Meeting Title: Catalog-App-Discussion Date: 2024-02-06 Meeting participants: Uttam Kumaran, Ivana Saginova, Jordan Wong, Ellen Wong, Suewong
WEBVTT
1 00:02:16.390 ⇒ 00:02:20.209 suewong: Hey, Jordan. hey! What’s up? Bob? Hearing
2 00:02:20.840 ⇒ 00:02:21.710 jordan wong: cool?
3 00:02:26.190 ⇒ 00:02:27.670 jordan wong: This is exciting.
4 00:02:28.050 ⇒ 00:02:31.370 suewong: It is our thing is being recorded. Did you know that?
5 00:02:32.930 ⇒ 00:02:34.440 jordan wong: I think.
6 00:02:38.790 ⇒ 00:02:39.929 suewong: what’s that? Jordan?
7 00:02:41.370 ⇒ 00:02:47.000 jordan wong: Yes, I’m happy. This is recorded because I gotta hop off in like 10 min.
8 00:02:48.130 ⇒ 00:02:49.669 Ellen Wong: This is funny.
9 00:02:52.410 ⇒ 00:02:56.160 suewong: I guess that’s a new feature now in zoom, it just auto records.
10 00:02:57.260 ⇒ 00:03:02.349 Ellen Wong: Yeah. Sorry. Go ahead, Jordan.
11 00:03:02.810 ⇒ 00:03:05.419 jordan wong: No, you’re good. I’m just saying it’s required for work.
12 00:03:05.930 ⇒ 00:03:08.500 Ellen Wong: Oh. yeah, it’s usually
13 00:03:08.930 ⇒ 00:03:11.979 Ellen Wong: like for school and stuff. It had to be like, the person
14 00:03:12.150 ⇒ 00:03:14.740 Ellen Wong: is host.
15 00:03:20.230 ⇒ 00:03:21.080 suewong: Okay.
16 00:03:25.790 ⇒ 00:03:29.560 jordan wong: it’s a very good let me get.
17 00:03:39.980 ⇒ 00:03:43.620 suewong: So what floor is you you, Tom.
18 00:03:45.570 ⇒ 00:03:53.329 jordan wong: Yeah, he’s on the the fourth floor. He’s got a sick crib. It’s he’s got a whole balcony like a wrap around balcony.
19 00:03:54.480 ⇒ 00:03:58.580 Ellen Wong: Say, right on like right by the pool. Sweet. He lives in your building.
20 00:03:58.910 ⇒ 00:04:00.130 jordan wong: Yeah.
21 00:04:05.130 ⇒ 00:04:08.969 jordan wong: Oh, my gosh! My legs are shaking. There’s some lights this morning.
22 00:04:09.470 ⇒ 00:04:10.340 Ellen Wong: L.
23 00:04:13.660 ⇒ 00:04:21.870 suewong: So Utah and Ivana and Ivana is in as well.
24 00:04:24.190 ⇒ 00:04:28.300 Ellen Wong: you know. You put yourself on mute Jordan.
25 00:04:28.330 ⇒ 00:04:30.110 jordan wong: and you have a print and receipt.
26 00:04:30.310 ⇒ 00:04:31.040 suewong: Okay.
27 00:04:37.850 ⇒ 00:04:39.250 jordan wong: thank you. Have a good day.
28 00:04:39.570 ⇒ 00:04:45.380 suewong: Hey, Ellen, after the call, do you have time? Okay, I want to run through some of the things.
29 00:04:45.740 ⇒ 00:04:46.880 suewong: You, Tom.
30 00:04:51.440 ⇒ 00:04:52.440 suewong: you, Tom?
31 00:04:52.720 ⇒ 00:04:56.140 Uttam Kumaran: Hey? How’s it going? Good. How are you?
32 00:04:56.780 ⇒ 00:05:02.600 suewong: I have Ellen Jordan. Jordan will probably drop off in about 10 min, cause he has.
33 00:05:03.840 ⇒ 00:05:05.479 suewong: he has to do other work.
34 00:05:06.310 ⇒ 00:05:07.420 Uttam Kumaran: Hey, Jordan.
35 00:05:08.020 ⇒ 00:05:18.519 jordan wong: Hey? What’s up, man, hey? Well, we’re the family dude. You’re part Asian now. It’s crazy.
36 00:05:20.200 ⇒ 00:05:22.440 Uttam Kumaran: That’s definitely true.
37 00:05:22.850 ⇒ 00:05:24.909 suewong: There you are
38 00:05:25.110 ⇒ 00:05:26.840 Uttam Kumaran: on my camera.
39 00:05:29.990 ⇒ 00:05:32.429 suewong: like everyone’s in their own little space.
40 00:05:33.190 ⇒ 00:05:44.810 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, that Indian food was crazy. Bro, isn’t it? Very? It’s very good. We gotta start going around like, very good. That’s my favorite spot. By the way.
41 00:05:45.070 ⇒ 00:05:57.520 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, it was insane! I was talking to Bike. I was like Brow. I was on the toilet for an hour, but it was good as out.
42 00:05:59.370 ⇒ 00:06:03.629 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, cool. We’re just waiting for Yvonne. Let me send her a quick note.
43 00:06:06.880 ⇒ 00:06:13.980 suewong: so as we’re waiting for her. Can you just give a quick on Yvonne and what she does, so that Jordan and Ellen can get up to speed.
44 00:06:14.330 ⇒ 00:06:23.350 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, or maybe I’ll I can let her
45 00:06:23.430 ⇒ 00:06:24.770 ivana saginova: to meet you.
46 00:06:25.340 ⇒ 00:06:38.219 Uttam Kumaran: Okay. Awesome. Well, great to have everyone here. I think everybody has contacts on everybody. But maybe Yvonne, I’ll let you give maybe a brief introduction, and then again, the goal. Today.
47 00:06:38.390 ⇒ 00:06:43.899 Uttam Kumaran: Last week we reviewed a little bit of the goal around the catalog app.
48 00:06:43.920 ⇒ 00:07:01.749 Uttam Kumaran: The primary flows, and like kind of the primary goal of the application. And then my perspective was in any sort of project like this. That number one thing you could do is like at least get it designed, and be able to have, like a little bit more of a grasp from what the look and feel
49 00:07:01.750 ⇒ 00:07:25.420 Uttam Kumaran: product might be. Not only will that kind of get you pretty far to be able to get that feeling. It’s quite a bit cheaper. And you could actually make quite a bit of decision before having any sort of engineering hands on keyboard. And so I call Ivana, who’s one of my good friends. She runs her own design agency, and previously led data led design at at
50 00:07:25.450 ⇒ 00:07:45.559 Uttam Kumaran: that flow code. And I think she’s perfect to kind of handle a task like this, and kind of has done projects like this before. So, Yvonne, maybe if you want to give a little bit of background and then she also has all the context about the project. So you can probably just dive right in to that. Yeah.
51 00:07:45.790 ⇒ 00:07:48.989 ivana saginova: great. Let me share screen.
52 00:07:54.600 ⇒ 00:08:05.030 ivana saginova: You can see my screen. Yes. I go full screen in this. Maybe not. Okay. This is fine. Okay, Hi, I
53 00:08:05.110 ⇒ 00:08:16.700 ivana saginova: and Ivana. Obviously, Tom said that I guess my background. I was born in Bulgaria. I grew up mostly in Las Vegas. I went to a Fine Arts High school, and I started doing graphic design. When I was
54 00:08:16.790 ⇒ 00:08:36.380 ivana saginova: like 14 and I went to Parsons for college. My major, there was like integrated design kind of shark tanky. I focus a lot on creative entrepreneurship and graphic design and print making and stuff like that. And I worked for a lot of tech startups as internships while I was there.
55 00:08:36.380 ⇒ 00:08:52.309 ivana saginova: And then I started working for flow code, where I met Utam and I was one of the first 20 employees. And I kind of built our design team there. I scaled it to figure out how to, you know. Take in design requests.
56 00:08:52.590 ⇒ 00:09:16.460 ivana saginova: hire people move efficiently all of that and I spent 4 years there. I was the head of design. I led our product design team branding creative services, everything kind of under our hood and I left in September to run my own design studio. So we focus on. I guess anything we’re able to do. Brand strategy brand identity, the uxui work
57 00:09:16.460 ⇒ 00:09:38.700 ivana saginova: pitch decks, investor decks all that. So I help my clients with that and then I kinda have some details on what you guys are looking for. Thank you, Tom, for putting together some of this. So I know you wanna create a app that helps individuals catalog their items. And then eventually, whether they wanna resell them or donate them or just have you’d be able to keep track of them.
58 00:09:39.180 ⇒ 00:10:05.160 ivana saginova: And so Tom Outline kind of some of these key flows, and that was helpful. And I was able to then go into process. And so I put together this timeline. I don’t know how fast you guys are looking to go. And I’d love to speak more. But just put this together as reference on the steps. And so first step would be for me to just, you know, spend some time on discovery, understand what else exists in the market, how they’re doing it, and how we can differentiate
59 00:10:05.270 ⇒ 00:10:28.609 ivana saginova: and then from there we go into ideation conceptualization. This is mostly me putting together wireframes that would look kind of like this, and our hand drawn, and you and I can align on that, so that we’re not wasting time on me designing something super high fidelity. And then you’re like this is actually not at all what I had in mind. So let’s get it down in sparks. We can move fast. Erase stuff, put pen marks on, you know.
60 00:10:28.640 ⇒ 00:10:57.960 ivana saginova: Figure that out from there we go into design prototyping, and that’s just creating like a blueprint of the app. Some stuff may be interactive. But this is digital. It’s on the computer. I’m designing in figma. I’m able to share this with people. We are establishing a bit of a design language here. I wouldn’t say you need a full design identity. But just so you can figure out like, okay, some of the values may be that you know your focus on sustainability. You can see that in some of the colors some of the language stuff like that just simple to get the feel for it.
61 00:10:58.240 ⇒ 00:11:16.539 ivana saginova: And that’s like you would see something like this. This is obviously desktop but you can imagine in mobile form where you’re like, okay, can see what everything looks like in the screens. You don’t see the super clicks on like what happens when someone wants to edit something they’ve already cataloged. That’s what’s at the stage. But you’re just figuring out like the flow.
62 00:11:16.540 ⇒ 00:11:41.380 ivana saginova: And then, after that, once we’re aligned on everything and all of those are approved, we would get into. This is like the final stage of implementing all those key flows. So here, you’re like, Okay, someone click, search. And then they search this, and then they click X. So that’s getting into like the super fine details. But most of the time will be spent kind of in the prototyping of figuring that out, getting it in front of people, seeing how people on track
63 00:11:41.380 ⇒ 00:12:04.720 ivana saginova: with iterating, based on that and making sure we feel comfortable about it. And then, once we’re ready to kind of hand off, we move forward. We would get into this stage. But I put together some next steps. Obviously I went through this very fast. I’d love to hear any questions and thoughts you guys have. But the next step for this we wanna move forward is having another meeting or using this meeting to kind of go through exactly what you’re looking for.
64 00:12:04.720 ⇒ 00:12:22.319 ivana saginova: and maybe we can. I can like live design with you. I’ll take out figma or an ipad and just drop and be like, okay, do we want people to open the app and go to this and figure this out, and then that way I can take that and kind of iterate on it, and I’ll spend time on some of that discovery phase. Kinda just get a better understanding of the space
65 00:12:22.430 ⇒ 00:12:37.890 ivana saginova: From there I can put together a better timeline. I don’t know how fast or so you guys wanna move. We can figure out how many hours we wanna spend on it for me per month, rates and all of that, and then, etc. So that was really fast, but let me know. Thoughts and I can go back anywhere.
66 00:12:38.470 ⇒ 00:12:39.680 suewong: Fast is good
67 00:12:39.730 ⇒ 00:12:44.329 ivana saginova: that was a very nice summary
68 00:12:44.470 ⇒ 00:12:54.950 suewong: and just quickly, for for my background for your knowledge. that you went into a Photoshop design, etc., in college because they said you must have that.
69 00:12:55.190 ⇒ 00:13:08.459 suewong: It was good, though, because my first job at Annie ends as a as a brand ambassador for certain geographic areas, I actually had to design my own flyers and things.
70 00:13:08.480 ⇒ 00:13:24.199 suewong: and I enjoyed it. Because it gave me that critical look at it. And then at the end, I’m like, Yeah, somebody else can do this because some more strategic things. So it’s good to to know that. What’s everything that you have laid out I’m familiar with or have touched because I’ve worked with agencies
71 00:13:24.270 ⇒ 00:13:38.600 suewong: various user experiences for product launches. That I have had experienced in. And now I folded in Ellen and Jordan because I want them to also get involved in spearheading, and I will vouch eventually drop back
72 00:13:39.040 ⇒ 00:13:41.499 suewong: and just oversee it from a different lens.
73 00:13:41.880 ⇒ 00:13:44.350 suewong: because
74 00:13:44.680 ⇒ 00:13:55.830 suewong: I believe they’re much more in tuned with the target markets, and we’ll have experience different widgets and stuff like that from an app standpoint that I wouldn’t see. Not to say that I’m aging myself.
75 00:13:55.870 ⇒ 00:14:05.569 suewong: But it’s just you know our target here will be very specific. But yet I don’t want to be so specific that we can’t come out of it
76 00:14:05.640 ⇒ 00:14:07.680 ivana saginova: if that makes sense.
77 00:14:07.690 ⇒ 00:14:17.870 suewong: I’m also, you know, you, Tom, and I discuss that this can grow to be really large. And I, when I first framed it out like it, can, this could be 10 projects
78 00:14:17.980 ⇒ 00:14:29.300 suewong: but I wanna hone it in to, you know, one successful one leads to more successful ones. And then there’s gonna be trial and error as well. And J, just after we
79 00:14:29.350 ⇒ 00:14:43.869 suewong: do the discovery free phase, and we will map out. You know, the user experiences, the pilots and all that stuff before we get out to the marketplace as well in that timeline that you have established. So we’ll feed into that timeline, too.
80 00:14:44.080 ⇒ 00:15:04.810 suewong: So from here you did capture what you, Tom, and I had discussed. And so from here we, we can walk through a workflow quickly and then feed into okay, this is what it’s going to look like. And
81 00:15:04.880 ⇒ 00:15:09.349 suewong: you tell the rate that you had the range.
82 00:15:09.500 ⇒ 00:15:14.279 suewong: I just need to know that for this project, plus plus
83 00:15:14.570 ⇒ 00:15:20.770 suewong: because I know after an app is built we also need to look into, you know, where it would be
84 00:15:20.920 ⇒ 00:15:21.930 suewong: placed
85 00:15:21.990 ⇒ 00:15:35.160 suewong: and the platform. So what Ios and Android place? Or is that a restriction is, you know. So those are the types of architectural things I would like to to know? I I’d like to know what my endpoint is going to be.
86 00:15:35.910 ⇒ 00:15:41.620 suewong: Because it doesn’t make any sense to build something, and it can’t go somewhere, because, you know different investments need to be made.
87 00:15:42.000 ⇒ 00:15:55.439 Uttam Kumaran: Css, so what for the one thing we can do is as we kind of agree on the scope of the design, and that would really for that pretty much. It’s like hand in hand in what gets built. I could begin to get a quote for what happens. Post
88 00:15:55.440 ⇒ 00:16:16.420 Uttam Kumaran: design. Again, the big things to consider are, yeah, it’s is it just going to be Ios or Android? Is this going to be pure mobile? And then the top like, ultimately, it’s like cash for timeline. So basically is, if you can give me a broad sense of hey, even as a whole, for the whole project, let’s say, can we get
89 00:16:16.420 ⇒ 00:16:44.500 Uttam Kumaran: an app out? For the original flows by like August or July? Right? So, having just even that sense, we can begin to back into. Where do we need to make investments resources? So I think Ivana will be able to provide. You know how fast we can move on the design side. But the engineering side. The only context I will give is that it will take longer than expected, and it’s always more complicated than expected.
90 00:16:44.500 ⇒ 00:17:13.000 Uttam Kumaran: So the reason why I want I suggest to getting it designed first is, you don’t want engineers to get creative. I think the best thing we can do is provide them with very clear outline of the flows. And then it’s very easy for me to then govern like how long that’s gonna take. But again, rough goals on timeline would be helpful. And then we can move levers to kind of change price.
91 00:17:13.099 ⇒ 00:17:34.079 suewong: That sounds good. Yeah. My rule of thumb is that you don’t get engineers and clinical people involved in dictating what it’s gonna look like. So with that, can I? Go through more detail on the flow.
92 00:17:34.480 ⇒ 00:17:42.010 suewong: You know what we want to build right? So we want to have this experience about like
93 00:17:42.200 ⇒ 00:17:57.530 suewong: my closet or my wardrobe and the the goal for this is to have a catalog library, whatever that term is going to be about what you have in your closet, and it’s not going to be everything that gets uploaded if you choose not to.
94 00:17:57.870 ⇒ 00:18:05.800 suewong: But we’ll be marketing what you what we want for you to upload, because the end goal of this this
95 00:18:05.960 ⇒ 00:18:28.099 suewong: library is for you to decide. If you want to just purely have a log and keep your items. You want to donate your items, you want to toss your items. You want to resell your items. So that’s the endpoint experience of integrating to to what that next phase is after we give them this ex. This portal experience.
96 00:18:28.390 ⇒ 00:18:37.030 suewong: So the flow here, like any other app, is the steps of, you know, initiating the sign in the account.
97 00:18:37.240 ⇒ 00:18:38.680 suewong: That is.
98 00:18:38.710 ⇒ 00:18:40.709 suewong: is that pretty much a
99 00:18:40.990 ⇒ 00:18:45.070 suewong: So what I’m looking for already built for that, so we don’t have to go through it.
100 00:18:45.370 ⇒ 00:19:06.859 suewong: Yeah, that’ll just be like a look and feel thing the way you do. Authentication and things like that are pretty standard right? Stan, that’s where. Yeah, we do. You know, based on Ellen’s experience, and how people decide to opt out of something really quickly. And and that’s for discussion, too, because I would like to know?
101 00:19:06.860 ⇒ 00:19:16.479 suewong: I know I don’t get into it too much. I know what I want, and I know that I’ve gone to apps that I’m like I’m never going to use it again, so I cancel it. But my subscription has already been paid for for the year.
102 00:19:17.360 ⇒ 00:19:26.719 suewong: And that’s a a business input, and I don’t know how that would work if someone were to say, Okay, I’m out. I’m opting out clearly. You want them to pay for the whole year.
103 00:19:27.050 ⇒ 00:19:42.579 suewong: Because you monetize that but the one thing I wanted to do was, if we did have a trial, and I think most apps do. Is to limit. You know how many outfits that you’re going to put in so that they can work through the entire experience.
104 00:19:43.390 ⇒ 00:19:55.689 suewong: But yeah, if they don’t do the entire experience. But the trial period and and this Ellen will chime in is, you know, what is that 7 days, 14 days. What’s enough to to tease that? This is a good
105 00:19:56.010 ⇒ 00:19:57.720 suewong: app to have and to keep.
106 00:19:59.280 ⇒ 00:20:10.630 ivana saginova: Yeah. And I think we can figure that out like through user testing and just through live. So I don’t think that’s something we need to do today, but good to keep in mind. And then the.
107 00:20:11.390 ⇒ 00:20:13.630 suewong: you know, getting start the tutorial.
108 00:20:13.920 ⇒ 00:20:15.790 ivana saginova: It’s added into this.
109 00:20:16.720 ⇒ 00:20:21.809 suewong: and then, you know the taking a picture or uploading into the library.
110 00:20:22.870 ⇒ 00:20:34.220 suewong: and to have pre and then once you do, that is then to do a description about what you just took and wanted to have like pre-fixed
111 00:20:34.260 ⇒ 00:20:38.929 suewong: inputs, so that no one’s typing up a a book and not knowing what it was.
112 00:20:39.000 ⇒ 00:20:42.489 suewong: So the the item, the size, the brand
113 00:20:43.640 ⇒ 00:20:48.099 suewong: date it was bought because we’re assuming we’re assuming
114 00:20:48.200 ⇒ 00:20:49.559 suewong: 2 things with that
115 00:20:49.680 ⇒ 00:20:54.820 suewong: if you bought it today and you’re just you’re gonna influence. Take a picture when you bought it.
116 00:20:54.930 ⇒ 00:21:01.860 suewong: cause it’s new and but if they still have something in their closet, I guess that field
117 00:21:02.150 ⇒ 00:21:03.310 suewong: could be
118 00:21:03.340 ⇒ 00:21:08.530 suewong: not a required field, because if you already have something in your closet. You you know what I mean
119 00:21:08.660 ⇒ 00:21:14.759 suewong: that you’re not buying now, but you’ve had it cause you bought it 6 months ago or a year ago. But it’s still new.
120 00:21:14.900 ⇒ 00:21:15.740 ivana saginova: Yeah.
121 00:21:15.970 ⇒ 00:21:31.359 suewong: they can input that. And then the price, because we, if they do decide to sell, at least they know what their price was. Yeah, I think also good for, like, you’re buying a vintage item, right? People want to know what year it is, and maybe you’ll forget that in 3 years. But to just have it in the app is nice, right?
122 00:21:31.470 ⇒ 00:21:35.220 suewong: Yes. but nice and and simple.
123 00:21:35.260 ⇒ 00:21:41.900 suewong: and we’ll get that in the in the highlight as well, just to see what else is missing, and then to be able to create an album
124 00:21:42.190 ⇒ 00:21:54.549 suewong: and and then to have the user be guided through by naming their album. And we wanted to have some level of
125 00:21:54.860 ⇒ 00:21:57.270 suewong: of customization.
126 00:21:58.240 ⇒ 00:22:05.840 suewong: meaning that I do like the personalization saying, this is my athletic closet. My, you know, my, my, my
127 00:22:05.860 ⇒ 00:22:12.880 suewong: and have that relationship. And they can customize after we do the my, they can input what they need.
128 00:22:15.350 ⇒ 00:22:17.389 suewong: and then
129 00:22:20.260 ⇒ 00:22:24.340 ivana saginova: So you don’t need the hierarchy of things right now. Right? We can work that in
130 00:22:24.700 ⇒ 00:22:34.090 suewong: and then also Alan brought this up, and I thought it was really nice, and we can add it in here and see how it works. Is that
131 00:22:34.240 ⇒ 00:22:36.729 suewong: the other part about
132 00:22:36.790 ⇒ 00:22:47.130 suewong: where it’ll go like donate, etc., she said. You know what’s been popular now is to have a a link of that article to send to a friend.
133 00:22:47.230 ⇒ 00:22:48.780 ivana saginova: Hmm! Sure
134 00:22:49.820 ⇒ 00:22:55.139 suewong: to see if something they want again working your network and repurposing what you have.
135 00:22:55.300 ⇒ 00:23:04.519 ivana saginova: That’s interesting. I also comes comes to mind so many people do like an Instagram sale, and you’re easily able to some spotify like, share the song. And it goes in story Format
136 00:23:04.810 ⇒ 00:23:08.680 Uttam Kumaran: suggested to is thinking about how to
137 00:23:08.780 ⇒ 00:23:36.499 Uttam Kumaran: like increase the virality right? A lot of what you do for customer acquisition is gonna be through like paid marketing. So you could do within the product itself to like, alleviate those costs. You want to do so exactly like things like quaking quickly, able to share a screenshot things easy to really refer people to the app things like that. I think there’s probably going to be some sort of like sharing features to work on.
138 00:23:36.720 ⇒ 00:23:37.480 suewong: Yes.
139 00:23:37.700 ⇒ 00:23:38.400 ivana saginova: oops.
140 00:23:38.740 ⇒ 00:23:43.190 suewong: and then? What else were we talking about?
141 00:23:49.850 ⇒ 00:23:55.229 suewong: And then, when it comes to once you, you create your library.
142 00:23:56.510 ⇒ 00:23:58.580 suewong: the other things I wanted to.
143 00:23:59.060 ⇒ 00:24:08.550 suewong: So I wanted to to add in to it. If we think it, it creates a a good overall experience trying to influence thought and ideas
144 00:24:08.700 ⇒ 00:24:16.900 suewong: of why you should do this. I’m sure we can build in some backdrops backgrounds. And
145 00:24:17.210 ⇒ 00:24:42.930 suewong: you know also the AI component of showing. You know, this article on on you. But it’s not you, you know. Cause if you’re sending this out just like Ellen said, like Raven sunglass hut. Now they can say, okay, you have this class. Here’s what it’s gonna look like on you. And I think there’s some clothing thing out there, as well, you know. But that’ll be public. They’ll say, Okay, this is what it looks like on the model. But how can we do it? To
146 00:24:43.220 ⇒ 00:24:47.379 suewong: to customize the you meaning? I guess they select their body type
147 00:24:47.620 ⇒ 00:24:57.040 suewong: and then close will pop in. I don’t know if that works. If it gets too complicated we won’t do it at this phase? But it’s available. It’d be nice to take a look into that
148 00:24:57.130 ⇒ 00:25:16.620 suewong: user interface. You’re saying so you could like build an outfit. Yes, build an outfit. When you come first, send me the information for this I used to in high school. Be so silly I would take photos of all my outfits. So so I could match them be like, what am I gonna wear today? So when he first told me about this is like, Oh, so I can plan my outfits. I love that.
149 00:25:16.620 ⇒ 00:25:40.980 Ellen Wong: I was saying that. I don’t know if you ever watch like I, Carly, when you were like younger, but they had like that revolving. And it you just like pops up. And I was like we should do something like that, like somehow, like incorporating it with like the weather or something. And being like, Yeah, you have this in your closet. You should wear it today, cause it’s a hundred percent chance of rain or something
150 00:25:42.010 ⇒ 00:25:42.980 ivana saginova: cool.
151 00:25:43.390 ⇒ 00:25:51.640 suewong: and and the other integration, as she, you know, put that in my head. I thought you know a a lot of the clothing that’s in your closet.
152 00:25:51.710 ⇒ 00:25:58.139 suewong: I believe that the you know the Gen. Z’s the millennials, etc., and even other demographics.
153 00:25:58.220 ⇒ 00:26:09.419 suewong: You know everyone’s going on vacation, and when you go on vacation, what do you do? You’ve got your clause. What do you have? What do I have? What don’t I have so mindset in there and eventually building those influences
154 00:26:09.430 ⇒ 00:26:16.080 suewong: helps create experience. That. Why, this is this app is going to be valuable
155 00:26:16.530 ⇒ 00:26:17.470 ivana saginova: cool.
156 00:26:17.650 ⇒ 00:26:30.549 ivana saginova: I. My mind’s going to 1 million places of like not phase one, because we have phase one, right? You have to start somewhere, but future. I’m like, okay. We we told me I have a friend who they both started a company to connect stylists
157 00:26:30.550 ⇒ 00:26:50.029 ivana saginova: to like guys in. La, that don’t get dressed. It’s like, Okay, there’s all stylists. And there’s all these guys that want to go on a date, but don’t know how to get dressed. So they made an app that connects them in our old CEO. Tim bought their company, but maybe they’d be interesting to share this like a prototype with this later on. And then
158 00:26:50.190 ⇒ 00:27:10.989 ivana saginova: the other thought I had that I lost the tail end to was that it feels like a mix of like mint or like, I don’t know if you guys use. So fi! I moved on, and mint got bought anyways. Where it tells you like. Here you’re qualified for this card, how much your car is worth. And then also, like the photo album. Okay?
159 00:27:11.050 ⇒ 00:27:33.210 Uttam Kumaran: So I think the other. The other thing that’s that, you know, if in my world is like I help a lot of companies build like analytics, and they sell analytics like back to their customers overview of your closet. And it’s like a one screen with. Like the number of items you have categorize. Here’s like the total value. Those are really good, like feedback loops to build, because
160 00:27:33.470 ⇒ 00:27:57.080 suewong: in order for that to get filled out. They’re gonna have to, you know. Go add all their clothes in there. So yeah, that’s I think, probably. No, I like it. Cause II know I’ve moved now twice in a period of like a short time period, and I do look at my things and like Oh, my gosh! All that money that’s sitting right there, and she used to sit there because I keep on moving and treating it going. I should do something with this
161 00:27:57.260 ⇒ 00:28:20.780 ivana saginova: interesting on the cataloging aspect I think, about who was at David’s. Werner started his career on knowing which artist or which our collector had. Which piece, so you guys could say, Okay, Utam has is very vintage Chanel bag. And my neighbor really wants it so she could have a wish list. And then she could say, I’m willing to pay this much money for it. And you, Tom, could be like, Oh, shit! Someone in the world wants to pay me a million dollars for this.
162 00:28:20.810 ⇒ 00:28:29.219 ivana saginova: Maybe I’ll just sell it, because I know I have a buyer, and you have a buyer that you know
163 00:28:29.420 ⇒ 00:28:37.850 suewong: I do know. The retail shops are doing it now. There was a store in our hometown that closed.
164 00:28:37.850 ⇒ 00:28:59.539 suewong: and they were starting to bring in second hand Lou Lou Louis Vuitton’s and but yeah, you looked at it. Call. Is it real? Is it for real? Now you you get that off because now you have a network of friends who says, Oh, you know Sue here does high quality things because I know she has. And so therefore you have more emotional relationship and trust, and all that. So I like that story.
165 00:28:59.760 ⇒ 00:29:06.740 ivana saginova: and it helps move things along as well back to phase one, though.
166 00:29:06.820 ⇒ 00:29:19.119 suewong: So that is the bill. But I do have questions about, is there? Is it our responsibility to to tie into this storage space minimum requirements?
167 00:29:19.160 ⇒ 00:29:22.169 suewong: and also, as you’re taking pictures.
168 00:29:22.380 ⇒ 00:29:27.740 suewong: and at at some point you do decide to to.
169 00:29:28.990 ⇒ 00:29:31.530 suewong: to donate, resell, or toss.
170 00:29:31.990 ⇒ 00:29:38.350 suewong: and how that experience goes through from removing it in your library to create more space.
171 00:29:38.450 ⇒ 00:29:42.869 suewong: But I also know that you know Apple has a stronghold on how space?
172 00:29:43.000 ⇒ 00:29:52.449 suewong: Yeah, the more space you get the better it is for for for that business line. Item meaning that you keep buying more storage so is there a way to.
173 00:29:52.720 ⇒ 00:29:54.160 suewong: you know? Remove
174 00:29:54.280 ⇒ 00:30:05.420 suewong: and help the the user cause I become annoyed with I had I removed that? Why is it still here? But then Ellen countered me by saying, Well, what if you removed it by accident? And it’s still here.
175 00:30:05.550 ⇒ 00:30:14.159 ivana saginova: Yeah, like I sold it. But I still want to know that I once had it, or what it was that I had where I bought it. Stuff like that.
176 00:30:14.540 ⇒ 00:30:20.520 suewong: So it’s something to think about because at some point we’re all maximizing our our cloud space
177 00:30:20.590 ⇒ 00:30:26.229 suewong: and the subscription side that’ll be built in
178 00:30:26.600 ⇒ 00:30:28.980 suewong: like all other apps.
179 00:30:29.710 ⇒ 00:30:32.870 suewong: So we can monetize this
180 00:30:32.930 ⇒ 00:30:37.760 Uttam Kumaran: so the biggest thing on the subscription side is definitely for you all to think about.
181 00:30:37.920 ⇒ 00:31:02.960 Uttam Kumaran: What features exist across the product? Right? And this is typically how these companies go through these sorts of payments, exercises you consider what are all the benefits your platform offers, and then, being able to govern, these are going to be free, and these are going to be paid, and then what is the conversion between free to paid? Is that a trial to pay is that there’s no free trial, and you’d have to pay to even install the app
182 00:31:02.960 ⇒ 00:31:16.000 Uttam Kumaran: right? So th there’s a lot of mechanisms you can do and there’s a lot that’s been written, and there’s a lot of stuff we could do on the payment side. The best thing is to just really outline what the benefits of the application are, and then to test.
183 00:31:16.150 ⇒ 00:31:41.050 Uttam Kumaran: So again, we may not have to get there until later on. But because if it’s just in testing, you could probably just have all the features for free initially. And it just be a testing app. But that’s something to consider. Longer term is, what are the benefits. And then basically, how do you outline? How do you? How do you push the benefits towards the people that pay anything that’s really you know, flashy and interesting features
184 00:31:41.080 ⇒ 00:32:04.730 Uttam Kumaran: like you mentioned some of those AI features, or anything where this is really where the value of the app is, you could begin to, you know, put behind a Paywall. The Flip side is, you know, you want to make sure that you can still demonstrate some value and get people to that conversion point. So this is where there’s just like art and that business. So that’s something. Think about longer term. Either way, all the features need to get developed
185 00:32:04.940 ⇒ 00:32:32.339 ivana saginova: doing that, we can be totally flexible later down the line. We can also prototype that right? Like, we can make a version where, like in clicking through it. You can upload 3 3 things and then it’s locked. And then maybe someone will be like, Okay, I get it all by, or maybe everyone’s gonna be like. Hmm, I really wish I could upload 6 things and see what a whole outfit looks like. So we can get that feedback in like typing stage before it’s built, and you’ll continue to learn along the way. Obviously, so
186 00:32:32.340 ⇒ 00:32:35.100 suewong: right? Right? And
187 00:32:35.490 ⇒ 00:32:38.209 suewong: you know. Quite interesting enough. I have a
188 00:32:38.810 ⇒ 00:32:39.639 are
189 00:32:39.930 ⇒ 00:32:44.930 suewong: friend who was so intrigued about having the 1 million dollar closet.
190 00:32:45.510 ⇒ 00:33:10.489 suewong: And you know, someone in Instagram does that tutorial. And it’s just it cracks me up because I’m like, really, what is what is that? That’s just like all their stuff is worth a million dollars in the closet. That’s the gist the gist is that your things is worth a million dollars, no matter what it’s worth. But if you organize it like a million dollar closet, satisfied that you have a million dollar clauses. So it’s influencing right, and how you can feel good about all the things you have
191 00:33:10.490 ⇒ 00:33:24.210 suewong: which is great. But it it leads towards what people are leaning towards. It is having the notion that you are in on trend. And and also that I’ll come back. Let me just hit that now.
192 00:33:24.350 ⇒ 00:33:35.390 suewong: Because from at some point like, who do you target? Who? Who’s who’s consuming and spending? And you know you have the high schoolers spending a lot of money.
193 00:33:36.340 ⇒ 00:33:53.289 suewong: and you have college students, you know, spending money shouldn’t be spending money, but spending money, but they have things and they have I articles. And then you get to individuals like yourselves. Right now that you’re working, your income has increased. You’re buying different items that are. You know what you really wanted?
194 00:33:53.380 ⇒ 00:34:01.530 suewong: And wanted to keep more so, I guess, or have the discretionary income to do so so as we’re building it.
195 00:34:02.370 ⇒ 00:34:05.709 suewong: I think it could stream through all of of that
196 00:34:05.980 ⇒ 00:34:07.850 suewong: demographic right?
197 00:34:09.159 ⇒ 00:34:18.740 ivana saginova: Yeah, yeah. It’s my boyfriend I talk about all the time. He has a lot of friends that are like very popular tick talkers. And they all just buy clothes and sell them. And they’re kids that are like 1819
198 00:34:19.305 ⇒ 00:34:44.019 suewong: 20. What? 2, maybe right now. But they are just buying the most expensive stuff, wearing it 4 times, or like, Okay, I’m done. Now, I need something new and like that’s just bonkers to me. But this really, you know, benefiting or I don’t know. As I was growing up I worked really hard, but I also bought an outfit every week.
199 00:34:44.020 ⇒ 00:35:03.500 suewong: and I never wear the same outfit in a month. So that was how I was. So so II know that there’s value to this and but as we build our clause, and if we don’t get rid of it, Purge, we just have a lot of stuff cramped into space. So I think this will help alleviate that
200 00:35:03.570 ⇒ 00:35:11.030 suewong: And when I was talking to an individual family individual about the idea.
201 00:35:11.060 ⇒ 00:35:17.080 suewong: and because she is in the millennial age. meaning
202 00:35:17.150 ⇒ 00:35:23.750 suewong: having kids and all that, I do want to also at some point add into this
203 00:35:24.420 ⇒ 00:35:26.080 suewong: the baby toddler.
204 00:35:26.720 ⇒ 00:35:37.279 suewong: because that also is a great segment hitting the same individuals. Because you get a lot of nice things, and they’re only wearing it for 3 months.
205 00:35:37.960 ⇒ 00:36:07.910 ivana saginova: My other client is a kid’s Multi brand retailer, so I can ask them for feedback if that’s helpful. I’m sure we all know moms. But that’s like a good audience, too. Yeah, they’re literally buying stuff every freaking month. Correct. And it’s moving pretty quickly fast. And then it leads to the same storyline as what we have, which is, somebody has a friend who’s going to be next? Yeah. And so then it leads to that connection to so I would like that to be added on to our
206 00:36:08.100 ⇒ 00:36:13.959 suewong: are build sounds good from a timeline. Did I answer on what we need for the first.
207 00:36:14.300 ⇒ 00:36:28.169 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. The only other thing that I noted is I went into the app store and I looked for a lot of different cataloging apps, and there are a few. One thing that Ivana you mentioned. It would be helpful to go. Do tear some of those apart.
208 00:36:28.170 ⇒ 00:36:35.120 Uttam Kumaran: and honestly, we could probably learn a lot as well as learn some stuff that we don’t want to do.
209 00:36:35.120 ⇒ 00:36:59.360 Uttam Kumaran: That, I think, is like a perfect, a lot of this. We, a lot of these will be unique to your product, but some of it will not be able to go. See what works and what’s working for other people going through those payment flows. Those trial flows like that’s gonna speed this up like so much. So that’s one thing that I think we should certainly include is like a a task, or to do a group or something, and there’s a there’s at least like 6 or 7 that
210 00:36:59.360 ⇒ 00:37:12.800 suewong: noted that I think would be really great to go through. I think that’s a great point, because it’s all about, you know, you’re not starting something new. But what are the the nuances that makes it unique.
211 00:37:12.880 ⇒ 00:37:28.110 suewong: If we can just share, if you can share your list, and then we can all divide. You know the team here, divide and conquer and pick out like you said what works best, what doesn’t? And one thing I don’t I don’t want from an app is to it to be
212 00:37:28.250 ⇒ 00:37:31.150 suewong: so infiltrated with
213 00:37:32.650 ⇒ 00:37:34.900 suewong: with the experience where it’s always stopping you.
214 00:37:35.330 ⇒ 00:37:36.180 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
215 00:37:36.380 ⇒ 00:37:42.210 suewong: I find it’s so annoying. And I don’t want to be that annoying app person to to.
216 00:37:42.280 ⇒ 00:38:05.529 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. And and again, I think there’s a lot of like the art of doing the pricing thing. But I think frankly, a lot of people. They, and again, me and Yvonne have been part of this. They they change pricing so often, but they realize that the product isn’t good, and they’re compensating by just gating things that don’t have any value. And so the number one thing is to make sure that the product is like really well designed has all the flows works really well.
217 00:38:05.530 ⇒ 00:38:16.579 Uttam Kumaran: and it’s gonna speak for itself. People are spending hundreds and hundreds of dollars on apps. I mean, we, I think we all do like we all order uber eats. Those are like it’s $100 being spent through the Ios store. So
218 00:38:16.580 ⇒ 00:38:40.299 Uttam Kumaran: I think the money is certainly there. And just because other products price low doesn’t mean that you have to. I think it’s just the one to be. The one thing is, in addition to sending timeline goals to try to think about what is like a revenue target, what is like a active users target. And then you could back into all of those numbers really easily, and be able to say, Hey, if we price at this number this number we need X amount of users.
219 00:38:40.370 ⇒ 00:39:04.619 Uttam Kumaran: and then to honestly think about the other competition. How can you charge a certain amount? And and what are the benefits? You’re providing the lot of people? You’ll see, they. They gate things because they run out of product innovation to do. And so they start to use pricing as a lever to increase that conversion. That’s something that totally you don’t have to do. And I think there’s other ways to kind of get the money in. So
220 00:39:05.510 ⇒ 00:39:32.090 ivana saginova: also, integrations. It’s huge like that to me sounds like a differentiator, if you can make it so that I can list on deep hop and postmark with the click of a button and not have to refill out the same information twice, like, there’s already some big difference that we just need to see. And maybe that’s like, okay is is integrations. If that’s the major thing, then, like, okay, we should prioritize that for and make sure that the bigger differentiators, isn’t it
221 00:39:32.090 ⇒ 00:39:45.049 suewong: right? It’s definitely a for it needs to be in there. You know, we’re not. It’s one thing we’re 20 years ago, maybe. But we know what it is today. So might as well link the 2 for this project.
222 00:39:46.370 ⇒ 00:39:48.490 suewong: And from a timeline standpoint.
223 00:39:49.300 ⇒ 00:39:51.790 suewong: Ii
224 00:39:52.220 ⇒ 00:39:56.289 suewong: feel good about where we are in regards to the inputs
225 00:39:57.380 ⇒ 00:39:59.640 suewong: for this. And so
226 00:39:59.780 ⇒ 00:40:05.709 suewong: the sooner we get started in checking off the task, and some things are in parallel.
227 00:40:05.740 ⇒ 00:40:09.319 suewong: I would like for it to to start as soon as we can.
228 00:40:09.470 ⇒ 00:40:18.520 Uttam Kumaran: Yvonne, do you want to share that timeline that you pulled up? And maybe we can just take that as the initial contacts, and then talk about each of those steps.
229 00:40:21.190 ⇒ 00:40:37.510 ivana saginova: Do you wanna walk through again? Just so. This is where we are now. Just kind of having this kick off meeting week. 2 next week I put as discovery, which is kind of what we talked about, is looking at some of the competitors and analyzing it, doing some, you know.
230 00:40:37.530 ⇒ 00:41:02.139 ivana saginova: early user interviews to just see, do people want this to think about this? What comes to mind what resonates what doesn’t, and aligning that with our goals? Some of the personas, I think you guys already have outlined. But these pain points and stuff like that will come from some of those user interviews. And this is perhaps stuff you guys have already thought about and can help supplement and then just going back the ideation and conceptualization. So that’s
231 00:41:02.140 ⇒ 00:41:22.969 ivana saginova: starting to kind of put pen to paper doing some of these rough mocks of, okay, you told me you want to prioritize the share button, the, you know, tutorial, how someone enter something when they take a picture of it, and having that streamline so we can kind of outline some of these flows and just draw them, make it like so we can visualize it, move things around.
232 00:41:23.100 ⇒ 00:41:47.970 ivana saginova: I put a couple of weeks for that, just because I think there’s different sections to this. And we can iterate on that. This part could be shrink. It could like take less time, but I always like to leave Buffer for it. The key flows and implementation. Oh, sorry! That was idea, this one designing and prototyping. Let me go to the other side. This one is accurate, for I think the time it takes is this is where we can really get this in front of people
233 00:41:47.970 ⇒ 00:42:03.260 ivana saginova: and get the feedback but this is actually designing it in figma, taking everything that we had drawn and just making it digital starting to make it so that when you click this it can go to that and getting the actual look and feel for it. And then this is where we’ll spend the most time.
234 00:42:03.280 ⇒ 00:42:33.149 ivana saginova: And then, after that, once everything here is like, yep, love it. This is exactly what we want. I’ll get really into the details of like you click, search. And then what happens? And all the like super finite details. And in case like situations where it’s like, what if someone misspelled something, how do they go back and edit? It’s like all that smaller details and then after that, and maybe towards the end of this is where we would get into like end off and starting to work on this.
235 00:42:33.170 ⇒ 00:42:35.190 suewong: Okay. I like it
236 00:42:35.400 ⇒ 00:42:46.009 Uttam Kumaran: on the engineering side. I think it’s pretty. It will be pretty difficult to kind of move on anything until at least like key flows implementation.
237 00:42:46.750 ⇒ 00:43:15.879 Uttam Kumaran: I just would like caution us to build anything until we’re solidified and a lot you can iterate so much faster within what we’re doing here in figma. Additionally, I think in that parallel between the design prototyping and implementing the key flows. I think that’s the team to kind of take on testing, showing a lot of people in the market potential customers, partners, any from anything from like the low fidelity stuff to the high fidelity stuff to the prototypes.
238 00:43:15.910 ⇒ 00:43:38.180 Uttam Kumaran: You’re gonna get that external feedback that we need in that moment. That’s something that if we wait to do will then cause us to have more cycles. So that’s something that we can totally do in parallel. And then, like II totally think we should do and get that feedback. And that feedback can include like, what would you pay for this? Tell me how you handle this today?
239 00:43:38.180 ⇒ 00:43:47.370 Uttam Kumaran: Watching people interact with it within their mobile fig map. Right? So that’s all totally something that you should do, because you’ll quickly see
240 00:43:47.370 ⇒ 00:44:09.090 Uttam Kumaran: generally what what the value prop is, how people articulate it back to you. And then, somewhere in between the key flows. Implementation, I think, can begin development. It’s hard for me to say how long development is gonna take. At this point, I think, at least by the design prototyping phase will be able to get a rough understanding.
241 00:44:09.390 ⇒ 00:44:25.479 Uttam Kumaran: I will go figure out like a rough estimate based on their flows today. And me and Yvonne will kind of talk about. Okay, it’s roughly going to be this, many screens. And what are the really non standard parts of the application? Right? Anything like login payments, that’s all
242 00:44:25.480 ⇒ 00:44:42.780 Uttam Kumaran: that’s pretty figured out. Not worried about that. What I am worried about is things that are related to taking pictures having the catalogs having a database for that any external integrations. I’m worried about that, so I will flag when we kind of we’ll do a little bit of summary of like these flows, I’ll flag what
243 00:44:42.870 ⇒ 00:44:55.110 Uttam Kumaran: are like? Kind of like the risky parts. And what is a little bit unpredictable today? But anything like sign in subscriptions? Things like that are are fairly standard.
244 00:44:55.150 ⇒ 00:44:59.400 Uttam Kumaran: I would I would like, for my honest contacts invite. You can let me know, I would say, this is pretty quick.
245 00:44:59.620 ⇒ 00:45:24.980 ivana saginova: This is quick. So like this is cause I was like, I’m not sure how you guys wanna move, and I’m not sure the complexity. So again, I put this together as an example. Timeline is like, let me just give you guys something to understand like the phases of it. Also, these should say, March, not February again, so you can go through. But I think like to Tom’s point the design prototyping. This is a good time to get an engineer involved like at a startup. We usually
246 00:45:24.980 ⇒ 00:45:36.720 ivana saginova: do like, you know, you have a whole team. I’m working on some of the design stuff at a middle stage of like, we kind of know what we’re working with. We pull on engineer. And they can say, Okay, like this is, gonna take forever.
247 00:45:36.720 ⇒ 00:46:00.609 ivana saginova: Or you could do it like this, and this will make it easier. And then we have a conversation. Is that a compromise we wanna make? Or is this really important to the first, you know, version to be released with this and then that can kinda help us with some of the decision making. And then, during some of these stages something may come up right like that’s just normal. We can sit here and be like, Okay, here’s our perfect little plan. But if you buy a house and do some. Reno you’re like. Oh, no, I didn’t expect this to come up, so
248 00:46:00.610 ⇒ 00:46:07.969 ivana saginova: I’m not saying it’s like guaranteed to throw off this whole schedule. But this can’t be, you know, perfectly sent and stone cause we may hear something that’s like
249 00:46:08.080 ⇒ 00:46:30.570 ivana saginova: someone says, and we decide to change kind of some of what we’re thinking based on it. We’ll see, you know, so I can come back with like a better outline, and I think we should have a second. Well, let me do some of the discovery. I’ll send some temporary Google Calendar invites as like check in for this. I like a weekly check in, just to keep us all kind of in the loop and make sure there’s not any pending work.
250 00:46:30.570 ⇒ 00:46:41.120 ivana saginova: That no one’s in the know about and we can kind of go. And and we’ll keep each other updated i’ll, let you know how I’m going on this timeline based on where we’re at
251 00:46:41.130 ⇒ 00:46:50.839 Uttam Kumaran: perfect. Just like looking at this and then thinking about the engineering do you have like a gut instinct on like, okay, if this came out by
252 00:46:51.290 ⇒ 00:47:10.000 Uttam Kumaran: July. That’d be like a home run right? Do you have any sort of like idea about that? And like that way kind of helps me start there and then I can kind of work backwards. February is almost done.
253 00:47:10.000 ⇒ 00:47:22.549 suewong: And so II look at that and say that March is where we should be, you know, as closer to design as possible, and if we had something that was released.
254 00:47:22.610 ⇒ 00:47:23.410 suewong: I mean
255 00:47:24.680 ⇒ 00:47:27.500 suewong: II don’t. My traditional marketing
256 00:47:28.700 ⇒ 00:47:31.380 suewong: pathways to product launches.
257 00:47:31.440 ⇒ 00:47:38.449 suewong: you know, typically, we avoid the summer months because people on vacation, etc. I don’t know today anymore about apps. If that matters.
258 00:47:38.580 ⇒ 00:47:44.329 suewong: I’ll lean on your expertise since you work with clients on on. You know, things like this.
259 00:47:44.390 ⇒ 00:47:51.170 suewong: And and in today’s product launch journeys is that even a factor to consider anymore
260 00:47:54.050 ⇒ 00:47:56.720 Uttam Kumaran: from my perspective, I
261 00:47:57.000 ⇒ 00:48:06.030 Uttam Kumaran: don’t really think there’s much seasonality. I would think about Prob, like the only thing I would consider is maybe like.
262 00:48:06.080 ⇒ 00:48:19.360 Uttam Kumaran: when people typically turn over their closets like W, as like if as any indicator. But I also don’t know whether that’s like super apparent. It would kind of depend on like if they’re if you’re planning like a larger rollout
263 00:48:19.360 ⇒ 00:48:44.280 ivana saginova: is gonna break. What are the things that we didn’t discover, because there’s no way we can try out every single way of using it and get feedback. And then from that quick feedback, maybe we’ll call Beta. One month, 2 months, a few weeks, like
264 00:48:44.280 ⇒ 00:49:09.029 ivana saginova: whatever we decide is best. Get it out in the world, get people using it, get the feedback, revise it, and then, like, obviously, we should plan it out and then pick a actual launch day. But factor in that beta fart. But I don’t think seasonality is as big of a factor. It’s more like, whenever you’re ready, let’s just go and figure
265 00:49:09.190 ⇒ 00:49:29.069 suewong: if it makes sense to go with the theme of the season. If we’re doing a June July, Beta make it summer summer type of exchange experiences. And then, after Beta, I can see this rolling into the
266 00:49:29.110 ⇒ 00:49:47.330 suewong: the fall right on holidays. So so that’s the theme component to help with the launch of putting some highlights into it, and why it should be used during that time. So those are the things I will factor in, even though it’s soft. I think those are the things that people can relate to. Yeah.
267 00:49:47.360 ⇒ 00:49:56.569 ivana saginova: And then I know this is a year from now, so don’t wanna throw anything off. But spring would be like the perfect time to be launching. I feel like you could really lean into spring cleaning
268 00:49:56.620 ⇒ 00:50:18.619 Ellen Wong: definitely a part where we
269 00:50:18.620 ⇒ 00:50:42.999 Ellen Wong: throw out a lot of clothes, buy new clothes for the fall semester. Then you have all that, and then like, then you have Christmas. Where, like, you’re getting a bunch of stuff, you’re buying a bunch of stuff, and then, like spring, like you said like, that’s when you throw out a lot of clothes from like the past year, and you’re like, I don’t need any of this. So I think, like for that first initial one. I think summer would be like a good target for that.
270 00:50:44.220 ⇒ 00:51:13.109 ivana saginova: I think it feels fast. So I don’t want summer to come around and us be like. Oh, no, we’re really behind. Cause, I think, like technically, that, like we’re building a whole app development takes time. I think we’re going to move as fast as possible, so maybe we could set a tentative date, and once we’re midway through we can just re-evaluate
271 00:51:13.110 ⇒ 00:51:20.429 suewong: all relying on. You know, the Ios teams and the Android teams to do what they need to do that. That gives us
272 00:51:37.110 ⇒ 00:51:49.529 Uttam Kumaran: like really, liberally. So let me find out if we were to launch on July first. Given all the context, we have today what we have like really utmost confidence we could get out. Then start to push that back and say, Okay, like.
273 00:51:49.530 ⇒ 00:52:07.029 Uttam Kumaran: right? So let’s start with that. I think 3 months is like a really good like first pass of like 3 months of like development time that that time will start really towards like as fast as we can. And like again. That’s where I think me and Ivana have worked a lot on like projects like this, where
274 00:52:07.030 ⇒ 00:52:20.020 Uttam Kumaran: it’s like we try to go as fast as possible, and again, the the only advice I could give an Evan is the same way is to leave the engineers with no room, meaning try to really tell them where they can
275 00:52:20.020 ⇒ 00:52:34.400 Uttam Kumaran: go ahead and make decisions, but tell them where their decisions have to be made from design. And then, again, what I’ll do is go find out. Okay? Given the flows we have today. What’s the cost? And what’s the confidence? We can get it done in 3 months. And then what are the levers we can pull?
276 00:52:34.450 ⇒ 00:52:39.230 ivana saginova: And I think, like by the end of this stage.
277 00:52:39.230 ⇒ 00:52:46.040 ivana saginova: we should be super clear on what we’re building for, phase one, because Utah and I have both had so many experiences where
278 00:52:46.040 ⇒ 00:53:10.829 ivana saginova: you get through it all. And then, like weekday, you have. You want to launch in 3 weeks. They’re like, what if we add this feature? And it’s like we can’t do that that late in the game. So it’s like we should just be ready to sign off and be ready to say like, here’s what we’re building, and we need to stick to it. And let’s make the best version of this that we can in X amount of time based on my other experiences.
279 00:53:11.190 ⇒ 00:53:22.409 suewong: and you lock it down and you move things to. And next next version, which is the beauty of products. And I think this this is one of those that has, if you plan it.
280 00:53:23.080 ⇒ 00:53:37.509 suewong: the because you know, when I first did my platform presentation and shared it out with with Jordan. When we first talked about it was like everything I wanted, so I know that there’s like Version 6 there somewhere there.
281 00:53:37.560 ⇒ 00:53:49.920 suewong: Because there’s so much that we can do in target which then leads me to this. I know that you know the architecture of this can be for multiple applications is what I’m hoping for, meaning that.
282 00:53:50.280 ⇒ 00:54:08.389 suewong: You know, this is the closet. I know you tell me we talked about collectibles. As well. You know my husband is in the hockey Realm sports room. We know a lot of people former athletes, etc.
283 00:54:08.590 ⇒ 00:54:23.170 suewong: There are some that is high value, some with low value, but still collectible for them, and it leads the same storyline in regards to the journey of acquis, you know, acquiring that item. And then with that item, you want to be able to one day sell it
284 00:54:23.460 ⇒ 00:54:32.650 suewong: right? Who knew Michael Jordan’s old sneakers would be 8 million dollars today. And who, you know, that’s the wild component of collect of collectors and collect both
285 00:54:32.660 ⇒ 00:54:38.970 suewong: and since we’re in that space from our professional life standpoint
286 00:54:39.070 ⇒ 00:54:40.650 suewong: and
287 00:54:41.240 ⇒ 00:54:50.550 suewong: I didn’t check yet on the app. Who has that journey experience about acquiring, collecting, and then, you know, moving it out
288 00:54:50.580 ⇒ 00:54:59.190 suewong: of and making you know money off of what you you did. So what you did purchase. So does this. Let line up with that, or it.
289 00:54:59.320 ⇒ 00:55:06.460 suewong: How does that? How can I think about that? I know it’s a different project, because it’s targeting someone different.
290 00:55:06.470 ⇒ 00:55:16.950 suewong: And what we’re building. But the infrastructure is the same. Correct. That’s that’s correct. So the big variables there is is this within the same application. Or is this a completely separate app?
291 00:55:17.280 ⇒ 00:55:27.319 Uttam Kumaran: The second thing is, I’ll rewrite from the design assets to like the back end. Infrastructure can all be reused, especially if they’re all very similar flows.
292 00:55:27.470 ⇒ 00:55:54.680 Uttam Kumaran: The thing is, you have to understand just where things differ. Right? Of course, like inputting things. The fields that you input, maybe the way it’s displayed would be different. Try to understand is if it’s a different app, or if it’s the same application, and maybe you can both do clothing and collectibles. Yeah, and then and then also like, what part of the design has to change between the 2. I
293 00:55:54.770 ⇒ 00:56:01.490 Uttam Kumaran: would also agree that probably centralizing into one application is best. And now saying you can do, you could have both.
294 00:56:01.620 ⇒ 00:56:06.550 Uttam Kumaran: Of course, that like expands the scope of like, the amount of design flows and things like that, but
295 00:56:06.610 ⇒ 00:56:13.869 Uttam Kumaran: seems like same application. And then, yeah, you’re right. All the back end infrastructure sign in payment stuff can all be
296 00:56:13.880 ⇒ 00:56:15.849 Uttam Kumaran: centralized. So you’re not rebuilding.
297 00:56:15.880 ⇒ 00:56:24.390 Uttam Kumaran: You’re not rebuilding 100 of it. You’re maybe only adding on 20 net new. So let me throw this out there for you.
298 00:56:24.400 ⇒ 00:56:26.090 suewong: because the
299 00:56:26.250 ⇒ 00:56:31.800 suewong: you know, the collectors range right from from
300 00:56:32.580 ⇒ 00:56:33.819 suewong: from different
301 00:56:35.000 ⇒ 00:56:36.069 suewong: age groups.
302 00:56:36.970 ⇒ 00:56:53.349 suewong: because it’s based on also income cause. Those are all non discretionary spends of. Yeah, I can afford that $400 sneaker. I’m gonna put it away and hope in 20 years it does something for me to those who are, added fans who are collecting.
303 00:56:53.390 ⇒ 00:56:55.209 suewong: And so
304 00:56:56.160 ⇒ 00:57:06.649 suewong: If it’s included into this, am I alienating that person? So I don’t give a crap about my closet. You know. I just want a app that is about
305 00:57:06.880 ⇒ 00:57:16.700 suewong: logging in my collectibles. because I can see that. I can be leveraging our conversations with the Nhl.
306 00:57:16.740 ⇒ 00:57:26.869 suewong: I can be leveraging conversations through our, you know, our connections with the Nba. You know those types of things trying to build that and curate that type of
307 00:57:27.120 ⇒ 00:57:31.990 suewong: story and journey and all things that comes with people who are added collectors.
308 00:57:32.050 ⇒ 00:57:59.780 ivana saginova: I feel like for the phase one like the focus incorrect me if I’m wrong, but should be more on like the close or the closet items, and maybe there’s an option that it’s kind of vague enough where you could enter something that’s not close. So it could still capture the people that have a collectible. And we could see, are people using it for that? I think you could also release, like not a press statement. But maybe there should be some blogs or just part of the marketing of like. Here’s what we want to do in the future. Right? You wanna upload 5,000 things. You can just
309 00:57:59.780 ⇒ 00:58:20.290 ivana saginova: take a photo of everything, and we’ll use AI to identify what’s what and all you have to do is fill in like the remainder of the information. And then you could say, we want to expand to collectables. We want you to host this. We want it to be for what you know. Like, include all that, and like somewhere as like the vision or mission statement, or just future releases that you want to do. And I think it should come out as a later thing.
310 00:58:21.180 ⇒ 00:58:45.709 ivana saginova: But I think that you won’t be alienating people, and I think there’s a route where in the future you could say, Hey, what are you coming here for like as an onboarding. Oh, I wanna do just collectibles. I also wanna include this. And maybe the home dashboard is kind of modular where it can just feature blocks of like their main things at the top could be. Here’s what your collectibles worth, or it could be. Here’s what your closer, you know, like whatever we choose to prioritize at that point, but just making it
311 00:58:46.120 ⇒ 00:58:51.159 ivana saginova: be able to be customizable and fit the person for what they’re using it and what they have in their closet.
312 00:58:51.310 ⇒ 00:59:03.549 Ellen Wong: Okay, spotify and stuff it like, the first thing that you do is like sign in and everything. And then it says, like, what type of music you like. Click that. And then it
313 00:59:03.650 ⇒ 00:59:10.669 Ellen Wong: generates. You know, that type of music. It would that be something that the app could do like
314 00:59:10.700 ⇒ 00:59:26.769 Ellen Wong: later in life, or if you wanted to add collectibles like, say, like, Hey, I wanted to use this for my baseball collectibles or my sports collectibles. And then, like others, could say, I’m gonna use this more towards clothing and
315 00:59:26.860 ⇒ 00:59:28.799 Ellen Wong: bags and stuff like that.
316 00:59:28.860 ⇒ 00:59:40.310 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, so exactly, we that’s part of, like the onboarding flow so similar to when you sign in. There’s like the tutorial that we described, which is like, here’s what to do. That’s exactly what we’d, there’d be some sort of like
317 00:59:40.420 ⇒ 01:00:02.750 Uttam Kumaran: entrance survey almost. That helps you customize the application that that not only helps just to customize the app, but also, that’s good data to have on, like what people intend to use the app for. That’s a pretty common flow that I think. Yeah. And it’s like, when you go on, Etsy, you make an account. And they’re like, what do you want? You want digital arts, you know. So you can just figure out kind of getting that onboarding flow in.
318 01:00:03.000 ⇒ 01:00:16.660 suewong: I know you’re ready to drop off, so we’ll wrap this up. so we have good notes on this on this meeting. And so my next thing is that if the 2 of you could meet and
319 01:00:16.800 ⇒ 01:00:23.749 suewong: you, Tom, we need to, you know. Take care of the formality component of a a work agreement.
320 01:00:23.980 ⇒ 01:00:27.449 suewong: So that’s what I’ll be expecting next. And
321 01:00:27.670 ⇒ 01:00:40.820 suewong: and then, you know, we should be executing the things that we’re talking about. So that we know what our pathways are and what that looks like in regards to the to the investment. Okay, so. With that
322 01:00:41.710 ⇒ 01:00:43.579 suewong: this was a very good meeting.
323 01:00:43.630 ⇒ 01:00:49.669 suewong: Do you think that documentation will be able to come soon so that we can get different eyes on it from my side.
324 01:00:49.990 ⇒ 01:00:56.790 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I think we’ll me and Ivana will talk. I need to have some conversations on the engineering side that may take
325 01:00:57.010 ⇒ 01:00:58.760 Uttam Kumaran: a day or 2.
326 01:00:58.860 ⇒ 01:01:25.439 Uttam Kumaran: But at minimum we should be able to get everything over to you about the designs. And then I’m gonna go kind of get some folks to understanding about the timeline, and you know, like money needed for the engineering. Again, we can continue to work towards and negotiate but let’s at least begin so we can kick. Start some of the stuff on design kind of timeline. And so maybe Ivana, we can talk later today and then move on that.
327 01:01:25.560 ⇒ 01:01:28.330 ivana saginova: And then, can I, can I see any sample work?
328 01:01:28.530 ⇒ 01:01:43.609 ivana saginova: Yeah, yeah, I can send you my website. There’s not much. I can send you a deck with better case studies my website. Some of the work is a bit confidential, so I haven’t put it up for the Ui side. But I’ll send you a deck with that, and I can send you the deck that I shared today.
329 01:01:43.810 ⇒ 01:01:58.210 suewong: and I’m in the city quite a bit, too. So II think that you are here as well. So hopefully as things move on, we can neat in person, I think 14 person is so great. So that’d be super helpful.
330 01:01:58.530 ⇒ 01:02:11.409 suewong: And me and Jordan, me and Jordan will have an in person meeting, too.
331 01:02:11.450 ⇒ 01:02:14.149 Ellen Wong: Yeah, there you go.
332 01:02:14.610 ⇒ 01:02:23.690 ivana saginova: Okay, awesome. It was great to meet you guys. I’m super likewise. Thank you so much. And I guess, after all, that we should also keep pace with our
333 01:02:24.210 ⇒ 01:02:27.920 suewong: our conversations and the timeline, the schedule. So we I’m a
334 01:02:28.070 ⇒ 01:02:47.209 Uttam Kumaran: schedule person as well. I think everyone is. That’s the only way to get this to the you know, to the different stage gates. So we can you, Tom? Will you be responsible for that most? We’ll catch up by Thursday, if done tomorrow? We’ll see how much we can get on in terms of putting together a timeline today.
335 01:02:47.220 ⇒ 01:02:48.300 suewong: Right? Super.
336 01:02:48.550 ⇒ 01:02:53.450 suewong: Thank you.