 Uttam Kumaran: I’m not, like, a really great salesperson, like, my background is all engineering, so everything that helped me with this business is all friends, or favors, or whatever.
27 00:03:05.240 ⇒ 00:03:24.600 Uttam Kumaran: So I do a very similar thing, it’s like, I need this, and I, like, have some people that I’m like, you’re the person, or you know a person, and I just, like, bat-signal out. Yeah. And, like, it’s been so nice that our company has grown that way. Wow. And people ask, like, oh, how do you, like… like, I think Luke was previously connected to Robert through…
28 00:03:24.600 ⇒ 00:03:25.020 Donovan Griffin: Hmm.
29 00:03:25.020 ⇒ 00:03:43.449 Uttam Kumaran: something in LA, and I was, like… I’m always interested in… the reason why I particularly love talking to people that are in, like, creative is, like, there’s actually a lot more parallels between a lot of the engineering work that we do and, like, a lot of the creative world, but it’s oftentimes that both
30 00:03:43.450 ⇒ 00:03:56.360 Uttam Kumaran: sides think that the other is, like, really super far away. Yes. And in my career, I’ve always… I was an engineer for a long time, built engineering teams, then I got to work in product development and product design.
31 00:03:56.360 ⇒ 00:04:06.239 Uttam Kumaran: And then started to meet a lot of friends there, built a lot of appreciation for design, and then a lot of… everyone I know that’s a great designer always is, like, doing clothing, or film, and I…
32 00:04:06.240 ⇒ 00:04:13.309 Uttam Kumaran: A friend of mine is a director here in Dallas as well, I’ve known him for a long time. And I am like, guys, what you guys are doing.
33 00:04:13.420 ⇒ 00:04:30.099 Uttam Kumaran: my industry sucks so bad at, but you guys don’t know anything about my industry, so, like, people like you don’t end up in here, and so that’s our opportunity, though. Like, so the reason why I loved Luke is I heard about his journalism background, of course, I saw some of the
34 00:04:30.390 ⇒ 00:04:33.570 Uttam Kumaran: Sort of shorts and short, like, films that he put together.
35 00:04:33.570 ⇒ 00:04:34.589 Donovan Griffin: And I’m like.
36 00:04:34.690 ⇒ 00:04:51.270 Uttam Kumaran: this is perfect for us, but what my job is to, like, sort of bridge the gap on, like, hey, in technology services, nobody is good at marketing, nobody is good at telling a story, and, like, what, you know, really the industry that I think
37 00:04:51.270 ⇒ 00:05:04.500 Uttam Kumaran: brought… took a lot of marketing is, like, e-commerce or consumer packaged goods, because you can put something into a store, like, it’s consumer, but this is a B2B, but what happens in business-to-business is that the marketing and,
38 00:05:04.500 ⇒ 00:05:13.119 Uttam Kumaran: like, acquisition always lags what happens in consumer, but people are sold… it’s just people buying things, and so there’s actually a lot of parallels, and so…
39 00:05:13.160 ⇒ 00:05:19.689 Uttam Kumaran: I love… a lot of the people at the company on the sales and marketing side have no background in technology.
40 00:05:19.690 ⇒ 00:05:20.060 Donovan Griffin: Or no?
41 00:05:20.060 ⇒ 00:05:22.800 Uttam Kumaran: Any background in my industry.
42 00:05:22.800 ⇒ 00:05:23.140 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
43 00:05:23.140 ⇒ 00:05:35.489 Uttam Kumaran: Great, perfect. Like, we don’t… I don’t want people to come to me and look at, like, what Accenture does and be like, we should do that. People should be as frustrated as I am with why our industry sucks.
44 00:05:35.790 ⇒ 00:05:36.150 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
45 00:05:36.150 ⇒ 00:05:46.629 Uttam Kumaran: Like, and Luke, like, I like that some people are new to this world, because they’re, like, questioning, like, the way we do things. I’ll tell you what the… what the… some of the constraints are.
46 00:05:46.960 ⇒ 00:05:52.339 Uttam Kumaran: in an industry, you just, like, oh, that’s just the way it is. Like, that’s, like, my worst… I, like, hate that phrase.
47 00:05:52.340 ⇒ 00:06:00.299 Donovan Griffin: It’s like, I swear by, like, keeping with, like, you know, like, Gandhi, be the change you want.
48 00:06:00.300 ⇒ 00:06:00.680 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
49 00:06:00.680 ⇒ 00:06:25.159 Donovan Griffin: And I’ve held true to that quote for so long, so same thing. Everyone’s like, the industry, the film industry’s so slow right now. I’m like, it’s slow when you tell yourself it’s slow, like, try and reach out more, get different, you know, think of retain, do not fun projects, like, keep it busy, keep it going, and no, that’s awesome to hear, too, you, Tom, because, like.
50 00:06:25.430 ⇒ 00:06:42.880 Donovan Griffin: I… have the same philosophy as, as a director, I’m, like, literally, like, I don’t know how to do… work a camera that well, like, I’ve DP’d for a couple projects, every time I’m behind the camera, I’m like, I’m tweaking, you know? I’m like.
51 00:06:42.880 ⇒ 00:06:43.840 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah.
52 00:06:43.840 ⇒ 00:06:57.980 Donovan Griffin: What are the… is the settings right, or is this going… oh my god, there’s… now there’s a light that just went out, and I don’t know how to fix it, like, this is crazy, but I… I find, like, the best cinematographer there is for that specific project. Editors, you know, I’ve edited.
53 00:06:57.980 ⇒ 00:06:58.400 Uttam Kumaran: It is.
54 00:06:58.400 ⇒ 00:07:11.470 Donovan Griffin: for a while, I have the editing background. The time, like, I think it was the first time I worked with an editor, I realized, wow, how much better someone who, like, loves this, and just does that, and has that, makes that their.
55 00:07:11.470 ⇒ 00:07:13.169 Uttam Kumaran: Super, super deep on something, yeah.
56 00:07:13.170 ⇒ 00:07:32.889 Donovan Griffin: so much faster, so much better at it, and the overall, like, story can grab the story in a better way, too, and just, like, yeah, so, it’s nice to hear, too, because that’s kind of how I feel like in my, you know, with my business and growing the production company, it’s been all friends. It’s been all.
57 00:07:32.890 ⇒ 00:07:33.460 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
58 00:07:33.460 ⇒ 00:07:34.520 Donovan Griffin: I like.
59 00:07:34.520 ⇒ 00:07:34.890 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
60 00:07:34.890 ⇒ 00:07:41.080 Donovan Griffin: who I think are better than me at those things, and then it’s just me who I’m like, okay, let’s, okay, yeah, yeah, let’s.
61 00:07:41.080 ⇒ 00:07:46.519 Uttam Kumaran: No, I mean, that’s what… that’s my job now, is, like, I spend most of my job coaching.
62 00:07:46.520 ⇒ 00:07:47.070 Donovan Griffin: Yeah!
63 00:07:47.070 ⇒ 00:07:52.099 Uttam Kumaran: Because, of course, like, I think me and you can… we can get away with doing everything.
64 00:07:52.100 ⇒ 00:07:52.470 Donovan Griffin: Yes.
65 00:07:52.470 ⇒ 00:07:54.020 Uttam Kumaran: But, like, that’s not leverage.
66 00:07:54.020 ⇒ 00:07:54.510 Donovan Griffin: No.
67 00:07:54.510 ⇒ 00:08:03.300 Uttam Kumaran: And what people need is, like, a shared set of principles, and, like, you hope that we can all make, like, 70-80% of the same decision.
68 00:08:03.300 ⇒ 00:08:07.620 Donovan Griffin: But, like, I actually want there to be tension, I want you to be, like.
69 00:08:07.620 ⇒ 00:08:21.960 Uttam Kumaran: actually F that, like, I think I have a better way. Yeah. And you’re not in, like, a fear-based environment. It’s like, you’re like, whatever this guy said I’m gonna do. Like, some of the problems in my company is that people hear me say something, and then they just go do it. I’m like, no, dude, like, that was just a suggestion, like.
70 00:08:21.960 ⇒ 00:08:22.540 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, yeah.
71 00:08:22.540 ⇒ 00:08:30.279 Uttam Kumaran: You need to think about it. This is your area, like, I don’t know what’s going on. I’m here to tell you, like, some ideas.
72 00:08:30.280 ⇒ 00:08:30.700 Donovan Griffin: Yes.
73 00:08:30.700 ⇒ 00:08:34.920 Uttam Kumaran: Like, then you’re gonna blame me if it was wrong, and no, it’s your fault.
74 00:08:34.929 ⇒ 00:08:36.629 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, exactly.
75 00:08:36.630 ⇒ 00:08:52.720 Uttam Kumaran: So, like, a lot of my job is, like, is so much more coaching, where I have to pull back myself from doing the thing really fast, and instead of being like, okay, let’s break it down, like, what did you try? Like, what are some solutions you think are possible? Here are some of my ideas.
76 00:08:52.720 ⇒ 00:08:53.180 Donovan Griffin: Yep.
77 00:08:53.180 ⇒ 00:09:12.919 Uttam Kumaran: drive, right? And so, I think, yeah, I think it’s a lot more like… I mean, I… I love cooking, and I love food, and so I… I feel like my industry, especially in… it’s a technology service business, like, I feel much more interested in taking learnings from, like, fine dining.
78 00:09:12.920 ⇒ 00:09:15.160 Donovan Griffin: then I do take learnings from.
79 00:09:15.160 ⇒ 00:09:21.120 Uttam Kumaran: like, a big consulting firm. Yeah. It’s about hospitality, it’s about how the client feels.
80 00:09:21.120 ⇒ 00:09:21.969 Donovan Griffin: Yep. Right? Yep.
81 00:09:21.970 ⇒ 00:09:35.429 Uttam Kumaran: everything is in the kitchen, but, like, I’m… I’m also, like, for as crazy as we are, I’m also, like, pretty detail-oriented, where I’m like, hey, this, like, Google Doc is, like, not… the title is, like, super, like… So, because those are the things that, like.
82 00:09:35.850 ⇒ 00:09:39.170 Uttam Kumaran: it’s like, at the finish line, we, like, F that up. And so.
83 00:09:39.170 ⇒ 00:09:40.070 Donovan Griffin: Yes. But.
84 00:09:40.070 ⇒ 00:09:48.600 Uttam Kumaran: that’s what I like to think about our business as, and that’s why we try to bring on a diverse set of people, and we also try to, like, do different things, you know?
85 00:09:48.600 ⇒ 00:09:49.120 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
86 00:09:49.120 ⇒ 00:09:51.189 Uttam Kumaran: Like, that’s why when,
87 00:09:51.770 ⇒ 00:10:04.940 Uttam Kumaran: when… when Luke told me about you, like, I’m always thinking about ways for us to separate ourselves. And someone, you know, I listened to this sales podcast, and about some stuff in consulting, and really, someone was like.
88 00:10:04.940 ⇒ 00:10:14.390 Uttam Kumaran: your job in… when you’re selling is to actually not show how… not compare yourself. It’s like, how is this, like, completely different from anything you’ve seen?
89 00:10:14.390 ⇒ 00:10:15.529 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
90 00:10:15.530 ⇒ 00:10:35.450 Uttam Kumaran: So, I have to do the things that no other IT service company’s gonna do, which is, like, think about brands super, super heavily. Everything needs to be, like, as polished as we can afford it to be. Hire people that, like, typically would have nothing to do with, like, a company like mine. And then, like, keep trying things to show that, like, wow, these guys are, like.
91 00:10:35.750 ⇒ 00:10:47.020 Uttam Kumaran: they, like, it looks like they’re, like, underneath the hood, they probably do stuff like that, but they think about the world differently, and then we’re, like, off to here. Then we can price off to here, we can recruit off to here, right?
92 00:10:47.020 ⇒ 00:10:54.340 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, I love it, I love it. Yeah. No, that’s awesome. I think that’s… it’s kind of one thing I noticed,
93 00:10:54.670 ⇒ 00:11:11.989 Donovan Griffin: Well, about you guys and Luke joining and everything, he told me about your company, I was just like, wow, that sounds like such an unbelievable company and so aligned, and I know Luke’s values and, you know, him as a person, he’s such a great human being, so when he was really excited.
94 00:11:11.990 ⇒ 00:11:22.570 Donovan Griffin: to be joining your company, I was like, wow, that really seems like it aligns in such a beautiful way. He was like, you know, I was like, God, bringing you guys all together is really cool.
95 00:11:22.570 ⇒ 00:11:28.950 Uttam Kumaran: No, I know, but also, like, I started… we started talking to Luke. We actually passed up Luke’s initial offer to work with us.
96 00:11:28.950 ⇒ 00:11:29.570 Donovan Griffin: Okay.
97 00:11:29.570 ⇒ 00:11:33.270 Uttam Kumaran: But I, again, I think it was just, like, we just didn’t see each other.
98 00:11:33.640 ⇒ 00:11:49.540 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, that’s why I also, like, I always am aware that, like, that happens, and so sometimes it’s good to let things marinate. So, like, relationships… if you’re dealing with people who are, like, are, like, long-term oriented, even if it’s not today, it’s like, okay, now we know kind of what each other do, like, let’s see, like.
99 00:11:49.580 ⇒ 00:11:53.290 Donovan Griffin: Yep. The mind or whatever will find a way, and so…
100 00:11:53.290 ⇒ 00:12:00.550 Uttam Kumaran: Luke initially pitched us some stuff go-to-market. I don’t think we were ready. I think he was also really, like, brand-focused when we needed to still, like.
101 00:12:00.590 ⇒ 00:12:19.559 Uttam Kumaran: some execution, we hired, another person, it taught us a lot about, like, what we needed, what we didn’t need, then we reconnected, but, like, that’s how, like, there’s people who I… there’s people who work here that I talked to, like, 2 years ago, they work at another company, they met me, then randomly they’re like, I’m leaving, like, what are you up to again?
102 00:12:19.570 ⇒ 00:12:24.250 Uttam Kumaran: So, that’s just, like, how my life is these days, which is great.
103 00:12:24.490 ⇒ 00:12:25.919 Donovan Griffin: That’s amazing.
104 00:12:25.920 ⇒ 00:12:26.270 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
105 00:12:26.270 ⇒ 00:12:39.820 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, I think that’s… I mean, yeah, same here, it’s always… I’m just kind of, like, meetings and meetings, and then my bread and butter is anytime we’re on, like, a big project that aligns, because similar to what you guys are doing is, like.
106 00:12:40.400 ⇒ 00:12:45.489 Donovan Griffin: being different, yeah. …and everything. The one thing…
107 00:12:45.750 ⇒ 00:12:57.649 Donovan Griffin: Our company really prides itself on… and the whole start of the company, and taking it seriously, and going into the film industry is, like, right now, everyone knows it, but…
108 00:12:57.780 ⇒ 00:13:03.230 Donovan Griffin: there’s no one who does anything about it. There’s no story anymore. There’s no heart.
109 00:13:03.230 ⇒ 00:13:03.630 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
110 00:13:03.630 ⇒ 00:13:06.090 Donovan Griffin: And even with…
111 00:13:06.710 ⇒ 00:13:13.099 Donovan Griffin: Like, people like to blame a lot of things, and like, yeah, the industry right now is so targeted towards
112 00:13:13.550 ⇒ 00:13:27.569 Donovan Griffin: money, money, money, and okay, you know, I need to make something to make people like this film, so what do the people want to see for this film, instead of just the art of the film itself, and making the film to be the absolute.
113 00:13:27.570 ⇒ 00:13:34.720 Uttam Kumaran: You have to have an opinion. Like, for me, we started this business, I know I have an opinion on, like, because I did it for so long, I did the job.
114 00:13:34.720 ⇒ 00:13:37.840 Donovan Griffin: Yeah. That we’re selling services towards for so long. Yeah.
115 00:13:37.840 ⇒ 00:13:42.639 Uttam Kumaran: that, like, I don’t… I don’t necessarily go to clients and say, tell me what to build. I’m like.
116 00:13:42.940 ⇒ 00:13:47.790 Uttam Kumaran: you know, with this a partnership, I’ve heard everything you have to say, like, here’s what I think you should build.
117 00:13:47.790 ⇒ 00:13:48.120 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
118 00:13:48.120 ⇒ 00:13:49.679 Uttam Kumaran: Of course, it’s your money, so you tell me.
119 00:13:49.680 ⇒ 00:13:50.890 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, yeah. But, like.
120 00:13:50.890 ⇒ 00:13:59.519 Uttam Kumaran: it’s a… it’s like, we’re equal, versus typically in, like, services, it’s just like a, what do you need next, what do you need next, versus I tell people, we’re not like that, like, we’re not like a dev shop.
121 00:13:59.560 ⇒ 00:14:10.619 Uttam Kumaran: Meaning, we’re not just like, oh, there’s 100 people, and they’re doing whatever. No, no, no, it doesn’t work like that. Like, it’s a partnership. We co-draft, like, the scope of where we’re gonna help, but there are also parts of this that you need to do.
122 00:14:10.620 ⇒ 00:14:21.169 Uttam Kumaran: Like, I can’t help you, and you need to go do these. I will direct you, but, like, this… it’s like, it’s more of a partnership, and exactly right, like, we are… I’m opinionated, like, we use certain tools, we…
123 00:14:21.170 ⇒ 00:14:21.490 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
124 00:14:21.490 ⇒ 00:14:33.569 Uttam Kumaran: use certain methods, like, it’s not sort of just, like, whatever anybody wants. Like, a good example is this, like, clients will ask us, like, hey, you guys are crushing it over here, can you go, like, build us this iPhone app? No, like, I don’t do that.
125 00:14:33.570 ⇒ 00:14:48.610 Uttam Kumaran: And I only do the things where we’re great at. Like, and so, if there’s a thing we’re mediocre at, we do not sell that. Like, I won’t sell that. That’s bad money, right? I’m signing myself up for, like, doing this thing that I know we’re gonna get caught, because we’re, like, just like…
126 00:14:48.660 ⇒ 00:14:58.180 Uttam Kumaran: dancing around. Instead, the things we do, we’re really, really good at, and I’m just like, keep doing that, like, keep doing that. And it’s rare, I think.
127 00:14:58.390 ⇒ 00:15:06.449 Uttam Kumaran: I think it took a lot of, like, a longer-term mindset to not just chase whatever it is, and similar to your example, like, not just put out
128 00:15:06.740 ⇒ 00:15:12.480 Uttam Kumaran: What you know is gonna make money, like, a reboot or a common trope, Think about, like.
129 00:15:12.480 ⇒ 00:15:12.860 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
130 00:15:12.860 ⇒ 00:15:24.360 Uttam Kumaran: what is challenging, and then have an opinion, and, like, have a point of view. And again, even in food, they talk a lot about it, which is kind of… I don’t… I still… it’s kind of weird, but people talk about, like, this food as, like, a point of view or perspective.
131 00:15:24.360 ⇒ 00:15:24.900 Donovan Griffin: Yup.
132 00:15:24.900 ⇒ 00:15:33.130 Uttam Kumaran: Like, that, I think, is still so much, like, not… like, people don’t have that. It’s sort of mind hive, like…
133 00:15:33.370 ⇒ 00:15:33.810 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
134 00:15:33.810 ⇒ 00:15:44.970 Uttam Kumaran: generic, everything generic. Everything looks like the Graza olive oil, like, you know, and this… we just work in so many different industries, so… and we do a lot with marketing.
135 00:15:44.970 ⇒ 00:15:45.550 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
136 00:15:45.550 ⇒ 00:15:46.380 Uttam Kumaran: budgets.
137 00:15:46.380 ⇒ 00:15:46.900 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
138 00:15:46.900 ⇒ 00:15:56.019 Uttam Kumaran: everything is prescribed for you, like, there’s no… nothing that you see in marketing or digital marketing is, like, it’s all A-B tested to hell.
139 00:15:56.020 ⇒ 00:15:57.500 Donovan Griffin: It’s insane!
140 00:15:57.500 ⇒ 00:16:02.200 Uttam Kumaran: It’s… there’s only a few companies that still have, like, a lot of taste.
141 00:16:02.200 ⇒ 00:16:02.650 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
142 00:16:02.650 ⇒ 00:16:07.209 Uttam Kumaran: And try, and even if they’re, like, the data, like, we can’t prove that this is gonna work.
143 00:16:07.640 ⇒ 00:16:10.240 Uttam Kumaran: Like, we have a perspective on a person, like.
144 00:16:10.240 ⇒ 00:16:10.730 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
145 00:16:10.730 ⇒ 00:16:15.209 Uttam Kumaran: I also read a lot of books from, like, David Ogilvy about, like, running ad agencies.
146 00:16:15.210 ⇒ 00:16:15.580 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
147 00:16:15.580 ⇒ 00:16:19.180 Uttam Kumaran: It’s, like, one of the most, you know, famous first ad agencies in the world.
148 00:16:19.180 ⇒ 00:16:19.530 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
149 00:16:19.530 ⇒ 00:16:26.840 Uttam Kumaran: and he talks… and, like, I don’t know, I think that’s what I more try to drive our business towards. Yeah. You know, versus, like…
150 00:16:26.970 ⇒ 00:16:29.399 Uttam Kumaran: Other, like, tech companies or whatever.
151 00:16:29.400 ⇒ 00:16:39.869 Donovan Griffin: I love that. No, that’s huge. That’s… it’s such a great mindset, because it’s, like, similar to kind of what you do is, like, we… I… I learned…
152 00:16:40.530 ⇒ 00:16:45.760 Donovan Griffin: early that, like, okay, I could go into social media. I know so many people with, like, social media.
153 00:16:45.760 ⇒ 00:16:50.890 Uttam Kumaran: What were you doing, like, what did you do before film, or, like, what was, like, yeah, like, early career stuff?
154 00:16:50.890 ⇒ 00:16:53.830 Donovan Griffin: That’s a great question. Yeah, so, I mean…
155 00:16:53.840 ⇒ 00:17:01.069 Donovan Griffin: before, like, growing up, I’ve always loved film, but I never knew what I really wanted to get into.
156 00:17:01.070 ⇒ 00:17:24.300 Donovan Griffin: And then I… I did… I, like, majored in theater and film, so I was like, oh, maybe theater, maybe film, but I didn’t really know until I did a co-op, so I went for 6 months while I was still in school to LA, and I was working at a documentary film company called Herzog and Company, and that’s where I really got to.
157 00:17:24.300 ⇒ 00:17:27.000 Uttam Kumaran: Wow, that’s, like, a great fucking place, dude.
158 00:17:27.000 ⇒ 00:17:45.369 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, it was great, yeah, they did the… my first… my first day ever on set that I’ve ever been on, like, a real set, I was a PA, and it was Tim Burton and Edward Norton who we were interviewing, and I was like, like, I was freaking out, and I was just like, be cool, be cool, and then I was like, I was like.
159 00:17:45.370 ⇒ 00:17:48.910 Donovan Griffin: How do I PA? Like, how do I do the best ever that
160 00:17:48.910 ⇒ 00:17:53.149 Donovan Griffin: And, like, the coordinator was like, you just chill out, like, just…
161 00:17:53.150 ⇒ 00:17:54.020 Uttam Kumaran: rocks.
162 00:17:54.020 ⇒ 00:18:16.580 Donovan Griffin: people some, like, coffee and waters and stuff, like, everything’s pretty set up, so I’d, like, help the grips. I’d be like, how can I help? And they, like, would teach me how to, you know, do the grip work, and then towards the end, I’d be like, okay, once everything was set up, I’d go help the grips a little bit, learn that. I love learning. And that was my favorite part, but then I also realized, I was like, wow, I’m doing…
163 00:18:17.190 ⇒ 00:18:23.309 Donovan Griffin: I’m kind of doing… it was almost like it was that… I could see the…
164 00:18:24.200 ⇒ 00:18:31.479 Donovan Griffin: kind of like what you’re talking about, too, like, I kind of saw, like, the heart being kind of taken away from, like, it was like.
165 00:18:31.480 ⇒ 00:18:31.880 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
166 00:18:32.420 ⇒ 00:18:45.449 Donovan Griffin: corporate company that would pump out, they would be working with all these huge, you know, huge celebrities and everything, but every time it was like a, you know, hour and a half interview, and then just all archival.
167 00:18:45.450 ⇒ 00:18:45.910 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
168 00:18:45.910 ⇒ 00:19:01.700 Donovan Griffin: clearance team, and then it’s a bunch, and then they’re doing, like, ESPN movies, and so it’s, like, a bunch of projects, and it’s always the same thing, and it’s just archival work, and it’s a big load on the post-production, and they would do it in a fine way, you know, where people would watch and enjoy and, you know.
169 00:19:01.700 ⇒ 00:19:14.929 Donovan Griffin: you know, maybe I kind of look at something like that more of, like, a, okay, kind of, like, relax, watch, or, like, feel… feel good, you know, like, okay, cool, let’s just put it on. But they weren’t making…
170 00:19:14.930 ⇒ 00:19:37.700 Donovan Griffin: any, like, documentaries or something that I saw someone with, like, I wanna… I’m striving to make the best thing possible, you know, like, I’m going for this, and I want to go 110% and, like, make the best, more just, like, pump it out, you know, and get it going, and, you know, they knew they would make money. And so I was just kind of like, oh, I love this, I saw my career, like, trajectory of, like, oh, I could…
171 00:19:37.700 ⇒ 00:19:53.289 Donovan Griffin: get to here, get to here, and then get on the top floor, and then be a producer, and then be doing this, and I was like, I want to take the freaking… I don’t want to take that route, I want to take the risky, like, I need to create films, like, I need to start making stuff for my own stuff, and so I,
172 00:19:53.380 ⇒ 00:20:00.010 Donovan Griffin: I had a couple projects, I had a couple, like, short film spec commercials, and then the…
173 00:20:00.090 ⇒ 00:20:19.929 Donovan Griffin: big one was the documentary that I made that was… that definitely cemented my path in the film industry, because we had zero budget, I had the connection with the two-time junior world champion downhill skateboarder, so they’re breaking, like, 70 miles per hour on their board, going down highway roads and stuff is insane.
174 00:20:19.930 ⇒ 00:20:42.900 Donovan Griffin: And I had that connection, and I was like… and I had a DP that I knew, it was a really good cinematographer. And so, with no budget, no nothing, I got him signed on, I got the cinematographer signed on, I put a date to it, and we’re like, we’re doing this no matter what, and we’ll try and figure it out. Ended up getting little money just from family and friends, you know, but, like, nothing. And…
175 00:20:42.900 ⇒ 00:20:54.960 Donovan Griffin: we went and… we just went with friends, and everyone did it for free, and we just got money to stay at, like, cheap Airbnbs along the way, and put into the equipment to do it, like, shoot it properly.
176 00:20:55.170 ⇒ 00:21:04.550 Donovan Griffin: went and did it, ended up getting such good coverage that we, that I was like, oh my god, we got such a great film here. Wouldn’t take…
177 00:21:04.700 ⇒ 00:21:16.799 Donovan Griffin: like, new… basically, I’m kind of like a perfectionist with especially things I really care about, and so we didn’t… we got more money from some investors because of what we captured.
178 00:21:16.800 ⇒ 00:21:31.300 Donovan Griffin: But we didn’t have enough for, like, a proper post team, and so I went around for 2 months, calling people, just, like, saying no, there’s a bunch of… there’s thousands of editors in LA, but I wasn’t gonna take someone that I, like, wasn’t, yeah, yeah, yeah.
179 00:21:31.300 ⇒ 00:21:31.740 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah.
180 00:21:31.740 ⇒ 00:21:53.350 Donovan Griffin: super, super efficient and amazing, even though the budget wasn’t great. So it was, like, this bad predicament, but I was like, I think it was, like, two months, two and a half months, I was sweating, I was like, is this ever gonna get made? I need it to get made, but I need a great team. And then, ended up hopping on an informational interview call with this ace editor who did, like, Netflix’s You, series.
181 00:21:53.350 ⇒ 00:21:53.710 Uttam Kumaran: Wow.
182 00:21:53.710 ⇒ 00:22:11.129 Donovan Griffin: he did Hitch, he did all these, he was an, you know, unbelievable editor, and and he did a Paulie Shore documentary, and I talked with him, and I was just, like, giving the whole, you know, rundown. I was like, yeah, we captured this, I was all excited about it, and at the end, I was like, would you be interested in editing? And he was like.
183 00:22:11.130 ⇒ 00:22:25.270 Donovan Griffin: Well, let me think about it, maybe me and I could bring some other editors on and stuff as a team that these other assistant editors that I want… let me think about it a little bit, I do really love the story, and then, like, a week later, he was like, okay, great, we’ll do it, and .
184 00:22:25.270 ⇒ 00:22:25.730 Uttam Kumaran: Wow.
185 00:22:25.730 ⇒ 00:22:40.659 Donovan Griffin: it was just amazing, and then it just grew and grew from there, and then to get, you know, international sales and go there was a whole nother leg of it, and so it just, like, grew, and I realized, like, oh, dang, I’m pretty good at, like, make, like, getting stuff done.
186 00:22:40.660 ⇒ 00:22:56.640 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, making it happen. Like, you know, some of what people say is that, like, either, like, the world kind of happens to you, or you watch, and throughout my life, I always liked watching people who are like, damn, that person’s literally, like, they’re, like, happening to the world, almost, you know?
187 00:22:57.020 ⇒ 00:23:05.890 Uttam Kumaran: But I never really got it, like, I don’t, like… I’m not super loaded, I like sort of normal person, but, like, it’s so funny because…
188 00:23:06.220 ⇒ 00:23:18.120 Uttam Kumaran: relationships I made in, like, 2020, 2019, just people I liked and hung out with, they… they don’t typically… even people who are successful, they, like, people don’t treat people like that.
189 00:23:18.120 ⇒ 00:23:32.899 Uttam Kumaran: Or, like, have, like, interest in, like, collaborating, however, and they remember that, and then they come back. Or they, like, this is, like, a super refreshing thing, should try to do something. And so, I don’t know, I just feel like, okay, I told my teams, like, my… your job was just, like.
190 00:23:33.040 ⇒ 00:23:47.979 Uttam Kumaran: help me do more of that, and I just be genuine, and things just tend to go a certain way, and so let’s just… let’s just keep doing that. So that’s, like, I feel like I… I think, think the similar, you know, kind of the… the similar way.
191 00:23:47.980 ⇒ 00:23:55.220 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, no, 100%. I think that’s the best way, and… and story first. I think, like, anyone can do…
192 00:23:55.460 ⇒ 00:24:10.159 Donovan Griffin: especially nowadays, I feel like this may apply to your industry, too. It’s like, I see in mine the flashiest content ever, I see the best cinematography, I see the best flashy editing, I see all this amazing, and I’m sure that in your industry, like, the…
193 00:24:10.160 ⇒ 00:24:23.739 Donovan Griffin: most up-to-date, you know, technology, or just, oh my god, this is unbelievable, but what is being… what’s lacked is the story, is the heart, and the thing that people actually relate to, and that’s, like.
194 00:24:23.740 ⇒ 00:24:29.519 Donovan Griffin: I guess for your guys’ is, like, actually being able to change people’s lives, change companies’ lives, you know?
195 00:24:29.520 ⇒ 00:24:37.929 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, and so it’s such a pain point. And so, but this is the thing, is like, I think as I’ve done this company, we start… it’s only about the people.
196 00:24:37.930 ⇒ 00:24:46.920 Donovan Griffin: You know, and so you can think about it, like, optimistically, pessimistically. Pessimistically, it’s sort of like, people are the limiting factor. Like, I know that what we are doing.
197 00:24:46.920 ⇒ 00:25:05.320 Uttam Kumaran: is really, really powerful. I have full belief that we are some of the best people to do data and AI implementations, and I think we are super, super cheap. Like, I think we don’t price nearly as much as some of the other people who have worse services that take longer.
198 00:25:05.320 ⇒ 00:25:06.000 Donovan Griffin: Yes.
199 00:25:06.000 ⇒ 00:25:24.290 Uttam Kumaran: Like, and I say that outwardly, I say that when I talk to clients, I’m like, guys, we are, like, underpriced, I promise you, like, you know, for what you’re gonna get from us. And so, there’s that, but also, similarly, like, people are the… are the people that we need to convince people, and show people that they can be empowered within their organization to make changes.
200 00:25:24.290 ⇒ 00:25:24.610 Donovan Griffin: Especially.
201 00:25:24.610 ⇒ 00:25:34.099 Uttam Kumaran: larger and larger companies that we go to, oftentimes you’ll find that my job or our team’s job is empowering that person to convince their management or their team that, like.
202 00:25:34.570 ⇒ 00:25:42.260 Uttam Kumaran: bringing these guys in, having them do this, is gonna help us. And the larger companies, there’s so much politics, there’s things like that, so thinking about of, like.
203 00:25:42.310 ⇒ 00:25:57.360 Uttam Kumaran: internal champion for, like, change, or something like that. And you have this, like, sense of urgency with AI, right? Like, you don’t want AI to be done to you, you kind of want to wield it. So there’s a lot of, like, thread lines, right, that I think.
204 00:25:57.360 ⇒ 00:25:57.680 Donovan Griffin: They have.
205 00:25:57.680 ⇒ 00:26:01.649 Uttam Kumaran: Come out naturally, even in just the way we sell and we discuss.
206 00:26:01.650 ⇒ 00:26:02.030 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
207 00:26:02.030 ⇒ 00:26:13.709 Uttam Kumaran: And part of it, I think, is highlighting us. I think I always… even early on, I talked to Luke, I’m like, maybe we should go… like, we should go sit with customers and film, like, a high production, like, case study, almost, like.
208 00:26:13.710 ⇒ 00:26:14.440 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
209 00:26:14.440 ⇒ 00:26:23.349 Uttam Kumaran: You know, and show… and this is also the thing, is we try to do a lot of in-person events, because I’m very different than most of the tech service, like.
210 00:26:23.470 ⇒ 00:26:28.830 Donovan Griffin: leaders and stuff like that, so I’m like, if I meet someone and I’m genuinely, like, I think we can help your company… Yeah.
211 00:26:28.830 ⇒ 00:26:38.499 Uttam Kumaran: and I shake a hand, like, pretty good shot we’re gonna get a phone call back. So I’m like, how do we package that? Like, how can… I can’t be in all the places, so how do we package that.
212 00:26:38.500 ⇒ 00:26:39.010 Donovan Griffin: Yes.
213 00:26:39.010 ⇒ 00:26:45.760 Uttam Kumaran: Feeling, or, like, that moment into something that, you know, for us as a business, is, like, we can scale.
214 00:26:45.760 ⇒ 00:26:46.100 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
215 00:26:46.100 ⇒ 00:26:55.239 Uttam Kumaran: We do… we do text-based content, it’s just not, like… I think it’s crowded, and it’s, like, it’s a skill to do great writing and great copywriting, but.
216 00:26:55.240 ⇒ 00:26:55.860 Donovan Griffin: Hmm.
217 00:26:55.860 ⇒ 00:27:03.850 Uttam Kumaran: still, I don’t think that’s it, like, I’m thinking about, like, other, you know, mediums that, like, kind of set us apart.
218 00:27:04.270 ⇒ 00:27:17.650 Donovan Griffin: No, 100%. Well, I love to hear that, too, because I always kind of… when I’m talking with clients, too, there’s two different clients. Some clients are, like, wanting to put in their, like, I just… we just need to get seen more, and we need to get seen. I’m like, okay, you guys are.
219 00:27:17.650 ⇒ 00:27:26.520 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, see, you can also ask, like, Luke, I have no interest in… like, I’m not… I’m only a… like, if I could say, like, impact.
220 00:27:26.710 ⇒ 00:27:27.260 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
221 00:27:27.260 ⇒ 00:27:33.859 Uttam Kumaran: Or if I can say, like, what the outcome is. Like, I don’t care if 500 people see this.
222 00:27:33.860 ⇒ 00:27:40.079 Donovan Griffin: But it’s, like, 500 of the exact people. I have no problem, that’s a huge success. You’re gonna get… yeah, no, exactly.
223 00:27:40.080 ⇒ 00:27:51.970 Uttam Kumaran: So it’s, for me, it’s like, I know what we are and what we aren’t. Like, we are not in the volume game. We are not in, like, the global game. Like, we have a message that only a few people should really probably understand.
224 00:27:52.110 ⇒ 00:27:53.100 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, no…
225 00:27:53.100 ⇒ 00:28:05.629 Uttam Kumaran: that’s, I think, gives a lot of constraint to it, you know? Like, my girlfriend should not really get… sometimes I’ll show her stuff where she’s like, it looks really great, I have no idea. I’m like, actually, like, yeah, fair. Like, I don’t know what, you know, okay.
226 00:28:05.630 ⇒ 00:28:07.100 Donovan Griffin: That’s awesome.
227 00:28:07.100 ⇒ 00:28:07.480 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
228 00:28:07.480 ⇒ 00:28:20.960 Donovan Griffin: Well, no, it’s great, because we literally did the exact same… I don’t know if Luke sent you, but we had the exact same situation with this company, BusRite, and it was basically.
229 00:28:20.960 ⇒ 00:28:21.490 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
230 00:28:21.490 ⇒ 00:28:45.190 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, so the bus rate video, that stemmed from the CEO going, we are not trying to blast this out and get a social media million views or whatever and nothing, you know? We want one video that we can send to, because they constantly are going to clients, or going to school districts, and they need a school district to look at it, say, okay, I’m gonna now start delegating
231 00:28:45.190 ⇒ 00:28:49.340 Donovan Griffin: X amount of budget to you guys, take away from other things for the.
232 00:28:49.340 ⇒ 00:28:49.720 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
233 00:28:49.720 ⇒ 00:28:55.499 Donovan Griffin: They’re already low, so why the heck am I trusting you guys? Sure, I know it works, but, like, why would I give my.
234 00:28:55.500 ⇒ 00:28:56.040 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
235 00:28:56.040 ⇒ 00:29:12.189 Donovan Griffin: to you guys. Like, why would I do that? And they kept on going to a lot of school… and they were doing great, but they… there were certain clients that just weren’t getting it, and it was… they knew how to do all the tech and everything to, you know, the top tier levels, but they weren’t getting
236 00:29:12.250 ⇒ 00:29:17.869 Donovan Griffin: Who they were across, and their message, and showing them that they know, kind of like.
237 00:29:17.900 ⇒ 00:29:33.399 Donovan Griffin: basically that people could trust them, and I had a lot of conversations of figuring out their company, their message, and overall, we realized, talking with them, he was like, honestly, the number one core thing is we want to showcase our product, is how
238 00:29:33.400 ⇒ 00:29:37.920 Donovan Griffin: Helping people, and that we understand the people that it’s serving.
239 00:29:37.920 ⇒ 00:29:38.290 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
240 00:29:38.290 ⇒ 00:29:44.070 Donovan Griffin: product, the people that it’s serving, you know, and how this is, you know, that we truly are…
241 00:29:44.070 ⇒ 00:30:02.060 Donovan Griffin: intertwined with their community, and we get it, because that’s what these people are. A lot of the people making the decision started off as a school bus driver, started off, then, you know, worked their way to transportation director, and then now are in this position to decide. And so we did the whole story around still showcasing the product, but…
242 00:30:02.230 ⇒ 00:30:08.559 Donovan Griffin: Product was secondary, primary was the audience, and showcasing the story of
243 00:30:08.560 ⇒ 00:30:33.519 Donovan Griffin: how this transportation director was looking back at his time as a school bus driver, the connection he made with this kid, watching him grow up through the years till graduation, and then the kid, you know, throwing him the same ball, which was his first day on school, and he sent me videos of conferences where people were weeping, like, men and women who are all transportation directors weeping. He called me, like.
244 00:30:33.520 ⇒ 00:30:35.530 Donovan Griffin: A month and a half later, he was like.
245 00:30:35.550 ⇒ 00:30:44.300 Donovan Griffin: we’ve been trying to lock in this one school district, we went, all we did was, this time we showed the video, she started crying, and we landed them as a client. I was like.
246 00:30:44.300 ⇒ 00:30:45.100 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I know.
247 00:30:45.100 ⇒ 00:30:47.600 Donovan Griffin: I was, like, insane, and so, it’s.
248 00:30:47.600 ⇒ 00:30:56.610 Uttam Kumaran: It’s like… but it takes everything. Like, for me, I think, like, one thing famous I think about is, like, Coca-Cola, they have, like, nine… it takes, like, nine impressions for someone to, like.
249 00:30:56.610 ⇒ 00:30:57.170 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
250 00:30:57.170 ⇒ 00:30:58.950 Uttam Kumaran: good idea of your brand, and so Coke.
251 00:30:58.950 ⇒ 00:30:59.460 Donovan Griffin: Yes.
252 00:30:59.460 ⇒ 00:31:17.470 Uttam Kumaran: does a good job of, like, being everywhere. Like, GEICO is another thing where it’s like, dude, you wouldn’t even, like, think about, like, you don’t think about insurance, right? And so I think a lot about that. But what that means is, like, if someone Googles me, they gotta see our website has to be tip-top shape, my LinkedIn has to be tip-top shape.
253 00:31:17.470 ⇒ 00:31:17.970 Donovan Griffin: Yep.
254 00:31:17.970 ⇒ 00:31:27.710 Uttam Kumaran: Maybe they see a connection, they text somebody, they’re like, that person, that company’s great. Then they look at our YouTube, there’s a great video. Like, everything has to work, and we have to have a great meeting.
255 00:31:27.710 ⇒ 00:31:28.090 Donovan Griffin: Yes.
256 00:31:28.090 ⇒ 00:31:38.480 Uttam Kumaran: be formal, and so as many of these as, like, I just want to make sure exist, and I actually totally agree with you that, like, sometimes people will be messaging back and forth with us, I’m like.
257 00:31:38.480 ⇒ 00:31:57.420 Uttam Kumaran: I want to just send them something, like, actually, just, like, take… if you have, like, 2 seconds, just watch this, just get a little… just understand us a little bit, and see, like, whether this is interesting to you. Yeah, exactly. Like, versus, typically, what do we do? Like, I have to send, like, I send an email, or a blurb. These days, I’m trying to sell more, like, videos, like, Loom videos of, like.
258 00:31:57.420 ⇒ 00:32:00.379 Donovan Griffin: Hey, so-and-so, like, this is how we’re thinking about your project.
259 00:32:00.380 ⇒ 00:32:05.479 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. But, again, people are buying their interaction with me and my team, like this.
260 00:32:05.830 ⇒ 00:32:12.620 Uttam Kumaran: Ultimately, everything that goes on beyond this is all, like, coding and whatever, but that’s still really important, but it’s the trust.
261 00:32:12.760 ⇒ 00:32:14.999 Uttam Kumaran: That is actually, we’re trying to sell.
262 00:32:15.000 ⇒ 00:32:17.120 Donovan Griffin: Yeah. And however we can…
263 00:32:17.680 ⇒ 00:32:20.420 Uttam Kumaran: Package that into a reusable way.
264 00:32:20.420 ⇒ 00:32:21.300 Donovan Griffin: Yeah. And…
265 00:32:21.300 ⇒ 00:32:28.170 Uttam Kumaran: Bootstrap that, so, like, it doesn’t take 3 or 4 meetings, or it doesn’t take, like, me having to shake their hand in person.
266 00:32:28.170 ⇒ 00:32:32.719 Donovan Griffin: Exactly. Right? Like, that’s how I really, really think about it, you know?
267 00:32:32.720 ⇒ 00:32:33.550 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
268 00:32:33.550 ⇒ 00:32:48.030 Donovan Griffin: No, that’s, that’s… that’s huge. Yeah, I mean, I would love to learn more, continue, and then also talk to Luke, too, because I think there’s a couple different ways, like, in… in,
269 00:32:49.920 ⇒ 00:33:05.549 Donovan Griffin: like, best case scenario, I almost look at it as… and this is what I kind of told Keith, too. It’s like, we figure out what you guys need first and foremost, what would be… create the most biggest impact, so that, with those impressions and the meaning.
270 00:33:05.550 ⇒ 00:33:06.140 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
271 00:33:06.140 ⇒ 00:33:16.629 Donovan Griffin: So you just send a video, they see it, it’s like a two-minute video or one-minute video, and they know, okay, cool, I’m interested in this company, everyone likes videos instead.
272 00:33:16.630 ⇒ 00:33:26.570 Donovan Griffin: within the first 3 seconds, they go, oh, this is… this is done properly, oh, this is interesting, oh, I’m kind of hooked, oh my god, I wasn’t expecting this, oh my god, I felt an emotion, like…
273 00:33:26.570 ⇒ 00:33:27.130 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah.
274 00:33:27.130 ⇒ 00:33:51.770 Donovan Griffin: feel something, and so that’s such a key component. Then, the secondary is there can also be a lot of use, I think, for a video that’s like, hey, now I got you to trust this company, you still have questions on how the product works and everything, here’s just a video that’s, like, a 60-second explanation, you know, still done very proper, not boring, not like, oh, I’m
275 00:33:51.770 ⇒ 00:33:58.990 Donovan Griffin: have to watch this presentation, but a 60-second of, like, explaining everything that you guys do and offer, so it’s
276 00:33:59.160 ⇒ 00:34:06.890 Donovan Griffin: everything in 60 seconds on a high level, where someone would go, okay, cool, I’ll… yeah, let’s do it, that sounds great.
277 00:34:06.890 ⇒ 00:34:07.440 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
278 00:34:07.440 ⇒ 00:34:22.080 Donovan Griffin: I’m a candidate. And the nice thing, too, about that main first and foremost video with such heart is that could be done in two ways. One, where we kind of did with, like, the bus ride, and that’s a video
279 00:34:22.219 ⇒ 00:34:27.349 Donovan Griffin: That’s a story. Everyone, you know, relates to story and resonates with story, and so if you…
280 00:34:27.350 ⇒ 00:34:46.120 Donovan Griffin: We come up with a beautiful, amazing story that anyone can watch, and they feel like now they’re just hooked in to this film, and they’re like, oh my god, but there’s… they feel this authenticity of you guys knowing and understanding the circumstance that you’re… you’re…
281 00:34:46.120 ⇒ 00:34:46.690 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
282 00:34:46.690 ⇒ 00:34:51.560 Donovan Griffin: clients are going through, and they feel heard, and they feel, oh, wow, this is authentic.
283 00:34:51.560 ⇒ 00:34:52.020 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
284 00:34:52.020 ⇒ 00:35:05.859 Donovan Griffin: and they feel immersed in the story, like, that’s number one. I always think, like, the absolute best, like, outcome ever, you know, just creating that. That can, you know, get up there with in terms of…
285 00:35:05.860 ⇒ 00:35:12.649 Donovan Griffin: you know, budgeting, I feel like the same way, we’re… we’re always way cheaper, we’re marketing with, like, I’m like, these…
286 00:35:12.650 ⇒ 00:35:22.409 Uttam Kumaran: I didn’t even ask you, like, what is the business now, or, like, what’s the play right now, or, like, yeah. No, it’s great. We specialize right now in… And who’s we?
287 00:35:22.410 ⇒ 00:35:38.860 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, no, that’s a great question. So, basically, it’s really fun. It’s me, and then my, my producing partner, who’s kind of like COO of the company, and we’re both full-time. We currently have, like.
288 00:35:39.790 ⇒ 00:36:03.230 Donovan Griffin: 150 or whatever, plus, like, project-by-project people. You know, a bunch of different people. We have a certain amount of people on our roster for, like, directors for certain projects, unbelievable editors, I tend to produce and direct, like, the big ones, but we have, like, people on a roster, and then when projects come.
289 00:36:03.230 ⇒ 00:36:24.769 Donovan Griffin: We have, like, a network of trusted, vetted people in all departments of pre-production, production, post-production. We have marketing, but we partner with marketing. We don’t specialize, we don’t advertise marketing, we advertise, you know, we advertise the creative of coming up and working with the marketing teams from the companies and getting that to a perfect place.
290 00:36:25.920 ⇒ 00:36:42.440 Donovan Griffin: But that’s… that’s kind of where we are now, and then we specialize in, like, the 150K lifestyle, you know, story-first, branded films that are…
291 00:36:42.490 ⇒ 00:36:49.910 Donovan Griffin: competable… I would say, like, better with freakin’, you know, heart and stuff than these brands that you will
292 00:36:50.320 ⇒ 00:36:56.529 Donovan Griffin: to pay, you know, half a million, or $300K as a minimum for a day rate, you know?
293 00:36:56.530 ⇒ 00:36:57.300 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
294 00:36:57.300 ⇒ 00:37:20.089 Donovan Griffin: going, and then that’s not including posts. So, you know, going through agencies, basically taking the whole, like, going through agencies, to then you have a creative director, and then the agency’s giving… taking 50% of the… the, you know, 500K project that you’re doing, so then it’s actually $250, and then that’s being taken from the, you know, creative, you know.
295 00:37:20.090 ⇒ 00:37:20.520 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
296 00:37:20.520 ⇒ 00:37:27.599 Donovan Griffin: who’s then the director, and then the production team is just the production team, just doing kind of like an army, doing exactly what they’re told.
297 00:37:27.600 ⇒ 00:37:48.619 Donovan Griffin: And so that… that’s where we come in, and that’s kind of like our bread and butter. However, those projects are, you know, we get a few of those projects, and we’re working towards getting more of those projects, because we’re seeing a big, need for that, and push for that now, but we constantly still do, like.
298 00:37:48.620 ⇒ 00:37:54.360 Donovan Griffin: I have other projects going on around the same time, too, of delegating to other directors for.
299 00:37:54.360 ⇒ 00:37:54.750 Uttam Kumaran: Cool.
300 00:37:54.750 ⇒ 00:38:10.799 Donovan Griffin: smaller little gigs, or if someone comes to us and they’re like, hey, we have, you know, 10K, or, you know, and I’m like, okay, is it a one day? Like, we can… we can have a one-man band, like, go and shoot this, and we’ll do it properly, it’ll look like a 25K one.
301 00:38:10.800 ⇒ 00:38:12.130 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah, I got you.
302 00:38:12.130 ⇒ 00:38:25.440 Donovan Griffin: We don’t… we don’t, like, say no, and then we have, like, post-retainers as well. So we, like, do it all there, but I focus… the growth of this company is taking on projects with companies that we
303 00:38:25.550 ⇒ 00:38:33.349 Donovan Griffin: resonate with, and we think that are actually trying to make a change for the betterment of society. Sure. Because when that is the case.
304 00:38:34.030 ⇒ 00:38:36.379 Donovan Griffin: The jobs are… we’re not, you know, we’re not.
305 00:38:36.380 ⇒ 00:38:37.320 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, it’s pretty easy.
306 00:38:37.320 ⇒ 00:38:38.450 Donovan Griffin: in a bad way to…
307 00:38:38.450 ⇒ 00:38:39.220 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
308 00:38:39.220 ⇒ 00:38:53.619 Donovan Griffin: We already have a great story and a great, you know, content that we can work off of and make amazing, and then we also know that when the people are, because film is manipulation, so when the people are manipulated to go.
309 00:38:53.660 ⇒ 00:38:59.809 Donovan Griffin: oh my god, I trust this, I feel like I wanna, I wanna choose them. It’s good, it’s for the.
310 00:38:59.810 ⇒ 00:39:00.309 Uttam Kumaran: You better be.
311 00:39:00.310 ⇒ 00:39:13.370 Donovan Griffin: You know, then they’re choosing them, and they’re getting better results than people who are ripping them off, and so, that’s where we kind of, like, pride ourselves on, like, story first, always, no matter what.
312 00:39:13.500 ⇒ 00:39:15.929 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, so it’s really fun.
313 00:39:15.930 ⇒ 00:39:29.190 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, dope. I mean, I think, like, tell me… yeah, I think me, you, and Luke should just, like, keep… keep talking. I… how can I be helpful? Like, I certainly have some people that I feel like in the last 6 months have asked me
314 00:39:29.340 ⇒ 00:39:30.399 Uttam Kumaran: for, like.
315 00:39:30.630 ⇒ 00:39:40.190 Uttam Kumaran: kind of, like, what you’re doing, that I, like, I’ll have to think and try to connect you as well. Yeah. But, like, tell me, like, how I can be helpful, like, yeah.
316 00:39:40.190 ⇒ 00:39:50.699 Donovan Griffin: No, and same here. I want to know how, like, how we could be helpful, too. Like, honestly, I just loved meeting you and talking with you. If…
317 00:39:50.800 ⇒ 00:40:08.569 Donovan Griffin: I think if you’re interested in… in collaborating or getting something together, I can give you kind of the rundown. We’re very much, like, we will do… we’ll work with you guys, we’ll pitch, and we’ll do a treatment, and, like, a whole budget breakdown and stuff. We do that for free when we
318 00:40:08.570 ⇒ 00:40:21.660 Donovan Griffin: kind of vet the client and know that, like, oh, this is something that they would be interested in doing. Sure. Even down the line, like, we do all of that stuff, so we kind of paint the picture and get it to a place where client knows
319 00:40:21.680 ⇒ 00:40:34.100 Donovan Griffin: exactly what the story, or, like, the high level of what the story is, and goes, yeah, this is… this is good, like, I proved this sounds, like, right up our alley, and then they also see the budget, and like…
320 00:40:34.100 ⇒ 00:40:44.779 Donovan Griffin: We even do, like, the line items. We pride ourselves on, like, transparency, so we just send the whole thing, and just, like, hey, this is where everything’s going, because those numbers can get, I think, what…
321 00:40:44.780 ⇒ 00:40:50.739 Donovan Griffin: It’s also one of the things that’s like, we hate the agencies that, like, just kind of like you hate a lot of things in the…
322 00:40:50.740 ⇒ 00:40:51.090 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
323 00:40:51.090 ⇒ 00:40:56.689 Donovan Griffin: certain industries, like, we hate that the agencies, like, will be like, 500K, and then just, like, take half.
324 00:40:56.690 ⇒ 00:40:57.010 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
325 00:40:57.010 ⇒ 00:40:59.080 Donovan Griffin: And it’s like, what the heck? It’s like…
326 00:40:59.080 ⇒ 00:40:59.730 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
327 00:40:59.730 ⇒ 00:41:02.180 Donovan Griffin: Well, you’re, you know, like, just be more transparent.
328 00:41:02.180 ⇒ 00:41:06.729 Uttam Kumaran: I agree, and I have no problem being more transparent, because we believe in the work, so…
329 00:41:06.730 ⇒ 00:41:07.430 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
330 00:41:07.430 ⇒ 00:41:14.760 Uttam Kumaran: If anything, again, like, I’m hopeful that our prices just go up, because I can’t hire enough people that could do this type of quality, and so this
331 00:41:15.050 ⇒ 00:41:23.310 Uttam Kumaran: there’s so… there’s demand, right? So I have a… Yeah, like, so maybe, like, maybe me, you, and Luke can keep texting, and, like, I want to follow up with him and sort of.
332 00:41:23.310 ⇒ 00:41:23.800 Donovan Griffin: Heck yeah.
333 00:41:23.800 ⇒ 00:41:27.140 Uttam Kumaran: See what he thinks, but, like, this is amazing. Yeah, I appreciate the time.
334 00:41:27.140 ⇒ 00:41:29.850 Donovan Griffin: Yeah, no, I appreciate the time, too. I look forward to it.
335 00:41:29.850 ⇒ 00:41:33.929 Uttam Kumaran: And if you’re in Austin for any reason, like, please come say hello.
336 00:41:34.950 ⇒ 00:41:44.870 Uttam Kumaran: come to LA soon. There’s, like, six people in our company that are in LA. I grew up in the Bay Area, but I’m a Lakers fan, but not a really big LA fan.
337 00:41:45.210 ⇒ 00:41:50.159 Uttam Kumaran: I, I have to come down there to see everybody now, I guess, so…
338 00:41:50.160 ⇒ 00:41:57.429 Donovan Griffin: You gotta let me know. I know, I’m more… once… I think my wife and I are gonna move to San Diego eventually, it’s just…
339 00:41:57.430 ⇒ 00:41:58.150 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
340 00:41:58.150 ⇒ 00:41:59.310 Donovan Griffin: Just peace, and so…
341 00:41:59.310 ⇒ 00:41:59.780 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
342 00:41:59.780 ⇒ 00:42:17.019 Donovan Griffin: Still be, like, and close enough where I can make the drive for everything. But most of my work is pre-production of really developing ideas, pitching, doing the treatments, getting that really honed in. Production’s such a small percentage, then, because there’s post-production, where the magic really happens, too.
343 00:42:17.020 ⇒ 00:42:17.640 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
344 00:42:17.640 ⇒ 00:42:23.109 Donovan Griffin: And, yeah, no, that’s awesome. Heck yeah! Well, yeah, let’s keep it going.
345 00:42:23.110 ⇒ 00:42:23.640 Uttam Kumaran: Totally.
346 00:42:23.640 ⇒ 00:42:34.900 Donovan Griffin: curious, let me know if there’s anything that I can do to help you, and yeah, hope to collaborate. And even, like, too, my mind was going, like.
347 00:42:34.900 ⇒ 00:42:48.719 Donovan Griffin: a documentary-type style thing could be very interesting, like you were saying, with certain… almost like a testimonial, but not done how every company does it, like a… like a beautiful, real, like, just…
348 00:42:48.720 ⇒ 00:42:55.760 Donovan Griffin: done properly, that people are like, oh, is this… this is like a… this really feels great, like you’re… if you’re… if it’s a farmer, you know.
349 00:42:55.760 ⇒ 00:42:59.829 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I mean, I really think, like, perception is, like, reality, you know? It is.
350 00:42:59.830 ⇒ 00:43:00.160 Donovan Griffin: Yeah.
351 00:43:00.160 ⇒ 00:43:10.269 Uttam Kumaran: we have to look like an Accenture in terms of, like, how above and, like, that we are sort of that big in order to get those types of opportunities.
352 00:43:10.270 ⇒ 00:43:10.950 Donovan Griffin: Cool. Get those signs.
353 00:43:10.950 ⇒ 00:43:26.809 Uttam Kumaran: of people, and so that’s why we’ve invested… I invested in brand the whole time. The third hire at the company was, like, a part-time designer, not, like, another engineer, because I was like, this has to look like people are going to want to pay. It can’t be, like, a shitty website for me.
354 00:43:26.810 ⇒ 00:43:27.540 Donovan Griffin: You’re the best.
355 00:43:27.540 ⇒ 00:43:38.350 Uttam Kumaran: It has to look like there’s, like, 100,000 people at this company, which is, like, that’s how people call me. They’re like, dude, everything looks so professional now, like, how many… this is crazy, it’s like a whole big operation. I’m like, yes, dude, let’s go.
356 00:43:38.350 ⇒ 00:43:51.539 Donovan Griffin: You have a thousand employees! I’m, like, the same, I’m always like, because it’s me and my good friend, and he’s the fellow producer, and then we’re… we have a… on certain projects, it’ll get up to, like, okay.
357 00:43:51.540 ⇒ 00:44:13.400 Donovan Griffin: 25, 50 crew members, if you’re including posts, and, like, you know, 50 or whatever. But, but, like, it’s just… besides that, it’s like, we don’t need it. We just keep… we, you know, keep going until… and eventually, start, start growing it internally, but for now, we’re… we’re… we’ve been very busy. Exactly.
358 00:44:13.400 ⇒ 00:44:13.920 Uttam Kumaran: Bye.
359 00:44:13.920 ⇒ 00:44:14.870 Donovan Griffin: Heck yeah.
360 00:44:14.870 ⇒ 00:44:16.320 Uttam Kumaran: Alright, man. Appreciate it.
361 00:44:16.320 ⇒ 00:44:28.700 Donovan Griffin: So nice meeting you, yeah. Have a great one, it was so nice talking with you, and yeah, let’s talk again soon. And let me know, too, feel free to text me with anything, and always happy to talk to and even consult, so just let me know.
362 00:44:28.700 ⇒ 00:44:29.870 Uttam Kumaran: Perfect.
363 00:44:29.870 ⇒ 00:44:31.160 Donovan Griffin: Appreciate it. Thank you so much.
364 00:44:31.160 ⇒ 00:44:32.960 Uttam Kumaran: Have a great day. Bye. Bye.