Meeting Title: Zoom-Meeting Date: 2024-08-01 Meeting participants: Nicolas Sucari, Uttam Kumaran
WEBVTT
1 00:00:21.820 ⇒ 00:00:22.650 Nicolas Sucari: Hey, Tom!
2 00:00:22.970 ⇒ 00:00:24.509 Uttam Kumaran: Hey, Ben? How’s the day?
3 00:00:25.090 ⇒ 00:00:27.590 Nicolas Sucari: All good. How about you? Nice haircut.
4 00:00:28.070 ⇒ 00:00:36.360 Uttam Kumaran: Good. Thanks. Yeah. Days, good emails are going out, which is good. Have, like, some opens.
5 00:00:36.460 ⇒ 00:00:38.960 Uttam Kumaran: I’m basically gonna spend.
6 00:00:39.610 ⇒ 00:00:42.430 Uttam Kumaran: you know, probably time after work today.
7 00:00:43.152 ⇒ 00:00:48.679 Uttam Kumaran: And then working with Brian, basically on a process where
8 00:00:49.391 ⇒ 00:00:59.989 Uttam Kumaran: I want to start targeting companies with open job requirements. So what we will do is have a process where you can submit to a form like there’s a job position open.
9 00:01:00.220 ⇒ 00:01:00.900 Nicolas Sucari: Okay.
10 00:01:01.170 ⇒ 00:01:04.750 Uttam Kumaran: AI to basically scrape the job posting.
11 00:01:05.200 ⇒ 00:01:07.739 Uttam Kumaran: And then also the company.
12 00:01:07.760 ⇒ 00:01:11.409 Uttam Kumaran: And then basically put that all into Google sheet with, like
13 00:01:11.440 ⇒ 00:01:23.620 Uttam Kumaran: the company, the job posting the title, the role. And then also the email we should send, basically like, Hey, we notice you have blah blah blah position opening. And then that’ll automatically get put into the email
14 00:01:23.850 ⇒ 00:01:26.080 Uttam Kumaran: like an email will automatically get sent.
15 00:01:26.250 ⇒ 00:01:30.589 Nicolas Sucari: But yeah, to what email to the email that is posted there on the job post, right?
16 00:01:30.590 ⇒ 00:01:33.940 Uttam Kumaran: No, we’ll we’ll find, like 3 or 4 people at the company.
17 00:01:34.010 ⇒ 00:01:36.617 Uttam Kumaran: unless there is, unless there is a
18 00:01:37.210 ⇒ 00:01:38.860 Uttam Kumaran: There is a person’s name there.
19 00:01:38.860 ⇒ 00:01:39.480 Nicolas Sucari: Okay.
20 00:01:39.960 ⇒ 00:01:45.960 Uttam Kumaran: So ideally it goes from like anytime. We just see open job postings. We can just throw it into the form
21 00:01:46.290 ⇒ 00:02:01.229 Uttam Kumaran: and then down the way. Ais, it’s the process is actually pretty nice. Basically, every email can be personalized. And then you can have, like the subject, be part of the engines. And it’s like, really nice.
22 00:02:01.618 ⇒ 00:02:05.799 Uttam Kumaran: So that’s kind of like, ideally, I think, what we’re gonna end up doing.
23 00:02:06.200 ⇒ 00:02:07.570 Nicolas Sucari: That’s good. Yeah.
24 00:02:07.910 ⇒ 00:02:08.550 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
25 00:02:09.780 ⇒ 00:02:10.530 Nicolas Sucari: Ice.
26 00:02:13.070 ⇒ 00:02:17.809 Nicolas Sucari: great, I mean, if you’re ready sending some emails as we are seeing.
27 00:02:17.970 ⇒ 00:02:20.870 Nicolas Sucari: And there is a open rate.
28 00:02:20.990 ⇒ 00:02:22.490 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, I think it’s great.
29 00:02:23.590 ⇒ 00:02:27.949 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I think you know, there’s some people that are opening. Everybody will get followed up with.
30 00:02:27.990 ⇒ 00:02:31.189 Uttam Kumaran: I already noticed some people are looking at my Linkedin, so
31 00:02:31.450 ⇒ 00:02:31.969 Uttam Kumaran: kind of.
32 00:02:31.970 ⇒ 00:02:32.680 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah.
33 00:02:32.680 ⇒ 00:02:35.684 Uttam Kumaran: Start to connect with people directly on Linkedin.
34 00:02:36.429 ⇒ 00:02:45.650 Uttam Kumaran: Again. It’s just gonna take 3, 4 HA day, basically just sitting there and doing that but yesterday and the day before was really good, like it based. Got everything hooked up.
35 00:02:47.700 ⇒ 00:02:48.640 Uttam Kumaran: so.
36 00:02:49.000 ⇒ 00:02:49.620 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah.
37 00:02:50.150 ⇒ 00:02:51.130 Nicolas Sucari: great.
38 00:02:51.580 ⇒ 00:02:55.909 Nicolas Sucari: It’s working. I think it’s yeah. It’s gonna it’s gonna work. Let’s hope it’s gonna work.
39 00:02:55.910 ⇒ 00:02:59.039 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, no, I mean again, i i i think
40 00:02:59.360 ⇒ 00:03:08.950 Uttam Kumaran: we’ll just have to send like 1,000 emails, and then we’ll see that some conversions, and then we’ll end up getting a good baseline for how much volume we need to be doing.
41 00:03:09.020 ⇒ 00:03:19.120 Uttam Kumaran: But I don’t want to just do email. I want to do the job postings. I need everything kind of just needs to start. And then we optimize like, how do we make it easier?
42 00:03:19.490 ⇒ 00:03:20.630 Uttam Kumaran: Exactly
43 00:03:21.050 ⇒ 00:03:25.009 Uttam Kumaran: so, Jared and Brian are kind of helping with some stuff.
44 00:03:28.110 ⇒ 00:03:29.300 Uttam Kumaran: so, okay.
45 00:03:31.600 ⇒ 00:03:38.149 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, I’ve seen that people is looking at the brain forge page in Linkedin, too. So yeah, I think, like.
46 00:03:38.150 ⇒ 00:03:38.850 Uttam Kumaran: Nice one.
47 00:03:38.850 ⇒ 00:03:41.180 Nicolas Sucari: Once we send some more
48 00:03:41.936 ⇒ 00:03:46.439 Nicolas Sucari: emails or other stuff. Yeah. And we are getting this interaction. I think
49 00:03:46.630 ⇒ 00:03:47.899 Nicolas Sucari: it will be good. Yeah.
50 00:03:47.900 ⇒ 00:03:52.810 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, like, ideally, here’s my thinking is like, once we know, emails are going out.
51 00:03:52.990 ⇒ 00:04:10.549 Uttam Kumaran: then I can spend less time working on like emails and more time doing like Linkedin and writing. And then someone. Even yesterday I talked to the head of sales at Real, and he was like part of the thing with email is, it’s just so, people know, you said, even in 6 months, when they need something in data, they think about you.
52 00:04:10.920 ⇒ 00:04:11.810 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, so.
53 00:04:12.140 ⇒ 00:04:13.730 Uttam Kumaran: It’s just good that we
54 00:04:14.230 ⇒ 00:04:14.950 Uttam Kumaran: we like. So.
55 00:04:14.950 ⇒ 00:04:16.889 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, it’s it’s it’s like
56 00:04:17.200 ⇒ 00:04:22.880 Nicolas Sucari: positioning on the Maria. It’s like getting brain 1st to be known there. So that’s fine.
57 00:04:23.670 ⇒ 00:04:24.250 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
58 00:04:24.250 ⇒ 00:04:34.290 Nicolas Sucari: Also some something that we can look at as a measure is if we are getting like book the, if someone is booking calls through the website
59 00:04:34.310 ⇒ 00:04:37.349 Nicolas Sucari: stuff kind of the through your calendar stuff, or that.
60 00:04:38.370 ⇒ 00:04:39.140 Nicolas Sucari: Yep.
61 00:04:39.480 ⇒ 00:05:03.649 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. So that’s what now. But in the future what we’ll do is we’ll have a booking, and then basically that will that will also get passed through AI to like enrich it. So you think it’s like some sort of work flow. There, there’s gonna be. I’m glad the email thing I had to learn, like how to do all the copy, and then instantly you have to do some different things. So since that’s all working now, we can begin to plan
62 00:05:03.950 ⇒ 00:05:12.520 Uttam Kumaran: like, I wanna keep, I wanna like have a process for manufacturing. And then basically we’ll copy paste this onto advertising copy paste this onto other stuff.
63 00:05:12.520 ⇒ 00:05:13.360 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, of.
64 00:05:13.570 ⇒ 00:05:14.900 Nicolas Sucari: I suppose.
65 00:05:14.900 ⇒ 00:05:16.300 Uttam Kumaran: Happening. So
66 00:05:17.130 ⇒ 00:05:21.660 Uttam Kumaran: that’s good. It’s taking like a damn long time, though, like.
67 00:05:21.660 ⇒ 00:05:26.080 Nicolas Sucari: I know, and then it seems a lot of hard work. Yeah, to set that up.
68 00:05:27.101 ⇒ 00:05:38.878 Uttam Kumaran: I mean the emails. I think the emails are actually pretty good like compared to when I 1st wrote them. They’re like much more salesy. And like, they’re really good. And that like, basically, I’ll even show you like,
69 00:05:40.440 ⇒ 00:05:44.090 Uttam Kumaran: one of the emails, I’m basically writing like.
70 00:05:48.580 ⇒ 00:05:52.485 Uttam Kumaran: yeah, one of them. Let me see what it is.
71 00:06:17.270 ⇒ 00:06:24.719 Uttam Kumaran: yeah. So the 1st one is like, Hey, I’m owner of brain force. We’re a Texas based data company helping manufacturing companies.
72 00:06:24.820 ⇒ 00:06:29.000 Uttam Kumaran: We recently helped Stella source slash coding time boost accuracy.
73 00:06:29.360 ⇒ 00:06:32.389 Uttam Kumaran: The teams not catching cost saving opportunities
74 00:06:32.690 ⇒ 00:06:35.579 Uttam Kumaran: is, and it puts in the company name like, are you wrestling with it?
75 00:06:35.580 ⇒ 00:06:36.410 Nicolas Sucari: And out any.
76 00:06:37.200 ⇒ 00:06:41.220 Uttam Kumaran: If you could make wave a magic one and fix one of these, what would it be?
77 00:06:42.680 ⇒ 00:06:45.250 Uttam Kumaran: And so I have like 2 variations of these.
78 00:06:46.236 ⇒ 00:06:53.140 Uttam Kumaran: So each of these I kind of worked with somebody, a friend of mine, and then use the AI to kind of break each down.
79 00:06:53.180 ⇒ 00:06:55.570 Uttam Kumaran: and then same thing in the next follow up.
80 00:06:55.910 ⇒ 00:07:02.691 Uttam Kumaran: We have, like some follows where I have 2 variations. Basically, is it circling back, just trying to be very crystal clear.
81 00:07:03.000 ⇒ 00:07:03.650 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah.
82 00:07:04.060 ⇒ 00:07:06.002 Uttam Kumaran: And the 3rd one, there’s just like
83 00:07:06.660 ⇒ 00:07:08.150 Uttam Kumaran: a fall off. So
84 00:07:08.270 ⇒ 00:07:10.759 Uttam Kumaran: these are good, I think.
85 00:07:11.300 ⇒ 00:07:17.959 Uttam Kumaran: Basically, we’ll continue to. I have now, like a decent AI setup of like each of these.
86 00:07:17.980 ⇒ 00:07:23.409 Uttam Kumaran: each of these lines is basically a part. And then I’m using AI to think about variations.
87 00:07:24.230 ⇒ 00:07:26.930 Uttam Kumaran: But like it’s in a pretty good place now.
88 00:07:27.230 ⇒ 00:07:33.839 Nicolas Sucari: So you’re you’re not adding on this one, I mean, you’re not adding on this one like the link to book the call
89 00:07:33.910 ⇒ 00:07:36.920 Nicolas Sucari: you you just have in step 2, I think.
90 00:07:36.920 ⇒ 00:07:39.809 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, cause you’re supposed to be putting links
91 00:07:39.990 ⇒ 00:07:43.479 Uttam Kumaran: in outbound messaging. The 1st one cause it’ll market a.
92 00:07:43.480 ⇒ 00:07:45.299 Nicolas Sucari: Okay. Great.
93 00:07:45.780 ⇒ 00:07:48.989 Uttam Kumaran: So I don’t put it, and then the second one, I have
94 00:07:50.070 ⇒ 00:07:51.030 Uttam Kumaran: a habit.
95 00:07:52.290 ⇒ 00:07:53.030 Nicolas Sucari: Okay.
96 00:07:56.510 ⇒ 00:07:59.009 Uttam Kumaran: So we’ll see. I mean, they’re all going out
97 00:08:00.110 ⇒ 00:08:03.840 Uttam Kumaran: like, we’ll we’ll end up seeing what happens. Some some of them bounced.
98 00:08:04.440 ⇒ 00:08:05.510 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
99 00:08:05.780 ⇒ 00:08:06.900 Uttam Kumaran: yeah, we’ll see.
100 00:08:07.620 ⇒ 00:08:08.320 Nicolas Sucari: Nice.
101 00:08:10.430 ⇒ 00:08:12.600 Nicolas Sucari: This is all for manufacturing
102 00:08:12.940 ⇒ 00:08:13.850 Nicolas Sucari: prospects.
103 00:08:13.850 ⇒ 00:08:17.520 Uttam Kumaran: Well, yeah, it’s all for manufacturing process.
104 00:08:17.710 ⇒ 00:08:20.390 Uttam Kumaran: Basically, we have, like.
105 00:08:22.610 ⇒ 00:08:25.459 Uttam Kumaran: we have, like all of the all of these leads
106 00:08:25.650 ⇒ 00:08:28.010 Uttam Kumaran: initially that we got
107 00:08:28.516 ⇒ 00:08:32.710 Uttam Kumaran: I formatted these until like each of the contacts.
108 00:08:33.230 ⇒ 00:08:36.429 Uttam Kumaran: And then I’m using Apollo
109 00:08:36.510 ⇒ 00:08:38.129 Uttam Kumaran: to. Yeah.
110 00:08:38.500 ⇒ 00:08:44.509 Uttam Kumaran: I’m using Apollo for 2 things. One is some of these. We just have the name, and we don’t have the email.
111 00:08:44.815 ⇒ 00:08:45.120 Nicolas Sucari: Please.
112 00:08:45.120 ⇒ 00:08:50.529 Uttam Kumaran: Click on the name. You can use Apollo, basically to get all that data out
113 00:08:51.090 ⇒ 00:08:55.350 Uttam Kumaran: and then I then load all that into
114 00:08:56.730 ⇒ 00:08:59.319 Uttam Kumaran: I load all that into instantly.
115 00:09:00.115 ⇒ 00:09:01.780 Uttam Kumaran: And then ideally.
116 00:09:02.140 ⇒ 00:09:06.529 Uttam Kumaran: we go one step further on the personalization which is like.
117 00:09:06.730 ⇒ 00:09:10.560 Uttam Kumaran: not only do we reference their company name or their title.
118 00:09:12.080 ⇒ 00:09:15.350 Uttam Kumaran: we actually talk about something about their profile.
119 00:09:15.790 ⇒ 00:09:17.520 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, well.
120 00:09:17.560 ⇒ 00:09:25.250 Uttam Kumaran: and so that’s gonna require, like a little bit more AI money. To do it. But we can do that in instantly.
121 00:09:25.480 ⇒ 00:09:31.889 Uttam Kumaran: pretty easily like. Instantly we’ll can look at all these fields, and then come up with a sentence so.
122 00:09:31.890 ⇒ 00:09:32.590 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, we’ll.
123 00:09:32.590 ⇒ 00:09:34.550 Uttam Kumaran: Better at the personalization.
124 00:09:35.536 ⇒ 00:09:47.103 Uttam Kumaran: But ideally, now, it’s basically like I get these lists. And I can go. So basically, I get a list like this, I can go into Apollo, clean it, and then put it instantly, or even an Apollo, I
125 00:09:48.160 ⇒ 00:09:53.960 Uttam Kumaran: I set up these like Icp, which is like the personas of the people we’re going after.
126 00:09:54.020 ⇒ 00:10:01.029 Uttam Kumaran: And I I can actually go in here, and I can look at here’s our manufacturing persona.
127 00:10:01.360 ⇒ 00:10:04.389 Uttam Kumaran: and it’ll say there’s a hundred 20 like 1,000 people.
128 00:10:04.810 ⇒ 00:10:08.819 Uttam Kumaran: Right? All of these are like manufacturing type companies.
129 00:10:08.960 ⇒ 00:10:17.180 Uttam Kumaran: And if you look at what I did as like here all the titles. Here’s a level. Here’s the industries. Here’s the locations. Here’s a number of employees.
130 00:10:17.860 ⇒ 00:10:20.939 Uttam Kumaran: So this will give me all the people that are in there
131 00:10:21.120 ⇒ 00:10:23.829 Uttam Kumaran: and then I could export as many of these as I want.
132 00:10:24.100 ⇒ 00:10:25.210 Uttam Kumaran: So
133 00:10:25.300 ⇒ 00:10:31.779 Uttam Kumaran: seemingly we could keep iterating on this like, I want to think of these as batches
134 00:10:33.440 ⇒ 00:10:34.840 Uttam Kumaran: And then
135 00:10:34.880 ⇒ 00:10:43.527 Uttam Kumaran: again, like the better, the more highly targeted we are, the more personalized, the better. So this one was mostly people in steel.
136 00:10:45.200 ⇒ 00:10:47.419 Uttam Kumaran: like this was my search
137 00:10:47.970 ⇒ 00:10:49.390 Uttam Kumaran: before was like
138 00:10:49.560 ⇒ 00:10:55.510 Uttam Kumaran: manufacturing icps, Stella type companies where the industry was steel or quoting.
139 00:10:55.760 ⇒ 00:10:58.269 Uttam Kumaran: They have more than 10 million revenue.
140 00:10:58.490 ⇒ 00:11:03.749 Uttam Kumaran: And you can see there’s about 97. So I took these and I took the other ones and then built basically built the list.
141 00:11:04.360 ⇒ 00:11:05.150 Nicolas Sucari: Nice.
142 00:11:07.690 ⇒ 00:11:13.820 Uttam Kumaran: But yeah, like this, this software is like, super complicated instantly is like
143 00:11:15.050 ⇒ 00:11:21.960 Uttam Kumaran: complicated. I was doing a bunch of stuff in copy AI, but it’s kind of expensive. So
144 00:11:22.361 ⇒ 00:11:28.788 Uttam Kumaran: I’m not sure how much we’re going to use that I may. I’m probably gonna end up doing something like
145 00:11:29.410 ⇒ 00:11:31.090 Uttam Kumaran: Apollo
146 00:11:31.520 ⇒ 00:11:34.500 Uttam Kumaran: like to Google sheets to install.
147 00:11:34.500 ⇒ 00:11:35.250 Nicolas Sucari: Certainly.
148 00:11:35.460 ⇒ 00:11:37.580 Uttam Kumaran: Use Zapier to like hook things up.
149 00:11:39.330 ⇒ 00:11:45.739 Nicolas Sucari: So why, instead of using copy AI copy, I is writing you like the custom messages to send right.
150 00:11:46.410 ⇒ 00:11:51.839 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. But the the thing is copy AI is expensive, because.
151 00:11:51.840 ⇒ 00:11:52.450 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah.
152 00:11:52.850 ⇒ 00:12:04.490 Uttam Kumaran: Like I don’t know. I mean, I I could. I could pay them to write a personalized email for every single person. But it’s taking a lot of time. However, copy AI is really nice, because.
153 00:12:04.510 ⇒ 00:12:13.009 Uttam Kumaran: for example, like I could put in like, if someone’s I have this thing where it’s like put in their name. And it figures everything out so like I can even put like.
154 00:12:13.420 ⇒ 00:12:14.959 Uttam Kumaran: let’s just try this.
155 00:12:28.740 ⇒ 00:12:32.279 Uttam Kumaran: So I have a couple of workflows that do like lead enrichment.
156 00:12:34.350 ⇒ 00:12:36.740 Uttam Kumaran: so let’s see if this one comes with anything.
157 00:12:39.370 ⇒ 00:12:41.859 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, this is actually not great results.
158 00:12:43.530 ⇒ 00:12:48.730 Uttam Kumaran: Well, there’s an example where I took someone’s I took. I took like someone’s name
159 00:12:48.850 ⇒ 00:12:49.690 Uttam Kumaran: like I’m trying to.
160 00:12:49.690 ⇒ 00:12:50.310 Nicolas Sucari: Aye.
161 00:12:53.290 ⇒ 00:12:55.320 Nicolas Sucari: I’m in Traceville. That’s okay.
162 00:13:11.020 ⇒ 00:13:15.080 Uttam Kumaran: enrich company. I don’t know what’s.
163 00:13:19.610 ⇒ 00:13:26.169 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, don’t worry. That’s okay. So you’re using it to get the right information from the people on the company.
164 00:13:26.610 ⇒ 00:13:31.130 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, like, another example is like, basically in this, input I can put in like.
165 00:13:31.370 ⇒ 00:13:32.640 Uttam Kumaran: someone’s
166 00:13:33.030 ⇒ 00:13:36.919 Uttam Kumaran: like, here’s an example. If we were to go to Link like some guy just looked me up.
167 00:13:37.322 ⇒ 00:13:42.149 Nicolas Sucari: What I’m thinking is we can’t we create these workflows on cloud?
168 00:13:42.980 ⇒ 00:13:43.770 Nicolas Sucari: No.
169 00:13:44.270 ⇒ 00:13:47.053 Uttam Kumaran: Claude. Claude is not like
170 00:13:48.000 ⇒ 00:13:55.100 Uttam Kumaran: it’s not one claw doesn’t connect to Internet. The second. Step by step.
171 00:13:55.530 ⇒ 00:13:56.550 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, exactly.
172 00:13:56.780 ⇒ 00:13:57.149 Uttam Kumaran: So I.
173 00:13:57.150 ⇒ 00:13:59.570 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, you can, you can create the workflow. Yeah.
174 00:13:59.730 ⇒ 00:14:02.030 Uttam Kumaran: We’ll use something like flow. Wise.
175 00:14:02.210 ⇒ 00:14:03.580 Uttam Kumaran: Ideally.
176 00:14:04.040 ⇒ 00:14:07.359 Uttam Kumaran: this is like a low, an open source
177 00:14:07.590 ⇒ 00:14:10.169 Uttam Kumaran: kind of like these flows that you can make.
178 00:14:10.690 ⇒ 00:14:11.939 Uttam Kumaran: but for now
179 00:14:11.970 ⇒ 00:14:14.260 Uttam Kumaran: oh, I’m fine to use something like this.
180 00:14:14.780 ⇒ 00:14:15.280 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, okay.
181 00:14:15.280 ⇒ 00:14:18.500 Uttam Kumaran: I’m just. I want it to work, and then we can cut it out.
182 00:14:18.850 ⇒ 00:14:27.829 Uttam Kumaran: But basically we have some flows where we can like if I give me a Linkedin, if you give me a name, if you give me a company, I could find people. Apollo does a lot of that, too.
183 00:14:29.900 ⇒ 00:14:34.959 Uttam Kumaran: And so ideally, it’s like a, it’s like a process by which.
184 00:14:35.230 ⇒ 00:14:40.979 Uttam Kumaran: from anywhere, I can get an email, or I can get a company, or I can get a person’s name and company.
185 00:14:41.130 ⇒ 00:14:47.540 Uttam Kumaran: put that into Google, sheet it, then gets all the fields get filled out, and then automatically, that’s pushed to instantly.
186 00:14:48.228 ⇒ 00:14:56.870 Uttam Kumaran: And then we just pick what category they’re in, basically but again, I don’t wanna like this. We’re we’re not sending like tens of thousands of emails.
187 00:14:56.870 ⇒ 00:14:57.980 Nicolas Sucari: Oh, yeah, yeah.
188 00:14:58.000 ⇒ 00:14:59.410 Nicolas Sucari: we can take a look.
189 00:14:59.410 ⇒ 00:15:00.445 Uttam Kumaran: What it is.
190 00:15:01.157 ⇒ 00:15:07.409 Uttam Kumaran: But the job. I I would love the job posting one to be more automated eventually, cause that’s
191 00:15:07.610 ⇒ 00:15:09.309 Uttam Kumaran: that’s 1 that we could just
192 00:15:09.670 ⇒ 00:15:11.079 Uttam Kumaran: continue to do so.
193 00:15:11.080 ⇒ 00:15:11.830 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah.
194 00:15:12.780 ⇒ 00:15:17.870 Nicolas Sucari: yeah. And probably, if you need to do it manually, is the one that takes you more most time. Right?
195 00:15:19.420 ⇒ 00:15:20.200 Nicolas Sucari: Yep.
196 00:15:20.200 ⇒ 00:15:23.909 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I can’t do any none. None of this can be manual, like I.
197 00:15:23.910 ⇒ 00:15:25.060 Nicolas Sucari: No.
198 00:15:25.060 ⇒ 00:15:26.090 Uttam Kumaran: Through
199 00:15:26.666 ⇒ 00:15:32.170 Uttam Kumaran: one of these. And then I want to use AI basically like instead of having
200 00:15:32.700 ⇒ 00:15:33.680 Uttam Kumaran: like.
201 00:15:33.790 ⇒ 00:15:35.579 Uttam Kumaran: And instantly I have
202 00:15:37.900 ⇒ 00:15:39.220 Uttam Kumaran: like a
203 00:15:39.920 ⇒ 00:15:46.339 Uttam Kumaran: like. Instead of this, I can make it something about the person like about their profile, or about something we have in common.
204 00:15:46.640 ⇒ 00:15:51.179 Uttam Kumaran: like something more personalized right now, the only personalizations
205 00:15:51.190 ⇒ 00:15:52.409 Uttam Kumaran: are this
206 00:15:52.680 ⇒ 00:15:53.780 Uttam Kumaran: and this.
207 00:15:53.990 ⇒ 00:15:55.480 Uttam Kumaran: But ideally.
208 00:15:55.970 ⇒ 00:15:59.240 Uttam Kumaran: you can personalize even more. So that’s the things that I’ll be
209 00:15:59.320 ⇒ 00:16:14.569 Uttam Kumaran: again continuing to improve basically because it it’s gonna it’ll take. Let’s say it takes like 50 min to write an email and send it like we that’s like 2 way too much time. So I use AI to do a little bit of personalization.
210 00:16:14.690 ⇒ 00:16:18.242 Uttam Kumaran: And then within here, like, I have,
211 00:16:20.450 ⇒ 00:16:24.690 Uttam Kumaran: I have like leads here somewhere.
212 00:16:28.810 ⇒ 00:16:31.595 Uttam Kumaran: yeah, like within these leads also.
213 00:16:35.280 ⇒ 00:16:36.250 Uttam Kumaran: a.
214 00:16:38.550 ⇒ 00:16:41.089 Uttam Kumaran: I can use AI to do things like
215 00:16:41.130 ⇒ 00:16:44.810 Uttam Kumaran: generate a sentence using a bunch of their information.
216 00:16:45.110 ⇒ 00:16:47.050 Uttam Kumaran: generate a 1st line
217 00:16:47.460 ⇒ 00:16:51.529 Uttam Kumaran: and put in the Linkedin, so it it can do some smart stuff.
218 00:16:52.030 ⇒ 00:16:54.609 Uttam Kumaran: And you can see, like all these
219 00:16:54.970 ⇒ 00:16:55.589 Uttam Kumaran: emails are.
220 00:16:55.590 ⇒ 00:16:55.930 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah.
221 00:16:55.930 ⇒ 00:16:56.500 Uttam Kumaran: That work
222 00:16:56.750 ⇒ 00:16:57.840 Uttam Kumaran: like so.
223 00:16:59.760 ⇒ 00:17:02.219 Nicolas Sucari: And this is really interesting.
224 00:17:06.589 ⇒ 00:17:07.659 Uttam Kumaran: Go for it.
225 00:17:08.339 ⇒ 00:17:08.989 Nicolas Sucari: Yep.
226 00:17:09.279 ⇒ 00:17:11.329 Nicolas Sucari: Oh, yeah, we’ll we will see
227 00:17:11.529 ⇒ 00:17:13.399 Nicolas Sucari: how effective are those.
228 00:17:14.060 ⇒ 00:17:14.440 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
229 00:17:14.440 ⇒ 00:17:17.480 Nicolas Sucari: Techniques. And see, yeah, we can
230 00:17:17.530 ⇒ 00:17:19.820 Nicolas Sucari: get some conversions. I think.
231 00:17:20.079 ⇒ 00:17:23.929 Uttam Kumaran: So the one thing I’m also gonna do is as soon as like, probably
232 00:17:23.959 ⇒ 00:17:27.399 Uttam Kumaran: on tues on Monday, I’ll go in and actually
233 00:17:29.099 ⇒ 00:17:34.189 Uttam Kumaran: connect with everybody that we email. And then also send them a Linkedin message.
234 00:17:34.921 ⇒ 00:17:36.367 Uttam Kumaran: which we have.
235 00:17:38.019 ⇒ 00:17:40.749 Uttam Kumaran: I already have the copy for basically. So
236 00:17:41.129 ⇒ 00:17:46.329 Uttam Kumaran: that’s what I’m gonna have Jared Brian help out on is basically log into my profile.
237 00:17:46.530 ⇒ 00:17:46.850 Nicolas Sucari: Okay.
238 00:17:46.850 ⇒ 00:17:47.509 Uttam Kumaran: The people
239 00:17:47.890 ⇒ 00:17:51.540 Uttam Kumaran: look at the people that we’ve contacted and go send them a message
240 00:17:52.190 ⇒ 00:17:54.590 Uttam Kumaran: that way. We have multiple touch points.
241 00:17:55.360 ⇒ 00:17:55.880 Uttam Kumaran: And then that.
242 00:17:55.880 ⇒ 00:17:56.790 Nicolas Sucari: Good, but.
243 00:17:56.790 ⇒ 00:17:59.869 Uttam Kumaran: Haven’t. That’s a sales. That’s what salespeople do. So that’s it.
244 00:17:59.870 ⇒ 00:18:00.699 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, with.
245 00:18:01.500 ⇒ 00:18:03.540 Nicolas Sucari: we can also use
246 00:18:04.060 ⇒ 00:18:09.859 Nicolas Sucari: like, we can invite people to follow Brainford space on Linkedin.
247 00:18:10.956 ⇒ 00:18:12.370 Nicolas Sucari: I think.
248 00:18:12.910 ⇒ 00:18:13.530 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
249 00:18:19.830 ⇒ 00:18:20.529 Nicolas Sucari: But yeah.
250 00:18:20.720 ⇒ 00:18:21.660 Nicolas Sucari: it’s fine.
251 00:18:22.800 ⇒ 00:18:25.000 Uttam Kumaran: I haven’t even checked that page in a while.
252 00:18:25.980 ⇒ 00:18:29.710 Nicolas Sucari: I think we if we yeah, I think we need to start like
253 00:18:29.880 ⇒ 00:18:31.320 Nicolas Sucari: publishing
254 00:18:31.710 ⇒ 00:18:41.250 Nicolas Sucari: something. Because if people is looking, if you’re sending emails, people wants to look about what we are doing or anything we we need to have something there.
255 00:18:41.390 ⇒ 00:18:42.140 Nicolas Sucari: right.
256 00:18:42.970 ⇒ 00:18:44.360 Uttam Kumaran: No, you’re right. You’re right.
257 00:18:46.710 ⇒ 00:18:49.390 Nicolas Sucari: Probably just like using
258 00:18:50.190 ⇒ 00:18:53.280 Nicolas Sucari: any of these tools and just like
259 00:18:53.610 ⇒ 00:18:55.939 Nicolas Sucari: showing the stellar
260 00:18:56.180 ⇒ 00:18:58.700 Nicolas Sucari: source case study there.
261 00:18:58.990 ⇒ 00:19:00.240 Nicolas Sucari: That should be okay.
262 00:19:00.240 ⇒ 00:19:07.149 Uttam Kumaran: Exactly. And then, yeah, what I’ll I mean, what I’ll do is once we have all those case studies that I’m gonna have. Jp, help
263 00:19:07.340 ⇒ 00:19:08.014 Uttam Kumaran: with
264 00:19:09.750 ⇒ 00:19:12.609 Uttam Kumaran: the thumbnail images, and like
265 00:19:13.130 ⇒ 00:19:19.810 Uttam Kumaran: like some of the header images for the Linkedin. And then we’ll use AI basically to to to write the post.
266 00:19:19.890 ⇒ 00:19:23.330 Uttam Kumaran: and then it’s ready. And then we have the link.
267 00:19:23.490 ⇒ 00:19:31.130 Uttam Kumaran: and then the link it all kind of like circles. And then every time we we publish. And then, basically, we put on a schedule like
268 00:19:31.330 ⇒ 00:19:38.050 Uttam Kumaran: every month or so. We republish every single case study and like it, kind of rolls forward. You know
269 00:19:39.590 ⇒ 00:19:44.329 Uttam Kumaran: the whole. The thing I realized is like everything we got. A workflow like
270 00:19:44.490 ⇒ 00:19:49.010 Uttam Kumaran: nothing is possible. If it’s manual in this, in the sales.
271 00:19:49.900 ⇒ 00:19:50.799 Nicolas Sucari: Totally yes.
272 00:19:50.800 ⇒ 00:19:55.608 Uttam Kumaran: Let me follow up so many things that
273 00:19:57.220 ⇒ 00:20:01.019 Uttam Kumaran: The only way is to hire like a ton of people.
274 00:20:01.870 ⇒ 00:20:02.930 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, soon.
275 00:20:03.480 ⇒ 00:20:17.879 Nicolas Sucari: Also, like I, I, I was working before on on my other company, a software development company. And when we wanted to get some leads like they went the like. The salespeople went to some events. They send messages through
276 00:20:17.900 ⇒ 00:20:26.479 Nicolas Sucari: Linkedin, but they were not using like these AI tools that we are using. So I think it’s something different. Then it will help a lot
277 00:20:26.530 ⇒ 00:20:28.359 Nicolas Sucari: increasing those needs.
278 00:20:28.410 ⇒ 00:20:31.870 Nicolas Sucari: And yeah, the sales world has changed
279 00:20:31.910 ⇒ 00:20:36.210 Nicolas Sucari: a lot since everything that has been created right.
280 00:20:37.460 ⇒ 00:20:43.530 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. And again, like, I think the only role I would hire is like, ideally, I can bring on someone that’s like
281 00:20:43.700 ⇒ 00:20:54.180 Uttam Kumaran: Jared, who can also do engineering, and then also, like help sales, or is like somewhere in the between because the the problem with engineers is, they’re not like
282 00:20:54.730 ⇒ 00:20:59.529 Uttam Kumaran: they won’t. They’re not good at sales at all like even me. I’m not like.
283 00:20:59.540 ⇒ 00:21:05.680 Uttam Kumaran: I’m somehow like through sheer like Will, forcing myself to learn this.
284 00:21:05.770 ⇒ 00:21:16.549 Uttam Kumaran: but it’s not what I wake up in the morning looking forward to. So it’s hard to find other people like me to do it, because it takes a level of like
285 00:21:16.650 ⇒ 00:21:22.912 Uttam Kumaran: you just need to fight through. No, no, after no after no! And
286 00:21:24.020 ⇒ 00:21:28.249 Uttam Kumaran: like salespeople, are good at that. But the sales who are not good at anything else.
287 00:21:28.250 ⇒ 00:21:28.949 Nicolas Sucari: Say blue.
288 00:21:28.950 ⇒ 00:21:34.565 Uttam Kumaran: Engineers are not good at that, but they’re good at so like it’s so tough.
289 00:21:35.280 ⇒ 00:21:42.979 Uttam Kumaran: that’s why, if I can find someone like Jared, who’s like interested in data, but also, like has a sales background. It’s actually perfect. Because
290 00:21:43.000 ⇒ 00:21:51.159 Uttam Kumaran: he’ll be able to talk about what we’re doing and why and like, that’s a perfect role for like kind of like a
291 00:21:51.240 ⇒ 00:21:52.930 Uttam Kumaran: sales engineer.
292 00:21:53.080 ⇒ 00:21:54.460 Uttam Kumaran: Kind of thing, you know.
293 00:21:54.800 ⇒ 00:21:55.460 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah.
294 00:21:56.330 ⇒ 00:21:58.019 Nicolas Sucari: yeah, I agree.
295 00:22:01.220 ⇒ 00:22:23.069 Uttam Kumaran: Okay. Yeah. So I spent some time this morning. I wanted to kind of go through this document that I shared kind of just spend some time thinking about last month and June of like how the like, I mean how the Pm. Function has been going. And then I think just like, especially as I’ve been spending the last few weeks.
296 00:22:23.280 ⇒ 00:22:32.760 Uttam Kumaran: you know, doing a lot more on sales. My consensus is that it’s just gonna get worse. May basically that like, I’m gonna have to spend
297 00:22:33.090 ⇒ 00:22:36.890 Uttam Kumaran: way more time. And we’re not even in a point where I’m
298 00:22:36.900 ⇒ 00:22:38.769 Uttam Kumaran: in in meetings.
299 00:22:39.323 ⇒ 00:22:49.140 Uttam Kumaran: So for us to be able to get my time to go, set up the documents, finish the website set up like to do this Linkedin automations.
300 00:22:49.190 ⇒ 00:22:55.009 Uttam Kumaran: It’s just gonna take like another 2 weeks of like a full attention.
301 00:22:55.170 ⇒ 00:23:11.180 Uttam Kumaran: So the one thing I wanted to go through is just like how I’ve been kind of thinking about the stuff we set out in the beginning about like the Pm. Role here, and like just all the things that that you’ve been tackling, that I’ve been tackling, and I’ve been kind of like handing off.
302 00:23:11.280 ⇒ 00:23:21.839 Uttam Kumaran: and then just go through what I think is going really well, what I think like there’s probably some room. And then what I think is just like we’re really having some challenges and talk about them. Not as like
303 00:23:22.574 ⇒ 00:23:27.759 Uttam Kumaran: not particularly about like you or me handling them. But more about like these are the
304 00:23:27.800 ⇒ 00:23:30.330 Uttam Kumaran: these are the facts of like, what’s going on?
305 00:23:31.396 ⇒ 00:23:33.229 Uttam Kumaran: More talk about like.
306 00:23:33.340 ⇒ 00:23:49.289 Uttam Kumaran: do we agree. Do we both agree that that these are things that’s challenging? And then how do we get through it? And the main reason is one. I think one. I always know that people have a hard time with conversations like this and feedback. So I try to be really
307 00:23:49.616 ⇒ 00:23:59.433 Uttam Kumaran: upfront with it. But also, W, we’re both attacking like the problem. So that’s the one thing I wanna establish. The second thing is again, it’s just gonna get worse. So.
308 00:23:59.750 ⇒ 00:24:00.620 Nicolas Sucari: I know me.
309 00:24:00.850 ⇒ 00:24:06.089 Uttam Kumaran: For me. It’s like I wanna I wanna know what we’ve tried so far where we think
310 00:24:06.130 ⇒ 00:24:15.680 Uttam Kumaran: things are breaking down. But also like I know that this process, our goal, is for this to work, not only for 2 clients, but for like 5,
311 00:24:15.960 ⇒ 00:24:23.610 Uttam Kumaran: right? And so that’s what I want to basically see as we’re as we’re again, everything is in the
312 00:24:23.620 ⇒ 00:24:37.300 Uttam Kumaran: everything is in the hope that the business grows right. So that’s the only thing we we plan. So I. So there are some things that I want to basically tackle head on to like how we’re gonna how we do this and how we’re gonna do it. So that when we do bring additional clients on, we.
313 00:24:37.330 ⇒ 00:24:39.650 Uttam Kumaran: we’re like, cool. We know exactly like
314 00:24:39.700 ⇒ 00:24:40.890 Uttam Kumaran: how to go.
315 00:24:41.530 ⇒ 00:24:42.140 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
316 00:24:42.180 ⇒ 00:24:45.469 Uttam Kumaran: So yeah, I don’t know if you had a chance to read this. I can give you like a minute or 2.
317 00:24:45.470 ⇒ 00:24:47.550 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, I I
318 00:24:47.620 ⇒ 00:24:49.730 Nicolas Sucari: I already went through all of the
319 00:24:50.105 ⇒ 00:24:59.100 Nicolas Sucari: the document before. So yeah, we can. I don’t know if we if we wanna talk on something. Specifically, I think the good stuff. Yeah.
320 00:24:59.100 ⇒ 00:25:05.346 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, give me your feedback like. What do you think? What do you think is accurate? What do you think is inaccurate? What do you think is missing?
321 00:25:06.980 ⇒ 00:25:20.350 Nicolas Sucari: So I think, yeah, I think everything is pretty accurate. We need to improve the consistency in client communications. Yeah, we only missed last week’s email sending stuff. So probably, yeah, I’m I’m gonna
322 00:25:20.640 ⇒ 00:25:38.370 Nicolas Sucari: get to that one today and obviously send tomorrow. And we’ll be, I think, good on that one the use of milestones? My sense there is that the milestones that we set at the beginning of the month are kind of difficult to group the tasks that we are working on right now
323 00:25:38.370 ⇒ 00:25:56.889 Nicolas Sucari: pro, because probably the milestones are kind of really detailed on what we should be working, and as weeks goes by like the tasks sometimes change the focus change and some priorities too. So probably we need to kind of adjust the milestones is something that we can. We can group them like in
324 00:25:57.000 ⇒ 00:26:19.629 Nicolas Sucari: more kind of broad categories. For example, like, I know that we have 4 type of tests that engineering that are modeling and Nbc’s and documentation. I’m not saying we need those for milestones, and just group everything there, but try to group a little bit more with broad categories. That will make it easier to understand what we are working on and what are deliverables like trying to?
325 00:26:19.998 ⇒ 00:26:27.171 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, what we are trying to to to deliver to the client, and what is like our added value. There.
326 00:26:28.410 ⇒ 00:26:49.699 Nicolas Sucari: Then, I think, like, I know, that you’re you’re you’re you’re we’re really busy on sales stuff. And that’s okay. I mean, it’s our top priority right now. I I understand that. And it’s great. And I think it will be easier once we start getting clients not not easier in the way of our work, and probably that will become harder. I think.
327 00:26:50.049 ⇒ 00:26:57.740 Uttam Kumaran: I would say, I’ll tell you. My stress will go. Will get a little bit better. But like that’s that’s that’s what.
328 00:26:58.090 ⇒ 00:26:59.450 Nicolas Sucari: That’s what’s need to happen. I mean.
329 00:26:59.450 ⇒ 00:27:01.059 Uttam Kumaran: You know? Yeah, so.
330 00:27:01.060 ⇒ 00:27:18.430 Nicolas Sucari: And it will. It will give us sense of like accomplishment on getting like new clients, and brings new things to the team. That will be great. So I understand that what I think we need to keep doing, and it’s just my only ask for you is to spend 1 h of the week
331 00:27:18.430 ⇒ 00:27:43.309 Nicolas Sucari: going through the backlog with me. We did it like 2 weeks, and it was kind of great, because we knew what was there and what we needed to do each of the weeks, and then we stopped and we kind. It was kind of difficult for me to get back on track with everyone on on what we need to do for the next week. Right? So if we can spend like 1 h of the week doing that, I think it would be great.
332 00:27:44.900 ⇒ 00:27:49.027 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, okay, let’s even plan even further, let’s just take
333 00:27:51.630 ⇒ 00:27:57.760 Uttam Kumaran: So kind of what I’ve done with my schedule is, I’ve blocked out basically like
334 00:27:57.900 ⇒ 00:27:59.619 Uttam Kumaran: the morning, as like.
335 00:27:59.620 ⇒ 00:28:00.400 Nicolas Sucari: Okay. Thanks.
336 00:28:00.400 ⇒ 00:28:06.760 Uttam Kumaran: Gonna just do edge stuff, whatever you need. But the rest of the day I’m based gonna be like
337 00:28:06.840 ⇒ 00:28:13.989 Uttam Kumaran: I may or may not. So what I think we should do is, let’s just take one of those. And I’m not booking any
338 00:28:14.080 ⇒ 00:28:21.149 Uttam Kumaran: like external meetings. I’m basically like, I’m available 8 to 10 for anything. So I think, let’s just take.
339 00:28:21.710 ⇒ 00:28:27.390 Uttam Kumaran: Let’s just take like like one of those blocks and do this every week.
340 00:28:28.810 ⇒ 00:28:56.220 Nicolas Sucari: I I think if we can spend like 1 h reviewing what we have there on board, and what like, specifically, are working on each of the guys so that we can plan the week, and I can then go back to them, communicate, see what they’ve done, see what they are missing. Check the deadlines, see the due dates that we are setting, and see if they are reaching the deadlines and we can review that every week. It will make like our process easier on planning and then understand it. What we can achieve right.
341 00:28:57.390 ⇒ 00:28:59.790 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. And then and then again, the goal is like
342 00:28:59.950 ⇒ 00:29:09.119 Uttam Kumaran: me, and you have either way I want to consider is like me, and you have as much time as we need, and I know, like I’ve been in and out of that. So let’s definitely do that.
343 00:29:09.120 ⇒ 00:29:09.859 Nicolas Sucari: So little.
344 00:29:09.860 ⇒ 00:29:10.689 Uttam Kumaran: The the I think.
345 00:29:10.690 ⇒ 00:29:11.480 Nicolas Sucari: Wearing it.
346 00:29:11.620 ⇒ 00:29:19.689 Uttam Kumaran: I think where it comes out of is like. If the engineers are spending more time figuring out what to do, then they’re gonna Bill, and that’s what we’ll talk about.
347 00:29:19.690 ⇒ 00:29:20.200 Nicolas Sucari: Cycling.
348 00:29:20.200 ⇒ 00:29:21.459 Uttam Kumaran: Here, and then I guess.
349 00:29:21.750 ⇒ 00:29:22.040 Nicolas Sucari: Us.
350 00:29:22.500 ⇒ 00:29:23.360 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, so.
351 00:29:23.360 ⇒ 00:29:27.807 Nicolas Sucari: That’s on us, like if we if we can’t give them like clear,
352 00:29:28.210 ⇒ 00:29:48.620 Nicolas Sucari: clear view of what they need to do and go and execute. It’s they. They will like, lose time on trying to understand stuff, and they will be more and not get things done right? So that’s what we are trying. Not. Yeah. We need to try not to happen. And I think that if we spend 1 h just in the week trying to plan out what are the tasks for that week? It would be great.
353 00:29:49.350 ⇒ 00:29:54.509 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, so let’s do that. And then I wanna do I wanna kind of have 2.
354 00:29:55.050 ⇒ 00:29:58.979 Uttam Kumaran: I kinda wanna have like 2 things we do. One is
355 00:29:59.453 ⇒ 00:30:14.639 Uttam Kumaran: I want to be able to. Of course, like, have a time. Do use Mondays to basically make sure everybody knows what they’re working on for the week. But I also want to have time, for example, on like a Friday morning, or maybe we have the Friday weekly where
356 00:30:14.710 ⇒ 00:30:18.520 Uttam Kumaran: we can. We can send people like, Hey, go review these tickets.
357 00:30:18.800 ⇒ 00:30:20.309 Uttam Kumaran: And this is what’s coming
358 00:30:20.720 ⇒ 00:30:38.030 Uttam Kumaran: right kind of do like grooming. Cause I think one of the things that, and we haven’t done that in the past. We mainly lumped it all together, but only been questions about like this is missing something or like, I don’t have full context. I wanna get some gap between that, so that you can.
359 00:30:38.030 ⇒ 00:30:38.350 Nicolas Sucari: Print.
360 00:30:38.350 ⇒ 00:30:39.950 Uttam Kumaran: Or anything that’s meaning.
361 00:30:39.960 ⇒ 00:30:47.099 Uttam Kumaran: For example, good example is Nick. If if we’re like Robert created a ticket, Nick picks it up. He’s like 5 questions.
362 00:30:47.190 ⇒ 00:31:01.219 Uttam Kumaran: That means that ticket isn’t ready like, let that that would have been good to be like, okay, let’s go, maybe back, or Robert. And then Nick is out of that right? So that’s the thing I think we should aim for. That’s a that’s a little bit different than what we’ve done.
363 00:31:02.050 ⇒ 00:31:26.419 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, I think. I think on the cella side. Well, right now we went to the meeting, and Robert just told us that he created like a new ticket. And yeah, we’re gonna review it. But we are not gonna start that one. And what that’s what we agreed with Robert like until everything is ready. We gonna start. I think now it’s ready. So Nick probably will be doing that. And the other task that he was working on is already done. So that’s okay. But yeah, I think if we set like our meetings for
364 00:31:26.420 ⇒ 00:31:34.780 Nicolas Sucari: creating the backlog or planning the week on Thursday, then we can go and send everyone Friday morning like, Hey, can you go review these tickets and
365 00:31:34.780 ⇒ 00:31:42.860 Nicolas Sucari: tell us if you have any questions, and then on Monday. We can agree on what everyone is going to be working on that week right?
366 00:31:43.130 ⇒ 00:31:44.580 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, so let’s.
367 00:31:44.580 ⇒ 00:31:59.689 Nicolas Sucari: The the only issue that I that I see with that is that jacob has only, like the afternoons has only availability on the afternoons to meet, and sometimes it’s kind of late in the day, so
368 00:31:59.710 ⇒ 00:32:14.899 Nicolas Sucari: probably with Jacob, we can do it on Friday, or we can do it asynchronously like sending. What are the tasks that we want him to be working on? So that it’s not that late in the day, because if not on Mondays. We’re losing like an entire day, almost.
369 00:32:15.700 ⇒ 00:32:17.429 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I agree. Okay.
370 00:32:17.960 ⇒ 00:32:19.840 Uttam Kumaran: okay, so let’s do that.
371 00:32:23.360 ⇒ 00:32:29.079 Nicolas Sucari: I think it’s if we can schedule something between us on Thursdays Thursday morning
372 00:32:29.150 ⇒ 00:32:35.900 Nicolas Sucari: that would be great. We can spend an hour reviewing everything, then sending every everything to
373 00:32:36.010 ⇒ 00:32:42.409 Nicolas Sucari: everyone to review. And on Monday I can meet with everyone and just agree on what we are trying to accomplish that week.
374 00:32:42.760 ⇒ 00:32:43.390 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
375 00:32:44.860 ⇒ 00:32:48.439 Uttam Kumaran: okay? And then for Jacob, yeah, we’ll try to meet with him on Friday afternoon.
376 00:32:48.440 ⇒ 00:32:49.830 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, exactly.
377 00:32:50.409 ⇒ 00:32:57.790 Uttam Kumaran: Or like, basically around the time we have the weekly meeting, and then go through stuff for next week.
378 00:32:57.790 ⇒ 00:33:12.360 Nicolas Sucari: It’s with with Jacob is easy. Because I I’m I’m talking a lot with him. I can. Yeah, he’s like, really responsive. So I don’t think it should be a problem, but if we wait until the meeting on Monday afternoon, probably it’s kind of a little bit late.
379 00:33:13.696 ⇒ 00:33:15.680 Uttam Kumaran: We basically probably lose
380 00:33:16.410 ⇒ 00:33:20.164 Uttam Kumaran: most of Friday and Monday at this point. Right? So.
381 00:33:20.540 ⇒ 00:33:21.400 Nicolas Sucari: Exactly.
382 00:33:22.420 ⇒ 00:33:35.919 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, the other thing is on effort estimation. And this is gonna go a little bit into the like what people are billing. But basically like I have a gut. Everything kind of starts from like my gut instinct.
383 00:33:35.920 ⇒ 00:33:37.100 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, I know it.
384 00:33:37.100 ⇒ 00:33:39.949 Uttam Kumaran: It, and then I’m able to think about like.
385 00:33:40.220 ⇒ 00:33:53.319 Uttam Kumaran: is it going good or bad? But again, if this that needs to be a feeling that you also have. But I can’t ask you to be like, have this feeling. So instead, we have to have some common language, which is, gonna be these sorts of like metrics right? And so.
386 00:33:53.320 ⇒ 00:33:53.980 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah.
387 00:33:54.120 ⇒ 00:34:03.282 Uttam Kumaran: The things. And one of the things I I think we should be trying to do this. A effort estimation is, there’s 2 things there’s 1 about estimates, and there’s 1 about how long it actually takes
388 00:34:03.840 ⇒ 00:34:09.540 Uttam Kumaran: both both. One is a guess. One is like a fact, and then the gap between. It is like
389 00:34:09.560 ⇒ 00:34:15.529 Uttam Kumaran: what we don’t know. So I really want to start understanding
390 00:34:15.870 ⇒ 00:34:20.389 Uttam Kumaran: to. I want to start and understanding a couple of things. One is like the efficiency of the people we have
391 00:34:20.489 ⇒ 00:34:23.010 Uttam Kumaran: at any moment like I have to know.
392 00:34:23.429 ⇒ 00:34:26.669 Uttam Kumaran: Are these the right people? Are they working on the right tasks?
393 00:34:26.730 ⇒ 00:34:29.590 Uttam Kumaran: And so that’s the thing is like when we do.
394 00:34:29.600 ⇒ 00:34:46.760 Uttam Kumaran: And this is what maybe we can plan as part of the backlog grooming stuff is we will take. We will take a stab at putting estimation in, and then basically say, you need to confirm these estimates. And then really, those estimates turn into
395 00:34:46.770 ⇒ 00:34:52.819 Uttam Kumaran: hours, and then I can say, great. You have 3 small tasks and 2 mediums per week.
396 00:34:52.900 ⇒ 00:35:08.329 Uttam Kumaran: That’s it. Like I just want. I just want us to have an understanding of that, because then I can bring. I can understand, if I bring on senior people what changes junior people expectations are like that’s going to give us a sense, and then also again for billing purposes.
397 00:35:08.751 ⇒ 00:35:14.210 Uttam Kumaran: Like. Right now we’re billing right now. We’re billing Stella about 10 to 15 h per week.
398 00:35:14.370 ⇒ 00:35:17.260 Uttam Kumaran: Right now we’re building pool parts 20 h per week.
399 00:35:17.853 ⇒ 00:35:23.170 Uttam Kumaran: So. But so Patrick is booked. As Patrick is booked on every
400 00:35:23.380 ⇒ 00:35:41.149 Uttam Kumaran: engineering client as the data engineer, so I wouldn’t consider his hours like, or I wouldn’t consider his hours in like important to one client in particular. But he is spread out across clients, and I still need to know how much things are gonna take for him, because
401 00:35:41.240 ⇒ 00:35:49.409 Uttam Kumaran: if he’s able to handle, I I told him, my expectation is for him to handle 3 clients worth of data engineering. If he’s able to handle 4, that’s great. Then we’ll do 4.
402 00:35:49.410 ⇒ 00:35:50.649 Nicolas Sucari: Oh, yeah, so suddenly.
403 00:35:50.950 ⇒ 00:35:56.437 Uttam Kumaran: So for Ryan. He has 20 h per week right now. He’s primarily working on pool parts
404 00:35:57.119 ⇒ 00:36:14.850 Uttam Kumaran: anywhere from 0 to 20 h per week. And Jacob, he’s working 10 h per week. Currently, he’s doing close to 15, cause I think this past 2 weeks. The nice thing is, I got approval for some more hours. The rough thing is, I think we waste. I think we just. He’s waste a bunch of time on evidence. Shit that I’m like. Take. We’ll just take it off.
405 00:36:14.850 ⇒ 00:36:15.670 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah.
406 00:36:15.670 ⇒ 00:36:17.740 Uttam Kumaran: Just done. I’m just done with it.
407 00:36:17.800 ⇒ 00:36:18.960 Uttam Kumaran: I think
408 00:36:19.110 ⇒ 00:36:20.319 Uttam Kumaran: I think I’ll.
409 00:36:20.320 ⇒ 00:36:21.200 Nicolas Sucari: I think
410 00:36:21.664 ⇒ 00:36:39.609 Nicolas Sucari: I think we need to just like check what he’s been doing like this 2 days, because this time he was spending on evidence wasn’t the configuration on how to do, on, how to run it locally and how to deploy. So if we take all that out, we need to understand how long it takes
411 00:36:39.610 ⇒ 00:36:53.479 Nicolas Sucari: for him to create a new page, to add these sources and write the quote the right queries to for for that sources. Right? So if we know that he can actually manage on creating pages and showing the right information, then we can just
412 00:36:53.838 ⇒ 00:37:10.330 Nicolas Sucari: use time from Patrick, probably, or you to just deploy, create the correct pull request and send everything to production right? Because I think he was being blocked and, like his issues was. We’re on trying to understand how to set all those configurations.
413 00:37:11.050 ⇒ 00:37:14.499 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. But at the same time, like those are always gonna be.
414 00:37:15.140 ⇒ 00:37:16.299 Nicolas Sucari: I know, I know.
415 00:37:16.300 ⇒ 00:37:17.090 Uttam Kumaran: So
416 00:37:17.640 ⇒ 00:37:23.420 Uttam Kumaran: look I I although I I am like, if you could just do the one piece and then like, don’t do everything the rest. But
417 00:37:23.450 ⇒ 00:37:46.100 Uttam Kumaran: it’s if people, it’s, it’s okay. I just. The thing for me is like, I just want to know whether people can do it or not. If it’s a no, I just need to know. The answer, if it’s yes, is Yes, no, no. If we’re in the middle is when I can’t make a decision right? I don’t know. So the nice thing is, I think, basically where I’m just. I’m like we I can’t. We can’t afford any more time. And I don’t have any other
418 00:37:46.100 ⇒ 00:37:55.029 Uttam Kumaran: like we should try this thing. We should try this thing. We’ve tried a bunch of stuff on evidence. I think. Basically, we’ll take me, or Patrick will take all the remaining evidence work.
419 00:37:55.040 ⇒ 00:38:09.840 Uttam Kumaran: you know. I’m gonna figure out how to get AI to do it, and so that’ll be, that’ll be my job. And then, like, I’ll figure that out. I’m also for the future. We know that if we, if we promise evidence, it needs to go to somebody that can handle it.
420 00:38:10.090 ⇒ 00:38:11.110 Nicolas Sucari: Yeah, yeah, I know.
421 00:38:11.110 ⇒ 00:38:13.329 Uttam Kumaran: Have anybody on the analysis side that’s
422 00:38:13.430 ⇒ 00:38:14.570 Uttam Kumaran: technical enough to.
423 00:38:14.570 ⇒ 00:38:21.390 Nicolas Sucari: I mean, it’s oh, sorry I have the meeting with Kim right right now, can I? I can. Can I go there and come back.
424 00:38:21.390 ⇒ 00:38:23.189 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, go go go and to jump back on me.
425 00:38:23.410 ⇒ 00:38:25.050 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, okay.