Meeting Title: Planning: Strategy-Analytics Date: 2025-12-29 Meeting participants: Robert Tseng, Uttam Kumaran
WEBVTT
1 00:02:40.270 ⇒ 00:02:41.230 Uttam Kumaran: Hey, dude.
2 00:02:45.410 ⇒ 00:02:46.240 Robert Tseng: Yay!
3 00:02:46.580 ⇒ 00:02:47.420 Uttam Kumaran: Hey!
4 00:02:47.600 ⇒ 00:02:50.550 Robert Tseng: I was wondering if anybody was gonna come to the…
5 00:02:50.550 ⇒ 00:02:51.990 Uttam Kumaran: It’d be just me and you.
6 00:02:51.990 ⇒ 00:02:52.880 Robert Tseng: Okay.
7 00:02:56.260 ⇒ 00:02:58.400 Uttam Kumaran: How’s everything? Sorry about the bag.
8 00:02:58.400 ⇒ 00:03:03.189 Robert Tseng: Dude, no worries. Wait, so, like, you got… you got yours a day later?
9 00:03:03.190 ⇒ 00:03:04.699 Uttam Kumaran: fly? Who’d you fly with?
10 00:03:04.700 ⇒ 00:03:05.630 Robert Tseng: United.
11 00:03:06.220 ⇒ 00:03:14.269 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, yeah, so… we flew Alaska, but what happened is I went, basically to the,
12 00:03:14.490 ⇒ 00:03:19.869 Uttam Kumaran: like, at the gate, or at baggage claim, I went to, like, the little area that’s, like.
13 00:03:21.030 ⇒ 00:03:24.709 Uttam Kumaran: my bag didn’t come, and there’s a couple of staff there, and then, yeah.
14 00:03:24.930 ⇒ 00:03:29.109 Uttam Kumaran: I got, like, a… basically a little voucher, and…
15 00:03:29.800 ⇒ 00:03:39.140 Uttam Kumaran: kind of like a receipt of acknowledgement that the bag is somewhere, and they ended up calling and found that the person at the, like.
16 00:03:39.520 ⇒ 00:03:46.160 Uttam Kumaran: The person at the bag check who’s supposed to put our bag on the flight just, like, didn’t put my bag on there, so it came through on…
17 00:03:46.330 ⇒ 00:03:48.330 Uttam Kumaran: Like, a flight the next day.
18 00:03:48.330 ⇒ 00:03:48.790 Robert Tseng: Huh.
19 00:03:48.790 ⇒ 00:03:58.619 Uttam Kumaran: And then they… they offered… and this may just be a Bay Area thing, I don’t know, but, like, they said basically that they have a… they work with a logistics company that’ll come drop it off at my house.
20 00:03:59.410 ⇒ 00:03:59.950 Robert Tseng: I see.
21 00:03:59.950 ⇒ 00:04:01.170 Uttam Kumaran: So, yeah.
22 00:04:01.770 ⇒ 00:04:10.029 Robert Tseng: Okay. Yeah, we called… there was a number to call. They didn’t have anybody at BatchCh, because we got them pretty early in the morning. Okay.
23 00:04:10.180 ⇒ 00:04:12.989 Robert Tseng: Yeah, but then similarly, they were just like…
24 00:04:13.850 ⇒ 00:04:18.410 Robert Tseng: Well, actually, I don’t even think they’ve tracked down the bag, we just kind of told them, like, what…
25 00:04:18.589 ⇒ 00:04:25.700 Robert Tseng: What it… what it looked like, and they said they’ll give us updates, so we’re still kind of waiting to know if they even located it.
26 00:04:25.700 ⇒ 00:04:26.960 Uttam Kumaran: Is it just yours?
27 00:04:26.960 ⇒ 00:04:28.999 Robert Tseng: No, it’s all of our check bags.
28 00:04:29.000 ⇒ 00:04:30.329 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, no.
29 00:04:30.330 ⇒ 00:04:32.430 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so we checked in 3 bags.
30 00:04:32.940 ⇒ 00:04:34.580 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, Lord.
31 00:04:34.580 ⇒ 00:04:36.949 Robert Tseng: Thankfully, it’s home, so I have a.
32 00:04:36.950 ⇒ 00:04:37.790 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
33 00:04:37.790 ⇒ 00:04:44.939 Robert Tseng: But I’m most worried about my… my computer. Yeah. Yeah, like, my Mac… my Mac Mini is in my…
34 00:04:44.940 ⇒ 00:04:45.880 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
35 00:04:45.880 ⇒ 00:04:50.120 Robert Tseng: So, I really hope that no one, no one took it. Yeah.
36 00:04:51.630 ⇒ 00:04:55.279 Uttam Kumaran: Well, okay. I mean, it’s probably in the airport, at least.
37 00:04:55.280 ⇒ 00:04:55.990 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
38 00:04:56.380 ⇒ 00:05:01.010 Uttam Kumaran: Like, you know what I started doing a few years ago is I put an AirTag in my.
39 00:05:01.010 ⇒ 00:05:01.840 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
40 00:05:02.180 ⇒ 00:05:02.960 Uttam Kumaran: In my bag.
41 00:05:02.960 ⇒ 00:05:05.839 Robert Tseng: We were just talking about that. We should start, we should start,
42 00:05:05.840 ⇒ 00:05:15.939 Uttam Kumaran: It’s… the batteries lasted a long time, you should just do it. It’s, I just put it in, like… I have one in my, like, work backpack and one in my luggage, and that way, at least, like.
43 00:05:16.110 ⇒ 00:05:19.419 Uttam Kumaran: I saw that it was still in SF, and I’m like, okay.
44 00:05:19.580 ⇒ 00:05:27.829 Uttam Kumaran: It’s… or I saw it was still in Austin, and I’m like, okay, it’s still at the airport. Yeah. It’s not, like, at someone’s house. Yeah.
45 00:05:28.800 ⇒ 00:05:30.349 Uttam Kumaran: You know, so…
46 00:05:30.700 ⇒ 00:05:35.129 Robert Tseng: Yep, that’s on my list of to-dos. We’re gonna buy AirTags.
47 00:05:35.130 ⇒ 00:05:35.700 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
48 00:05:36.930 ⇒ 00:05:37.490 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
49 00:05:39.900 ⇒ 00:05:41.260 Robert Tseng: How are you? How’s the weekend?
50 00:05:41.850 ⇒ 00:05:49.460 Uttam Kumaran: Good, dude. Yeah, last week was great, and then just relaxed, like, the rest of the weekend.
51 00:05:49.460 ⇒ 00:05:49.800 Robert Tseng: Nice.
52 00:05:49.800 ⇒ 00:05:55.560 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, Clarence came over, and we got a bunch done on Saturday,
53 00:05:56.390 ⇒ 00:05:57.780 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, that’s kind of it, just like…
54 00:05:57.780 ⇒ 00:06:01.739 Robert Tseng: Is he in, like… he’s not in Austin, right?
55 00:06:01.740 ⇒ 00:06:03.499 Uttam Kumaran: No, he’s in San Antonio.
56 00:06:03.500 ⇒ 00:06:04.230 Robert Tseng: Okay, yeah.
57 00:06:04.230 ⇒ 00:06:12.069 Uttam Kumaran: But he has, like, a… yeah, but he… yeah, he’s in San Antonio, but he was thinking about trying to get some property here.
58 00:06:12.380 ⇒ 00:06:17.060 Robert Tseng: But just comes, like, kind of often. There’s some other friends here, too, so… Okay.
59 00:06:17.920 ⇒ 00:06:21.310 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah, I feel like we got actually, like…
60 00:06:21.850 ⇒ 00:06:24.749 Uttam Kumaran: A bunch of the logistics of, like, how to…
61 00:06:25.480 ⇒ 00:06:29.610 Uttam Kumaran: do the new roles, and then we did a bunch of stuff, so I’ll have them…
62 00:06:29.730 ⇒ 00:06:35.120 Uttam Kumaran: Probably, I grabbed some time later to talk about it, but that should be…
63 00:06:35.360 ⇒ 00:06:37.800 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, we should be able to finish a lot up today.
64 00:06:38.020 ⇒ 00:06:38.680 Robert Tseng: Okay.
65 00:06:41.380 ⇒ 00:06:43.970 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, I see, yeah, okay, yeah, I’ll…
66 00:06:43.970 ⇒ 00:06:44.850 Robert Tseng: I’ll do that.
67 00:06:46.730 ⇒ 00:06:48.110 Uttam Kumaran: How are you? How’s everything?
68 00:06:48.980 ⇒ 00:06:52.539 Robert Tseng: Yeah, no, time at home was good. I think,
69 00:06:52.760 ⇒ 00:06:55.010 Robert Tseng: So, a few things we did…
70 00:06:55.170 ⇒ 00:07:05.250 Robert Tseng: Well, I mean, yeah, this is, like, my one of two times a year I see my parents, so, I feel like… I mean, being at home is just a bunch of interruptions all the time, which I just accepted, and we…
71 00:07:05.250 ⇒ 00:07:07.310 Uttam Kumaran: Yay!
72 00:07:07.310 ⇒ 00:07:10.340 Robert Tseng: Spent good time with the family, helped my dad with some housework.
73 00:07:10.450 ⇒ 00:07:11.600 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
74 00:07:11.600 ⇒ 00:07:16.770 Robert Tseng: we’re basically… it’s not… it’s not anyone’s fault, I think, but, like.
75 00:07:18.100 ⇒ 00:07:22.870 Robert Tseng: There’s, like, a toilet leaked, and like… I think
76 00:07:23.180 ⇒ 00:07:27.450 Robert Tseng: It seems like it’s been, like, a clog for a long time, so, like, I feel like…
77 00:07:27.990 ⇒ 00:07:38.969 Robert Tseng: Yeah, like, some pipe, like, ruptured, so it was, like, just flooding the bathroom, so I was helping my dad do that for a couple hours, because it’s just impossible to get, like, a real plumber to come in.
78 00:07:39.210 ⇒ 00:07:40.610 Robert Tseng: Like, last week.
79 00:07:40.800 ⇒ 00:07:41.190 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
80 00:07:41.190 ⇒ 00:07:45.330 Robert Tseng: So at least we’re able to kind of have a temporary fix there, so…
81 00:07:45.500 ⇒ 00:07:48.429 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so I had some home improvement projects.
82 00:07:48.430 ⇒ 00:07:50.399 Uttam Kumaran: And then.
83 00:07:51.060 ⇒ 00:07:55.549 Robert Tseng: Yeah, we, also did some,
84 00:07:56.340 ⇒ 00:08:02.170 Robert Tseng: Yeah, just seeing some friends, I don’t think I told you this, but one of,
85 00:08:02.670 ⇒ 00:08:10.059 Robert Tseng: One of the… a friend that, like, had a big, influence on me going to law school, actually, but she… she has cancer, so…
86 00:08:10.060 ⇒ 00:08:11.080 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, man.
87 00:08:11.080 ⇒ 00:08:20.170 Robert Tseng: Yeah, we started ball school at the same time, but she ended up, yeah, it was kind of surreal, like, on my last day of class, she…
88 00:08:20.550 ⇒ 00:08:35.110 Robert Tseng: was, you know, on the… on the West Coast. She goes to school at Stanford, and she was, she got her diagnosis then. So, we had been meaning to go back and see her in the Bay, so we visited her a few days, actually, and,
89 00:08:35.360 ⇒ 00:08:45.100 Robert Tseng: Yeah, like, she just… she has to go through 6 rounds of chemo, it’s like a… it’s like a type of lymphoma, probably 60%… they… the doctors are saying 60%.
90 00:08:45.340 ⇒ 00:08:49.119 Robert Tseng: Survival rate, which is high for that type of.
91 00:08:49.120 ⇒ 00:08:49.440 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
92 00:08:49.440 ⇒ 00:08:52.929 Robert Tseng: and she’s young, so… I mean, she’s like Rachel’s age, so…
93 00:08:52.930 ⇒ 00:08:55.589 Uttam Kumaran: How did she get the diagnosis? Like, was it expected?
94 00:08:55.900 ⇒ 00:08:58.080 Robert Tseng: No, no, it was not.
95 00:08:58.800 ⇒ 00:09:01.390 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, for this type of… there’s, like…
96 00:09:01.410 ⇒ 00:09:20.949 Robert Tseng: two main types of lymphoma. One that, like, starts, you know, this is bone marrow, and, like, the… those symptoms are more predictable. Then there’s another one that kind of starts off as, like, lumpy tumors, so, it kind of looks different for every person. But I think for her, it was… she, like, started to feel, like, this mass in her… in her gut.
97 00:09:21.210 ⇒ 00:09:25.440 Robert Tseng: And I don’t know, they thought it was just like a… just like a…
98 00:09:25.600 ⇒ 00:09:30.570 Robert Tseng: You know, a harmless tumor, but ended up being cancerous, so…
99 00:09:30.570 ⇒ 00:09:31.240 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
100 00:09:31.240 ⇒ 00:09:31.820 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
101 00:09:32.750 ⇒ 00:09:44.099 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so she’s gone through her first round of chemo, and yeah, it seems pretty rough, and she has to kind of do 5 more rounds of that over the next few months, so we’ll kind of, we’ll see.
102 00:09:44.370 ⇒ 00:09:45.880 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so…
103 00:09:46.680 ⇒ 00:10:00.999 Robert Tseng: That was, that was pretty much our Friday through Sunday. We did go up to SF and just, like, do, like, half a day up there, because the weather cleared up, and it was, like, really nice, and we biked across the Golden Gate Bridge, and, like, that was.
104 00:10:01.000 ⇒ 00:10:01.770 Uttam Kumaran: Nice.
105 00:10:01.770 ⇒ 00:10:02.130 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
106 00:10:02.130 ⇒ 00:10:02.730 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
107 00:10:03.170 ⇒ 00:10:07.849 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so that was, that’s pretty much how home went.
108 00:10:08.090 ⇒ 00:10:10.640 Uttam Kumaran: Okay. Yeah. Cool.
109 00:10:11.230 ⇒ 00:10:12.830 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, we didn’t… we just…
110 00:10:12.980 ⇒ 00:10:24.730 Uttam Kumaran: I went to Jess’s house, but her family and my family are very different, so they don’t, like… like, after a while staying with the family, for me, I just get really, like…
111 00:10:24.930 ⇒ 00:10:33.459 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, okay, I just want to go home and sit still. Yeah. So, like, by the end of Christmas, I was like, I’m so tired, I’d like to go home and sleep.
112 00:10:33.460 ⇒ 00:10:33.795 Robert Tseng: Oh.
113 00:10:34.320 ⇒ 00:10:45.090 Uttam Kumaran: But, it’s good, they’re really, really kind, really nice. It’s just none of them, like, none of my interests, which is, like, talking about, like, news, or work, or, like…
114 00:10:45.090 ⇒ 00:10:49.490 Robert Tseng: interesting thing. It’s all sort of, like, just contained to the whatever’s…
115 00:10:49.520 ⇒ 00:10:54.930 Uttam Kumaran: In the present, and I’m like, I’m running out of topics, like, I don’t have anything to talk about.
116 00:10:55.370 ⇒ 00:10:59.499 Uttam Kumaran: But it’s, it’s good, and yeah, we just stayed here otherwise, so…
117 00:10:59.500 ⇒ 00:11:00.110 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
118 00:11:01.470 ⇒ 00:11:02.340 Robert Tseng: Nice.
119 00:11:02.720 ⇒ 00:11:05.429 Robert Tseng: And your family’s still in India?
120 00:11:05.430 ⇒ 00:11:11.709 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, so they’ll be back, next week, and then I’ll probably try to go see them in the next, like, few months again.
121 00:11:11.710 ⇒ 00:11:12.140 Robert Tseng: Okay.
122 00:11:12.380 ⇒ 00:11:13.779 Uttam Kumaran: Or have them come here.
123 00:11:14.020 ⇒ 00:11:14.720 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
124 00:11:14.720 ⇒ 00:11:15.330 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
125 00:11:17.640 ⇒ 00:11:18.440 Robert Tseng: Nice.
126 00:11:18.630 ⇒ 00:11:25.460 Robert Tseng: Yeah, well, we came back today because Rachel’s dad is also alive today. He’s at our place right now.
127 00:11:25.650 ⇒ 00:11:29.919 Robert Tseng: He’ll be here, he’ll be here with us until the 1st.
128 00:11:30.360 ⇒ 00:11:39.240 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so, a little bit more family time, but at least it’s… more… out of our.
129 00:11:39.240 ⇒ 00:11:40.560 Uttam Kumaran: You’re in New York, yeah.
130 00:11:40.560 ⇒ 00:11:41.829 Robert Tseng: Yeah, yeah.
131 00:11:43.760 ⇒ 00:11:44.500 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
132 00:11:46.150 ⇒ 00:11:49.120 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, otherwise, today, my plan was just gonna go…
133 00:11:49.730 ⇒ 00:11:56.389 Uttam Kumaran: To the coffee shop and work on getting people follow-ups from our chat… chats last week.
134 00:11:56.690 ⇒ 00:12:00.550 Uttam Kumaran: So I have, like, contracts prepared. I saw Zoron sent this stuff.
135 00:12:00.550 ⇒ 00:12:00.940 Robert Tseng: Right.
136 00:12:01.040 ⇒ 00:12:03.390 Uttam Kumaran: So that should be good. I think…
137 00:12:03.780 ⇒ 00:12:09.150 Uttam Kumaran: We basically did an exercise on Saturday. We mapped out, like, every client.
138 00:12:09.280 ⇒ 00:12:12.580 Uttam Kumaran: Every of the… of the sort of three roles, and…
139 00:12:13.130 ⇒ 00:12:15.969 Uttam Kumaran: So I think we’ll have a… we’ll have some clarity.
140 00:12:16.540 ⇒ 00:12:21.430 Uttam Kumaran: This week, on, like, everybody’s assignments,
141 00:12:21.780 ⇒ 00:12:24.910 Uttam Kumaran: And… and also, like, have some clarity on…
142 00:12:25.370 ⇒ 00:12:31.530 Uttam Kumaran: On, like, basically what you’ll… what this new structure will allow us to see is, like, who…
143 00:12:31.800 ⇒ 00:12:35.709 Uttam Kumaran: Needs to take more, and, like, who we’ve sort of maxed out.
144 00:12:35.710 ⇒ 00:12:36.340 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
145 00:12:36.810 ⇒ 00:12:38.940 Uttam Kumaran: So that should be good.
146 00:12:39.320 ⇒ 00:12:44.989 Uttam Kumaran: And then we also… one thing that I wanted to do for a while is, like, sort of do a leveling guide.
147 00:12:45.080 ⇒ 00:12:48.739 Robert Tseng: Yup. So we’ve, we finished that with rates.
148 00:12:48.790 ⇒ 00:12:52.670 Uttam Kumaran: And then, basically, what we’re gonna do is…
149 00:12:52.900 ⇒ 00:12:58.030 Uttam Kumaran: have levels, like junior, mid, senior, and then depending on, like.
150 00:12:59.090 ⇒ 00:13:08.849 Uttam Kumaran: as I was like, okay, then how do we… how does AI people different than data people? He’s like… he’s like, Clarence was suggesting instead of doing higher rates for one, he’s like, just put, like, a premium
151 00:13:09.060 ⇒ 00:13:12.109 Uttam Kumaran: On the ones where you just need people faster.
152 00:13:13.950 ⇒ 00:13:23.849 Uttam Kumaran: And so we’ll kind of show you what that looks like, and I think that ended up good. So that was, like, a big thing I wanted to just cross off the list. Yeah. So that when we go recruit, we’re not, like…
153 00:13:24.370 ⇒ 00:13:28.449 Uttam Kumaran: always guessing. And then also, I think…
154 00:13:28.840 ⇒ 00:13:32.329 Uttam Kumaran: We also talked about, like, the bonus structure.
155 00:13:32.810 ⇒ 00:13:39.639 Uttam Kumaran: And then we… what I kind of… what I kind of said is this quarter is just gonna be, like.
156 00:13:39.890 ⇒ 00:13:44.340 Uttam Kumaran: it’s gonna be tough to nail all of this, so I said, let’s just focus on, like, one metric.
157 00:13:44.420 ⇒ 00:13:46.569 Robert Tseng: For each of those, like, 3 roles.
158 00:13:47.210 ⇒ 00:13:52.740 Uttam Kumaran: And then… We can just ascribe a bonus to if you were to hit that.
159 00:13:54.150 ⇒ 00:14:14.119 Uttam Kumaran: And for what we decided is, like, we’ll do… typically, these would… like, most places pay bonus, like, yearly, and so I was like, okay, that’s just not gonna be, like… it needs to be something more tangible, so I was like, okay, for this first two quarters, let’s just do it quarterly if we can, and then after these two.
160 00:14:14.410 ⇒ 00:14:16.910 Uttam Kumaran: We’ll switch to, like, every half year.
161 00:14:17.080 ⇒ 00:14:17.480 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
162 00:14:18.450 ⇒ 00:14:30.029 Uttam Kumaran: And then the last piece I wanted to do, and we’ll go through that, is, like, what is, like, total rewards at Brainforge? Because one of the things I’m always… it’s tough is that every, time we recruit, we’re explaining to people, like.
163 00:14:30.250 ⇒ 00:14:35.269 Uttam Kumaran: Sort of, like, all these different parts of, like, why working here.
164 00:14:35.530 ⇒ 00:14:39.039 Uttam Kumaran: And, like, can we describe a dollar value to, like, for example.
165 00:14:39.300 ⇒ 00:14:42.250 Uttam Kumaran: there’s, like, it’s fully remote, right? So…
166 00:14:42.400 ⇒ 00:14:54.899 Uttam Kumaran: compared to if you were gonna work at Deloitte in person, okay, there’s a value to that. And I think every time we’re talking to candidates, it’s almost all, like, hinging on just, like, the salary amount. Yeah. And then we…
167 00:14:55.050 ⇒ 00:15:08.420 Uttam Kumaran: it gives us, like, not much to… to debate with the candidate about. Instead, I think we just… we basically went through and have a pretty clear list of, like, what total rewards our brain forge is, and showing that, like.
168 00:15:08.720 ⇒ 00:15:12.170 Uttam Kumaran: It’s just gonna help us be able to navigate those conversations better.
169 00:15:13.780 ⇒ 00:15:19.389 Uttam Kumaran: You know, and so we come into… we should… ideally, what I’m hopeful for is that not everything is a…
170 00:15:19.580 ⇒ 00:15:22.389 Uttam Kumaran: Isn’t… is as much of a negotiation anymore.
171 00:15:22.570 ⇒ 00:15:29.750 Uttam Kumaran: Like, we come in with a lot of clarity on what we can or can’t do, because ultimately, when we start to hand this off, like.
172 00:15:29.850 ⇒ 00:15:30.690 Uttam Kumaran: people…
173 00:15:30.860 ⇒ 00:15:39.929 Uttam Kumaran: recruiting will need to sort of think that way. And so, we’ll have some cl… we made some good… we spent, like, an hour thinking through this, so that was also really good.
174 00:15:42.220 ⇒ 00:15:42.910 Robert Tseng: Nice.
175 00:15:43.370 ⇒ 00:15:56.419 Uttam Kumaran: That way, we just, like, don’t… it’s not… not everything is, like, always, like, a debate, and it’s like, okay, if we can’t… this doesn’t work, then so be it. We’re, like, okay. And at least up front, we can also be clear on, like, what the ranges are for roles.
176 00:15:56.950 ⇒ 00:15:57.560 Robert Tseng: Right.
177 00:15:58.270 ⇒ 00:15:59.050 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
178 00:16:03.900 ⇒ 00:16:09.760 Robert Tseng: Okay, I mean, that’ll be helpful, especially as we’re, like, talking to a few of these folks already, and they’re just like, oh…
179 00:16:10.430 ⇒ 00:16:11.540 Robert Tseng: You know, whatever.
180 00:16:11.540 ⇒ 00:16:13.099 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, people just make up numbers.
181 00:16:13.100 ⇒ 00:16:14.339 Robert Tseng: And it’s like that.
182 00:16:14.340 ⇒ 00:16:28.370 Uttam Kumaran: I want them to think… like, I don’t want us to get taken advantage of. I also want people to, like, think more hard about, like, what they want in their career, and, like, understand that there’s a lot to, like, being at a job versus just, like, making the money, and, like.
183 00:16:28.420 ⇒ 00:16:32.760 Robert Tseng: If they can’t realize that, then that’s fine, that’s a good sign that they’re not gonna…
184 00:16:32.900 ⇒ 00:16:35.470 Uttam Kumaran: They don’t just understand where we’re coming from, so…
185 00:16:35.470 ⇒ 00:16:36.120 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
186 00:16:36.280 ⇒ 00:16:40.260 Uttam Kumaran: And then, yeah, we can also talk, like, I do wanna…
187 00:16:40.450 ⇒ 00:16:42.309 Uttam Kumaran: We can talk about just, like.
188 00:16:42.750 ⇒ 00:16:56.809 Uttam Kumaran: like, how the sales org is gonna look like, and then… basically, we should have real clarity after this week on, like, where we need more delivery folks, and then I still think we can get away with, like.
189 00:16:57.180 ⇒ 00:17:06.520 Uttam Kumaran: Eliza is really, really good, and I think we can probably operate with her for a while, and probably push off the ops lead for a bit more.
190 00:17:07.180 ⇒ 00:17:08.010 Uttam Kumaran: So…
191 00:17:08.260 ⇒ 00:17:08.990 Robert Tseng: Okay.
192 00:17:10.160 ⇒ 00:17:10.829 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
193 00:17:13.710 ⇒ 00:17:29.170 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I’m spending my day, kind of… I have some, like, sales items I want to check off a list, just in terms of, like, OKR planning for the quarter, and then, I mean, yeah, I think… I still think I want to bring… I want to bring Luke on, and so…
194 00:17:29.540 ⇒ 00:17:32.190 Robert Tseng: Any questions on his side on, like, kind of…
195 00:17:33.320 ⇒ 00:17:39.590 Robert Tseng: we’ve already… there was a couple strategy docs. I mean, I know you haven’t kind of joined in on some of the calls the past two weeks, so I just…
196 00:17:39.590 ⇒ 00:17:42.789 Uttam Kumaran: I can be there today, and yeah, but yeah, you tell me.
197 00:17:42.960 ⇒ 00:17:51.169 Robert Tseng: Yeah, yeah. I don’t expect the folks to be there today, but if they are, I’m gonna, you know, assume that I should be ready for that anyway, so…
198 00:17:51.170 ⇒ 00:17:51.540 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
199 00:17:51.540 ⇒ 00:17:54.599 Robert Tseng: That’s what I’m hoping to get done before that kickoff. Yeah.
200 00:17:56.100 ⇒ 00:18:02.600 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I’m kind of interested in, like, where you see him fitting and where he’s, like, gonna grow, because I know he doesn’t come from a…
201 00:18:02.900 ⇒ 00:18:05.020 Uttam Kumaran: Traditional sales background.
202 00:18:05.020 ⇒ 00:18:05.340 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
203 00:18:05.340 ⇒ 00:18:09.029 Uttam Kumaran: So, I’m wondering if you’re like, okay, he’s gonna lean more, like.
204 00:18:09.280 ⇒ 00:18:20.809 Uttam Kumaran: marketing strategy, and you’re gonna sort of show him more of the actual execution, or, like, how you’re thinking about the role, because ultimately, for me, that’s what’s gonna define how you comp
205 00:18:21.080 ⇒ 00:18:29.079 Uttam Kumaran: Because if someone comes in, there’s like, yeah, I can do everything and take us to the next level, is one thing, but if we’re hiring people who are, like.
206 00:18:29.190 ⇒ 00:18:31.880 Uttam Kumaran: Look, you’re… you’re good in, like, this one area.
207 00:18:32.110 ⇒ 00:18:40.669 Uttam Kumaran: you still need to grow in this area, here’s how we can get you to that whatever salary range. So, yeah, I’m interested in, like, how you’re thinking about what he is capable of doing.
208 00:18:40.800 ⇒ 00:18:46.800 Uttam Kumaran: Versus, like, where he may not just be, like, the kind of execution person we need.
209 00:18:48.750 ⇒ 00:19:03.129 Robert Tseng: Yeah, yeah, I mean, I think just, you know, thoughts on that would be, like, he’s… he’s not, like… he’s not a BDR AE kind of person. He’s not gonna be able to jump on calls and close deals for us right out the gates, but I think in terms of, like.
210 00:19:03.300 ⇒ 00:19:10.310 Robert Tseng: Like, on the content side, like, I feel like he can be held to that, and then…
211 00:19:10.770 ⇒ 00:19:25.070 Robert Tseng: I mean, yeah, and then just being the… basically, like, the… the Gabe equivalent on the… on the sales side to kind of drive the other… the other things forward, like, I… I think he can… he’s… yeah, he’s… he’s able to…
212 00:19:25.730 ⇒ 00:19:31.140 Robert Tseng: I mean, ideally, I want him to be running the stand-ups and, like, kind of pushing things along with, with…
213 00:19:31.290 ⇒ 00:19:36.890 Robert Tseng: Whether we keep Jed or not, Jed, Jed, Jed plus Ryan and Hannah, so…
214 00:19:37.310 ⇒ 00:19:38.090 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
215 00:19:39.470 ⇒ 00:19:40.010 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
216 00:19:41.780 ⇒ 00:19:44.050 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so, I, I…
217 00:19:44.180 ⇒ 00:19:59.510 Robert Tseng: I think where he’s strong at, I think, is on the messaging side, so I really want to see him kind of impact on us in that way, when we’re… I think that’ll come out of the content,
218 00:20:00.090 ⇒ 00:20:11.859 Robert Tseng: hopefully he’ll be able to give more guardrails to Ryan. But yeah, I think these past few weeks really just been about him seeing everything that we’re doing, knowing, kind of, like.
219 00:20:12.310 ⇒ 00:20:21.640 Robert Tseng: Yeah, like, all the systems that we have in place, like, we’re not starting from scratch, we don’t really need him to do execute end-to-end. Like, he needs to really just be…
220 00:20:21.640 ⇒ 00:20:25.280 Robert Tseng: They would take, like, the ideas from us,
221 00:20:25.280 ⇒ 00:20:42.079 Robert Tseng: it’s good that he has his own ideas as well, and he can kind of push back and help us refine things, but then once it’s, like, ready to go, he needs to put forth the brief, and then kind of push things downwards on making sure that it gets executed well. So, I think that’s kind of where I see him, slotting in.
222 00:20:42.190 ⇒ 00:20:44.429 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
223 00:20:48.970 ⇒ 00:20:49.600 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
224 00:20:50.960 ⇒ 00:20:54.589 Uttam Kumaran: And then what… what… how did it go with Jed? Like, what are you thinking?
225 00:20:54.890 ⇒ 00:21:01.860 Robert Tseng: With Jed, I think, like, with…
226 00:21:02.130 ⇒ 00:21:05.120 Robert Tseng: I spoke with the growth assistant people, I think…
227 00:21:10.520 ⇒ 00:21:18.620 Robert Tseng: I mean, my feedback to them was, like, he needs to be more proactive, because he’s still kind of just, like, waiting for things to be, like, kind of handed to him, but…
228 00:21:18.620 ⇒ 00:21:19.260 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
229 00:21:19.260 ⇒ 00:21:28.839 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think… on the… Middle-of-funnel messaging kind of stuff, or, like, kind of lead nurturing.
230 00:21:31.000 ⇒ 00:21:33.459 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I’ve… I… I think…
231 00:21:36.640 ⇒ 00:21:54.589 Robert Tseng: he… he understands reporting, and, like, he can do… like, there’s a lot of overlap with… with him, Ryan. I just… I need him to really own… own the middle of funnel stuff, so, like, if he doesn’t… if he doesn’t take that, maybe it’s just a matter of, like, I… I didn’t really, like, define it well enough for him, but, okay. Yeah, so I…
232 00:21:56.700 ⇒ 00:22:05.529 Robert Tseng: I mean, he did send some… he did send some messages, but, like, I don’t know, our end of the year sequence, like, I haven’t seen that go out, and there’s, like, there’s a couple of things that…
233 00:22:05.740 ⇒ 00:22:07.620 Robert Tseng: I mean, he’s… he’s…
234 00:22:07.700 ⇒ 00:22:24.480 Robert Tseng: he’s not, like, a huge step up from, like, Ryan, frankly. Yeah. Like, it’s… it’s kind of the same. He’s just, like, a… he’s just a three times more expensive Ryan that’s, like, maybe a little bit more polished in terms of, like, he can communicate his thoughts better, but he’s also, like, not as…
235 00:22:24.550 ⇒ 00:22:34.440 Robert Tseng: like, gung-ho about, like, jumping into things like Ryan is. So, I mean, it’s hard to, like, kind of say whether… I mean, if he can still own that lane.
236 00:22:34.490 ⇒ 00:22:52.719 Robert Tseng: and, like, kind of free up Ryan to go just do content SEO exclusively, then I’m… I’m okay with it, but I think that’s… that’s something I… I need to try to make… make it work in the next… in the next week, otherwise I don’t think… then… then we’ll… then, Growth Assistant already… is already looking for someone else to replace him.
237 00:22:52.720 ⇒ 00:22:53.410 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
238 00:22:53.410 ⇒ 00:22:53.920 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
239 00:22:54.060 ⇒ 00:22:57.449 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, the alternative is you can have, like, Luke…
240 00:22:57.840 ⇒ 00:23:00.690 Uttam Kumaran: Get more involved in that process, too, like…
241 00:23:01.300 ⇒ 00:23:03.890 Uttam Kumaran: You know, if this person is gonna be more of, like.
242 00:23:04.060 ⇒ 00:23:04.810 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
243 00:23:04.810 ⇒ 00:23:08.780 Uttam Kumaran: the VA for Luke, or, you know, somehow goes that, and then you can kind of
244 00:23:08.920 ⇒ 00:23:10.690 Uttam Kumaran: have Luke do some of the…
245 00:23:10.860 ⇒ 00:23:13.480 Uttam Kumaran: Thinking about where he wants to put this person.
246 00:23:13.490 ⇒ 00:23:14.800 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
247 00:23:16.300 ⇒ 00:23:18.840 Uttam Kumaran: But otherwise, like, for example, that, like…
248 00:23:19.000 ⇒ 00:23:28.499 Uttam Kumaran: you can just get anybody to come do the HubSpot report. You don’t… it’s like, you don’t really need to be that much. You should be kind of somewhat smart, and you can figure out, like, how to do HubSpot and things like that.
249 00:23:28.500 ⇒ 00:23:31.150 Robert Tseng: Yeah, it’s not a big priority for me at all, yeah.
250 00:23:31.150 ⇒ 00:23:32.759 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, it’s like.
251 00:23:35.540 ⇒ 00:23:42.709 Robert Tseng: That’s why I kind of want to finish the OKRs, and then really see, like, which ones will Jed actually own, and, like, if, you know, if…
252 00:23:43.150 ⇒ 00:23:49.260 Robert Tseng: Well, yeah, I think we would need to discuss to kind of see how we would assign it, but yeah.
253 00:23:49.260 ⇒ 00:23:49.870 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
254 00:23:52.170 ⇒ 00:23:53.000 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
255 00:23:56.690 ⇒ 00:23:59.139 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, for me, I think you just want to get someone who’s, like.
256 00:23:59.990 ⇒ 00:24:04.990 Uttam Kumaran: Now, if Luke’s gonna fill in on a lot of the strategy stuff and messaging, then you just want…
257 00:24:05.170 ⇒ 00:24:10.539 Uttam Kumaran: Someone who can… who can really, like, execute and think about new campaigns and stuff like that.
258 00:24:11.800 ⇒ 00:24:15.470 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
259 00:24:20.140 ⇒ 00:24:20.830 Uttam Kumaran: Nope.
260 00:24:28.040 ⇒ 00:24:41.269 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so I just have, like, this messy doc with all this kind of stuff that I… thoughts I had dropped in from last week, but, I mean, now that I’m kind of back online, I’m gonna have to just spend some time going back to some of the stuff to put it together.
261 00:24:42.160 ⇒ 00:24:46.330 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I think this week, if… before, because if we come back next week, we’re just gonna…
262 00:24:46.590 ⇒ 00:24:49.849 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, I want to be in a place where we can just go back and…
263 00:24:50.430 ⇒ 00:25:07.239 Uttam Kumaran: basically, for me, on my side, I’m like, okay, how do we… how do I get delivery into a good spot so I feel, like, comfortable? Yeah. Selling, like, another 5 deals, you know? Yeah. Like, do we have a through-line to servicing another 5 deals?
264 00:25:07.780 ⇒ 00:25:10.620 Uttam Kumaran: What’s in the bag?
265 00:25:11.340 ⇒ 00:25:22.000 Uttam Kumaran: 60 days. It’s like, okay, we feel good, and we have a through line as to what resources are needing, and within 60 days…
266 00:25:23.240 ⇒ 00:25:24.050 Uttam Kumaran: Bye.
267 00:25:33.820 ⇒ 00:25:37.980 Uttam Kumaran: We’re comfortable with the state of, like, and then we can go hit a…
268 00:26:01.100 ⇒ 00:26:02.399 Robert Tseng: I think you cut out.
269 00:26:03.580 ⇒ 00:26:04.860 Uttam Kumaran: Oh yeah, I’m back, come back.
270 00:26:09.910 ⇒ 00:26:11.460 Robert Tseng: Okay, you’re back. Yep.
271 00:26:15.450 ⇒ 00:26:21.509 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, yeah, that’s all… that’s… that’s most of what I had, so I’ll, maybe let’s plan on chatting later with Clarence?
272 00:26:23.030 ⇒ 00:26:23.640 Robert Tseng: Yep.
273 00:26:26.870 ⇒ 00:26:27.360 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
274 00:26:27.360 ⇒ 00:26:29.590 Robert Tseng: Yeah, we’ll chat again in a few hours, yep.
275 00:26:29.840 ⇒ 00:26:31.590 Uttam Kumaran: Okay. Alright, perfect. Talk to you later.
276 00:26:31.590 ⇒ 00:26:31.960 Robert Tseng: Okay.
277 00:26:34.590 ⇒ 00:26:35.899 Robert Tseng: Alright, talk to you in Slack.