Meeting Title: Brainforge Internal _ Sales Sync Date: 2025-01-27 Meeting participants: Robert Tseng, Connor Fenn
WEBVTT
1 00:05:25.210 ⇒ 00:05:26.350 Robert Tseng: Hey? Connor?
2 00:05:30.320 ⇒ 00:05:31.020 Connor Fenn: Hey?
3 00:05:36.790 ⇒ 00:05:37.760 Connor Fenn: Can you hear me?
4 00:05:38.490 ⇒ 00:05:39.580 Robert Tseng: Yep, I can hear you
5 00:05:44.960 ⇒ 00:05:50.559 Robert Tseng: alright. So who? Tom’s not joining for this? I’ll I’ll drive the call.
6 00:05:52.980 ⇒ 00:05:53.770 Connor Fenn: Okay.
7 00:06:05.530 ⇒ 00:06:13.969 Robert Tseng: okay, I mean, this stuff will be covered later and on Friday. So I’m not gonna go through all the okrs. But I think, just gonna chat through.
8 00:06:14.490 ⇒ 00:06:18.724 Robert Tseng: It’s like overall kind of thought that’s been put into sales.
9 00:06:19.520 ⇒ 00:06:23.569 Robert Tseng: introduce the sales strategy goals to you.
10 00:06:24.650 ⇒ 00:06:26.329 Robert Tseng: And then.
11 00:06:26.780 ⇒ 00:06:36.383 Robert Tseng: yeah, I mean, this time is less to answer tactical questions about like different leads. But if we have time remaining like I I think I should be able to get through this pretty quick. So
12 00:06:40.090 ⇒ 00:06:42.209 Robert Tseng: yeah. So I I guess
13 00:06:42.860 ⇒ 00:06:48.121 Robert Tseng: there are just certain sections that I’ve kind of edited. If you’ve ever clicked around here.
14 00:06:50.200 ⇒ 00:07:10.470 Robert Tseng: yeah. Obviously, you’re familiar with industry. You’re you’re familiar with the industry pages. That’s kind of where we’ve been playing around to like, build out different like playbooks for industry targeting. Right now, we’re just actively going after Ecom and legal and then, yeah, I mean, this is just a
15 00:07:11.030 ⇒ 00:07:23.700 Robert Tseng: I’ve done. I’ve been migrating some of the sales assets that I had in Pongo over to Brain Forge, so we don’t really have like a client Kit for Brainforge. But this is just something that I’m having. Marianne kind of translate over
16 00:07:24.387 ⇒ 00:07:31.460 Robert Tseng: there used to be some stuff here on like, what is our sales process? It was really just like lead, qualification discovery call
17 00:07:32.001 ⇒ 00:07:39.168 Robert Tseng: I think this needs more love. And just like building out like what these different? What are like, what are these actual steps?
18 00:07:40.150 ⇒ 00:08:00.340 Robert Tseng: yeah. So I think this is something that I want to own the documentation of. It’s not like a huge priority. But as I continue to migrate some some stuff over that way, you or anybody else that comes in to sell, if they’re yeah, rather than starting from just looking at the disco call. Kind of looking at what are the different
19 00:08:00.470 ⇒ 00:08:10.270 Robert Tseng: stages? Not just in terms of a status like on a lead but hopefully, just like a clear like playbook for for these different steps.
20 00:08:11.174 ⇒ 00:08:16.342 Robert Tseng: Other than that, I haven’t. Really. This is just kind of kept to whatever we Tom had here.
21 00:08:17.200 ⇒ 00:08:28.040 Robert Tseng: yeah. So as far as like the sales strategy goals, it will. Just. Kinda I know I just shared it recently. So it’s not really much time to go over it, or we probably didn’t have too much time to go over it.
22 00:08:28.574 ⇒ 00:08:40.729 Robert Tseng: But over here kind of just have like 3 okrs. Okrs are just objectives and key results. The objective, usually just like an ambitious, measurable target.
23 00:08:41.137 ⇒ 00:09:07.569 Robert Tseng: And then the initiatives are kind of the yeah, I guess the initiatives that we think that will move the needle to to get us to these objectives. So the idea, this is like kind of homework that we’ve had to do as we’ve been going through the startup accelerator for every function of the business kind of setting clear, clearer targets. For just more accountability. And so people actually know, like.
24 00:09:07.720 ⇒ 00:09:22.019 Robert Tseng: well, what does success look like for us at the stage that we’re at right now. So hopefully, you know, this added detail is helpful as maybe you’re a lot a lot in the in the weeds of the day to day now, but I think
25 00:09:22.130 ⇒ 00:09:27.980 Robert Tseng: I think it’s we were overdue, for, like kind of setting some clear strategy targets here.
26 00:09:28.380 ⇒ 00:09:30.830 Connor Fenn: This. This is just like.
27 00:09:31.060 ⇒ 00:09:37.916 Connor Fenn: honestly, this would be cool to just have like printed out, I guess, on my desk, just to have like as a little goal thing. But.
28 00:09:39.030 ⇒ 00:09:44.499 Robert Tseng: Yeah. So the idea is, yeah, you’re not gonna be involved in every initiative. But.
29 00:09:44.500 ⇒ 00:09:45.329 Connor Fenn: Yeah, I see.
30 00:09:45.330 ⇒ 00:09:54.233 Robert Tseng: Like, what is the sales function like really trying to to drive towards? But yeah, I think,
31 00:09:55.020 ⇒ 00:10:00.610 Robert Tseng: I I mean, I think it’s it’s good to kind of give you the context on all how we’re thinking about the business growing.
32 00:10:01.238 ⇒ 00:10:22.819 Robert Tseng: So yeah, I’ll kind of close these toggles. But yeah, the 1st one is really just getting us to this revenue target. We’re actually more than halfway there, based on, like our current, full of 5 5 clients. So but I think just to to get there, I think, to have a diverse portfolio of different customer types
33 00:10:22.920 ⇒ 00:10:50.149 Robert Tseng: right now, we’re kind of just like stuck in this middle where clients are around 10 KA month on the data side. I think the 1st initiative is like more account management, and that’s on me to kind of grow some of the clients that have potential to really break into this revenue band to like, get there. And then, yeah, I think just the way that we’re selling and into mid market. There are other ways to go about it. And
34 00:10:50.340 ⇒ 00:10:57.590 Robert Tseng: things. These are ideas that I’ve touched on in 2024, but haven’t really like pushed too hard on so Catalan is just like a
35 00:10:57.620 ⇒ 00:11:13.289 Robert Tseng: it’s like a high ticket. Revenue, or a contract bidding platform like nothing there is under like 200 k, so like it’s mostly ex consultants. Or like ex fortune. 500 executives
36 00:11:13.290 ⇒ 00:11:29.040 Robert Tseng: that kind of fill the talent pool there. And yeah, they’re just these bigger clients that go and post like really long term projects like 6 plus a month projects on there. So yeah, I’ve kind of did it a few times here and there last year.
37 00:11:29.170 ⇒ 00:11:57.640 Robert Tseng: The sales cycle is much longer. And I I think that you know we we just have to accept that if we’re gonna bid for bigger contracts is that those process, it’s gonna require more due diligence. And we’re kind of already like headed in that direction. So I think that’s where I want my my sales focus to be on kind of going after those bigger clients. We have contacts that some of these like that, like next tier, like 500 K, plus kind of contract.
38 00:11:58.200 ⇒ 00:12:05.870 Robert Tseng: my consulting firms. And yeah, I think we have warm connections there. But we want to really actually
39 00:12:06.010 ⇒ 00:12:19.080 Robert Tseng: hit those partnerships and ask them for for the Referrals, because they sometimes I mean, they get a lot of deals that are too small for them to really service. And they’re actually they would be good good clients for us. So.
40 00:12:19.080 ⇒ 00:12:20.559 Connor Fenn: Do you have a writer
41 00:12:20.770 ⇒ 00:12:33.220 Connor Fenn: that you are using for like engaging with people at Deloitte, or like what I could talk about? I surf with 3 people that work at Deloitte, like all summer every year.
42 00:12:33.610 ⇒ 00:12:34.470 Robert Tseng: Oh, yeah.
43 00:12:34.470 ⇒ 00:12:40.671 Connor Fenn: So I might be able to get us like some kind of connection in there. If there’s something you want to say to somebody.
44 00:12:40.930 ⇒ 00:12:45.814 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, I’ll introduce you to the Catalan like platform as well.
45 00:12:46.420 ⇒ 00:12:58.430 Robert Tseng: it’s less about like a 1 like one message like you’ll see, like Catalan like. It’s a lot more tedious to kind of. They. They require a lot more to send proposals to actually bid but those are.
46 00:12:58.430 ⇒ 00:13:04.390 Connor Fenn: Can imagine that’s closer to like how my my previous company was. We were.
47 00:13:04.390 ⇒ 00:13:05.130 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
48 00:13:05.130 ⇒ 00:13:08.549 Connor Fenn: So it’s I, I get that process. Yeah, that’s so long
49 00:13:09.000 ⇒ 00:13:14.530 Connor Fenn: the problem with those 2 I’m the Cadillac ones I’d be interested to look at, because I know like
50 00:13:15.160 ⇒ 00:13:29.369 Connor Fenn: it. Like, I’m curious, like, what kind of companies are really listing there, because, like the real big companies, it’s like, it doesn’t even matter who you are. It’s all relationship based. If you’re not golfing with them, you’re not getting the deal.
51 00:13:30.040 ⇒ 00:13:36.659 Robert Tseng: Yeah, totally. There’s like a layer of anonymity on that platform still. But I think what helps is we can go. And
52 00:13:36.850 ⇒ 00:13:55.725 Robert Tseng: we can have someone like Ericsson or like through some other ways, we can find the contact and reach out to them directly. So, yeah, definitely want to. I’m not really saying that we should just go bid on everything on the platform. But if there are good, if there’s a good fit, and there’s there’s a couple of bids. There’s a couple
53 00:13:56.500 ⇒ 00:14:02.040 Robert Tseng: like ones that popped up recently that I want to spit on, so I’ll probably share more info on that.
54 00:14:02.200 ⇒ 00:14:06.880 Connor Fenn: You know what I just thought of that would be interesting. Have you ever heard of?
55 00:14:07.540 ⇒ 00:14:11.099 Connor Fenn: Sorry I have it saved in my other browser. Let me look it up real quick.
56 00:14:11.810 ⇒ 00:14:15.490 Connor Fenn: Have you ever heard of biz, buy, sell, or Flippa.
57 00:14:17.220 ⇒ 00:14:19.971 Robert Tseng: Lippa, or these are just like
58 00:14:20.430 ⇒ 00:14:25.329 Connor Fenn: They’re like, like people sell a lot of like businesses on them.
59 00:14:25.510 ⇒ 00:14:26.330 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
60 00:14:26.741 ⇒ 00:14:31.330 Connor Fenn: But Flip was actually more ecom based like companies.
61 00:14:31.750 ⇒ 00:14:35.049 Connor Fenn: Curious, do you see? Do you think it would be worth
62 00:14:35.380 ⇒ 00:14:50.159 Connor Fenn: reaching out to like I want. I wonder if Erickson could pull data from those somehow, where we could start engaging people that are like trying to sell their companies and maybe see if there’s a slot or like
63 00:14:50.520 ⇒ 00:14:56.850 Connor Fenn: either, get that process when someone just buys the new one or like
64 00:14:57.290 ⇒ 00:15:02.789 Connor Fenn: contact them to see why they’re selling it? Is it because they’re struggling with the data parts? And
65 00:15:03.210 ⇒ 00:15:03.980 Connor Fenn: I don’t know.
66 00:15:03.980 ⇒ 00:15:09.005 Robert Tseng: Yeah, definitely. I you know, I think that’s a i think that’s a great idea.
67 00:15:09.640 ⇒ 00:15:20.710 Robert Tseng: I would. I would say that it’s businesses that have recently been bought out that they tip or like they get new funding, that they’re typically getting kind of investing more in data. So
68 00:15:21.273 ⇒ 00:15:37.170 Robert Tseng: yeah, if we can get any signal from platforms like that, that recent like acquisition or transaction has taken place and that businesses in new hands, then that I think that would be good timing to go after A client like that.
69 00:15:37.170 ⇒ 00:15:43.690 Connor Fenn: Do you think that’s something like, can I just ask Eric’s in that if I send him a couple of links? Or is there more like.
70 00:15:44.900 ⇒ 00:15:56.759 Robert Tseng: Yeah, we we should, I mean, I think, so let me even put that there. So I think I also revamped this partnerships thing you talk about a bunch of like I want to create clear tears. So
71 00:15:56.990 ⇒ 00:16:06.090 Robert Tseng: kind of what you’re describing is something, you know. Upwork is more of the famous platform there. But we actually get a good number of opportunities through upwork.
72 00:16:06.701 ⇒ 00:16:18.639 Robert Tseng: They don’t necessarily have signal for like when businesses are being bought out. But I think the benefit of that platform is everyone on there that’s posting anything
73 00:16:18.780 ⇒ 00:16:29.660 Robert Tseng: is looking to make a transaction quickly, and the the level of intent, there is way higher than any other platform. So yeah, I mean, I even want Ericsson to go
74 00:16:29.660 ⇒ 00:16:49.719 Robert Tseng: into these particular platforms and not just be stuck on linkedin and email. So yeah, if we are gonna explore those other platforms you mentioned, I would suggest just kind of adding into the prospects here. Let me review it, and like, kind of just get a sense of what what kind of leads are in there. If you put post a couple of examples that’d be helpful.
75 00:16:51.420 ⇒ 00:16:53.310 Robert Tseng: But yeah, I would say, like.
76 00:16:53.520 ⇒ 00:16:56.664 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I would like to pre vet it first.st I think
77 00:16:57.100 ⇒ 00:17:06.980 Robert Tseng: Uton had too many people that he had, like elevated to partner status in 2024, and as a result like, was not very disciplined about like going after them.
78 00:17:07.600 ⇒ 00:17:12.829 Robert Tseng: So I do. Wanna like be more selective about
79 00:17:13.099 ⇒ 00:17:19.960 Robert Tseng: where we want to get Erickson’s attention to go? Cause he, yeah, we talked about a bunch of these buddies that are just like.
80 00:17:20.130 ⇒ 00:17:30.850 Robert Tseng: yeah, I mean, they’re. I’m sure they’re good contacts. But like, I don’t know, we don’t need to be hitting 20 of them at a time. We just wanna pick like a few and have Erickson be more focused on this? Yeah.
81 00:17:31.250 ⇒ 00:17:33.369 Connor Fenn: Sure. No, no, that makes sense, I agree.
82 00:17:33.800 ⇒ 00:17:34.450 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
83 00:17:35.220 ⇒ 00:17:56.570 Robert Tseng: cool. So yeah, I mean, feel free. You can add, if yeah, I mean, I think I’m gonna add these, I’m already, added Catalan in here. But I’ll add a few others. But yeah, so partners, partnership. I would say. Platforms are considered partners too, so definitely add that in here, and I want to be more disciplined about going after those
84 00:17:58.700 ⇒ 00:18:12.980 Robert Tseng: and then, as far as like single function data teams. I would say, this is like what we do for Javi, for pool parts. I think Eden’s a bit more of a cut above that. They’re like closer to this full service. Fractional team.
85 00:18:14.470 ⇒ 00:18:21.949 Robert Tseng: but yeah, I think we’ve been. We’ve had more success in getting these types of clients. I think. And I just need to go back and
86 00:18:22.120 ⇒ 00:18:39.220 Robert Tseng: revive, lost or expired leads and clients. So I mentioned, there are a couple of renewals that I’m going after this this week. And I think that if we just reach back out there’s probably more people who are willing to re-engage. So we wanna keep that going.
87 00:18:39.220 ⇒ 00:18:41.009 Connor Fenn: Can help with or no.
88 00:18:41.300 ⇒ 00:18:50.406 Robert Tseng: I think that one is more kind of just relate relying on the relationship that we already have. So I think that’s on. And I to drive to drive these ones?
89 00:18:50.990 ⇒ 00:18:59.200 Robert Tseng: And then I was thinking, Yeah, I mean, you’ve taken a lot of discovery calls on the on the on the AI side and data audit side. So I know we have, like
90 00:18:59.430 ⇒ 00:19:14.139 Robert Tseng: we have a couple of campaigns. But I want to really turn it up on for Erickson to go after more. So on the data audit and paid discovery side. I think what we had success with in Q 3 of last year that I don’t really think we’ve replicated
91 00:19:14.360 ⇒ 00:19:38.590 Robert Tseng: is targeting particular companies based on the tools that they use. So I think I want to kind of push him more towards that, because I was looking at hey, reach and instantly and well, I mean, it’s only been a week, and realistically his campaign has only been running for 3 days, because apparently it doesn’t send on Fridays. So it’s too early to say on the legal stuff. But I think that we need to at least turn those back on
92 00:19:39.286 ⇒ 00:19:40.240 Robert Tseng: and so.
93 00:19:40.320 ⇒ 00:19:49.930 Connor Fenn: You know how to work, he said. He added my name. I saw that this morning, but I looked at my Linkedin, and I don’t have any like messages in my inbox. Does that take a while?
94 00:19:51.385 ⇒ 00:19:59.810 Robert Tseng: I looked at it. It looks like he only set like one from your account. So I’m assuming he just tested it. He hasn’t actually like fully turned it on for you yet.
95 00:20:00.150 ⇒ 00:20:01.310 Connor Fenn: Gotcha. Okay.
96 00:20:02.040 ⇒ 00:20:13.919 Robert Tseng: Yeah. But then the other thing is because you probably haven’t been that active on Linkedin and sending. There’s like a warming process, too. So your account probably has lower limits than Uton’s.
97 00:20:15.240 ⇒ 00:20:15.960 Connor Fenn: It.
98 00:20:16.520 ⇒ 00:20:20.269 Connor Fenn: Maybe I don’t know it does it?
99 00:20:21.040 ⇒ 00:20:35.300 Connor Fenn: Does it account for like company pages, cause like I don’t use my account much, but I’m also hooked up to this serious business account, and I post everything for that company through my account. I don’t know if that matters, but.
100 00:20:35.830 ⇒ 00:20:40.089 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, I’m not. I’m not entirely sure how the algorithm works. I think, like.
101 00:20:40.090 ⇒ 00:20:42.138 Connor Fenn: It’d be nice if it would.
102 00:20:42.480 ⇒ 00:21:07.649 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think, these these tools kind of just take into a few things to consideration. I just know there’s like a a warming period for an account where, like maybe the 1st week, it only lets you send like 20, and then after that it incrementally goes up, like I think my account can probably send about 50 right now. And like, I think I don’t know which. I’m probably higher since he’s been running campaigns for a while.
103 00:21:08.840 ⇒ 00:21:10.050 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
104 00:21:10.580 ⇒ 00:21:32.030 Robert Tseng: yeah. So I think there’s like a process of like, okay, yeah, you’re building these lead lists. And we can talk about that later. But I want. I want Erickson to build the lead list more. We just kind of give him like, what are the things that he should go fish for rather than your time, because I think your time’s more valuable than his in terms of building lead lists.
105 00:21:32.270 ⇒ 00:21:47.039 Connor Fenn: I’m with you. I saw your message on that, too. I just like I’ll be honest with you. I just some. I’ve been kind of lost on like what to really go after as far as like outreach, just because, like, there hasn’t been a lot of
106 00:21:47.240 ⇒ 00:21:51.119 Connor Fenn: income through like the slack bots like that, and I didn’t know.
107 00:21:51.120 ⇒ 00:21:51.650 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
108 00:21:51.670 ⇒ 00:21:55.790 Connor Fenn: The other process, really. So I just started building out my own. But I’m
109 00:21:55.960 ⇒ 00:22:01.049 Connor Fenn: I’m all for it, because that’s honestly where I’m struggling right now is, I just don’t have like
110 00:22:01.280 ⇒ 00:22:04.369 Connor Fenn: a big enough list where I could just go and like.
111 00:22:04.620 ⇒ 00:22:07.829 Connor Fenn: get after it and try to just talk to people.
112 00:22:09.040 ⇒ 00:22:20.549 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I’ll I’ll address that when we get down to the initiative there on, like, how do we get you like more consistent calls for Disco and Demo, and like, what are some kind of adjustments that you could make?
113 00:22:22.210 ⇒ 00:22:29.629 Robert Tseng: But yeah, I mean, I think it’s like definitely getting you comfortable with just throwing ideas towards Erickson’s way. I think.
114 00:22:30.240 ⇒ 00:22:37.600 Robert Tseng: Yeah, like, he doesn’t need that much to get started in campaigns. But there, we do have to give him some some structure on, like.
115 00:22:38.610 ⇒ 00:22:47.700 Robert Tseng: yeah, go after companies that use these tools that are this size, that and he may ask some questions back and forth. So I think well, after a couple.
116 00:22:48.170 ⇒ 00:22:58.110 Robert Tseng: you know we’ll you, can I? I maybe you’ve I don’t know if you remember seeing how I kind of thought. Ericsson started on the legal campaign stuff, but I think I.
117 00:22:58.110 ⇒ 00:22:58.900 Connor Fenn: Yeah. No.
118 00:22:58.900 ⇒ 00:22:59.880 Robert Tseng: 2 messages.
119 00:23:00.285 ⇒ 00:23:08.050 Robert Tseng: and that like includes all the data information that he would need. So we basically just have to at least get him that he can. He can build the lead list from there.
120 00:23:08.800 ⇒ 00:23:09.460 Connor Fenn: Okay.
121 00:23:10.219 ⇒ 00:23:19.689 Robert Tseng: So yeah, I mean, I’ll be definitely more. I I think he can if he we’re only running 2 campaigns right now. I want him to run be running at least 10. He has the capacity for that.
122 00:23:20.155 ⇒ 00:23:36.129 Robert Tseng: And then, as far as like, Okay, like, how do we get you to feel more confident, confident about the messaging that you’re sending. I know you feel like you’re kind of dependent on the copy that we produce. And so I was thinking, Well, how do I get you? More comfortable talking to interested prospects?
123 00:23:36.525 ⇒ 00:23:45.299 Robert Tseng: Kind of going back to? Why, I said on the upwork side like. Honestly, I think I would probably just give you my upwork access. I get a bunch of incoming leads
124 00:23:45.480 ⇒ 00:23:48.939 Robert Tseng: like probably like 3, 3 to 5 a week I was in.
125 00:23:48.940 ⇒ 00:23:54.610 Connor Fenn: That Cbr. Relead was honestly probably the best AI conversation I had.
126 00:23:54.800 ⇒ 00:24:00.309 Connor Fenn: for like that we’d researcher like those, even if those are coming in regularly. That would be great.
127 00:24:00.950 ⇒ 00:24:15.130 Robert Tseng: Yeah. And I, I know, like, even just so you you I’ll I’ll kind of. I’ll show. I’ll probably record like the video for you. I’ll share the creds you can go on and just like make it like a daily, or it doesn’t necessarily be daily. It could be daily or by like
128 00:24:15.330 ⇒ 00:24:39.324 Robert Tseng: I. I still go on upwork once a week, and I just like look through my inbox because people hit me with like 3 to 5 requests a week, and then I like, I have like a few keywords that I just like type into the jobs, and then I’ll just browse like a few, a few of them, and that’s how I found that’s how I found a few of these, like the cbre one like came in through that the
129 00:24:39.810 ⇒ 00:24:40.580 Robert Tseng: like.
130 00:24:41.050 ⇒ 00:25:10.360 Robert Tseng: or or Eden came in, came in through that, and and Joby also came in through that it was not like I necessarily bid on upwork, but like from a posting, I found the company, and I reached out directly to the person, because I could gather enough context and be like, Hey, I know that you’re already looking for this stuff, and like the timing was like helpful, I think, in in getting someone who was interested in replying.
131 00:25:11.140 ⇒ 00:25:11.820 Connor Fenn: Okay.
132 00:25:12.380 ⇒ 00:25:30.150 Robert Tseng: Yeah. So I think that’ll also make you more comfortable, I think, with just like, kind of testing out different types of copy. And you can reference. I basically just copy and paste the same proposal every time like the structure. And then I just edit a few words every when I when I do send out bids
133 00:25:30.608 ⇒ 00:25:38.981 Robert Tseng: so yeah, hopefully, that’s something that we can help help you with there. And on the AI side. Yeah, I feel like the AI
134 00:25:39.920 ⇒ 00:25:44.850 Robert Tseng: targeting is not as clear as I. The data targeting has been.
135 00:25:45.180 ⇒ 00:25:49.420 Robert Tseng: It’s harder because there aren’t like particular tools.
136 00:25:50.050 ⇒ 00:25:55.036 Robert Tseng: Well, I think this is something that Utah needs to really like kind of iron out like
137 00:25:55.980 ⇒ 00:26:07.670 Robert Tseng: which maybe we just don’t have enough context yet are like, what are the tools that we know that people struggle with using that they would really benefit from with the with the AI work that we’re doing.
138 00:26:07.960 ⇒ 00:26:26.199 Robert Tseng: Maybe there are certain workflows that are, we’ve we’ve been able to articulate. But yeah, we just have to figure out the the messaging better. There. What are those keywords that we should be looking for the vendors, etc, and maybe upwork will will will give good context, because you will see a bunch of
139 00:26:26.870 ⇒ 00:26:38.389 Robert Tseng: proposals from people who are asking for AI related work, and you can just detect some of the patterns for what they’re asking for. That might help with the messaging there.
140 00:26:40.427 ⇒ 00:26:53.350 Robert Tseng: I also think the pricing on the AI seems too high. 5 K. For the 1st month. I don’t really feel like just based on. I’ve been following the notes that you’ve shared out. Seems like everyone gets scared away from that. And I’m thinking.
141 00:26:53.804 ⇒ 00:26:57.440 Connor Fenn: Just sent Veyron. Their quote is 10 K.
142 00:26:57.610 ⇒ 00:27:03.020 Connor Fenn: That’s what Utah wanted me to do. And I got a feeling that was way, too. They’re just. There’s no way.
143 00:27:03.310 ⇒ 00:27:10.519 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I I don’t. I, personally, don’t think so. And that’s okay. I think, utoman. I don’t have to agree on this. But like.
144 00:27:10.990 ⇒ 00:27:22.880 Robert Tseng: it’s yeah. I I just 5 K for 5 users also seems kind of too high. So I’m even thinking like, Hey, we should probably try to drop, we should drop the pricing.
145 00:27:23.477 ⇒ 00:27:29.189 Robert Tseng: I get that. We’ve wanted the pricing to be high, because the the initial
146 00:27:29.865 ⇒ 00:27:32.899 Robert Tseng: setup cost is higher than like
147 00:27:33.330 ⇒ 00:27:40.000 Robert Tseng: is is quite high, like we have to actually engineer the product. And that’s why he wants to have like a high upfront cost.
148 00:27:41.450 ⇒ 00:27:52.399 Robert Tseng: but I also think that we’ve built it enough times that it doesn’t actually take us very long anymore. And we can afford to have, like a more of a steeper discount for the 1st month just to get them on
149 00:27:52.933 ⇒ 00:27:55.869 Robert Tseng: like, if we really believe that the work is like.
150 00:27:55.870 ⇒ 00:28:09.220 Connor Fenn: He was here because I thought the reason it was 5 K. Was because that’s how much it cost Ericsson to. That’s how much Ericsson charges us each month, or Erickson charges us 2,500 each month.
151 00:28:09.330 ⇒ 00:28:11.790 Connor Fenn: and we double it to get
152 00:28:12.870 ⇒ 00:28:15.680 Connor Fenn: profit. That’s what Utam told me is that not.
153 00:28:15.950 ⇒ 00:28:27.490 Robert Tseng: That’s for the lead researcher tool. But for, like the chat bot building or I don’t know, maybe. Have you only been pitching like the lead researching tool, or like lead research service.
154 00:28:28.290 ⇒ 00:28:34.690 Connor Fenn: Yeah, like, wait when you say chat, chat, bot! Are you talking about like the the bot we have in slack.
155 00:28:35.220 ⇒ 00:28:35.920 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
156 00:28:37.130 ⇒ 00:28:44.070 Connor Fenn: Yeah, I I haven’t really been selling that at all. It’s all been just the the full clay
157 00:28:44.850 ⇒ 00:28:49.210 Connor Fenn: quite outline with the pay reach.
158 00:28:49.930 ⇒ 00:28:51.760 Robert Tseng: Yeah, okay. I see.
159 00:28:55.860 ⇒ 00:29:01.510 Connor Fenn: I didn’t even know. So Erickson’s the one that’s building all of those, too. I thought that was Casey.
160 00:29:01.670 ⇒ 00:29:08.399 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I know that’s Casey Mcgill. But I just think about like the vitaco tool that we market everywhere
161 00:29:08.887 ⇒ 00:29:19.940 Robert Tseng: that was built by Miguel and Casey. It’s pretty much just like a web scraper that goes to like target.com different locations and and checks like to see if vitaco products were stocked out.
162 00:29:20.540 ⇒ 00:29:27.139 Robert Tseng: So it’s like it’s not a chat bot, but it is like a bot. It’s like a web scraping automation.
163 00:29:27.690 ⇒ 00:29:28.210 Robert Tseng: and
164 00:29:28.750 ⇒ 00:29:37.269 Connor Fenn: Realize that was a AI bot. I thought that was like a data or analytics like service that we did.
165 00:29:37.530 ⇒ 00:29:38.640 Connor Fenn: So. That’s how I.
166 00:29:38.640 ⇒ 00:29:39.240 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
167 00:29:39.650 ⇒ 00:29:44.650 Connor Fenn: Trying to thinking about that, but I haven’t really sold anybody on that either, but that.
168 00:29:44.650 ⇒ 00:29:45.100 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
169 00:29:46.100 ⇒ 00:29:53.830 Connor Fenn: What that whole list that I built out was about is, I was watching that video that Utam had put together.
170 00:29:54.376 ⇒ 00:30:05.069 Connor Fenn: And then I just kind of thought about, you know, Ecom brands that were emerging in retail. And then I actually just used Grok to like come up with like
171 00:30:05.320 ⇒ 00:30:08.420 Connor Fenn: top trending retail, emerging brands.
172 00:30:08.640 ⇒ 00:30:17.049 Connor Fenn: and most of the ones I found actually, Utam didn’t reach out has never reached out to on Linkedin. So that’s the reason I kept them, but
173 00:30:17.310 ⇒ 00:30:21.510 Connor Fenn: they’re probably the best leads out there, but they’re leads.
174 00:30:22.550 ⇒ 00:30:23.200 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
175 00:30:24.370 ⇒ 00:30:30.490 Robert Tseng: okay, yeah, sounds like we should regroup on the AI strategy. Like, I feel like we need to.
176 00:30:30.840 ⇒ 00:30:34.845 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, sounds like, you’ve just primarily been selling like
177 00:30:35.540 ⇒ 00:30:44.719 Robert Tseng: Erickson service. And yeah, I think of the 50% markup on his service just doesn’t. I don’t think people are gonna bite on that. So we have to make some adjustments there.
178 00:30:45.192 ⇒ 00:31:08.550 Robert Tseng: And then I yeah, I think I would want you to feel comfortable selling either Chatbot development or like the other, any other AI automation or agent that we build. So okay, that’s that’s good context for me, like, yeah. So I think I’ll, yeah, I’m I’m going to. Yeah. There’s a couple of takeaways just to recap like
179 00:31:09.065 ⇒ 00:31:21.880 Robert Tseng: one. We’re gonna get Ericson to turn on a few more campaigns. I’m gonna be pushing him on this. And then, yeah, I also, you know, as you’ve been building out your list, I want to like help. You feel comfortable, like
180 00:31:22.100 ⇒ 00:31:45.199 Robert Tseng: sending that to Erickson, and like working with him to get what he needs to build out, to finish building out your lead list like sounds like you’ve added quite a few, but let him like turn that into to more and then I’m gonna give you access to upwork and kind of just give you a quick tutorial of like. How I think you could use my my upwork to go and like, learn about
181 00:31:45.320 ⇒ 00:31:53.010 Robert Tseng: the the data gigs, and like how you bid on them, and you might as well just like in the same, in the same, at the same time, like.
182 00:31:53.460 ⇒ 00:31:57.440 Robert Tseng: figure out like the AI, some of the AI keywords as well.
183 00:31:59.880 ⇒ 00:32:03.178 Robert Tseng: So yeah, I think that’s that’s that.
184 00:32:03.830 ⇒ 00:32:06.170 Robert Tseng: Let me just make sure.
185 00:32:07.330 ⇒ 00:32:13.515 Robert Tseng: Okay, yeah, I can go like about 10 more minutes, and then I have to get ready for a call afterwards.
186 00:32:14.110 ⇒ 00:32:17.519 Robert Tseng: let me just see. What can I click through really quick.
187 00:32:18.680 ⇒ 00:32:27.629 Robert Tseng: yeah, I don’t want you to feel like your responsibility is to bring in a bunch of leads. That’s definitely
188 00:32:28.230 ⇒ 00:32:45.459 Robert Tseng: yeah. Okay. I I feel like that’s not where we should be getting stuck. And I need to do a better job of like having consistent lead flow coming in. So I think this kind of is parallel to some of the stuff that we mentioned above already. But yeah, I think
189 00:32:45.990 ⇒ 00:32:58.470 Robert Tseng: just making sure that we have enough campaigns to be hitting those numbers like 2 campaigns is not gonna get us there. So we need more. Ideally. We had at some point I would like to be seeing like, kind of
190 00:32:58.920 ⇒ 00:33:04.119 Robert Tseng: 20 plus leads coming in per week. And then we were able to have a bunch of bookings. So
191 00:33:04.330 ⇒ 00:33:11.539 Robert Tseng: that’s that. I think the services mapping we’re getting there. So this is more of just like a continue to keep going on that.
192 00:33:12.078 ⇒ 00:33:18.691 Robert Tseng: Yeah. Let’s kind of chat about this one, Connor taking discovery call. So? Yeah, I think.
193 00:33:19.470 ⇒ 00:33:22.877 Robert Tseng: you know, you’ve been on a bunch of calls at this point. It’s been a month.
194 00:33:24.250 ⇒ 00:33:27.749 Robert Tseng: yeah, I think you’ve experienced kind of the 1st touch
195 00:33:27.870 ⇒ 00:33:39.530 Robert Tseng: you’ve also sent over proposals you’ve done follow ups. Yeah, I think I wanna really help you to close so I think
196 00:33:41.120 ⇒ 00:33:42.620 Robert Tseng: there is a
197 00:33:43.540 ⇒ 00:33:49.640 Robert Tseng: I think, with the inter with the with your own personal referrals like I think Uten and I both both like
198 00:33:49.900 ⇒ 00:33:55.160 Robert Tseng: went through the same kind of cycle that I feel like you’re going through, which is like.
199 00:33:55.500 ⇒ 00:34:17.209 Robert Tseng: Yeah, you have a bunch of like people that you can hit up, and then, like they’ll be willing to hop on a call with you. But then, when you actually push them to to make a purchasing decision. They may like back out. And I think that’s like the the curse of selling to friends right? It’s like they. They make you feel like you’re you’re like they want, like you’re worth talking to. But then they may not actually
200 00:34:17.290 ⇒ 00:34:26.900 Robert Tseng: like they’re not necessarily the most honest buyers. And it kind of waste your time like kind of through that. So I think it was probably good reps just to get you like, Get you started.
201 00:34:26.909 ⇒ 00:34:28.256 Connor Fenn: Once today.
202 00:34:29.110 ⇒ 00:34:34.999 Robert Tseng: Yeah, no, I get it. We we basically went through that as well. So yeah, I think.
203 00:34:35.320 ⇒ 00:34:55.299 Robert Tseng: no, I think there’s some wisdom on like, okay, when we pre qualify a lead before you hop on a disco call with them. If we know that their budget is small and we kind of anticipate them to be a smaller deal. We’re only gonna give them one call, and then we have to move on from that. You can do the follow ups and stuff. But like, yeah, like, I think we just gotta
204 00:34:55.850 ⇒ 00:35:06.810 Robert Tseng: have that have that like willingness to go after go after more. Okay, it’s not that they’re not a good option, but I think, like some wisdom that I was given was like.
205 00:35:06.880 ⇒ 00:35:30.759 Robert Tseng: even if you have a good sense of who your Icp is your custom ideal customer profile, like around 5% of them, are actually in the right time window to make a bit right purchasing decision. So the timing is. The one is the one thing that doesn’t matter how well we understand our client. If it’s not the right time, we’re just we just we just have to move on. So yeah, I think, just like
206 00:35:30.840 ⇒ 00:35:32.779 Robert Tseng: getting kind of.
207 00:35:33.090 ⇒ 00:35:40.130 Robert Tseng: yeah, get getting through that. I think we’ll that hump, I think, will get you get you more I kind of
208 00:35:40.410 ⇒ 00:35:44.010 Robert Tseng: more conversations that are moving moving through the stages
209 00:35:44.360 ⇒ 00:36:12.959 Robert Tseng: rather than getting hung up on those that like seem to be leading you on cause. That’s that’s really what the worst feeling is when you you feel like you’re so close. But there’s not actually movement like I I think that’s at least to me. When I was doing a lot taking a lot more volume of Disco, and Demo calls like that was like the worst part for me, so I’d rather have a a clear no, and then move on. But the people who string you along like. That’s that’s what really weighs, weighs on you the most.
210 00:36:13.120 ⇒ 00:36:13.690 Connor Fenn: Yeah.
211 00:36:14.190 ⇒ 00:36:14.810 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
212 00:36:15.120 ⇒ 00:36:24.590 Robert Tseng: so yeah, I think, kind of like, what are different ways we can get to the 5 new discovery calls, you know. I think with the lead list that Erickson’s building out, you know.
213 00:36:24.920 ⇒ 00:36:49.029 Robert Tseng: Yeah, you may not always have, like, you know, start the week. You may not always have the calls like kind of lined up. But honestly, like I would just even do some cold calling to there are some like with our legal list. Yeah, you can go in and look at the campaigns. There are some that have viewed emails that are kind of like in our messaging sequence. But they just haven’t responded. And maybe we just go and hit them with a call.
214 00:36:49.530 ⇒ 00:36:50.340 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
215 00:36:50.530 ⇒ 00:36:57.860 Connor Fenn: Yeah, cause like, I, yeah, I have no experience with that stuff. But like, I will do that for sure. If you could show me how to do it.
216 00:36:58.290 ⇒ 00:37:01.439 Robert Tseng: Yeah. Yeah. And like, you know, I think even that like
217 00:37:01.700 ⇒ 00:37:11.539 Robert Tseng: it will if that helps you kind of hit the number like hitting the numbers is like this is arbitrary, but like it’s to at least what it it creates like a.
218 00:37:11.950 ⇒ 00:37:14.250 Robert Tseng: It’s a funnel, right? The more that you’re able to.
219 00:37:14.250 ⇒ 00:37:18.229 Connor Fenn: I could have a goal number to keep. That’s like it’s just good to have.
220 00:37:18.470 ⇒ 00:37:24.169 Robert Tseng: Yeah. Yeah. So you know, at some point I like, last year I was making like
221 00:37:24.470 ⇒ 00:37:33.810 Robert Tseng: 30 to 50 cold calls a week. If I if the inbound pipeline dropped like dried up, I would just call a bunch and
222 00:37:34.320 ⇒ 00:37:51.229 Robert Tseng: even if not all of them became like buyers. I did like, learn a lot of interesting things. So like, this is kind of expanding into this last Okr on like, why we don’t. Yeah, I think like this is a questions list that I came up with when
223 00:37:51.770 ⇒ 00:38:10.570 Robert Tseng: in Q 4 of last year, I was like, yeah, we’re gonna just go and try to work with nonprofits that are low tech or whatever, and just like from cold calling and talking to a bunch of people. I ended up coming up with this list of questions of like, Hey, I think these are the most common data questions that a buyer would be asking.
224 00:38:10.750 ⇒ 00:38:19.170 Robert Tseng: And at least, you know, if you read through these, I think this is like this gives you a good understanding, like I feel like I could talk to any like nonprofit like
225 00:38:19.630 ⇒ 00:38:31.395 Robert Tseng: at this point, and know what questions that they’re probably asking about their data. We may not be focusing on that this quarter, but, like I would totally go back and hit the same hit the same list again.
226 00:38:31.690 ⇒ 00:38:54.720 Robert Tseng: so yeah, even when you’re cold calling, if they don’t end up being a buyer if you can just even get them to tell you their one question, that they ask about their data, or whatever like that kind of helps to create, give you some context for, like, what is the what is the buyer persona really thinking about? So I kind of just like brought this list in here as an example for you to
227 00:38:55.040 ⇒ 00:39:13.546 Robert Tseng: when you’re when you do have calls with people like, even if they’re not gonna buy to not get discouraged, but to use it as like a learning opportunity and figure out like, what is that one question that they care about a lot and that will kind of teach you a lot about the the about about data. I think so.
228 00:39:14.320 ⇒ 00:39:16.790 Robert Tseng: hopefully, that kind of helps like
229 00:39:17.170 ⇒ 00:39:34.670 Robert Tseng: we, we’ll make this more practical. I know I’m just kind of showing this for now, but just trying to give you different ideas of like how you can navigate these calls or I just navigate like discovery calls beyond, just like trying to bring them to the next stage.
230 00:39:34.920 ⇒ 00:39:37.680 Connor Fenn: Yeah, no, no, for sure. This is really helpful.
231 00:39:38.720 ⇒ 00:39:49.340 Robert Tseng: Okay, and then this last one is just like on partners, pious wants to be more involved in the partner side. He gave us like 5 partner leads last week. And so I’m trying to just like, get him more involved there.
232 00:39:50.790 ⇒ 00:39:56.769 Robert Tseng: yeah, I think. That’s that’s just something I’ll be working with him on. So no, no work not to worry there.
233 00:39:57.207 ⇒ 00:40:07.910 Robert Tseng: Yeah. Okay, so this is pretty much it. As far as like verticals that we’re focusing on. Yeah, I think we’ll turn on stuff for the Ecom that makes. Where did I put it?
234 00:40:08.170 ⇒ 00:40:11.069 Robert Tseng: Services? Industry?
235 00:40:15.750 ⇒ 00:40:18.070 Robert Tseng: I don’t sales.
236 00:40:19.030 ⇒ 00:40:19.980 Robert Tseng: All right.
237 00:40:21.110 ⇒ 00:40:31.159 Robert Tseng: Yeah. So we have legal on. We have Ecom. And I know you work on a list. And yeah, basically, between these 2, we’ll get, we’ll get Ericsson to probably turn on another like 6 to 8 campaigns.
238 00:40:31.535 ⇒ 00:40:49.980 Robert Tseng: And then we’ll just be hitting that for for the quarter on the outbound stuff. Obviously, we can still make different bets here and there, and do do manual outreach, which I still think is really effective if you find someone with the right timing. But yeah, I think that’s something that I wanna get him going on the in the near in the near term.
239 00:40:50.320 ⇒ 00:41:03.169 Connor Fenn: Okay. So with my list, I know you gotta go with my list. What do you think I should do with it right now to get it going as fast as possible. I just like I need some kind of leads to start going. So
240 00:41:03.510 ⇒ 00:41:06.049 Connor Fenn: if I can get something going that’d be great.
241 00:41:06.270 ⇒ 00:41:13.090 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, you could start reaching out to them. Or if you want to get the copy from from the
242 00:41:14.030 ⇒ 00:41:20.520 Robert Tseng: you want to review the copy with Ericsson. You can just send him the the list and just have him like
243 00:41:20.720 ⇒ 00:41:34.119 Robert Tseng: give you. Tell him to like reference the copy from previous Ecom came campaigns that we’ve launched, and we can edit it from there. But yeah, pretty much like what he’s gonna want is like something like this, right where
244 00:41:34.330 ⇒ 00:41:52.659 Robert Tseng: maybe this step you already built the lead list. And now, like he have him like, go and figure out like how to turn that list of 100 to a thousand. And then, like the campaign triggers, he can, he can go and figure that out. Like, yeah, so yeah, just at least to give.
245 00:41:52.660 ⇒ 00:42:02.090 Connor Fenn: That’d be pretty much the same exact campaign as the one we did for Vitaco. Like it’s just they’re just ecom brands that have retail products. Now.
246 00:42:02.890 ⇒ 00:42:03.450 Connor Fenn: likewise.
247 00:42:03.930 ⇒ 00:42:04.410 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
248 00:42:05.180 ⇒ 00:42:06.810 Connor Fenn: It’s pretty similar.
249 00:42:07.010 ⇒ 00:42:09.050 Connor Fenn: Yeah, okay, so it should just be similar.
250 00:42:09.460 ⇒ 00:42:12.656 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think if anything
251 00:42:13.550 ⇒ 00:42:18.260 Robert Tseng: we we would just be testing the. The messaging would be adjusted slightly. So
252 00:42:18.854 ⇒ 00:42:42.220 Robert Tseng: yeah, I don’t necessarily think like pure Ecom brands will not want what we did for Ida Coco, because they’re not really in store. So we, I think once that once we get to that draft stage like, I’ll probably chime in to like, adjust the copy a bit, and make it more relevant to what we have been doing for finds like Joby would, that are purely Ecom.
253 00:42:43.880 ⇒ 00:42:45.740 Connor Fenn: Okay, that makes sense.
254 00:42:46.510 ⇒ 00:42:47.130 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
255 00:42:47.970 ⇒ 00:42:48.490 Connor Fenn: Alrighty!
256 00:42:48.490 ⇒ 00:42:57.650 Robert Tseng: Okay, cool? Well, yeah. Feel free to just go in. I gotta review it a bit more if you have any other questions ask me. But yeah, hopefully, that was just
257 00:42:58.170 ⇒ 00:43:05.290 Robert Tseng: good way to kind of get centered on some more clear goals for the rest of the quarter.
258 00:43:05.520 ⇒ 00:43:07.280 Connor Fenn: Absolutely I appreciate it.
259 00:43:07.810 ⇒ 00:43:10.399 Robert Tseng: Cool alright. Well, I’ll talk to you later. Then.
260 00:43:11.970 ⇒ 00:43:12.690 Robert Tseng: Yeah.