Meeting Title: Platform Weekly Sync Date: 2026-02-02 Meeting participants: Gabriel Lam, Uttam Kumaran
WEBVTT
1 00:00:14.870 ⇒ 00:00:16.890 Uttam Kumaran: Hey, sir. How are you?
2 00:00:17.560 ⇒ 00:00:18.620 Gabriel Lam: Good, how are you?
3 00:00:19.050 ⇒ 00:00:20.669 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, dude, how was the weekend?
4 00:00:21.530 ⇒ 00:00:24.060 Gabriel Lam: I got sick. Again.
5 00:00:25.610 ⇒ 00:00:27.999 Gabriel Lam: I don’t know what happened, dude. It’s like…
6 00:00:28.460 ⇒ 00:00:29.070 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, sorry.
7 00:00:32.000 ⇒ 00:00:39.190 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, I… I had, like, cold sores for the first time in years, and I’m like, dude, holy crap.
8 00:00:39.190 ⇒ 00:00:42.789 Uttam Kumaran: Maybe it’s just because it’s still… it’s been so cold for a while?
9 00:00:43.200 ⇒ 00:00:54.749 Gabriel Lam: I have no idea, but I took some more medication, and then… yeah, apparently the flu this year is pretty bad. My girlfriend had the same thing. She was like, I lost… like, she lost her voice for a couple days, so…
10 00:00:54.750 ⇒ 00:00:57.560 Uttam Kumaran: Oh my god, no way. Yeah, dude.
11 00:00:57.740 ⇒ 00:01:01.629 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, but other than that, I just sort of rested. How about you?
12 00:01:02.290 ⇒ 00:01:07.210 Uttam Kumaran: It was good, I, like, I made a lot of progress on the weekend. I mean, I was telling Robert, like.
13 00:01:07.530 ⇒ 00:01:17.169 Uttam Kumaran: I’m, like, I’m, like, actually, like, a nerd, dude, so, like, I… this is, like, what I like to do, that’s, like… my job is so non-nerdy, though, these days, it sucks.
14 00:01:17.390 ⇒ 00:01:21.820 Uttam Kumaran: Like, all I do is, like, business shit, which is, like, the worst, like…
15 00:01:22.850 ⇒ 00:01:27.389 Uttam Kumaran: I’m good, I’m getting really good at it, like, cosplaying as a business person, but like…
16 00:01:27.690 ⇒ 00:01:31.210 Uttam Kumaran: just, like, so uninteresting compared to the AI stuff.
17 00:01:31.780 ⇒ 00:01:33.889 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, you literally want to tinker.
18 00:01:34.080 ⇒ 00:01:41.470 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I’m really pumped that I got time to do that, and I got to, like, time to, like, kind of push the limits of, like, what I thought I could do on my own, and…
19 00:01:41.680 ⇒ 00:01:51.390 Uttam Kumaran: naturally, like, learning, okay, like, how do I take that and… and help others, you know? So, I think I’m a good guinea pig, as I mentioned in the morning, which is, like.
20 00:01:51.530 ⇒ 00:01:55.540 Uttam Kumaran: I think I’m a good guinea pig for the AI team to be, like, support
21 00:01:55.870 ⇒ 00:01:59.440 Uttam Kumaran: My, like, development process, and then we figure out, like, how does that…
22 00:02:00.230 ⇒ 00:02:05.410 Uttam Kumaran: scale to others who may be less prepared or less enabled, you know? So…
23 00:02:05.660 ⇒ 00:02:11.390 Uttam Kumaran: I thought it was awesome. I mean, I think more of my mind now is going to, like, okay, how can I work…
24 00:02:11.660 ⇒ 00:02:17.409 Uttam Kumaran: best, like, what the thing I continue to lack is, sort of, time during the week, you know, and so…
25 00:02:17.470 ⇒ 00:02:20.110 Gabriel Lam: More of my thought process as I, like.
26 00:02:20.180 ⇒ 00:02:25.049 Uttam Kumaran: Continue to iterate on, like, okay, how do we keep Getting adoption up is, like.
27 00:02:25.310 ⇒ 00:02:35.080 Uttam Kumaran: maybe, like, a good way to collaborate is, like, I’m gonna be able to ship these features out, like, I’m getting better, but it’s actually the adoption piece that I think our team needs, like.
28 00:02:35.200 ⇒ 00:02:39.439 Uttam Kumaran: Just needs, like, seminars and, like, more hand-holding to do so.
29 00:02:39.770 ⇒ 00:02:45.619 Uttam Kumaran: And I wonder if, like, that’s a good way… That’s a good way…
30 00:02:46.100 ⇒ 00:02:52.470 Uttam Kumaran: for you to be involved is that, like, I’m gonna get the features out, and some…
31 00:02:52.610 ⇒ 00:03:00.360 Uttam Kumaran: case, but for example, like, one good use case is, like, I shipped a HubSpot MCP and API, but everybody needs to go set that up.
32 00:03:00.530 ⇒ 00:03:06.479 Uttam Kumaran: And so, I wonder if, like, a good thing is, like, I can show you how to do it, and then…
33 00:03:06.480 ⇒ 00:03:08.799 Gabriel Lam: And then I can just start up a webinar kind of thing, yeah.
34 00:03:08.800 ⇒ 00:03:18.829 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, and then it’s actually more… gives you the ability to actually own what is the crucial point here, which is, like, the learn… like, almost like an L&D-type
35 00:03:18.990 ⇒ 00:03:31.509 Uttam Kumaran: set up at Brainforge? Like, how does everybody start to onboard these tools, and how does some of the ergonomics of what’s affecting the people on the ground end up back to, like, me and you and Sam?
36 00:03:31.630 ⇒ 00:03:33.739 Uttam Kumaran: To, like, change the system, right?
37 00:03:33.980 ⇒ 00:03:38.759 Uttam Kumaran: And I actually think, like, that’s a great…
38 00:03:39.440 ⇒ 00:03:44.510 Uttam Kumaran: like, that’s kind of, like, what I feel like immediately is where… I feel like…
39 00:03:44.860 ⇒ 00:03:48.269 Uttam Kumaran: Are, like, you can support, and, like, our… the team needs help.
40 00:03:48.680 ⇒ 00:04:02.720 Uttam Kumaran: Because I’m able to get this stuff out, I feel confident, but, like, I can’t get the adoption, it’s really hard. And we still have people that aren’t using Cursor and things like that, and so I’m almost like, if we tag-team it in that way, it may be more effective than
41 00:04:03.190 ⇒ 00:04:06.270 Uttam Kumaran: Both of us shipping, or both of us trying to teach.
42 00:04:06.800 ⇒ 00:04:10.009 Uttam Kumaran: Because I do think that they’re very different skill sets.
43 00:04:11.940 ⇒ 00:04:13.250 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, what do you think?
44 00:04:14.360 ⇒ 00:04:17.089 Gabriel Lam: I’m with you there, I think…
45 00:04:18.100 ⇒ 00:04:19.500 Gabriel Lam: I think there’s a couple of…
46 00:04:19.750 ⇒ 00:04:24.780 Gabriel Lam: I’ll step back a bit, and I’ll… and sort of think out loud.
47 00:04:25.070 ⇒ 00:04:27.349 Gabriel Lam: I’m with you in that the…
48 00:04:30.210 ⇒ 00:04:36.039 Gabriel Lam: adoption is the hard part. I think a big part of that has been when talking to people, they’re like.
49 00:04:36.450 ⇒ 00:04:49.260 Gabriel Lam: is there, like, a standard way of doing things, or what… how can I expect to use this? I think that hasn’t really been set up yet, and I think through conversations with, like, the different leads, it’s getting clearer, but…
50 00:04:50.560 ⇒ 00:04:51.110 Gabriel Lam: I think.
51 00:04:51.110 ⇒ 00:04:53.910 Uttam Kumaran: But do you feel like, in your heart, do you feel that…
52 00:04:54.070 ⇒ 00:05:00.580 Uttam Kumaran: that’s just a way for people to continue to kick the can, because ultimately, what I think is happening is people are just not
53 00:05:00.980 ⇒ 00:05:05.650 Uttam Kumaran: like… People are not giving it a go in their spare time.
54 00:05:05.910 ⇒ 00:05:10.390 Uttam Kumaran: And they’re not getting to the moment of, like, aha, you know? It’s like, why…
55 00:05:10.650 ⇒ 00:05:12.419 Uttam Kumaran: what I feel like, because
56 00:05:12.670 ⇒ 00:05:16.850 Uttam Kumaran: Some people are saying that, but then I’m like, yo, have you even tried to do anything?
57 00:05:16.990 ⇒ 00:05:22.629 Uttam Kumaran: They’re like, no, it’s on my list, blah blah blah, and I’m like, just pull it up right now. And then I walk them through, and they’re like, oh.
58 00:05:23.190 ⇒ 00:05:25.240 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, I get it, you know?
59 00:05:25.240 ⇒ 00:05:26.360 Gabriel Lam: Mmm…
60 00:05:26.800 ⇒ 00:05:28.040 Uttam Kumaran: It’s what I’m seeing.
61 00:05:28.260 ⇒ 00:05:29.110 Uttam Kumaran: Because…
62 00:05:29.110 ⇒ 00:05:29.740 Gabriel Lam: Interesting.
63 00:05:29.740 ⇒ 00:05:36.759 Uttam Kumaran: part of me wanted to trust them, that, like, okay, people are just… but then, I fundamentally think that people are just not taking the time.
64 00:05:36.900 ⇒ 00:05:40.339 Uttam Kumaran: And so, what I realized is, like, okay, let’s keep
65 00:05:40.460 ⇒ 00:05:48.899 Uttam Kumaran: if I just… if I’m on a call with somebody, I’m like, yo, pull up Cursor, let’s go through it, and they do it, and they’re like, holy shit. And I’m like, yes!
66 00:05:49.130 ⇒ 00:05:50.980 Uttam Kumaran: Exactly!
67 00:05:51.750 ⇒ 00:06:08.599 Uttam Kumaran: You know, and I actually just think that people have not stopped doing that, because I catch them. I’m like, well, just, let’s do it right now. I, like, have… they’re like, oh, no, and I’m like, no, dude, I’m making the time. Let’s go through it right now. And then it ends up being, like, super, super positive for them overall.
68 00:06:10.500 ⇒ 00:06:13.169 Gabriel Lam: Okay, yeah,
69 00:06:13.560 ⇒ 00:06:19.770 Gabriel Lam: I wonder if there’s… I think this is something that I’m… I can do, is just also… more…
70 00:06:20.920 ⇒ 00:06:25.980 Gabriel Lam: I wonder if this is something that we can include into… Right.
71 00:06:25.980 ⇒ 00:06:33.500 Uttam Kumaran: I think naturally, like, it would be better… it would be better if we’re like, hey, go into Cursor and just say, help me get set up, and then we could do it, but like…
72 00:06:33.730 ⇒ 00:06:38.730 Uttam Kumaran: Again, I think part of that learning is gonna be on, like, some people are just stubborn.
73 00:06:39.410 ⇒ 00:06:43.260 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, there’s, like, the mental leap of, like, even opening the programming, like.
74 00:06:43.260 ⇒ 00:06:48.829 Uttam Kumaran: Yes, yes, which is so, like, which is so crazy to me, but it’s what I’m seeing.
75 00:06:49.290 ⇒ 00:06:50.670 Gabriel Lam: Mmm…
76 00:06:52.210 ⇒ 00:07:01.099 Uttam Kumaran: Like, it doesn’t make any sense to me, but again, like, I just… I don’t know. Yeah. It doesn’t compute for my brain, but it… that’s what I’m… that’s what I’m seeing, you know?
77 00:07:01.970 ⇒ 00:07:11.049 Gabriel Lam: Hmm, okay. Yeah, I… it reminds me of something I talked to Clarence about. I’ll reach out to him, right after this call, just because I think he had brought something up about
78 00:07:11.220 ⇒ 00:07:18.230 Gabriel Lam: how… and I think Shashu also mentioned something super earlier about, like, not only holding office hours, but, like, how to get people to actually come.
79 00:07:19.300 ⇒ 00:07:21.599 Uttam Kumaran: Well, part of it is, like, at some point.
80 00:07:21.920 ⇒ 00:07:26.689 Uttam Kumaran: you’re gonna be… like, at some point, I have to make a decision on when to require.
81 00:07:27.130 ⇒ 00:07:27.580 Gabriel Lam: Yeah.
82 00:07:27.850 ⇒ 00:07:33.329 Uttam Kumaran: Like, as a leader, at what point are we losing? Because I’m not requiring
83 00:07:34.110 ⇒ 00:07:43.820 Uttam Kumaran: our team to do it. Like, I’m not forcing them, I’m not calling people out because they’re not using it, right? At what point? Because we’ve done everything to try, except
84 00:07:44.140 ⇒ 00:07:46.559 Uttam Kumaran: Like, literally pull people’s hands there.
85 00:07:46.560 ⇒ 00:07:47.460 Gabriel Lam: requirement.
86 00:07:47.920 ⇒ 00:07:52.220 Uttam Kumaran: And I don’t want to do that until we’ve literally given… tried everything.
87 00:07:52.990 ⇒ 00:07:53.640 Gabriel Lam: Yup.
88 00:07:53.640 ⇒ 00:08:03.470 Uttam Kumaran: Which I feel like… and the thing is, the moment I show them, they’re like, oh my god, and they’re like, they’re in it, you know? But it has been, like, finding this moment of, like.
89 00:08:03.840 ⇒ 00:08:06.310 Uttam Kumaran: Showing them, okay, just try it, you know?
90 00:08:07.100 ⇒ 00:08:07.970 Gabriel Lam: Hmm.
91 00:08:08.310 ⇒ 00:08:09.140 Uttam Kumaran: So…
92 00:08:10.990 ⇒ 00:08:22.490 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t know, that’s kind of, like, what I wanted to discuss today, because I actually feel comfortable, like, for example, I mean, that way, you can come to me and be like, okay, this team, they love it, but they need this feature, and I’ll get it out.
93 00:08:23.010 ⇒ 00:08:26.340 Uttam Kumaran: Okay. I’ll just bang… I’ll just bang it out, and then…
94 00:08:26.840 ⇒ 00:08:34.279 Uttam Kumaran: That way, we’re not… both of us aren’t focused on building and getting adoption at the same time, and they’re both, like, I think.
95 00:08:34.970 ⇒ 00:08:35.850 Uttam Kumaran: I mean.
96 00:08:35.970 ⇒ 00:08:40.980 Uttam Kumaran: I’m able to build now, but I’m starting to learn, like, how difficult it was, and I’m fixing stuff.
97 00:08:41.120 ⇒ 00:08:52.920 Uttam Kumaran: And then eventually, like, we kind of think about it, like, almost like a… like a level course. Like, I think the, like, intro to Cursor is just, like, intro to how to even just, like, use AI.
98 00:08:52.920 ⇒ 00:09:03.610 Uttam Kumaran: Then, as I figure out how to build more, we can actually probably just, like, teach people that. Like, the most enabled people can learn how to build, and then there’s gonna be, like, levels, you know, of, like.
99 00:09:04.500 ⇒ 00:09:05.980 Uttam Kumaran: Of how people grow.
100 00:09:07.480 ⇒ 00:09:12.119 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, I almost imagine, like, you know, as you’re building, just leave the loom on, let it…
101 00:09:12.510 ⇒ 00:09:13.030 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
102 00:09:13.030 ⇒ 00:09:20.750 Gabriel Lam: and then, like, cut down as needed. Like, you can… you can get the raw file, and then, like, either I can go in or someone else can go in and just.
103 00:09:20.750 ⇒ 00:09:26.770 Uttam Kumaran: There’s a lot of things that I have to deal with… had to deal with on Saturday that I was like, nobody would have been able to, like…
104 00:09:27.150 ⇒ 00:09:38.040 Uttam Kumaran: People would have just stopped, because this was too hard. So those are the things I’m, like, trying to just bust through. And then, for example, like, what if we have 10 PRs a day? Like, okay, Sam needs to figure that out.
105 00:09:38.160 ⇒ 00:09:41.830 Uttam Kumaran: So, I want to spearhead the figuring out part.
106 00:09:41.980 ⇒ 00:09:44.099 Uttam Kumaran: For… for our team.
107 00:09:44.280 ⇒ 00:09:46.080 Uttam Kumaran: So they don’t have to deal with it.
108 00:09:46.260 ⇒ 00:09:52.949 Uttam Kumaran: Because some stuff is not clear. But, can I give you an example? Like, today, I’m on my desktop, and I wanted to set up HubSpot.
109 00:09:53.250 ⇒ 00:09:56.900 Uttam Kumaran: the MCP, and so all I did was I went into Cursor, I said, hey.
110 00:09:57.040 ⇒ 00:10:01.409 Uttam Kumaran: Set up HubSpot. It’s in the… it’s in playbooks, how to do it, and it did it.
111 00:10:01.520 ⇒ 00:10:02.259 Uttam Kumaran: And I was like.
112 00:10:02.260 ⇒ 00:10:03.120 Gabriel Lam: Holy shit.
113 00:10:03.390 ⇒ 00:10:07.099 Uttam Kumaran: That was, like, exactly how we hoped this was gonna go, you know?
114 00:10:07.100 ⇒ 00:10:08.570 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, yeah.
115 00:10:08.920 ⇒ 00:10:13.759 Gabriel Lam: I had that same experience with a Google Workspace MCP, and I was like, holy crap, this is incredible.
116 00:10:13.760 ⇒ 00:10:15.409 Uttam Kumaran: It’s working, right? Like, the way we.
117 00:10:15.410 ⇒ 00:10:15.800 Gabriel Lam: set up.
118 00:10:15.800 ⇒ 00:10:22.409 Uttam Kumaran: The markdown files and things, like, okay, we just removed that, like, cognitive… cognitive overhead.
119 00:10:22.980 ⇒ 00:10:24.020 Uttam Kumaran: And…
120 00:10:24.630 ⇒ 00:10:32.139 Uttam Kumaran: So, like, those are the things that I… but can I give you an example? It’s like, even though I had it to work, I don’t know if everybody on sales is gonna use it.
121 00:10:32.290 ⇒ 00:10:32.799 Uttam Kumaran: And I think.
122 00:10:32.800 ⇒ 00:10:33.339 Gabriel Lam: Try to tell you.
123 00:10:33.340 ⇒ 00:10:35.919 Uttam Kumaran: I told them this… we just had a sales meeting. I told them.
124 00:10:36.120 ⇒ 00:10:38.270 Uttam Kumaran: Try to use it, try to use it, but, like…
125 00:10:38.750 ⇒ 00:10:41.369 Uttam Kumaran: I just have a feeling they’re not, and I’m like.
126 00:10:41.870 ⇒ 00:10:43.900 Uttam Kumaran: Like, what do I do? Like…
127 00:10:44.440 ⇒ 00:10:54.149 Uttam Kumaran: I can go carrot or stick on this one. I’m like… and I don’t want to do stick, ever. I really want people to kind of get to the point where they understand why we’re pushing it, you know?
128 00:10:54.910 ⇒ 00:10:55.360 Gabriel Lam: Yeah.
129 00:10:55.360 ⇒ 00:11:02.810 Uttam Kumaran: And we have to kind of give you a similar example. On the data analysis side, I know a lot of people aren’t using the Snowflake CLI to access data.
130 00:11:03.190 ⇒ 00:11:06.669 Uttam Kumaran: But, like, we’re missing out, they should be, and so I’m, like, figuring out, like.
131 00:11:06.870 ⇒ 00:11:09.009 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, how do we think about that, you know?
132 00:11:16.600 ⇒ 00:11:18.350 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, like, my… yeah.
133 00:11:23.900 ⇒ 00:11:29.459 Gabriel Lam: First thought would just be, like, how do you… How do you handhold them?
134 00:11:31.050 ⇒ 00:11:33.910 Gabriel Lam: Like, what is the easiest lift to hand-holding them?
135 00:11:34.980 ⇒ 00:11:39.759 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I’m, like, wondering, like, what the immediate thing is, is, like, Should you focus on…
136 00:11:39.990 ⇒ 00:11:42.399 Uttam Kumaran: The team that’s, like, the furthest away.
137 00:11:43.050 ⇒ 00:11:48.730 Uttam Kumaran: Because ultimately, we want to think about something that maybe scales, but, like, dude, I don’t know, like, schools…
138 00:11:48.900 ⇒ 00:11:56.760 Uttam Kumaran: like, there’s a reason why remote schooling doesn’t work. Like, some people still are, like, you know, like, self-learning is tough, like, some people still maybe just need
139 00:11:58.320 ⇒ 00:12:03.419 Uttam Kumaran: they need to just do it with you, and they need, like, your calm voice to help them get through it, I don’t know.
140 00:12:03.420 ⇒ 00:12:05.739 Gabriel Lam: Which I think.
141 00:12:05.740 ⇒ 00:12:09.820 Uttam Kumaran: It’s hard, it’s hard for me, because I’m just not wired that way, like, I just will go…
142 00:12:10.410 ⇒ 00:12:12.310 Uttam Kumaran: I’ll just go try things.
143 00:12:12.460 ⇒ 00:12:16.419 Uttam Kumaran: You know, so it’s… I’m almost like, yo, I just gave you, like.
144 00:12:16.840 ⇒ 00:12:19.599 Uttam Kumaran: I just gave you, like, the ultimate cheat sheet, like.
145 00:12:19.830 ⇒ 00:12:22.479 Uttam Kumaran: how do you know, how are people not seeing that? And so I’m like.
146 00:12:23.570 ⇒ 00:12:27.749 Uttam Kumaran: What is working, though, is, like, if I go to people and tell them directly to use it.
147 00:12:28.010 ⇒ 00:12:31.970 Uttam Kumaran: and then I walk them through, like, a use case, then they’re like, okay, I get it now.
148 00:12:32.390 ⇒ 00:12:33.310 Uttam Kumaran: So…
149 00:12:35.850 ⇒ 00:12:36.620 Gabriel Lam: Hmm.
150 00:12:37.060 ⇒ 00:12:40.779 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, I mean, that might just be what it is, I think.
151 00:12:41.160 ⇒ 00:12:49.720 Gabriel Lam: Well, I’m happy to lead that initiative, right? I mean, it’s similar to, I think, what people have shared, what Clarence and Shishu have shared before about their experiences.
152 00:12:49.830 ⇒ 00:13:00.380 Gabriel Lam: And, like, basically organizing sessions that I think are gonna be tougher at the beginning.
153 00:13:00.760 ⇒ 00:13:05.399 Gabriel Lam: just because… We want to have the right…
154 00:13:06.290 ⇒ 00:13:12.520 Gabriel Lam: I think on our end, it’s like, what is the material that we want to present? And then for them, it’s like, we also…
155 00:13:12.660 ⇒ 00:13:15.280 Gabriel Lam: Or I would also want to figure out, like, what is…
156 00:13:16.210 ⇒ 00:13:24.260 Gabriel Lam: the material that they want to see, like, you know, the things that they’re doing for sales is probably going to be different for analytics and…
157 00:13:24.540 ⇒ 00:13:35.670 Gabriel Lam: I’m like, okay, you know, if I’m talking to analytics, then I’m like, okay, this is how you set up Snowflake, but aside from that, like, are there certain things about Snowflake that you guys are trying to use? Like, they’re figuring that part out.
158 00:13:38.520 ⇒ 00:13:38.860 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
159 00:13:38.860 ⇒ 00:13:42.040 Gabriel Lam: I think I just imagined, like, okay, maybe… maybe…
160 00:13:42.640 ⇒ 00:13:45.749 Gabriel Lam: Fridays or something? Just, like, a weekly…
161 00:13:47.790 ⇒ 00:13:51.739 Gabriel Lam: session, where I just, like, hop in a call with each of these different groups.
162 00:13:52.060 ⇒ 00:13:55.109 Gabriel Lam: I’m just like, alright guys, like, what are you guys doing this week?
163 00:13:56.470 ⇒ 00:14:03.280 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, I wonder how I can help you prep for that, like, maybe, like, you can come to the table with a few use cases, and you’re like, hey, we’re all gonna, like.
164 00:14:03.550 ⇒ 00:14:07.059 Uttam Kumaran: Try to, like, access HubSpot today.
165 00:14:07.690 ⇒ 00:14:09.600 Uttam Kumaran: Maybe, or something, I don’t know.
166 00:14:12.030 ⇒ 00:14:16.000 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, I mean, I think… I think that’s not a… Bad idea.
167 00:14:16.810 ⇒ 00:14:19.840 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, I think I can reach out and just figure out, like, who…
168 00:14:26.130 ⇒ 00:14:26.490 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, but…
169 00:14:26.490 ⇒ 00:14:27.330 Gabriel Lam: per user.
170 00:14:27.330 ⇒ 00:14:32.660 Uttam Kumaran: The problem is, is, like, sometimes if you do with, like, a big group, like, half the people aren’t gonna be paying attention, so…
171 00:14:33.050 ⇒ 00:14:35.460 Uttam Kumaran: I’m almost like, maybe you take, like…
172 00:14:36.530 ⇒ 00:14:39.869 Uttam Kumaran: Maybe you just take, like, 2 people or 3 people at a time.
173 00:14:40.150 ⇒ 00:14:40.620 Gabriel Lam: Yeah.
174 00:14:40.620 ⇒ 00:14:41.549 Uttam Kumaran: once a week.
175 00:14:42.400 ⇒ 00:14:44.530 Uttam Kumaran: And you just work your way through the company.
176 00:14:45.590 ⇒ 00:14:47.270 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, I, I, I mean…
177 00:14:47.270 ⇒ 00:14:49.530 Uttam Kumaran: tip everybody on AI team, and…
178 00:14:49.940 ⇒ 00:14:53.420 Uttam Kumaran: Or what we could do is we could go… we could start with the people that are
179 00:14:53.550 ⇒ 00:14:55.309 Uttam Kumaran: Using it the least, you know?
180 00:14:58.240 ⇒ 00:14:59.170 Gabriel Lam: Mmm.
181 00:15:00.550 ⇒ 00:15:02.779 Uttam Kumaran: Look, I can give you the culprits, basically.
182 00:15:05.090 ⇒ 00:15:09.619 Gabriel Lam: I’m also thinking through, like, what… I mean, yeah, yeah.
183 00:15:20.670 ⇒ 00:15:38.639 Gabriel Lam: I think it could be both. It’s, like, of the three people I meet a week, like, maybe one… one person, or… let’s say five people. Of the 5 people that I meet this week, it’s, like, two people are low-hanging fruit, and then, like, two people are culprits, and then one person is, like, a wild card. So I think it’s… I think it is just, like, a sort of…
184 00:15:40.540 ⇒ 00:15:47.040 Gabriel Lam: consistency, and I think once people Are in close proximity.
185 00:15:47.150 ⇒ 00:15:50.689 Gabriel Lam: to tools, and they’re like, okay, you know, if…
186 00:15:51.340 ⇒ 00:15:52.440 Uttam Kumaran: It’s blank.
187 00:15:52.630 ⇒ 00:15:57.660 Gabriel Lam: I see, you know, Luke doing something really quickly. I’m like, how’d you do it that quickly? Then…
188 00:15:57.870 ⇒ 00:15:59.580 Gabriel Lam: I think that’s another…
189 00:15:59.580 ⇒ 00:16:00.560 Uttam Kumaran: layer.
190 00:16:01.880 ⇒ 00:16:02.680 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
191 00:16:03.230 ⇒ 00:16:09.050 Gabriel Lam: So I… I think that’s a good idea. I think it will just be a slower start, where…
192 00:16:10.800 ⇒ 00:16:14.820 Gabriel Lam: Especially for people who aren’t using it now, it’s just, like.
193 00:16:15.110 ⇒ 00:16:19.150 Gabriel Lam: Getting them through the hurdle of just, like, okay, what…
194 00:16:19.680 ⇒ 00:16:23.560 Gabriel Lam: is stopping you? Or, like, what is not getting through to you?
195 00:16:24.590 ⇒ 00:16:30.790 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, and I actually think, like, I’m… I care a lot… I care a little bit less about scaling?
196 00:16:32.140 ⇒ 00:16:34.350 Uttam Kumaran: As much as I care about it working.
197 00:16:35.050 ⇒ 00:16:40.599 Uttam Kumaran: You know, because maybe it is that we just have to spend… every person needs two sessions before they…
198 00:16:40.960 ⇒ 00:16:42.960 Uttam Kumaran: They figure it out, and okay, fine.
199 00:16:43.890 ⇒ 00:16:44.230 Gabriel Lam: Yeah.
200 00:16:44.230 ⇒ 00:16:47.089 Uttam Kumaran: Like, that’s… that’s just the cost right now.
201 00:16:47.870 ⇒ 00:16:55.520 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, and I think if it does scale, it might just be… it could eventually shift to, like, one session is to onboard
202 00:16:55.830 ⇒ 00:17:03.809 Gabriel Lam: Generally, and then the other session, as people get more used to it, they can start meeting, like, hey, you know, sales has their own, like, use cases, and then someone
203 00:17:04.150 ⇒ 00:17:15.410 Gabriel Lam: Like, a super user on sales can then lead that other… that follow-up session, or someone on analytics can lead that follow-up. I think that’s something we could do, but I think… I’m happy to take up that, like, initial…
204 00:17:17.020 ⇒ 00:17:23.780 Uttam Kumaran: Because that way you can surface up to me, too, that, like, oh, this thing is really… this thing, like, didn’t work, or, like, this was much harder, like, we have to figure this out.
205 00:17:23.970 ⇒ 00:17:28.640 Uttam Kumaran: Because I’m not going to be able to have the on-the-ground Feedback as much.
206 00:17:28.950 ⇒ 00:17:31.110 Uttam Kumaran: Like, I’m like, yo, this thing works, like…
207 00:17:31.380 ⇒ 00:17:35.200 Uttam Kumaran: It’s ready, go, next thing, next thing, because we have such a backlog of shit.
208 00:17:35.320 ⇒ 00:17:36.270 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
209 00:17:39.270 ⇒ 00:17:44.500 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, I also saw your note about, like, the personalized dashboard.
210 00:17:44.500 ⇒ 00:17:45.620 Uttam Kumaran: Platform.
211 00:17:45.620 ⇒ 00:17:49.849 Gabriel Lam: dashboard. Like, I’ve been thinking of that for a while, and I’m like, I have no idea what that looks like.
212 00:17:49.970 ⇒ 00:17:51.050 Gabriel Lam: And…
213 00:17:51.760 ⇒ 00:17:58.090 Gabriel Lam: I don’t want it to be just, like, linear and, you know. So, that’s been on my mind for a while. I’m still sort of.
214 00:17:58.090 ⇒ 00:18:05.170 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, so that’s the thing for me, it’s like, if I can get the first version of things out, that’s all I’m doing, then it’s easy to build on top of it.
215 00:18:05.430 ⇒ 00:18:10.279 Uttam Kumaran: You know… So that’s, like, what I’m trying, is I’m just getting the first versions of things out.
216 00:18:10.740 ⇒ 00:18:18.410 Uttam Kumaran: And then as people use it and it gets… we get feedback, it’s… then I can go to the person and be like, well, why don’t you try to ship that? Like, just go ask Cursor to build it.
217 00:18:19.000 ⇒ 00:18:19.670 Gabriel Lam: Yeah.
218 00:18:20.090 ⇒ 00:18:20.700 Uttam Kumaran: -
219 00:18:25.400 ⇒ 00:18:26.950 Gabriel Lam: Okay, yeah.
220 00:18:28.010 ⇒ 00:18:36.089 Gabriel Lam: I do think the… I mean, I was also facing struggles, especially deploying
221 00:18:37.520 ⇒ 00:18:41.079 Gabriel Lam: I think if you just ask her, sir, there’s still certain…
222 00:18:41.080 ⇒ 00:18:42.710 Uttam Kumaran: There’s still a huge gap, yeah.
223 00:18:42.710 ⇒ 00:18:46.969 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, there’s still a gap of, like, understanding why cursor…
224 00:18:47.390 ⇒ 00:18:53.849 Gabriel Lam: does things a certain way, and so, like, I still have to go to, like, Sam and Casey. I’m like, okay, I’m getting this weird…
225 00:18:54.890 ⇒ 00:19:00.080 Gabriel Lam: error, like… what’s going on? How is it fitting in with what you guys are seeing? And so…
226 00:19:00.080 ⇒ 00:19:00.740 Uttam Kumaran: -
227 00:19:01.630 ⇒ 00:19:07.689 Gabriel Lam: I think there is… there’s gonna be, like, oh, okay, we can get them to ship their features, and it might be, like.
228 00:19:08.610 ⇒ 00:19:12.369 Gabriel Lam: it might start as PRDs, and like, hey, this is what I want to do. And we’re like, great.
229 00:19:13.430 ⇒ 00:19:17.390 Gabriel Lam: And you can start thinking of, like, features as more than just, you know, some sort of.
230 00:19:17.390 ⇒ 00:19:17.720 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
231 00:19:17.720 ⇒ 00:19:24.209 Gabriel Lam: imaginary thing. And it might be just a sort of piecemeal, like, okay, from feet, we have the…
232 00:19:24.440 ⇒ 00:19:26.509 Gabriel Lam: like, the AI team’s able to ship out.
233 00:19:26.820 ⇒ 00:19:28.849 Gabriel Lam: like, V0s or MDPs.
234 00:19:28.990 ⇒ 00:19:32.120 Gabriel Lam: And then people can build, like, PRDs and features on top of that.
235 00:19:32.220 ⇒ 00:19:37.289 Gabriel Lam: And then once people get comfortable, or if there’s, like, a maybe general understanding of
236 00:19:37.580 ⇒ 00:19:40.819 Gabriel Lam: What a feature looks like, or how to actually deliver one, then…
237 00:19:41.460 ⇒ 00:19:45.150 Gabriel Lam: we’ll get there. And I think what we talked about today with, like, code owners.
238 00:19:46.040 ⇒ 00:19:49.849 Gabriel Lam: And, like, if there’s a, like, branch,
239 00:19:50.440 ⇒ 00:19:55.309 Gabriel Lam: permissions, then I don’t think… I think that won’t be a problem.
240 00:19:55.310 ⇒ 00:19:56.050 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
241 00:19:56.050 ⇒ 00:19:57.609 Gabriel Lam: then I don’t think that’ll be a problem.
242 00:19:58.510 ⇒ 00:19:59.670 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I agree.
243 00:20:00.680 ⇒ 00:20:01.780 Uttam Kumaran: Exactly.
244 00:20:02.170 ⇒ 00:20:04.500 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, it’s just, like, locking certain things.
245 00:20:04.660 ⇒ 00:20:07.989 Gabriel Lam: from direct commits from Maine.
246 00:20:10.950 ⇒ 00:20:15.330 Gabriel Lam: Okay, yeah, I… I like where that’s going. I’m happy… I’m happy with that.
247 00:20:15.330 ⇒ 00:20:19.759 Uttam Kumaran: So, do you want to try to rip one, like, Friday? Should we just talk about, like, who you want to include?
248 00:20:22.650 ⇒ 00:20:31.380 Gabriel Lam: Who you want to conclude in terms of, like, who’s in that That, like, code owner list?
249 00:20:31.670 ⇒ 00:20:32.949 Uttam Kumaran: No, no, no, like, a walkthrough session.
250 00:20:32.950 ⇒ 00:20:33.330 Gabriel Lam: Or…
251 00:20:33.330 ⇒ 00:20:34.070 Uttam Kumaran: product.
252 00:20:34.650 ⇒ 00:20:42.789 Gabriel Lam: Oh, yeah, I’m happy to do that on Friday. It seems to me…
253 00:20:48.350 ⇒ 00:20:49.639 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, I would probably…
254 00:20:49.640 ⇒ 00:20:50.050 Uttam Kumaran: Probably, like.
255 00:20:50.050 ⇒ 00:20:51.980 Gabriel Lam: visibility… sorry, go on.
256 00:20:52.370 ⇒ 00:20:57.469 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I feel like sales… are the ones… sales are the folks that are, like, the least…
257 00:20:57.830 ⇒ 00:21:03.269 Uttam Kumaran: enabled right now, but I also know that there’s still some people on delivery that aren’t using it that heavily.
258 00:21:04.960 ⇒ 00:21:06.300 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I think…
259 00:21:07.140 ⇒ 00:21:14.870 Gabriel Lam: my sentiment is I… And least connected to… Sales.
260 00:21:14.990 ⇒ 00:21:19.770 Gabriel Lam: like, what exactly, or how exactly, like, Ryan or Luke
261 00:21:19.960 ⇒ 00:21:24.100 Gabriel Lam: are working on the day-to-day, so whenever I chat to them, they’re like.
262 00:21:24.220 ⇒ 00:21:30.380 Gabriel Lam: there’s still a sort of context switching, and then I also interface leased with, like, the data delivery.
263 00:21:31.110 ⇒ 00:21:33.900 Gabriel Lam: And so, maybe these are great people to…
264 00:21:37.300 ⇒ 00:21:38.829 Gabriel Lam: Like, to start with.
265 00:21:40.320 ⇒ 00:21:40.960 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
266 00:21:47.930 ⇒ 00:21:53.800 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, cool. Alright, I’m gonna run to go prep for the CSO meeting.
267 00:21:53.910 ⇒ 00:22:01.900 Uttam Kumaran: But yeah, I’m down if you want to do that. I mean, as I… as I get more time on Fridays, I’ll probably try to… try to do some of these training sessions as well, so…
268 00:22:02.350 ⇒ 00:22:05.749 Gabriel Lam: Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. I’m hap- like…
269 00:22:06.820 ⇒ 00:22:10.959 Gabriel Lam: as long as we have the information, and, like, if I have a bunch of looms.
270 00:22:11.250 ⇒ 00:22:12.640 Gabriel Lam: To be able to, like.
271 00:22:12.750 ⇒ 00:22:24.719 Gabriel Lam: just run the demo on my, like, on my computer locally, I’m happy to lead the training sessions. It’s… I think it’s just more, like, deep technical execution, where.
272 00:22:25.370 ⇒ 00:22:25.890 Uttam Kumaran: I know, but I actually.
273 00:22:25.890 ⇒ 00:22:26.359 Gabriel Lam: I think it’s.
274 00:22:26.360 ⇒ 00:22:28.139 Uttam Kumaran: Fair that you don’t know
275 00:22:28.260 ⇒ 00:22:35.700 Uttam Kumaran: like, everything, because that’s what you’re… it’s, like, empathizing with them a lot more. Because if I go there, I may be like, oh, just, like.
276 00:22:36.100 ⇒ 00:22:37.830 Uttam Kumaran: It’s just this small thing.
277 00:22:38.250 ⇒ 00:22:43.000 Uttam Kumaran: So, I think maybe if you… if you plan out who you’re gonna demo to, we can work on
278 00:22:43.640 ⇒ 00:22:44.530 Uttam Kumaran: what…
279 00:22:45.540 ⇒ 00:22:50.809 Uttam Kumaran: things you want to demo, and then you can go through them on your laptop and be like, hey, there’s still issues here.
280 00:22:51.630 ⇒ 00:22:52.240 Gabriel Lam: Yeah.
281 00:22:55.340 ⇒ 00:22:57.340 Gabriel Lam: Okay, yeah, I like the sound of that.
282 00:22:57.340 ⇒ 00:22:58.050 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
283 00:22:58.430 ⇒ 00:23:02.140 Gabriel Lam: I’ll… I’ll send a bunch of use cases that I can think of over, I’ll reach out to…
284 00:23:03.260 ⇒ 00:23:04.250 Gabriel Lam: the sales.
285 00:23:04.610 ⇒ 00:23:07.180 Gabriel Lam: I think sales seems to be the most, like.
286 00:23:09.730 ⇒ 00:23:12.279 Gabriel Lam: It’s the biggest bite that we can do.
287 00:23:12.800 ⇒ 00:23:14.619 Gabriel Lam: So I’m proud of them.
288 00:23:19.590 ⇒ 00:23:22.780 Gabriel Lam: Yeah, okay, that sounds good. I… let’s… let’s rip it for Friday.
289 00:23:23.340 ⇒ 00:23:26.010 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, okay, perfect. Alright, thank you, dude.
290 00:23:26.490 ⇒ 00:23:29.910 Gabriel Lam: Alright, I’ll… I’ll give you your time back. Okay.
291 00:23:29.910 ⇒ 00:23:30.240 Uttam Kumaran: ship.
292 00:23:30.240 ⇒ 00:23:32.570 Gabriel Lam: Yeah. Awesome. Thank you.
293 00:23:32.850 ⇒ 00:23:33.640 Uttam Kumaran: Bye.