Meeting Title: Brainforge Content Strategy Discussion Date: 2025-08-13 Meeting participants: Jake Nathan, Robert Tseng
WEBVTT
1 00:03:23.040 ⇒ 00:03:24.490 Jake Nathan: What’s up, Robert?
2 00:03:24.490 ⇒ 00:03:25.470 Robert Tseng: Hey, Jake?
3 00:03:26.310 ⇒ 00:03:27.479 Jake Nathan: How’s it going, dude?
4 00:03:27.480 ⇒ 00:03:29.490 Robert Tseng: Long time no see. How you been?
5 00:03:30.150 ⇒ 00:03:41.459 Jake Nathan: Good, man. Just, been in Austin still, playing, playing pickleball a handful of times since the last time I saw you, and yeah, just, …
6 00:03:41.920 ⇒ 00:03:44.260 Jake Nathan: Yeah, what about you? Are you in New York still?
7 00:03:44.450 ⇒ 00:03:59.549 Robert Tseng: Yeah, still in New York. My business partner lives in Austin, so I actually came to Austin, once, once again, it was a short trip, though, but same conference I was at last time when I met you. Yeah. This time, we actually went through the accelerator, we, like.
8 00:03:59.750 ⇒ 00:04:07.710 Robert Tseng: presented at the conference and everything. So, yeah, no, it’s been… it’s been good. I have a reason to come, like, kind of every few months now.
9 00:04:07.710 ⇒ 00:04:10.720 Jake Nathan: Oh yeah, dude, hit me up next time you come, let’s play some pickleball.
10 00:04:10.950 ⇒ 00:04:12.140 Robert Tseng: Yeah, that would be great.
11 00:04:12.680 ⇒ 00:04:13.240 Jake Nathan: …
12 00:04:13.560 ⇒ 00:04:31.210 Jake Nathan: Well, dude, tell me, I want to be as helpful as possible. You were saying a little bit about, how y’all were, like, trying to think about content, and I went through y’all’s YouTube channel and LinkedIn and stuff, and, but I’d love to hear from you, and then I want to be as helpful as I can, so what’s up?
13 00:04:31.380 ⇒ 00:04:35.859 Robert Tseng: Okay, cool, yeah, I mean, I guess if you’ve seen a bit of our branding now, …
14 00:04:36.110 ⇒ 00:04:38.410 Robert Tseng: Yeah, well, I feel like we’ve gotten, like.
15 00:04:39.640 ⇒ 00:04:45.990 Robert Tseng: We’ve gotten the foundations covered, where we have, like, a content, you know, strategy, some…
16 00:04:46.110 ⇒ 00:05:02.539 Robert Tseng: regular posting for both of our accounts. I think the quality can get better. I mean, we’re obviously using, kind of like… we have an in-house marketing team at this point, it’s mostly VAs, and, you know, we’re… we’re just trying to level them up here and there, and, yeah, still finding, like.
17 00:05:02.540 ⇒ 00:05:22.230 Robert Tseng: I think the long-form interviews are… do well, like, they get referenced often when we meet new leads, so like, hey, we listened to this technical conversation you had. I think we do, like, co-hosting events as well, so both in-person and virtual. Those drive a lot of engagement for us. And then, like, everything else on LinkedIn is really just to kind of just grease the wheels and, like, keep
18 00:05:22.360 ⇒ 00:05:33.739 Robert Tseng: more eyes, like, on our profiles and stuff, but, like, we’re not really getting… I mean, content’s not driving any leads for us, really, directly, in my opinion. Or, like, at least that… that post, like, LinkedIn, LinkedIn content.
19 00:05:33.740 ⇒ 00:05:34.370 Jake Nathan: Okay.
20 00:05:34.390 ⇒ 00:05:35.170 Robert Tseng: …
21 00:05:35.530 ⇒ 00:05:42.559 Robert Tseng: So yeah, I mean, I think from my perspective, like, I kind of… I basically lead go-to-market for our team, and …
22 00:05:43.020 ⇒ 00:05:46.670 Robert Tseng: you know, we have some outbound campaigns that, like, I’ve been kind of
23 00:05:46.860 ⇒ 00:06:05.339 Robert Tseng: I’ve been having the team execute on. But yeah, I think we’re also just thinking, like, I think we’re at a point now where it’d be great to, like, bring in somebody to come and run go-to-market. And, so we’ve been talking, interviewing a bunch of people, actually, so it was time that you reached out, because I was like, oh yeah, I mean, you’re…
24 00:06:05.490 ⇒ 00:06:24.769 Robert Tseng: you’ve been in the B2B space, obviously you do B2C content now, but, like, maybe you would know people that, with kind of the profile that we’re looking for. So yeah, I mean, I think I… I can kind of go into more detail of, like, who I… who I… where I think we’re… we… we need support in, but it’s kind of… that’s… that’s kind of the… the spiel.
25 00:06:25.630 ⇒ 00:06:43.520 Jake Nathan: Totally, yeah. That, that makes sense. And so you were saying, so LinkedIn, you’re kind of using it to grease the wheels, not getting too many leads, but you, yeah, like, if you had to just, rank, like, the content that’s driving the most leads, like you’re saying, it seems like long form is the most right now?
26 00:06:44.140 ⇒ 00:06:53.160 Robert Tseng: Yeah, well, like, that’s what gets talked about the most. I don’t… I still think that content’s not directly bringing in leads, like, it’s not a first touch place, like, I think it’s, like.
27 00:06:53.250 ⇒ 00:07:04.490 Robert Tseng: people hear of us through the events, or kind of through referrals, or whatever. They look us up, they’ll look at the content, they’ll go watch the YouTube video and take a look at it, and … yeah, people, like.
28 00:07:04.490 ⇒ 00:07:18.269 Robert Tseng: just kind of takes different pieces out of it, and we finally jump on a call with them, that’s usually something that they reference. Usually, like, the event that we did, like, someone at an event introduced them, or, like.
29 00:07:18.340 ⇒ 00:07:27.350 Robert Tseng: yeah, they, like, looked us up, and they saw something on our… on YouTube through our… through our long-form interviews, and that’s usually a conversation starter for us.
30 00:07:27.730 ⇒ 00:07:32.839 Jake Nathan: Yeah, I think it’s awesome that y’all are already doing long form, because, yeah, I think long form is…
31 00:07:33.040 ⇒ 00:07:44.850 Jake Nathan: like, one of the… I think it is the most underrated format, because usually it takes longer, and it, doesn’t get, like, the virality that short form does, but like… like you said, people who actually stick around for…
32 00:07:44.850 ⇒ 00:08:07.200 Jake Nathan: 40 minutes and watch it, they’re gonna be so much warmer than someone who just saw, like, one post, so I think that’s… and in general, yeah, so I checked out the website. One, the branding is awesome, like, I think it’s really well done. And then the… yeah, like, y’all already have a content motion, which is, like, the hardest part. Most people, when they ask me, like, how to make better content, they haven’t even posted, so I’m like, okay.
33 00:08:07.200 ⇒ 00:08:07.690 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
34 00:08:07.690 ⇒ 00:08:27.949 Jake Nathan: start with that. So that’s really good. So, my… yeah, I just want to try to be as helpful as I can. So, my… my, model when I’m thinking about, like, how to do content, my… my two things are, number one, value, number two, packaging. So, value is, like, I’m trying to think, and especially y’all, y’all are subject matter experts.
35 00:08:27.950 ⇒ 00:08:33.559 Jake Nathan: How can you give away as much value as humanly possible just…
36 00:08:33.710 ⇒ 00:08:43.729 Jake Nathan: Selflessly, because, as you know, like, you could tell me, like, let’s say I had a, like, I needed help with AI, you could give me the exact steps on how to do it.
37 00:08:43.850 ⇒ 00:08:57.240 Jake Nathan: what’s gonna happen? I’m probably gonna get to step two, and then I’m not gonna be able to figure it out, and then, like, I would ask you for help again. Yeah. If I already was, like…
38 00:08:57.560 ⇒ 00:09:11.559 Jake Nathan: people who are gonna figure it out themselves are gonna figure it out themselves anyway. So, you, like, I’m a big fan of, like, trying to give away as much as possible, and then it’s actually gonna come back, because, like, I’ve… I’ve, I’ve probably had
39 00:09:11.560 ⇒ 00:09:26.740 Jake Nathan: like, probably a call once a week with someone, like, getting help with, content, and I tell them, like, hey, here are, like, the three things that you need to do, like, especially in the B2C side, like, people who come to me with brands are like, okay, how do you grow on TikTok? And I literally say exactly what to do, and then…
40 00:09:26.740 ⇒ 00:09:29.330 Jake Nathan: Yeah. Two months later, they hit me up, and they’re like.
41 00:09:29.330 ⇒ 00:09:45.959 Jake Nathan: And I look, and obviously, it’s just… I do the same thing in other ways, so it’s just like… so anyway, so number one is value, and then number two is packaging. So, like, really trying to figure out what are the… like, you know, the… don’t judge a book by its cover, I think it’s, like, my hot take is, like, it’s the opposite, like.
42 00:09:45.960 ⇒ 00:10:06.100 Jake Nathan: people judge a book by its cover, so, like, make it the best packaging possible, like, that’s why I think I’ve grown on TikTok, is just because, like, anyone can make a cooking video, but, like, I’ve obsessed over, like, how to package it to where, like, the hook hooks you in, and then the pacing of the video, all that. So, for y’all… Yeah.
43 00:10:06.320 ⇒ 00:10:21.660 Jake Nathan: and I see you do this on LinkedIn, like, you have, like, a lot of them are, like, infographics of, … Yeah. And so, that’d be an example to me of, like, that’s, like, it is awesome that y’all are posting those, but I would… I would go even deeper and… and try to, like.
44 00:10:21.810 ⇒ 00:10:46.579 Jake Nathan: give away more sauce, basically, in your secret sauce, in your content. So, like, that’s probably gonna lend itself to either more videos, where you can explain things more, or long-form text, like, personal narratives. Like, there’s a ton of different formats, and we can talk about those, but I would, I would spend more time, even if you post less, posting, like, super
45 00:10:46.580 ⇒ 00:11:01.470 Jake Nathan: valuable stuff that, like, almost no one else can get anywhere else, and then in return, they’re gonna be, like, more likely. Versus, like, even if you got 50 likes on an infographic, because that’s more, like, generic, like a quote or something. Yeah.
46 00:11:01.470 ⇒ 00:11:03.360 Jake Nathan: I would…
47 00:11:03.470 ⇒ 00:11:22.950 Jake Nathan: I would, yeah, double down on just, like, thinking, like, you have so much knowledge trapped in your head, like, how can you just give away as much as you can? And then, like, for the long form, I, I, was looking at your LinkedIn, like, I actually, I really like a lot of the long-form interviews, and another part of packaging is figuring out how do you…
48 00:11:22.950 ⇒ 00:11:36.209 Jake Nathan: repurpose content that you already have, so that way you don’t have to, like, reinvent the wheel every time. So, like, I think y’all were interviewing a guy… I think the interview I watched was either, like, a private equity person, or, like, a…
49 00:11:36.380 ⇒ 00:11:42.479 Jake Nathan: guy who helps, … it’s, like, superposition, I forgot. Yeah, yeah. I’m trying to remember.
50 00:11:42.480 ⇒ 00:11:44.380 Robert Tseng: Oh, yeah, thanks, thanks for looking, yeah.
51 00:11:44.380 ⇒ 00:12:03.179 Jake Nathan: Yeah, but, like, I think y’all reposted just, like, hey, you can go watch the interview here, but I would now take that, like, there’s so many, like, nuggets in there, like, that should be, you know, push yourself to see if you can get 5 to 10 posts out of that, whether it’s quotes, whether it’s, like.
52 00:12:03.380 ⇒ 00:12:14.789 Jake Nathan: taking one part of what he said, and then trying to, like, expand on it and making it, like, a full post. Whether it’s… I don’t know if y’all do a newsletter, I think y’all might do a newsletter, but, like.
53 00:12:14.790 ⇒ 00:12:19.160 Robert Tseng: We do, but it’s not… I mean, we have a link to it, but we don’t send out stuff that often, to be honest.
54 00:12:19.160 ⇒ 00:12:28.010 Jake Nathan: Yeah, yeah, like, you could literally just make a newsletter for the next, 24 newsletters, like, once a week, out of just…
55 00:12:28.010 ⇒ 00:12:50.339 Jake Nathan: 6 interviews that y’all have done, just, like, literally just take a 5-minute part of it and make that topic your newsletter, and then link to the long form. Like, to me, I think that’s the other thing, is people think, like, oh, I need to do all this new stuff, but, like, especially long form, you just have so many nuggets in there, so I would… I would just repurpose, like, almost… it should be a little bit uncomfortable, like, how much
56 00:12:50.340 ⇒ 00:12:55.440 Jake Nathan: you’re repurposing it, … Yeah. Yeah. And then, …
57 00:12:55.440 ⇒ 00:13:09.240 Jake Nathan: So yeah, I think valued packaging, and then, optionally, one thing that I haven’t actually started doing yet, but I want to start, doing is… I don’t know if y’all… do y’all run any LinkedIn ads, or no?
58 00:13:09.790 ⇒ 00:13:10.599 Robert Tseng: We don’t, yeah.
59 00:13:10.600 ⇒ 00:13:25.720 Jake Nathan: I would, even if you, actually don’t start running ads, I think you should definitely, and you know it from your e-commerce days, like, you should set up, like, set up the LinkedIn pixel on your website, just so the pixel starts…
60 00:13:25.720 ⇒ 00:13:36.529 Jake Nathan: bringing in data about, like, who’s coming to your website, who’s clicking on specific forms, because ultimately, once you really do start having kind of, like, a flow of, …
61 00:13:36.530 ⇒ 00:13:47.700 Jake Nathan: people coming and visiting, then you’ll… like, the cheapest form of paid advertising is retargeting, because, like, you… they already have the data. So, ….
62 00:13:47.700 ⇒ 00:13:48.130 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
63 00:13:48.130 ⇒ 00:14:01.479 Jake Nathan: Yeah, that way, now you have, like, this kind of trove of data that you could start retargeting people, because I think that’s kind of the… at a high level, I think that’s, like, the best marketing strategy is, like, crush it organically, give away a ton of value, and then…
64 00:14:01.570 ⇒ 00:14:11.450 Jake Nathan: kind of use paid marketing, like, retargeting as, like, a bottom of funnel, like, okay, remember you saw that, you know, long-form video now, like, come book a call with us.
65 00:14:11.810 ⇒ 00:14:15.149 Robert Tseng: Yeah, yeah, no, that’s a really good way of putting it, yeah.
66 00:14:16.720 ⇒ 00:14:26.920 Jake Nathan: So yeah, that’s… that’s kind of, like, high level. I mean, I know I threw a lot at you, but then, I mean, I’m down to go into, like, formats, but that… yeah, that was kind of, like, the main takeaway, I guess.
67 00:14:27.300 ⇒ 00:14:29.710 Robert Tseng: Okay, cool. Yeah, no, I think, …
68 00:14:30.450 ⇒ 00:14:48.279 Robert Tseng: Yeah, for us, it was just kind of getting the motion started, like, I think we were like, okay, we need to just be regularly posting, and then we’ll kind of find ways to boost the quality. So I think it’s good, it’s timely advice on, like, yeah, like, really lean into making the post quality, or, I mean, yeah, like, we can slow down the pacing, or just, like, make higher quality posts.
69 00:14:48.360 ⇒ 00:14:56.099 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think that’s something that, … I mean, it’s just… it is… it just takes more time from my partner and I, like, we have to….
70 00:14:56.100 ⇒ 00:14:56.540 Jake Nathan: Totally.
71 00:14:56.560 ⇒ 00:14:58.670 Robert Tseng: … Yeah, like….
72 00:14:58.670 ⇒ 00:14:59.750 Jake Nathan: Yeah, you’re….
73 00:14:59.750 ⇒ 00:15:03.779 Robert Tseng: Caring for those interviews is… takes a bit of time, and then also, like.
74 00:15:03.950 ⇒ 00:15:08.929 Robert Tseng: Yeah, if we were to do more long-form, like, written content as well, …
75 00:15:09.110 ⇒ 00:15:14.029 Robert Tseng: I mean, what we’ve been able to do with AI, I guess, is just be able to
76 00:15:14.560 ⇒ 00:15:17.940 Robert Tseng: We, you know, once or twice a week, we’ll just, like.
77 00:15:18.480 ⇒ 00:15:29.569 Robert Tseng: brain dump transcripts, and then have our team kind of, like, pull out nuggets, and then sort of spin up drafts, and then they come… it comes to us for approval. We’ll do, like, some last-touch editing, and then kind of push it.
78 00:15:29.570 ⇒ 00:15:41.280 Robert Tseng: I, I think that it’s… I mean, it’s still a bit clunky, like, I feel like it takes me, like, maybe 20, 20 to 30 minutes to kind of refine each post, or I just, like, I’m just like, I’m not gonna….
79 00:15:41.280 ⇒ 00:15:41.630 Jake Nathan: Yes.
80 00:15:41.630 ⇒ 00:15:44.600 Robert Tseng: This is nowhere near, we’re not gonna post this. Yeah.
81 00:15:44.790 ⇒ 00:15:56.379 Robert Tseng: But yeah, there’s other times I’m just like, okay, well, we just need to get something out, like, well, I’ll just let this one through today, whatever. So I think there are definitely… there’s more tightening up of the process that we could make, and…
82 00:15:56.390 ⇒ 00:16:11.130 Robert Tseng: Yeah, at least for me, like, my… like, I have… my head hasn’t been on improving the content, per se, it’s been more on, like, we have, like, a bunch of connections and leads at this point, so I’m running a few campaigns, like, one is, like.
83 00:16:11.250 ⇒ 00:16:19.950 Robert Tseng: a mutual intro kind of campaign, like, asking first-degree connections to make intros to second-degree connections. So, like, that’s something that I’ve been having our team execute on.
84 00:16:19.950 ⇒ 00:16:35.199 Robert Tseng: kind of circling back with people who the timing wasn’t right the first time we talked, or whatever reason, like, we just didn’t close the deal. Just kind of bringing up, hey, here are some updates, like, maybe it’s a better time. So, like, I’m kind of, like, focused on executing those outbound motions, but…
85 00:16:35.210 ⇒ 00:16:48.200 Robert Tseng: Yeah, after that, I want to come back to content and kind of boost the quality there. So, but yeah, I feel like that’s just kind of a limitation, like, we still have to run the business and work on some of the client work, too, so that’s why I think for both of us, we’re like.
86 00:16:48.310 ⇒ 00:17:00.340 Robert Tseng: you know, if we’re both spending 25%, kind of, like, worrying of our time, worrying about the stuff, like, I think that’s… that’s definitely a full-time job that we should go and hire for someone to come and, and help drive that forward, so…
87 00:17:00.340 ⇒ 00:17:09.140 Robert Tseng: I don’t know what your thoughts are, like, at our stage, or kind of what you’ve seen, like, do you think hiring somebody at this point would be a good move? Just…
88 00:17:09.140 ⇒ 00:17:22.049 Robert Tseng: like, we have all, like, these people who do execution, but nobody is able to really own a roadmap and, like, kind of push strategy forward. So, yeah, I think that’s kind of, like, some… something that we’ve been thinking about,
89 00:17:22.079 ⇒ 00:17:22.800 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
90 00:17:23.190 ⇒ 00:17:41.029 Jake Nathan: Yeah, that… that totally makes sense. I mean, yeah, I think, like, if it’s possible to find someone smart that you can bring in-house, like, that’s… that would definitely be the best way to do it. I think… I’m trying to just think off the top of my head of, like, some ways to, like, …
91 00:17:41.370 ⇒ 00:17:46.269 Jake Nathan: Besides, like, just doing the classic, like, you know, reaching out to people, like, …
92 00:17:47.240 ⇒ 00:17:59.319 Jake Nathan: I think it’d be interesting, it might be a bigger time investment up front, but, like, I do feel like, I mean, as you see in all of tech, like, just, younger people
93 00:17:59.460 ⇒ 00:18:06.070 Jake Nathan: Tend to have, like, just a better taste of, like, what, does well, like, especially on short-form stuff.
94 00:18:06.070 ⇒ 00:18:06.500 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
95 00:18:06.500 ⇒ 00:18:08.229 Jake Nathan: So, like.
96 00:18:08.490 ⇒ 00:18:29.830 Jake Nathan: there are, I mean, it would take a while, but, like, maybe just, like, while you’re eating lunch or something, like, scrolling TikTok, and even if it’s someone who has a completely, like, is, you know, not in the… like, I think it’s gonna be really hard to find someone who’s really good at content and really good at exactly what Brainforge does, but I think that’s possible to basically upskill someone
97 00:18:29.830 ⇒ 00:18:41.449 Jake Nathan: like, who’s good… like, it’s… I think the biggest skill in content is taste, which is kind of annoying, because, like, that’s not, like, it’s not, like, knowing how to code or something, but it’s…
98 00:18:41.910 ⇒ 00:18:43.540 Jake Nathan: Basically, knowing the…
99 00:18:43.680 ⇒ 00:18:59.280 Jake Nathan: like, knowing if this is a good post or not, which is just… like, AI is, I think, is gonna continue to get way better at it, but still, like, it’s just, like, knowing kind of off the ground. Yeah, for sure. So anyway, so I think it’s harder to teach taste than it is to teach
100 00:18:59.410 ⇒ 00:19:11.620 Jake Nathan: almost anything else. So, yeah, I think if you… it might take a while, but if you can basically find someone who’s a killer creator, and then upskill them on what you’re doing, I think that’s possible. So, like…
101 00:19:11.840 ⇒ 00:19:21.850 Jake Nathan: I’m just thinking, like, in college, I mean, I remember I was always just, like, thirsty to get an internship, so I don’t know if leveraging it like that, like, that…
102 00:19:22.080 ⇒ 00:19:26.359 Jake Nathan: Like, just finding someone, like a college person, ….
103 00:19:27.080 ⇒ 00:19:44.770 Robert Tseng: Yeah, how… how did you get into… like, yeah, I don’t… I don’t… you were… I mean, you were a business consultant before, and, like, I guess, how did you end up, kind of, making the switch? Like, I’m trying to look at, like, who’s somebody who’s, like, kind of… yeah, like, how do I… how do I find somebody, like, with… with, like, someone like you, I guess, so….
104 00:19:45.310 ⇒ 00:19:47.540 Jake Nathan: Yeah, that’s a… I’m trying to think.
105 00:19:47.710 ⇒ 00:19:51.079 Jake Nathan: I’ve had just the most random, like, …
106 00:19:51.200 ⇒ 00:19:57.910 Jake Nathan: career, like, because before I… so I graduated UT, like, 2020,
107 00:19:58.040 ⇒ 00:20:04.810 Jake Nathan: right before I started, like, basically during COVID, I started a lacrosse YouTube channel, because I grew up playing lacrosse.
108 00:20:04.810 ⇒ 00:20:23.620 Jake Nathan: taught me, like, how to make videos, and then I did that at… and then I kind of did that on the side while I was at Deloitte, then I worked for a startup, and then I ultimately left that, and then I was like, okay, lacrosse is so small, I need to try to do something bigger, so then that’s… I was like, oh, cooking is such a big niche, I’ll do that. So…
109 00:20:23.650 ⇒ 00:20:30.109 Jake Nathan: That, … but that’s just so random, I’m trying to think, … Yeah, like…
110 00:20:30.250 ⇒ 00:20:39.730 Jake Nathan: I… my only advice for hiring there is just, like, just trying to… just… people who have… make good… good content, whether it’s videos, posts, like.
111 00:20:40.050 ⇒ 00:20:47.539 Jake Nathan: that, yeah, just hiring someone for taste as opposed to skills, I think, is usually the better move. … Yeah.
112 00:20:47.540 ⇒ 00:20:54.899 Robert Tseng: I feel like, I mean, obviously, like, and you’re working with a lot of people who want to learn from you, and they’re not gonna… not gonna be as big as you are, but, like.
113 00:20:55.080 ⇒ 00:20:58.130 Robert Tseng: Maybe, like, if there’s somebody that you’re like, hey, like.
114 00:20:58.530 ⇒ 00:21:04.189 Robert Tseng: They’re gonna keep growing their content, but they need to also have something on the side that’s, like, kind of consistently, like.
115 00:21:04.340 ⇒ 00:21:12.539 Robert Tseng: I don’t know, I feel like maybe you’re working with, you know, talented content creators more than I am, and I’d be open to kind of tapping into that network, too.
116 00:21:12.960 ⇒ 00:21:18.429 Jake Nathan: Yeah, totally. Let me… I’m… I’m gonna try to think, on it. … Yeah.
117 00:21:18.840 ⇒ 00:21:22.319 Jake Nathan: Cause, yeah, I want to try to be helpful. And, …
118 00:21:22.560 ⇒ 00:21:25.140 Jake Nathan: And on my side, I, …
119 00:21:25.390 ⇒ 00:21:33.789 Jake Nathan: truly, it’s kind of, like, random timing, but basically, like, so, what I’ve been up to, like, I guess since the last time we talked, so I did the cooking.
120 00:21:33.790 ⇒ 00:21:48.499 Jake Nathan: Yeah. That was fun. I basically just… it came down to… it was a… it was, like, an amazing lifestyle business, but, like, just with the cookbooks, I’m sure I could have figured it out, but just, like, the repeat purchase rate of the cookbooks was, like, basically brutal, because, like, you can.
121 00:21:48.500 ⇒ 00:21:49.120 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
122 00:21:49.360 ⇒ 00:21:51.140 Jake Nathan: So I was just like, okay, I…
123 00:21:51.180 ⇒ 00:22:06.240 Jake Nathan: once again, like, I could… it would be a fun life to be, like, a cooking influencer, I guess, but I just… I just didn’t want to do it. So, then after that, very, very funny, I… I started a high-protein frozen pizza business, and …
124 00:22:06.240 ⇒ 00:22:11.870 Jake Nathan: No way! For, like, the past 8 months, and it was… it was, like, the most fun I’ve ever had doing something. And basically….
125 00:22:11.870 ⇒ 00:22:12.490 Robert Tseng: Amazing.
126 00:22:12.490 ⇒ 00:22:18.369 Jake Nathan: Yeah, like, I got in, I guess, … I don’t know if you’ve ever been to Central Market in Texas.
127 00:22:18.370 ⇒ 00:22:19.269 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I have.
128 00:22:19.270 ⇒ 00:22:30.160 Jake Nathan: Okay, yeah, so I got into Central Market, and it, like, did super well, and then basically it just came down to… I needed to raise money to, like, to scale, and I just…
129 00:22:30.360 ⇒ 00:22:45.860 Jake Nathan: … at the end of the day, I kind of realized, like, okay, I’d rather… like, this is, like, such… like, building a CPG company is such a moonshot business. It’s awesome if you… like, if you get acquired by Nestle, then, like, you’re on top of the world, but if you don’t, then the path to get there is kind of…
130 00:22:45.920 ⇒ 00:23:07.649 Jake Nathan: it’s just… it’s pretty binary, it seems like, in CPG. So, ultimately, I kind of realized, like, okay, I love making content, I’m confident in that, but I just would rather build something that has, like, that’s just, like, profitable, I guess, from day one, which kind of eliminates, like, 90% of business models, and then leads me, actually, to doing services. So… Yeah.
131 00:23:07.650 ⇒ 00:23:09.000 Robert Tseng: I….
132 00:23:09.350 ⇒ 00:23:17.060 Jake Nathan: I have started, like, … like, literally today, I reached out to a bunch of, … like, I, …
133 00:23:17.300 ⇒ 00:23:29.149 Jake Nathan: reached out to a bunch of tech companies and, like, basically offering, like, hey, can I do some sort of… like, ultimately, I think the goal would be, like, building some sort of B2B marketing
134 00:23:29.160 ⇒ 00:23:42.169 Jake Nathan: agency for B2B companies. So, I’m not trying to, like, I’m truly… just wanna help you as a friend, but if there’s… if there’s any way you think that there’s some sort of, like.
135 00:23:42.260 ⇒ 00:23:45.950 Jake Nathan: … Part-time, like, either…
136 00:23:45.980 ⇒ 00:24:08.069 Jake Nathan: I would be doing it, or, like, I could ultimately scale it where, like, just like you’re doing with, like, a services company, like, doing a team to do it, I’m… I’m down to talk about that, but like I said, I’m, … I’m… I truly came into this conversation, like, just wanting to help you as much as I can. There’s, you know, a bunch of other tech companies, too, I can try to reach out to.
137 00:24:08.280 ⇒ 00:24:12.919 Robert Tseng: Yeah, no, I appreciate you bringing that up, like, I obviously wanted to jump on this call and kind of…
138 00:24:13.010 ⇒ 00:24:17.680 Robert Tseng: I mean, I trust you, I trust your case, like, you clearly have a track record of making content go…
139 00:24:17.760 ⇒ 00:24:34.140 Robert Tseng: you know, do well. So, yeah, I mean, I’d love to see how we can work together. My business partner lives in Austin, so I’d love to… for you to meet him. I think, he’s probably the only other person I would need you to talk to, and, yeah, like, I… I think…
140 00:24:34.430 ⇒ 00:24:50.810 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think that’d be great. Like, I… we’ve been looking for someone for a while. Your message came at the right time, and I was like, oh, shoot, I forgot, Jake is, like, in Austin, too. And, yeah, so, like, I think… I think… we’d love to show you the nitty-gritty of, like, kind of.
141 00:24:51.060 ⇒ 00:25:02.399 Robert Tseng: how we’ve been thinking about things, and … yeah, we can kind of talk. Maybe I’ll get him on the phone, we’ll… the three of us will talk again a bit more tactically about where we think you could plug in, and then…
142 00:25:02.520 ⇒ 00:25:05.379 Robert Tseng: Yeah, like, we’ll see if we can make that work.
143 00:25:06.070 ⇒ 00:25:25.350 Jake Nathan: Yeah, that sounds… that sounds great, because I’m, like, I’m sure you were… I think I was kind of talking to you about this last year, like, and I’m sure you have it a lot more refined now, but I’m… I’m kind of personally trying to figure out, like, my positioning slash go-to-market of, like, okay, like, I… I feel confident that I could, like, help
144 00:25:25.480 ⇒ 00:25:30.459 Jake Nathan: most businesses with content, but now I’m trying to figure out how to turn into, like, a…
145 00:25:30.460 ⇒ 00:25:32.449 Jake Nathan: Service line that actually
146 00:25:32.450 ⇒ 00:25:53.200 Jake Nathan: like, is it just me doing it all the time? And also, I can scale. So, that was… I just wanted to ask you, aside from, like, I’m… I’m, like, excited to keep talking just about, like, how I could help y’all, but just in general, do you have any advice, like, as I start, like, yeah, my… my ultimate goal is to start, like, an agency, so, like.
147 00:25:53.260 ⇒ 00:25:57.650 Jake Nathan: … I don’t know, just any advice on, I guess, either…
148 00:25:57.880 ⇒ 00:26:05.639 Jake Nathan: positioning, or like, I don’t know if you’ve tried to work with any other marketing agencies, or I’m just trying to figure out how… Yeah. Yeah, make that a thing.
149 00:26:06.110 ⇒ 00:26:17.090 Robert Tseng: Yeah, no, I think, the… the strategy has to stay with you, I guess, of the positioning. I think, outsourcing that too early, or trying to scale up is… it’ll be tough, because,
150 00:26:17.220 ⇒ 00:26:32.900 Robert Tseng: yeah, like, you’re just gonna be throwing darts at a wall or spaghetti and trying to see what sticks, and … I think you’re able to be more nimble about it than if you were to kind of bring on somebody too early. I think where you should consider bringing someone on is, like, once
151 00:26:33.060 ⇒ 00:26:44.559 Robert Tseng: yeah, once you have deals and people to execute, so, like, I don’t know, even if we ended up working together, you know, you’re the strategist, but then you need somebody to actually go and, like, run, kind of, like.
152 00:26:44.670 ⇒ 00:27:02.609 Robert Tseng: like, you’re gonna have to learn how to manage a team, right? And maybe you may not have those folks yet, but, you know, we have, like, 17 people on staff right now. And, yeah, like, I think this would be a good, you know, whether you use our staff or you have your own, like, you can get… you’ll get a feel for, like, what
153 00:27:03.160 ⇒ 00:27:15.890 Robert Tseng: you know, VAs or, kind of, assistant roles are what they’re really able to do. I think what we’ve found is that when you’re outsourcing, especially overseas,
154 00:27:15.890 ⇒ 00:27:25.610 Robert Tseng: They’re very… they’re all specialists, very narrow in what they’re able to do, and so they need very clearly defined directions in order to, like, run a problem very efficiently.
155 00:27:25.700 ⇒ 00:27:26.630 Robert Tseng: …
156 00:27:27.000 ⇒ 00:27:46.870 Robert Tseng: Yeah, and so, like, I think that’s… that’s it. And then when, obviously, if you do work with somebody who’s, you know, U.S.-based, they’re typically… they’ve got more… they’ve got a wider range, and, better for creative kind of work, and … so that’s kind of how it is. Like, all the leaders on our team are U.S.-based, and then, like, our execution staff are all overseas, kind of.
157 00:27:46.870 ⇒ 00:28:03.329 Robert Tseng: But yeah, the margins are great. I think the margins have never been better, and like, from a… it’s a great time to start a services business, and that’s obviously, like, a lot of the money is where it is. I mean, we are an AI business, and so if you want to kind of get back and learn… learn about that, like, I think there’s a lot of…
158 00:28:03.360 ⇒ 00:28:10.210 Robert Tseng: there’s a lot of hype around AI right now, and people are, you know… I just talked to a dude yesterday who runs, like, a…
159 00:28:10.470 ⇒ 00:28:20.529 Robert Tseng: he was doing a marketing agency, then he focused on just SEO, and now he’s calling it, like, AI SEO, and yeah, he just, like, scaled it a lot. Like, he’s… he, like.
160 00:28:20.900 ⇒ 00:28:33.770 Robert Tseng: forex in size, like, he’s way bigger than us now, over the past, like, 6 months, which is crazy. So, I think, there are a lot of good opportunities, kind of, in the B2B services, realm right now, so….
161 00:28:34.180 ⇒ 00:28:38.379 Jake Nathan: Yeah, that… Yeah. That makes sense, and I’d love to… I mean…
162 00:28:38.700 ⇒ 00:28:49.719 Jake Nathan: I think there’s a way to, like, both make it mutually beneficial for both of us, because I’d love to pick your brain more on… like, I’m… for example, like, right now, I’m kind of going to market, like.
163 00:28:49.900 ⇒ 00:28:56.010 Jake Nathan: cool emailing people with, like, hey, I do content for B2B companies, but to me, like.
164 00:28:56.230 ⇒ 00:29:06.950 Jake Nathan: like, a lot of times, like, when I look up B2B content companies, like, B2B content has almost always meant, like, SEO, which is not what I’m doing. I would say I’m, like, thought leadership, like, trying to.
165 00:29:06.950 ⇒ 00:29:07.770 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
166 00:29:07.770 ⇒ 00:29:17.889 Jake Nathan: But, so is that… yeah, I guess, like, when… when I say, like, B2B content, do you… … are there any other, like, I guess, keywords that pop in your head of, like, what…
167 00:29:18.350 ⇒ 00:29:25.889 Jake Nathan: yeah, like, is thought leadership content for B2B? Does that make sense to you, like, off the jump? Or, like, how would you… Yeah, that makes sense.
168 00:29:26.220 ⇒ 00:29:27.939 Jake Nathan: grab what I… okay, yeah, that’s….
169 00:29:28.740 ⇒ 00:29:43.469 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think, like, blog SEO stuff is probably what traditionally it’s been, but like you said, like, I’m more interested in talking to somebody who’s been able to do short-form, long-form content, and … obviously, because, like, I think that’s…
170 00:29:43.470 ⇒ 00:29:48.850 Robert Tseng: There aren’t very many data agencies like ours putting the kind of content we’re doing out there, which is, like.
171 00:29:48.850 ⇒ 00:29:49.440 Jake Nathan: Yeah.
172 00:29:49.590 ⇒ 00:30:06.659 Robert Tseng: I think it’s quite a low bar, but most of them are just kind of churning out blog pages, blog posts, and, you know, doing a lot of investments in paid ads and SEO, pretty much. But not many people are really investing in video or, like, in these other, like, more newer platforms, I guess.
173 00:30:06.660 ⇒ 00:30:21.720 Robert Tseng: So… but yeah, that’s only where we’ve been investing, and, like, it’s, you know, paid off for us to some extent, and, you know, we haven’t been in business very long. It’s gonna take us a long time to see the ROI on the SEO investments, so we haven’t… yeah, like, this hasn’t really been, like, a big focus for us.
174 00:30:22.090 ⇒ 00:30:26.210 Jake Nathan: That makes sense. Okay. So yeah, so that… it kind of…
175 00:30:26.430 ⇒ 00:30:45.629 Jake Nathan: yeah, if I… like, if I was cold emailing someone and I said, like, hey, I made you these posts, and I do B2B, or I do thought leadership content for B2B, that would make sense in your head of, like, oh, okay, he doesn’t do… he’s not talking about SEO, he’s talking about, like… that’s what I’m… I’m trying to figure out, like, what I, ….
176 00:30:45.630 ⇒ 00:30:46.300 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
177 00:30:46.300 ⇒ 00:30:56.549 Jake Nathan: what it is that I’m… like, I know that what I’m doing is going to be helpful, but it’s a little bit more, like, ethereal than just, like, SEO or, like, paid ads, you know, it’s not as, like… Right.
178 00:30:57.300 ⇒ 00:31:04.770 Robert Tseng: Yeah, yeah, I think thought leadership content, makes sense. Like, I’ll send you something, that another guy approached us, like.
179 00:31:04.940 ⇒ 00:31:07.929 Robert Tseng: try to work with us on things. He calls himself…
180 00:31:08.080 ⇒ 00:31:11.189 Robert Tseng: Oh, he’s just… he’s just LinkedIn, but it’s just, like…
181 00:31:11.490 ⇒ 00:31:29.079 Robert Tseng: He’s like, yeah, turn your LinkedIn profile into a high-converting landing page for your B2B business, and he’s all about, like, LinkedIn optimization, and then, like, that’s his one-time service, and then you retain him because he helps you with, like, the LinkedIn content. So, …
182 00:31:29.600 ⇒ 00:31:32.249 Robert Tseng: Yeah, like, it’s… It’s like a…
183 00:31:32.740 ⇒ 00:31:36.940 Robert Tseng: thought leadership content engine. That’s, like, what he pitches.
184 00:31:36.940 ⇒ 00:31:37.380 Jake Nathan: Okay.
185 00:31:38.200 ⇒ 00:31:42.850 Jake Nathan: Yeah, it’s kinda… it’s… I’m like, yeah, sometimes… Yeah, it’s….
186 00:31:42.850 ⇒ 00:31:48.050 Robert Tseng: argument is kind of ridiculous, but, like, I, you know, like, it’s… I don’t know, it’s… that’s how he’s positioning yourself, yeah.
187 00:31:48.050 ⇒ 00:31:58.779 Jake Nathan: Yeah, totally. Well, cool. Well, yeah, this is… I’m glad, like, I truly, it was kind of funny, I just, saw that, video of, like, the guy making backpacking food, and I was like, oh, I.
188 00:31:58.780 ⇒ 00:31:59.370 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
189 00:31:59.370 ⇒ 00:32:02.879 Jake Nathan: Exactly what you’re doing, so I just was like, I just might as well email you and, ….
190 00:32:02.880 ⇒ 00:32:04.360 Robert Tseng: Yeah, no, thanks for reconnecting.
191 00:32:04.360 ⇒ 00:32:13.000 Jake Nathan: Yeah, I’m glad that that happened. And yeah, you just let me know, like, if you… I’d love to meet your, co-founder in Austin, or… yeah, do whatever, you just let me know what’s best.
192 00:32:13.210 ⇒ 00:32:19.689 Robert Tseng: Okay, cool. Yeah, I’ll make the intro over email, and hopefully you guys can meet, and … yeah, no, I’m excited. I mean, I…
193 00:32:19.910 ⇒ 00:32:25.949 Robert Tseng: I’m glad that you’re on this journey, like, I’d love to… we’d love to help you in every way we can, and I’m sure that maybe our
194 00:32:26.220 ⇒ 00:32:30.530 Robert Tseng: Our business could be a good, like, training ground for you as well, so….
195 00:32:30.530 ⇒ 00:32:35.490 Jake Nathan: I’d love to, yeah, try to figure out, yeah, this is… this is super helpful. So, thanks, Robert. Alright, man.
196 00:32:35.490 ⇒ 00:32:36.740 Robert Tseng: Alright, see you, Jake.
197 00:32:36.740 ⇒ 00:32:37.370 Jake Nathan: Bye.