Meeting Title: Brainforge x Eden Project Check-in Date: 2026-02-06 Meeting participants: Greg Stoutenburg, Uttam Kumaran
WEBVTT
1 00:07:08.130 ⇒ 00:07:09.110 Uttam Kumaran: Hey, Greg.
2 00:07:09.720 ⇒ 00:07:11.109 Greg Stoutenburg: Hey, happy Friday!
3 00:07:11.110 ⇒ 00:07:18.159 Uttam Kumaran: Hey, happy Friday. I’m just, just running to actually go work… co-work with Pranav and Shay Shuang.
4 00:07:19.240 ⇒ 00:07:19.930 Greg Stoutenburg: Nice.
5 00:07:20.290 ⇒ 00:07:23.159 Greg Stoutenburg: How many of you are located in Austin?
6 00:07:28.560 ⇒ 00:07:29.730 Greg Stoutenburg: Nope, hello?
7 00:07:31.220 ⇒ 00:07:32.180 Greg Stoutenburg: Trick, tick.
8 00:07:37.490 ⇒ 00:07:38.880 Uttam Kumaran: Me? Am I cutting out?
9 00:07:39.230 ⇒ 00:07:45.319 Greg Stoutenburg: Oh, hey, there you are. Yeah, you were gone for a second. I was like, I was like, I’m gonna check my own Wi-Fi, am I still online?
10 00:07:45.320 ⇒ 00:07:53.399 Uttam Kumaran: My Wi-Fi is down this morning, so it’s actually… well, it’s… I guess it’s… it’s a coincidence, because I’ll be leaving, but yeah, it’d be brutal.
11 00:07:53.400 ⇒ 00:07:54.540 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah.
12 00:07:54.620 ⇒ 00:07:55.460 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
13 00:07:55.460 ⇒ 00:07:57.169 Greg Stoutenburg: It’d be a hard job to do without internet access.
14 00:07:57.270 ⇒ 00:08:03.909 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, they’re being… actually, I mean, I guess I could… I could sort of, mull over some strategy stuff then.
15 00:08:03.910 ⇒ 00:08:07.619 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, that’s right, mulling. Actually old pen and paper. That’s right.
16 00:08:07.880 ⇒ 00:08:11.909 Greg Stoutenburg: Dude, I still have an embarrassing number of sticky notes and paper on my desk.
17 00:08:11.910 ⇒ 00:08:16.820 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, I do too. I actually, I write a lot, but it’s, like, it’s just to… to just, like…
18 00:08:17.100 ⇒ 00:08:25.739 Uttam Kumaran: I really do believe in just different modes of, like, you know, I read a lot about note-taking, and, like, I think it’s helpful, but I… it’s sort of all throwaway stuff, like…
19 00:08:25.740 ⇒ 00:08:26.120 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah.
20 00:08:26.120 ⇒ 00:08:32.249 Uttam Kumaran: You know, just so I can get some thoughts down and, like, have some type of structure. Otherwise, I just loop through…
21 00:08:32.360 ⇒ 00:08:34.370 Uttam Kumaran: Too many things in my head.
22 00:08:34.940 ⇒ 00:08:41.319 Greg Stoutenburg: I think much better in a physical space than a digital one. Digital is for production.
23 00:08:41.770 ⇒ 00:08:46.700 Uttam Kumaran: How’s the, how’s the week? Or this week, yeah.
24 00:08:46.950 ⇒ 00:08:51.360 Greg Stoutenburg: It’s been a good week. I feel like this week… this week felt…
25 00:08:51.680 ⇒ 00:09:07.520 Greg Stoutenburg: it really felt productive in that, I feel like there’s just a lot of traction in the projects I’m working on, and that’s good, yeah. Like, things are going the right way with product analytics at default.
26 00:09:07.520 ⇒ 00:09:19.220 Uttam Kumaran: It was a curveball to learn that Phoenix is further back than was expected, but, like, it’s okay. Yeah, I mean, I think every team internally in that company is dealing with that.
27 00:09:19.530 ⇒ 00:09:27.380 Uttam Kumaran: And so, like, on our side, I think we… we will just kind of figure… this is just the peril of, like, startup world, where you’re…
28 00:09:27.380 ⇒ 00:09:27.970 Greg Stoutenburg: Yep.
29 00:09:27.970 ⇒ 00:09:35.269 Uttam Kumaran: They’re always, like, one behind and forward, and, like, kind of just trying to land this plane in the wind kind of deal.
30 00:09:35.270 ⇒ 00:09:47.129 Greg Stoutenburg: this is over here, that’s over there. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And then, you know, same with Eden. I feel like this week, I feel like, after Monday’s, I don’t know how much you saw of it, but, like, putting
31 00:09:47.460 ⇒ 00:09:48.260 Greg Stoutenburg: wire.
32 00:09:48.520 ⇒ 00:09:57.679 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I know a little bit, but I’m… yeah, I’m most interested in, like, how it’s going with Eden, and if there’s any learnings that we can replicate or take away.
33 00:09:57.680 ⇒ 00:10:07.680 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, I mean, I think… I mean, yeah, I have a perspective on that. So, for me, personally, it just feels like… I feel like I’m finally on the other side of Henry’s departure, as far as, like.
34 00:10:08.190 ⇒ 00:10:17.399 Greg Stoutenburg: who I’m working with at Eden, and what we’re doing, and, you know, making some progress there. So that’s good. I think as far… I mean, I think as far as takeaways is that there was just, like.
35 00:10:17.510 ⇒ 00:10:25.409 Greg Stoutenburg: I think that there were a lot of assumptions around who owned what, and how certain things were measured, that nobody was on the same page about.
36 00:10:25.820 ⇒ 00:10:26.380 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
37 00:10:26.680 ⇒ 00:10:28.090 Greg Stoutenburg: at Eden?
38 00:10:28.300 ⇒ 00:10:37.749 Greg Stoutenburg: at Brainforge, and between Eden and Brainforge, so… Okay. It’s like, it’s like no one’s fault, and everyone’s.
39 00:10:37.750 ⇒ 00:10:38.850 Uttam Kumaran: It’s everyone’s fault, but it’s.
40 00:10:38.850 ⇒ 00:10:40.600 Greg Stoutenburg: Exactly.
41 00:10:40.600 ⇒ 00:10:41.510 Uttam Kumaran: our fault.
42 00:10:41.750 ⇒ 00:10:44.280 Greg Stoutenburg: Well, I mean, that is what it… yeah, yeah.
43 00:10:44.280 ⇒ 00:10:46.160 Uttam Kumaran: I, I don’t, I don’t know, it’s, it’s…
44 00:10:46.290 ⇒ 00:10:52.809 Uttam Kumaran: There are times to blame the client, but usually, it’s us, like, and it’s fine, it’s, like, not, like…
45 00:10:53.360 ⇒ 00:11:04.440 Uttam Kumaran: But you blame us, right? I think we tried different times, I mean, this is sort of, like, what Henry was struggling with a lot, and so I’m not surprised that it is some disorganization, yeah.
46 00:11:04.440 ⇒ 00:11:06.109 Greg Stoutenburg: Just, like, ownership and organization and stuff.
47 00:11:06.110 ⇒ 00:11:10.769 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, and, like, being able to push it forward, like, Henry was more of, like, a startup
48 00:11:11.030 ⇒ 00:11:14.159 Uttam Kumaran: Analytics guy, and he was like, it was always frantic.
49 00:11:14.340 ⇒ 00:11:20.439 Uttam Kumaran: And it never really… like, he’s able to execute a lot, but he needs a lot of direction.
50 00:11:20.440 ⇒ 00:11:21.400 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah. And…
51 00:11:21.500 ⇒ 00:11:26.370 Uttam Kumaran: at Eden, it’s actually… they need a… they’re so much… they’re so big that they need, actually, a lot of organization, you know?
52 00:11:26.640 ⇒ 00:11:31.719 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, that’s, yeah, I think that’s a good take. So I think, like…
53 00:11:31.990 ⇒ 00:11:39.899 Greg Stoutenburg: you know, in some ways, I’m just gonna repeat what I said, like, last week in the feedback session. Like, some… just some things around when someone’s brought into a new project.
54 00:11:40.210 ⇒ 00:11:40.550 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
55 00:11:40.550 ⇒ 00:11:59.350 Greg Stoutenburg: things like, this person owns this responsibility set, this person owns this responsibility set. And of course, you know, we’re responsive, and we’re… we’re, agile with the client’s needs, but, so it’s never going to be entirely nailed down, but, like, 80% would go a long way.
56 00:12:00.310 ⇒ 00:12:11.689 Greg Stoutenburg: So, yeah, that’s… that’s my take on that. So it turns out, really, nothing was broken, and Zoron just fixed everything, but, like… No, I mean, it’s… it’s… it’s usually, again, like, we have no problem on, like.
57 00:12:11.690 ⇒ 00:12:14.819 Uttam Kumaran: The technical side’s always communication.
58 00:12:14.820 ⇒ 00:12:17.389 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah. Which is so frustrating, because…
59 00:12:17.520 ⇒ 00:12:25.190 Uttam Kumaran: I would rather it be technical, and then I’m like, okay, like, this is a real challenge. Otherwise, it’s usually expectation setting.
60 00:12:25.350 ⇒ 00:12:26.960 Uttam Kumaran: Putting together a plan.
61 00:12:27.680 ⇒ 00:12:28.060 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah.
62 00:12:28.060 ⇒ 00:12:29.269 Uttam Kumaran: You know, yeah.
63 00:12:29.270 ⇒ 00:12:47.490 Greg Stoutenburg: Right. Yeah, so, like, what happened, like, so the way I experience it is Monday morning, at, like, 6 AM, I see a meeting invitation for 8, and, like, a 4-hour block of time from Ryan inviting me and Zoran, and, and maybe Ryan, and maybe Robert, I think? I’m going off the top of my head. And I’m like, okay, here we go, you know?
64 00:12:47.490 ⇒ 00:12:47.970 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah.
65 00:12:47.970 ⇒ 00:12:53.240 Greg Stoutenburg: They’re not there. I log in, and you know, he’s saying all this stuff about Catalyst. I’m like.
66 00:12:53.350 ⇒ 00:13:04.939 Greg Stoutenburg: I’ve never logged into Catalysts, so a little bit, I’m just, like, taking it in, trying to keep a straight face here, like, sure, I’m gonna be able to help with whatever this is. Yeah. And, you know, we got it sorted out, but, you know, again, it’s just the sort of thing where.
67 00:13:04.940 ⇒ 00:13:10.570 Uttam Kumaran: And Eden also, like, Eden is a good client to see, because we will never…
68 00:13:10.900 ⇒ 00:13:16.859 Uttam Kumaran: We will most likely never work with people like them again, because they kind of spaz out a lot.
69 00:13:17.040 ⇒ 00:13:19.039 Greg Stoutenburg: And they tend to quickly…
70 00:13:20.460 ⇒ 00:13:21.450 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, really?
71 00:13:21.450 ⇒ 00:13:33.359 Greg Stoutenburg: On, like, Tuesday, he thanked us and was like, you know, Zoran is always this, like, stoic, peaceful person, and here I freak out anytime I see a conversion dip, so…
72 00:13:33.360 ⇒ 00:13:48.249 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, so they spaz out a lot. It’s a very, like, it’s a company built on fear internally, so then we’re… since we’re external, we’re, like, really easy punching bags for a lot. Yeah. And…
73 00:13:48.430 ⇒ 00:13:56.959 Uttam Kumaran: like, we’re moving towards clients that are more put together than both Default and Eden. So you are getting, like, the worst.
74 00:13:57.880 ⇒ 00:14:14.820 Uttam Kumaran: Of, like, mixed requirements, which I actually think is okay, because you will then see what it’s like. Like, when we go work with, like, CES, it’s like, on their side, they’re just so happy that we’re doing anything, and it’s a little bit… it’s a little bit interesting, so…
75 00:14:14.820 ⇒ 00:14:15.300 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah.
76 00:14:15.300 ⇒ 00:14:19.930 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, on one hand, I think it’s good, like, you’re seeing both of those, and I think you’re…
77 00:14:20.450 ⇒ 00:14:24.989 Uttam Kumaran: you’re seeing why, like, I kind of stress how much communication
78 00:14:25.290 ⇒ 00:14:29.140 Uttam Kumaran: Matters in some situations more than just,
79 00:14:29.860 ⇒ 00:14:31.920 Uttam Kumaran: Then just the execution, you know?
80 00:14:31.980 ⇒ 00:14:46.859 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, no, I do agree with that, and I’ve been in work environments in the past where, like, I mean, I was at this one place briefly where, everything looked great from the outside, but then you get in and you find out that, like, the real roadmap is the CEO’s mood this afternoon.
81 00:14:46.860 ⇒ 00:14:47.520 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah.
82 00:14:47.520 ⇒ 00:14:49.990 Greg Stoutenburg: Your design meeting is a joke.
83 00:14:49.990 ⇒ 00:14:53.849 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, that’s most confident companies, by the way, like…
84 00:14:53.850 ⇒ 00:14:55.729 Greg Stoutenburg: Most companies under 15 employees.
85 00:14:58.540 ⇒ 00:15:00.010 Greg Stoutenburg: Most really small ones.
86 00:15:01.570 ⇒ 00:15:02.839 Uttam Kumaran: Birds, you know?
87 00:15:03.150 ⇒ 00:15:03.520 Greg Stoutenburg: Check, check.
88 00:15:03.520 ⇒ 00:15:03.920 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
89 00:15:03.930 ⇒ 00:15:12.910 Greg Stoutenburg: Lost you for a sec. Yeah. Oh, okay. So, yeah, seen it. Seen it, so… .
90 00:15:12.910 ⇒ 00:15:13.510 Uttam Kumaran: Cool.
91 00:15:13.510 ⇒ 00:15:19.210 Greg Stoutenburg: Cool. Alright. Other things, other things top of mind for me? Can I keep going?
92 00:15:19.490 ⇒ 00:15:20.359 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, please.
93 00:15:20.360 ⇒ 00:15:25.600 Greg Stoutenburg: Yep, so I, thanks for jumping on the contract renewal.
94 00:15:25.600 ⇒ 00:15:26.430 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
95 00:15:26.430 ⇒ 00:15:33.990 Greg Stoutenburg: I responded to Rico with just a couple questions, like, I was like, can we just amend these things? Because, like, the original sort of capped me at $8,000 a month, and I was like.
96 00:15:33.990 ⇒ 00:15:34.720 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
97 00:15:34.720 ⇒ 00:15:41.940 Greg Stoutenburg: remove that, because it was, you know, it was 20 hours a week or whatever. And then the other is, and this is just something I’m exploring, like, can I be billed through an LLC?
98 00:15:42.850 ⇒ 00:15:57.980 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, so for both of those, I think, one, on the LLC front, I think we don’t care at this point, since we’re not… we’re just not doing any W-2, so we’re totally… I’m totally fine to do that. On the cap, I think one thing that I was talking to Robert about is, like, we initially were, like.
99 00:15:57.980 ⇒ 00:16:12.850 Uttam Kumaran: we were okay with doing the 8K, because I kind of assumed that you would only have, like, 20 hours, and what I want us to… what I want to propose moving to is moving to our standard sort of leveling, which would put you at, like, 85.
100 00:16:12.910 ⇒ 00:16:20.499 Uttam Kumaran: And then you would then basically be eligible for, like, all… we would just factor in all the bonuses and everything, which I think would…
101 00:16:20.730 ⇒ 00:16:30.830 Uttam Kumaran: basically get you above, 100, like, at the end. So if you’re okay with that, and I think I… if I recall, I believe that’s, like, what we discussed, like.
102 00:16:30.890 ⇒ 00:16:39.140 Uttam Kumaran: when I was at the airport in December, on, like, hey, if we can get… if you… if we can get to our standard, and you can… we can end up with a full plate of work.
103 00:16:39.140 ⇒ 00:16:53.959 Uttam Kumaran: And for you, I think, one, you have work for Default and Eden. You’re also helping on stuff and go to market, and then we’re gonna try to land one or two more clients, right? So… Yeah. Like, I don’t… I expect us to be able to get towards, like, a full plate of work.
104 00:16:53.980 ⇒ 00:16:57.520 Uttam Kumaran: And then I think if we could do 85,
105 00:16:57.880 ⇒ 00:17:01.969 Uttam Kumaran: I think we’re kind of swell there, and then we’d layer on all the…
106 00:17:02.160 ⇒ 00:17:04.969 Uttam Kumaran: Kinda, like, bonus and other stuff that we talked about.
107 00:17:05.220 ⇒ 00:17:12.050 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, yeah, and I think, I mean, like, in principle, I’m good with that. I think just, for me, the question is, like, what, you know.
108 00:17:12.079 ⇒ 00:17:27.229 Greg Stoutenburg: what does that look like at the end of the year? Because, like, you know, what I said before, and I sort of went back on what I was thinking about and thought, I don’t know if this is the right way to put this, because I was like, can we just make sure I don’t make less than 8? But really, if I make 8 in a month, annualized, that’s like 96K. That’s like…
109 00:17:27.700 ⇒ 00:17:35.950 Greg Stoutenburg: not enough. So, so, I mean, yeah, I mean, if there’s… if we think there’s a path to… I mean, I guess that’s…
110 00:17:35.950 ⇒ 00:17:36.670 Uttam Kumaran: Sure.
111 00:17:36.670 ⇒ 00:17:39.239 Greg Stoutenburg: 85 is great if I’m billing… if I’m.
112 00:17:39.240 ⇒ 00:17:39.710 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
113 00:17:39.710 ⇒ 00:17:42.490 Greg Stoutenburg: 30 to 40 hours, and that’s the hard part, right?
114 00:17:42.710 ⇒ 00:17:49.630 Uttam Kumaran: No, no, so that’s what I can still do. I can… no, I can still do, like, a minimum…
115 00:17:53.440 ⇒ 00:17:54.420 Greg Stoutenburg: Hello?
116 00:17:56.190 ⇒ 00:17:57.420 Greg Stoutenburg: Check, check.
117 00:17:58.730 ⇒ 00:18:00.239 Uttam Kumaran: Grace in the car, hold on.
118 00:18:00.240 ⇒ 00:18:01.889 Greg Stoutenburg: Sorry, you… sorry, you cut off there.
119 00:18:01.890 ⇒ 00:18:03.029 Uttam Kumaran: Am I back?
120 00:18:03.200 ⇒ 00:18:04.169 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, you’re back.
121 00:18:04.570 ⇒ 00:18:05.090 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
122 00:18:05.090 ⇒ 00:18:08.499 Greg Stoutenburg: The last thing you say is, we can do, and then I didn’t hear anything after.
123 00:18:08.500 ⇒ 00:18:13.730 Uttam Kumaran: I heard your part, so I… how about we do minimum of 8K, and then we do 85?
124 00:18:13.870 ⇒ 00:18:18.479 Uttam Kumaran: And then… You’re just gonna get whatever… It ends up being.
125 00:18:18.660 ⇒ 00:18:19.370 Greg Stoutenburg: Okay.
126 00:18:19.850 ⇒ 00:18:20.810 Greg Stoutenburg: Okay.
127 00:18:20.810 ⇒ 00:18:21.799 Uttam Kumaran: Does that make sense?
128 00:18:21.800 ⇒ 00:18:23.180 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, yeah, I think we.
129 00:18:23.180 ⇒ 00:18:39.920 Uttam Kumaran: I still want to fulfill your, like, okay, we’re still gonna get a minimum. I’m fine with that. I do want to adhere to, like, our leveling, because we don’t… we’re… as I mentioned earlier, we’re trying to move as many people from, like, contractor to, like, a full plate of work, so nobody is currently…
130 00:18:40.020 ⇒ 00:18:44.780 Uttam Kumaran: Sitting at, like, outside of our, sort of, like, leveling.
131 00:18:44.950 ⇒ 00:18:51.920 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, no, I do understand that too, given that, you know, it’s a services business. And I think…
132 00:18:52.490 ⇒ 00:18:56.200 Greg Stoutenburg: I think it’ll be fine, just as long as I’m able to bill enough, you know what I mean? Because, like…
133 00:18:56.200 ⇒ 00:18:56.700 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
134 00:18:56.700 ⇒ 00:19:07.010 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, I mean, like… like I’m suggesting, so I… when we talked initially, you know, it was, like, full-time equivalent is, like, between 200K, so… Yes.
135 00:19:07.010 ⇒ 00:19:14.989 Uttam Kumaran: The 85… the 85 plus all of our bonuses would basically put you closer to 200.
136 00:19:15.070 ⇒ 00:19:16.190 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah.
137 00:19:16.190 ⇒ 00:19:20.730 Uttam Kumaran: And, like, I think that’s just where we are for the most senior people right now.
138 00:19:20.730 ⇒ 00:19:25.850 Greg Stoutenburg: I’m happy to do the minimum of A2, so there’s not a month in which you get less than that.
139 00:19:25.850 ⇒ 00:19:45.579 Uttam Kumaran: Because… and I… and I’m telling you, I’m gonna fill up… we’re gonna… I’m gonna be… we’re gonna ask for more time on stuff, like, I’m fairly confident. Like, you’re gonna take this… you’re gonna take… if we talk about the Omni thing, you’re gonna take that, that’s gonna be another, like, big set of work, so… Yeah. I’m, like, really, really confident. And then if you do one of those, I have a bunch more that we’re gonna go do, so…
140 00:19:45.580 ⇒ 00:19:51.690 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, good. No, and that’s all good. And I think, you know, maybe this is, like… so I’m… I’m new to this model,
141 00:19:51.690 ⇒ 00:19:52.290 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
142 00:19:52.470 ⇒ 00:19:58.510 Greg Stoutenburg: And I have wondered if I’m, like, way under billing hours, honestly. Like, I put in…
143 00:19:58.970 ⇒ 00:20:14.190 Greg Stoutenburg: like, because I’m mostly only recording if I’m that focused time, you know, if I’m working for Eden, for example, I’m recording a meeting with them, I’m recording that focus time of, like, alright, I got caught up on what I need to get caught up on, now I’m producing. And I’m like.
144 00:20:14.480 ⇒ 00:20:17.839 Greg Stoutenburg: Should I be, kind of, a little more generous to myself on this?
145 00:20:18.150 ⇒ 00:20:22.199 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I guess, like, what… if you… if I was to put it the other way, what time are you not billing?
146 00:20:22.490 ⇒ 00:20:23.950 Uttam Kumaran: Like, tell it to me that way.
147 00:20:24.150 ⇒ 00:20:28.490 Greg Stoutenburg: Okay. I have not been billing time if I do something like…
148 00:20:28.730 ⇒ 00:20:34.530 Greg Stoutenburg: take a short break. Or, I’ve been not been billing time if…
149 00:20:34.650 ⇒ 00:20:42.180 Greg Stoutenburg: there’s, like, research that I have to do in order to prepare to work on some analysis.
150 00:20:42.560 ⇒ 00:20:45.330 Uttam Kumaran: So the second thing I think you should bill for…
151 00:20:45.610 ⇒ 00:20:46.430 Greg Stoutenburg: Okay.
152 00:20:46.430 ⇒ 00:20:56.229 Uttam Kumaran: So, let me tell you, like, the business model on the, on the services side. So, typically, for services companies, you’re expecting all of your team to be 80% billable.
153 00:20:56.360 ⇒ 00:21:08.590 Uttam Kumaran: That’s, like, the typical benchmark, which means, like, let’s say all of our people were to have 40 hours, we’re typically expecting that 32 hours of those are billable.
154 00:21:08.680 ⇒ 00:21:15.549 Uttam Kumaran: So, I’d, I, like, that is our guidance on our side, and so one is, like, I would say.
155 00:21:15.580 ⇒ 00:21:30.269 Uttam Kumaran: if you are working on things for a client, or working on things to prepare for a client, those are client activities. Yeah. Like, you should just bill for that. I think there’s gonna be some things that are, like, 15 minutes, 15 minutes, like, you can be as specific as you want, but I wouldn’t…
156 00:21:30.440 ⇒ 00:21:38.729 Uttam Kumaran: like… and, you know, this is so… it’s funny, because, like, the… if I was just, like, a greedy bastard, I’d be like, oh yeah, don’t bill for any of that.
157 00:21:38.730 ⇒ 00:21:39.500 Greg Stoutenburg: Right, right, right, right.
158 00:21:39.500 ⇒ 00:21:42.809 Uttam Kumaran: I’m saying? Bill for, bill for the day…
159 00:21:45.810 ⇒ 00:21:47.480 Uttam Kumaran: Listen what it is, no.
160 00:21:47.940 ⇒ 00:21:48.370 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, yeah.
161 00:21:48.370 ⇒ 00:21:49.763 Uttam Kumaran: You’re gonna…
162 00:21:53.910 ⇒ 00:21:57.909 Uttam Kumaran: though, is like, for a lot of, for a lot of… Am I out again?
163 00:21:57.910 ⇒ 00:22:02.980 Greg Stoutenburg: Oh, yeah, I lost you for about 20 seconds. You said if I were a greedy bastard, I’d be like, no, don’t bill for any.
164 00:22:02.980 ⇒ 00:22:06.020 Uttam Kumaran: Hold on, can you hear me? Yep. Okay.
165 00:22:06.020 ⇒ 00:22:06.790 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah.
166 00:22:07.050 ⇒ 00:22:14.080 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I was… yeah, so… so I… Bill, if you have a question on, like, is this or not, Bill?
167 00:22:14.190 ⇒ 00:22:16.429 Uttam Kumaran: I, I think,
168 00:22:16.630 ⇒ 00:22:25.310 Uttam Kumaran: I tend to agree with you in that I’m pretty confident that we’re under billing in those places. This is where, like, I would…
169 00:22:25.640 ⇒ 00:22:31.850 Uttam Kumaran: I would like to probably try to give you more… More clarity is…
170 00:22:32.370 ⇒ 00:22:35.320 Uttam Kumaran: is in, like, what is our future roadmap? Like.
171 00:22:35.480 ⇒ 00:22:38.940 Uttam Kumaran: What projects that we think you’re gonna be working on?
172 00:22:39.220 ⇒ 00:22:39.910 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah.
173 00:22:39.910 ⇒ 00:22:41.950 Uttam Kumaran: That we’re gonna have a full book of work.
174 00:22:42.290 ⇒ 00:22:48.390 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, no, that sounds good. Okay. Cool. Well, let’s move forward with that, and then maybe,
175 00:22:48.970 ⇒ 00:22:51.119 Greg Stoutenburg: Should I just Slack with Rico, or with you?
176 00:22:51.120 ⇒ 00:22:53.179 Uttam Kumaran: And we’re talking… we’re talking every…
177 00:22:53.500 ⇒ 00:22:59.569 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah, you could… I’ll text it through, and we’ll get it closed today. Also, dude, we’re talking every week, so…
178 00:22:59.770 ⇒ 00:23:03.900 Uttam Kumaran: as you have any questions on this, like, you know me, I don’t, like, I’m happy to…
179 00:23:04.210 ⇒ 00:23:10.320 Uttam Kumaran: share how we’re thinking about it. And again, my goal is to ramp you up.
180 00:23:10.390 ⇒ 00:23:16.219 Uttam Kumaran: To get you a full book, and then, ideally, like, we’re gonna be pressing more towards, like.
181 00:23:16.270 ⇒ 00:23:31.699 Uttam Kumaran: W-2s and, you know, U.S. folks… for U.S. folks this year, and hopefully this next quarter, and so I want everybody on the team to have a comfortable book of at least 40 hours of work, so that that transition is, like, is really, really clear.
182 00:23:31.710 ⇒ 00:23:39.830 Greg Stoutenburg: So, yeah. Yeah, that’s great. No, I love that. That’s where I want to be going. So, cool. Alright, that all sounds good.
183 00:23:39.830 ⇒ 00:23:51.829 Uttam Kumaran: And then if you need… also, like, this is, like, more on, like, an individual… I did the LLC thing, by the way, so if you have any questions on how to do that, if you need an accountant or a lawyer to review anything.
184 00:23:51.830 ⇒ 00:24:02.450 Uttam Kumaran: if you actually want to use our… like, because that’s how we started this business, by the way, so… and I used to do that through my own LLC when I was learning, kind of, about consulting.
185 00:24:02.750 ⇒ 00:24:05.390 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, that’s what I mean. So, if you need any, like.
186 00:24:05.980 ⇒ 00:24:14.450 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, okay, if you need any of the paperwork, like, if you’re like, yo, I don’t… when I’m about to chat GPT a contract, I can give you our contracts, and you can use them. They’re…
187 00:24:14.720 ⇒ 00:24:15.040 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah.
188 00:24:15.040 ⇒ 00:24:16.550 Uttam Kumaran: They’re really protective.
189 00:24:17.280 ⇒ 00:24:18.100 Uttam Kumaran: See?
190 00:24:18.670 ⇒ 00:24:35.440 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, I… yeah, I would… I would really appreciate that. That is where I’m at now, and I’m just like, you know, I’m just figuring out how to build this thing, and just sort of doing it, you know, what’s the metaphor? You know, like, building the plane while you’re flying it. So, yeah, I’ll… I’ll take it.
191 00:24:37.330 ⇒ 00:24:41.009 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, cool. Yeah, and if you’re, like, googling stuff, and you’re, like.
192 00:24:41.130 ⇒ 00:24:46.840 Uttam Kumaran: if you’re building stuff, and, like, this is, like, super confusing, just let me know. I went through the same, so I’m happy.
193 00:24:46.840 ⇒ 00:24:49.260 Greg Stoutenburg: Okay, yeah, I appreciate that. And,
194 00:24:49.430 ⇒ 00:24:58.730 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, that all sounds good, and for, For the Tableau to Omni, project,
195 00:24:58.730 ⇒ 00:24:59.470 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
196 00:24:59.640 ⇒ 00:25:01.619 Greg Stoutenburg: Just let me know when you want to do that.
197 00:25:01.740 ⇒ 00:25:13.489 Greg Stoutenburg: sort of overview. Never done it, definitely feeling very grateful for how much stuff I’ve been able to learn in a… sort of, like, through a different lens, from a different starting point since I’ve been with Brainforge.
198 00:25:15.950 ⇒ 00:25:33.929 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I think one is, like, it’s gonna… it’s gonna be, like, a little bit of expansion of what you’re learning on the Mixpanel side, is that that company just needs a lot of help on, like, metric organization. The lovely thing is, BI and metrics and, like, is, like, what our company’s foundation is built on, so it’s actually a very safe project.
199 00:25:34.050 ⇒ 00:25:35.449 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah. In that, like.
200 00:25:35.450 ⇒ 00:25:48.579 Uttam Kumaran: everybody on our data team is very, very familiar with this type of work. Like, the Catalyst thing, for example, is purely Zoron, so that’s why he’s, like, kind of in a jam, and everyone learning from him.
201 00:25:48.580 ⇒ 00:26:07.550 Uttam Kumaran: Versus, like, standing up BI is, like, something we do kind of in our sleep. So, I think, like, if you don’t mind, like, I would love to sort of grab time on Monday. Maybe we can spend an hour and map out, like, the different phases of the project. I will have you pair directly with,
202 00:26:07.770 ⇒ 00:26:27.049 Uttam Kumaran: either Demolade or Awash on… on the, on the data side, who will kind of be your, like, technical backing. And then we’ll talk through, like, how to do it. The other part is, like, Omni is also, like, really, really helpful. So, they have a lot of helpful guides, they’re super supportive, and so… and the tool is really…
203 00:26:27.190 ⇒ 00:26:38.109 Uttam Kumaran: Great. So, it’ll be a little bit of a learning curve on just, like, learning about business intelligence tooling, but you’re gonna see, it’s just, like, it’s just the same kind of, like.
204 00:26:38.250 ⇒ 00:26:44.179 Uttam Kumaran: it’s just a lot of data work, so… Yeah. Part of it will be… part of it will be,
205 00:26:44.230 ⇒ 00:26:51.509 Uttam Kumaran: like, there’ll be some type of, like, we need to stand up Omni, we need to show similar reports side by side.
206 00:26:51.510 ⇒ 00:27:09.860 Uttam Kumaran: do some demos, show a lot of the AI features, and then we’ll kind of build a migration plan. Yeah. The product, Omni as a product is super, super good, so the executives are gonna find it, like, way better than what they’re dealing with in Tableau, and the AI features are also super, super good.
207 00:27:09.960 ⇒ 00:27:28.889 Uttam Kumaran: Cool. The other, sort of, like, you know, more of, like, why I think this is, an important project for Brainforge is, like, one, we’re deepening our partnership with Omni. This will be, like, our third project with them. Second is they’re gonna… that tool is gonna blow up, like, it’s… you’ll see it’ll become like Tableau in probably, like, 2 years.
208 00:27:28.930 ⇒ 00:27:37.579 Uttam Kumaran: It’s just very, very good. So, I want to make sure that our team is, like, on the edge on some of these tools that are, that are, like, really, really up and coming.
209 00:27:37.630 ⇒ 00:27:40.569 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah. And we are sort of continuing to push.
210 00:27:40.600 ⇒ 00:27:43.429 Uttam Kumaran: how AI helps, like.
211 00:27:43.560 ⇒ 00:27:58.879 Uttam Kumaran: with, you know, business intelligence and querying. So, it’s a fun project. I think on Monday, we’ll sort of scope out the, like, conservative estimate on timeline, and then what I think we could do, like, how do we, you know, over-exceed that.
212 00:27:59.060 ⇒ 00:28:04.090 Uttam Kumaran: And then, yeah, I mean, I feel like we’ll just go from there.
213 00:28:04.490 ⇒ 00:28:09.060 Greg Stoutenburg: Yeah, cool. Yeah, that sounds good to me. That’s perfect.
214 00:28:10.340 ⇒ 00:28:12.590 Greg Stoutenburg: I have no other thoughts. Okay.
215 00:28:12.590 ⇒ 00:28:15.719 Uttam Kumaran: Cool. Alright, great.
216 00:28:15.720 ⇒ 00:28:19.730 Greg Stoutenburg: Cool, yeah, I already sent, I blocked off time on Monday and sent you an invite.
217 00:28:20.110 ⇒ 00:28:29.950 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, cool. If I can, yeah, I don’t know if you’re gonna spend any time on it before then, let me know, I can send some resources. I might as well… I may just, like, jot down some random thoughts.
218 00:28:30.010 ⇒ 00:28:33.069 Greg Stoutenburg: Maybe if you want to create, like, a little Notion.
219 00:28:33.170 ⇒ 00:28:38.189 Uttam Kumaran: for it, I can write down some, like, resources and things, and, like.
220 00:28:38.190 ⇒ 00:28:38.940 Greg Stoutenburg: Sure.
221 00:28:38.940 ⇒ 00:28:43.690 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I may have just, like, a couple minutes to, like, note down some thoughts, so…
222 00:28:44.020 ⇒ 00:28:47.230 Greg Stoutenburg: Okay, sounds good. I’ll do that.
223 00:28:47.490 ⇒ 00:28:52.700 Greg Stoutenburg: And, I guess you’ll follow up with Rico and just send me something over?
224 00:28:52.910 ⇒ 00:28:53.580 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
225 00:28:53.870 ⇒ 00:28:54.580 Greg Stoutenburg: Okay.
226 00:28:54.880 ⇒ 00:28:55.740 Greg Stoutenburg: Boom.
227 00:28:56.270 ⇒ 00:29:04.300 Greg Stoutenburg: Alright, sounds good. Yep, I’ll be heads down on default and Eden today, and then we’ll skate off into the weekend.
228 00:29:04.650 ⇒ 00:29:06.910 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, perfect, dude. Thank you for the call.
229 00:29:07.110 ⇒ 00:29:08.660 Greg Stoutenburg: Cool, yep. Thanks, Titan. Talk soon.
230 00:29:08.660 ⇒ 00:29:09.590 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, thank you.
231 00:29:09.890 ⇒ 00:29:10.700 Greg Stoutenburg: Bye.