Meeting Title: ABC Home Renewal Terms Date: 2025-03-03 Meeting participants: Robert Tseng, Scott_Harmon, Uttam Kumaran
WEBVTT
1 00:00:20.110 ⇒ 00:00:20.980 Uttam Kumaran: Hey, Scott!
2 00:00:25.771 ⇒ 00:00:27.929 Uttam Kumaran: Hey! Can you hear me?
3 00:00:28.450 ⇒ 00:00:29.010 Scott_Harmon: Yeah.
4 00:00:30.550 ⇒ 00:00:35.700 Uttam Kumaran: You’re just a little muted, or it sounds like a little bit.
5 00:00:42.360 ⇒ 00:00:43.340 Scott_Harmon: How’s that?
6 00:00:43.700 ⇒ 00:00:44.530 Uttam Kumaran: Better, better.
7 00:00:44.530 ⇒ 00:00:45.090 Robert Tseng: Better.
8 00:00:45.460 ⇒ 00:00:46.430 Scott_Harmon: Hey, Robert.
9 00:00:47.110 ⇒ 00:00:48.019 Robert Tseng: Hi, Scott!
10 00:00:48.190 ⇒ 00:00:49.530 Robert Tseng: Good to meet you.
11 00:00:49.530 ⇒ 00:00:50.760 Scott_Harmon: I don’t think we met.
12 00:00:52.190 ⇒ 00:00:55.330 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, we should do. We should do some intros. Yeah.
13 00:00:55.330 ⇒ 00:00:57.589 Scott_Harmon: Where are you? Where you live, Robert? Where are you from?
14 00:00:57.590 ⇒ 00:00:58.930 Robert Tseng: I live in New York.
15 00:00:59.170 ⇒ 00:01:00.419 Scott_Harmon: Oh, great whereabouts.
16 00:01:00.960 ⇒ 00:01:06.420 Robert Tseng: I’m in actually in Jersey City currently. But I’m about to move to Columbus Circle in a couple of weeks.
17 00:01:06.420 ⇒ 00:01:08.270 Scott_Harmon: Oh, oh, okay. Cool.
18 00:01:08.270 ⇒ 00:01:08.970 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
19 00:01:08.970 ⇒ 00:01:13.060 Scott_Harmon: My daughter and a son-in-law live in Brooklyn, so I go up there quite a bit.
20 00:01:13.200 ⇒ 00:01:14.390 Robert Tseng: Oh, no way, cool.
21 00:01:14.640 ⇒ 00:01:15.220 Scott_Harmon: Yeah.
22 00:01:15.760 ⇒ 00:01:22.610 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I haven’t been here too long. I was in La for 5 years before just just finished my 1st year in New York, so.
23 00:01:22.940 ⇒ 00:01:25.219 Scott_Harmon: They moved from LA. As well. Yeah.
24 00:01:25.220 ⇒ 00:01:26.320 Robert Tseng: Oh, okay.
25 00:01:26.590 ⇒ 00:01:28.530 Scott_Harmon: Area. Yeah, they lived in Culver City and.
26 00:01:28.530 ⇒ 00:01:29.910 Robert Tseng: I was in Culver City. Yeah.
27 00:01:29.910 ⇒ 00:01:30.400 Scott_Harmon: Whoa!
28 00:01:31.880 ⇒ 00:01:35.810 Scott_Harmon: Which? Which? What do you like better about New York and worse about New York?
29 00:01:36.429 ⇒ 00:01:42.300 Robert Tseng: Well, to be honest, the decision to move was mostly driven by my wife. She wanted to live in New York
30 00:01:42.580 ⇒ 00:01:44.950 Robert Tseng: so you like, the wife is pretty good. Yeah.
31 00:01:46.680 ⇒ 00:01:54.830 Robert Tseng: yeah, I do like la, but no, I’m I’m looking forward to being next to Central Park, I think. That’ll make my experience better.
32 00:01:55.530 ⇒ 00:01:56.240 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
33 00:01:56.440 ⇒ 00:01:59.400 Scott_Harmon: Yeah. Well, you’re definitely right in the middle of things, man. Oh, man.
34 00:01:59.400 ⇒ 00:01:59.960 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
35 00:02:01.464 ⇒ 00:02:02.680 Uttam Kumaran: The circle is great.
36 00:02:03.090 ⇒ 00:02:06.439 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I’m I’m very excited to to move stuff.
37 00:02:07.310 ⇒ 00:02:11.680 Robert Tseng: And then Utam and I are gonna go to la at the end of the month, and yes.
38 00:02:11.680 ⇒ 00:02:12.599 Robert Tseng: often so.
39 00:02:13.030 ⇒ 00:02:13.790 Scott_Harmon: Whoa!
40 00:02:14.270 ⇒ 00:02:22.930 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. And then so we’re in this, I think, as Scott I may have mentioned. But we’re in this like sort of tech services. Accelerator. Here that we’ve been
41 00:02:23.440 ⇒ 00:02:33.860 Uttam Kumaran: doing some work with for the past like month or 2 months started by a group here that sold they previously sold a large data.
42 00:02:34.362 ⇒ 00:02:50.807 Uttam Kumaran: Well, like, it was sort of data and a mix of services to Ntt data, ntt, data is like a really large sort of consultancy. And then they they went off and started sort of what they described as like Y combinator for tech services companies. They’ve been incredibly helpful.
43 00:02:51.350 ⇒ 00:03:04.680 Uttam Kumaran: yeah, we have moved a lot forward. You know, one is part part of it is like they forced us to think a lot about positioning and and a few other things, but have been extremely helpful as a resource, and
44 00:03:04.990 ⇒ 00:03:05.500 Scott_Harmon: How old.
45 00:03:05.500 ⇒ 00:03:07.949 Uttam Kumaran: They’re called Vixel VI. Xu l.
46 00:03:09.810 ⇒ 00:03:11.019 Scott_Harmon: Okay. I’ll look them up.
47 00:03:11.020 ⇒ 00:03:13.950 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, take a look. I’d be surprised if you’re
48 00:03:14.370 ⇒ 00:03:21.389 Uttam Kumaran: you’re not connected, or one of the guys is here. Well, he’s he’s sort of closer. He lives in closer to Round Rock, but
49 00:03:21.490 ⇒ 00:03:26.180 Uttam Kumaran: they built their business here. And yeah, really, really great tool. So they have, like a
50 00:03:26.310 ⇒ 00:03:34.961 Uttam Kumaran: they do an annual conference here where they bring a lot of the alumni of the program, and they have the current cohorts like, sort of speak and meet.
51 00:03:36.000 ⇒ 00:03:43.789 Uttam Kumaran: But yeah, it’s that’s how that. So we’ve been sort of doing that. And then, yeah, we’ll be presenting there probably something in Austin in April.
52 00:03:43.790 ⇒ 00:03:44.210 Scott_Harmon: Question.
53 00:03:45.050 ⇒ 00:03:45.920 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
54 00:03:48.610 ⇒ 00:04:17.300 Uttam Kumaran: And then, yeah, I guess, like this chat mainly. Well, what I’m I’m really happy that you guys finally get to meet. I guess, Scott, I told Robert a lot about our relationship and sort of ABC televero the stuff on legal. So I think we’re we’re excited. I think there’s tons for us to do. I think we’re gonna start doing a little bit more on sort of leaning more into partnerships and also, you know, work, probably closer together with you on a
55 00:04:17.579 ⇒ 00:04:32.278 Uttam Kumaran: bunch of other stuff, I think, for this call, really just wanted to talk about stuff for ABC, and really what to put together for this next phase. I think what probably best I can do is I I just threw
56 00:04:33.130 ⇒ 00:04:47.080 Uttam Kumaran: actually just threw a bunch of stuff into Chat Gbt before this meeting, to sort of get organized on the data they sent. And sort of how we typically put together what we’ve kind of similar to what we put together for televero in terms of
57 00:04:47.190 ⇒ 00:04:53.340 Uttam Kumaran: what kpis we can affect here, and I think for Robert, for your context
58 00:04:53.550 ⇒ 00:05:19.070 Uttam Kumaran: for ABC. We agreed on like 2 phase, like a 2 phase approach, basically one which was related to just getting the agent out the door. And that’s sort of where we’re at like sort of finalizing that the second piece was moving after we get the agent deployed to their customer service team to start charging on an ongoing basis. And that’s the sort of
59 00:05:19.830 ⇒ 00:05:23.889 Uttam Kumaran: sort of determination we need to make right now on on how
60 00:05:24.320 ⇒ 00:05:27.180 Uttam Kumaran: all that is gonna work. Let me just paste.
61 00:05:27.570 ⇒ 00:05:33.520 Uttam Kumaran: Let me just grab this and paste this into notion. But I guess, Scott, any other details we should add, there.
62 00:05:34.950 ⇒ 00:05:38.830 Scott_Harmon: No, I mean, I have my overarching thought about it about it is.
63 00:05:39.440 ⇒ 00:05:43.540 Scott_Harmon: you know, just like we did. For to Leavero
64 00:05:44.820 ⇒ 00:05:51.559 Scott_Harmon: you have to understand? 2, 2, 2 variables, one like what one is. What’s the Kpi, or what’s the metric
65 00:05:52.020 ⇒ 00:05:59.360 Scott_Harmon: that that you can? Do? You think you would? You know influence, and that you think is, you know, valuable to them. That’s number one
66 00:05:59.510 ⇒ 00:06:00.869 Scott_Harmon: and number 2.
67 00:06:01.590 ⇒ 00:06:04.239 Scott_Harmon: What’s kind of the unit value
68 00:06:04.740 ⇒ 00:06:07.179 Scott_Harmon: of moving the needle with that metric.
69 00:06:07.710 ⇒ 00:06:12.950 Scott_Harmon: and that that second piece is the magic, in my opinion, to
70 00:06:13.220 ⇒ 00:06:17.050 Scott_Harmon: to getting these long term relationships where it’s sort of win-win.
71 00:06:17.320 ⇒ 00:06:22.750 Scott_Harmon: and the customer is sort of happily writing you a bigger check every quarter, right like
72 00:06:23.170 ⇒ 00:06:26.169 Scott_Harmon: the the real trick to this model is where
73 00:06:26.470 ⇒ 00:06:29.270 Scott_Harmon: the customer is stroking you a check, and they
74 00:06:29.620 ⇒ 00:06:32.439 Scott_Harmon: they love the fact that they’re writing you a bigger check.
75 00:06:33.010 ⇒ 00:06:33.700 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
76 00:06:34.260 ⇒ 00:06:38.069 Scott_Harmon: Because it means they’re either making more money or they’re
77 00:06:38.180 ⇒ 00:06:41.180 Scott_Harmon: they’re saving money in a real tangible way.
78 00:06:41.700 ⇒ 00:06:46.569 Scott_Harmon: And that that’s not, you know, that’s just very. That’s very clear. So
79 00:06:46.950 ⇒ 00:06:56.210 Scott_Harmon: yeah, so those are the 2. And I think I think we identified those with televero and with televero. It’s like, Hey, I’m signing up new customers like, if this works.
80 00:06:56.710 ⇒ 00:07:02.690 Scott_Harmon: I have more customers every quarter than I would without you and the customers worth this much, and sure, why wouldn’t I pay you.
81 00:07:02.840 ⇒ 00:07:05.619 Scott_Harmon: you know, 50 bucks for each new customer, so.
82 00:07:05.620 ⇒ 00:07:06.320 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
83 00:07:06.320 ⇒ 00:07:12.790 Scott_Harmon: So that’s that’s the idea here, I think. And so I think, with what they’ve given us the 3 metrics they’ve given. I think they gave us 3.
84 00:07:13.140 ⇒ 00:07:13.730 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
85 00:07:13.730 ⇒ 00:07:16.339 Scott_Harmon: Then I think we could just talk about those 3
86 00:07:16.730 ⇒ 00:07:21.500 Scott_Harmon: and decide which ones you think are, you know we we should. We should lead with.
87 00:07:22.530 ⇒ 00:07:28.567 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. So I just here, let me. Actually, I was just grabbing a little food. Let me just switch back to my
88 00:07:29.070 ⇒ 00:07:30.090 Uttam Kumaran: computer.
89 00:07:33.640 ⇒ 00:07:39.380 Uttam Kumaran: Let me just share what I I just sent this into the channel. But basically.
90 00:07:40.055 ⇒ 00:07:42.035 Uttam Kumaran: yeah, they sent us.
91 00:07:43.090 ⇒ 00:07:52.510 Uttam Kumaran: these are just a couple that I sort of thought through. I mean, the biggest things I think were our average whole average whole time.
92 00:07:52.620 ⇒ 00:07:58.739 Uttam Kumaran: 1st call resolution rate, and then.
93 00:07:59.410 ⇒ 00:08:06.689 Uttam Kumaran: you know, they mentioned something about customer satisfaction rate. There’s also the oh, by the ways which we can do.
94 00:08:07.460 ⇒ 00:08:11.114 Uttam Kumaran: But they didn’t give us any metrics on those yet.
95 00:08:12.100 ⇒ 00:08:15.530 Uttam Kumaran: I think we they she mentioned, trying to just look at like.
96 00:08:17.190 ⇒ 00:08:22.470 Scott_Harmon: Yeah, they gave. No. By the way, metric they they did. Yeah.
97 00:08:22.470 ⇒ 00:08:25.522 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, okay, so let me pull up. Let me just get
98 00:08:25.800 ⇒ 00:08:27.960 Scott_Harmon: Pull up her email from yesterday. She gave her
99 00:08:28.210 ⇒ 00:08:31.229 Scott_Harmon: a metric world. By the way, yeah, it’s a monthly average.
100 00:08:33.630 ⇒ 00:08:35.789 Scott_Harmon: Oh, okay, I see this now. Good. Yeah.
101 00:08:36.830 ⇒ 00:08:41.069 Uttam Kumaran: So stop this at the bottom. Here.
102 00:08:52.890 ⇒ 00:08:54.790 Scott_Harmon: They’re right there. 76 for pest.
103 00:08:56.010 ⇒ 00:08:59.570 Scott_Harmon: the 80 for lawn are the 2 numbers, the 2 metrics.
104 00:09:00.020 ⇒ 00:09:06.049 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. And Robert. So oh, by the way, is basically like their upsell metric. So when they take a phone call with
105 00:09:06.360 ⇒ 00:09:10.950 Uttam Kumaran: their customers, part of the things they want to.
106 00:09:11.440 ⇒ 00:09:17.229 Uttam Kumaran: Measure is like the ability to like solve a problem with an upsell onto an additional service.
107 00:09:17.230 ⇒ 00:09:17.780 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
108 00:09:19.020 ⇒ 00:09:23.000 Uttam Kumaran: We basically want to see whether our agent can help affect
109 00:09:23.340 ⇒ 00:09:27.330 Uttam Kumaran: that metric. In addition to what’s pretty common, which is
110 00:09:27.610 ⇒ 00:09:32.640 Uttam Kumaran: average average handle time a average whole time, and
111 00:09:32.930 ⇒ 00:09:36.890 Uttam Kumaran: the other thing is like, I guess increased capacity is the
112 00:09:37.050 ⇒ 00:09:45.789 Uttam Kumaran: downstream affected that. But we’re we’re probably not affected by that. I think really it’s fcr average hold time. And the
113 00:09:45.930 ⇒ 00:09:47.350 Uttam Kumaran: oh, by the ways
114 00:09:49.040 ⇒ 00:09:51.600 Uttam Kumaran: She did say something about like.
115 00:09:51.900 ⇒ 00:09:53.929 Uttam Kumaran: can we look at the number of
116 00:09:54.540 ⇒ 00:10:00.150 Uttam Kumaran: calls and chats handled for the agent we can we already have. We already measured that?
117 00:10:00.686 ⇒ 00:10:10.429 Uttam Kumaran: The accuracy, in fact, effectiveness. We can measure that the AI system response. We can measure that. But I think that’s all baked into like, I wouldn’t say that’s like those are success metrics.
118 00:10:11.096 ⇒ 00:10:15.489 Uttam Kumaran: And then the training time reduction. Csat. I think that’s probably next.
119 00:10:15.830 ⇒ 00:10:18.050 Uttam Kumaran: But I think really, it’s like
120 00:10:18.470 ⇒ 00:10:23.354 Uttam Kumaran: these 3 at the top that are the most important.
121 00:10:24.190 ⇒ 00:10:28.479 Scott_Harmon: Yeah. So I I’m not sure I fully on board with that.
122 00:10:28.480 ⇒ 00:10:29.130 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
123 00:10:29.940 ⇒ 00:10:30.630 Scott_Harmon: But
124 00:10:30.740 ⇒ 00:10:36.689 Scott_Harmon: but I guess that’s the purpose of the call is to see. So so if we could maybe just go through those one at a time.
125 00:10:37.990 ⇒ 00:10:40.160 Scott_Harmon: And some of this, Robert I
126 00:10:40.510 ⇒ 00:10:43.870 Scott_Harmon: one of the things that you know you’re old. When you get old you’ve you’ve
127 00:10:44.530 ⇒ 00:10:52.359 Scott_Harmon: you’ve done a lot of different things for good or ill right? But one of the things I used to run a company that did call center automation. So.
128 00:10:52.520 ⇒ 00:10:53.330 Robert Tseng: Okay.
129 00:10:53.330 ⇒ 00:10:57.689 Scott_Harmon: All these metrics about whole time and handle time. All those things are real.
130 00:10:58.740 ⇒ 00:11:02.609 Scott_Harmon: I just spent, you know, almost 10 years running a company that did
131 00:11:02.860 ⇒ 00:11:05.400 Scott_Harmon: that. All they did was work on these metrics.
132 00:11:05.400 ⇒ 00:11:06.060 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
133 00:11:06.060 ⇒ 00:11:11.685 Scott_Harmon: So, you know, there’s a whole. There’s just a lot to unpack here. But but
134 00:11:14.100 ⇒ 00:11:22.319 Scott_Harmon: The just to kind of repeat what I said, I think the metrics we want to focus on are metrics where ABC could very quickly answer
135 00:11:23.670 ⇒ 00:11:30.310 Scott_Harmon: what the financial value of improving the metric would be, and so.
136 00:11:30.910 ⇒ 00:11:31.890 Uttam Kumaran: The.
137 00:11:32.210 ⇒ 00:11:37.040 Scott_Harmon: Average handle times and hold times is very difficult to do that
138 00:11:38.538 ⇒ 00:11:41.710 Scott_Harmon: even in the most sophisticated organizations.
139 00:11:41.940 ⇒ 00:11:48.209 Scott_Harmon: And I’m quite sure ABC won’t be able to do it. So in other words, if you just went in and said, Okay, if I lower.
140 00:11:48.410 ⇒ 00:11:48.740 Scott_Harmon: yeah.
141 00:11:49.141 ⇒ 00:11:54.670 Scott_Harmon: handle times from 7 min to 5 min. What’s that worth to you? They could. They won’t be able to answer you.
142 00:11:55.080 ⇒ 00:11:58.110 Scott_Harmon: And so if you tie your
143 00:11:59.680 ⇒ 00:12:02.459 Scott_Harmon: to that, it’s a very difficult thing.
144 00:12:02.840 ⇒ 00:12:08.129 Scott_Harmon: The the same thing is is true for hold times
145 00:12:08.290 ⇒ 00:12:11.380 Scott_Harmon: and the same. The same thing is even true, for customer sat.
146 00:12:11.540 ⇒ 00:12:18.090 Scott_Harmon: surveys, customer, sat, surveys, everybody uses them. Everybody wants them to go up, but if you say, what’s the value of
147 00:12:18.520 ⇒ 00:12:21.650 Scott_Harmon: customer? Sat going up by 4 points, they they just can’t tell you.
148 00:12:21.650 ⇒ 00:12:23.970 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. So the measurability.
149 00:12:24.470 ⇒ 00:12:25.830 Uttam Kumaran: It’s really hard.
150 00:12:25.830 ⇒ 00:12:32.109 Scott_Harmon: No, no, it’s not the measurability. I’m not being very clear. You can measure the problem with call centers is you can measure anything
151 00:12:32.500 ⇒ 00:12:37.710 Scott_Harmon: like, like some call centers, will have 70 70 different metrics that they measure.
152 00:12:37.880 ⇒ 00:12:38.890 Uttam Kumaran: But.
153 00:12:39.370 ⇒ 00:12:47.190 Scott_Harmon: But what they can’t do for a given metric is to put a a number, for example, financial financial
154 00:12:47.530 ⇒ 00:12:52.600 Scott_Harmon: benefit. Next to the metric, right. It’s just more intuitive, like
155 00:12:53.270 ⇒ 00:12:59.710 Scott_Harmon: like, Oh, of course, we want customers to be to to be higher. Well, what is every point worth to you? I don’t know. That’s.
156 00:12:59.710 ⇒ 00:13:00.310 Uttam Kumaran: That’s why.
157 00:13:00.310 ⇒ 00:13:11.180 Scott_Harmon: So, and and so companies that sell things that make metrics go up for which you don’t know the value of you tend to just not. Those companies don’t tend to do very well.
158 00:13:11.510 ⇒ 00:13:12.500 Scott_Harmon: So
159 00:13:13.250 ⇒ 00:13:26.459 Scott_Harmon: so. And I’ll I’ll give you example just because I, from my own experience, when I this company motive. So we we had the software, and it would affect all these metrics whole time, handle time like we had like. We hired people
160 00:13:26.850 ⇒ 00:13:33.369 Scott_Harmon: that were specialists in call center metrics, and they had spreadsheets that just went on forever. And
161 00:13:34.280 ⇒ 00:13:39.730 Scott_Harmon: and then, you know, you instrument your phone systems to spit out all these metrics. It’s crazy. And
162 00:13:40.590 ⇒ 00:13:47.840 Scott_Harmon: we just argued with our customers all the time. Well, what’s the value of making that number go down by 4 points? And they? We could just never agree.
163 00:13:47.840 ⇒ 00:13:48.230 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
164 00:13:48.230 ⇒ 00:13:54.370 Scott_Harmon: The most impactful thing they we ever did was
165 00:13:54.870 ⇒ 00:13:59.620 Scott_Harmon: we had a tool that was called self healing, where
166 00:13:59.760 ⇒ 00:14:11.370 Scott_Harmon: the problem would be resolved automatically in your broadband or your PC. Before you ever had to call the call center. So it was literally an avoided phone call like, it’s just a phone call that didn’t happen
167 00:14:11.860 ⇒ 00:14:15.829 Scott_Harmon: and they go well, if you could ever do that, the average.
168 00:14:16.260 ⇒ 00:14:24.400 Scott_Harmon: the average amount per phone call that we pay is about 6 bucks. So every phone call that we take costs us about 6 bucks.
169 00:14:24.710 ⇒ 00:14:32.890 Scott_Harmon: So we were like great if we can. If we could show you we avoided a hundred of those, and they’re going well, yeah, that’s worth 600 bucks.
170 00:14:33.240 ⇒ 00:14:36.679 Scott_Harmon: And what about what about a thousand? Why not 6,000 bucks like?
171 00:14:37.030 ⇒ 00:14:44.500 Scott_Harmon: And so it was just easy. We said, great! We’ll split it with you. So for every 100 calls we’ll charge you 3 bucks. Is that a good deal. They’re like great deal.
172 00:14:44.650 ⇒ 00:14:48.310 Scott_Harmon: and we made more money off that product than any other product combined.
173 00:14:48.610 ⇒ 00:14:49.510 Scott_Harmon: And
174 00:14:49.690 ⇒ 00:14:54.409 Scott_Harmon: the only reason is, it was just very clear to them that they were either making money or saving money.
175 00:14:55.330 ⇒ 00:14:59.000 Scott_Harmon: So so to bring that home to roost on this one.
176 00:14:59.460 ⇒ 00:15:04.390 Scott_Harmon: My hunch is there’s 2 that you could make a lot of money on.
177 00:15:04.660 ⇒ 00:15:08.050 Scott_Harmon: The the 1st is the
178 00:15:10.350 ⇒ 00:15:13.840 Scott_Harmon: 1st call resolution rate. That second item you’ve got there.
179 00:15:13.840 ⇒ 00:15:14.730 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
180 00:15:14.730 ⇒ 00:15:18.220 Scott_Harmon: Number one, they said, industry average is 70 to 80%.
181 00:15:18.600 ⇒ 00:15:25.150 Scott_Harmon: Theirs is only 50. So she put in the in the email that they’re at 50. So number one, they’re bad.
182 00:15:25.890 ⇒ 00:15:27.350 Scott_Harmon: Number 2.
183 00:15:28.090 ⇒ 00:15:35.049 Scott_Harmon: If the cost of having to call someone back, you can get them to quantify. Usually it’s a lost sale.
184 00:15:36.140 ⇒ 00:15:43.449 Scott_Harmon: Right? So so most so, some percentage of these things involve a sale, an upsell, or something, or renewal.
185 00:15:43.600 ⇒ 00:15:47.480 Scott_Harmon: And so, if only half of.
186 00:15:47.680 ⇒ 00:15:50.280 Scott_Harmon: if half my calls require a callback.
187 00:15:51.020 ⇒ 00:15:59.670 Scott_Harmon: and half those callbacks ever get completed. I’m I’m about 25% of those calls are resulting in a lost sale. You probably get my math.
188 00:15:59.670 ⇒ 00:16:00.240 Uttam Kumaran: Yes, sir.
189 00:16:01.030 ⇒ 00:16:04.100 Scott_Harmon: And and they could put a dollar value on that.
190 00:16:04.510 ⇒ 00:16:12.580 Scott_Harmon: and we could talk to them for 3 min, and they would agree. Yep, that costs us all we know. When we when we don’t have a 1st call resolution, we are losing
191 00:16:12.900 ⇒ 00:16:22.380 Scott_Harmon: a bunch of money. So that’s item one number one. The second one is that
192 00:16:23.560 ⇒ 00:16:28.389 Scott_Harmon: Oh, by the way, item, which I don’t think you’ve gotten this table yet.
193 00:16:28.570 ⇒ 00:16:30.040 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I just put it here.
194 00:16:30.040 ⇒ 00:16:36.249 Scott_Harmon: There it is sorry. Sorry. So the oh, by the way, things are the are the simplest, because that’s just revenue, like every time
195 00:16:36.590 ⇒ 00:16:44.160 Scott_Harmon: they get a successful. Oh, by the way, that’s that’s that’s a new contract, right? That’s it’s almost exactly like
196 00:16:44.420 ⇒ 00:16:53.229 Scott_Harmon: the situation we had with Televiro like, Hey, I got I got a new contract, and my average new contract value is, you know, 800 bucks a year.
197 00:16:53.420 ⇒ 00:16:56.659 Scott_Harmon: so great every one of those, every every one you could make go up
198 00:16:56.840 ⇒ 00:16:58.629 Scott_Harmon: is worth 800 bucks to us.
199 00:16:58.910 ⇒ 00:17:02.130 Scott_Harmon: and I will happily split it with you. So those are the 2
200 00:17:03.130 ⇒ 00:17:08.520 Scott_Harmon: that I think we should focus on, because they are directly tied
201 00:17:08.880 ⇒ 00:17:12.400 Scott_Harmon: to revenue the other ones. I’m not saying they don’t matter at all.
202 00:17:12.400 ⇒ 00:17:12.790 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
203 00:17:12.790 ⇒ 00:17:15.040 Scott_Harmon: That we couldn’t dashboard them, or
204 00:17:15.609 ⇒ 00:17:20.870 Scott_Harmon: but in my experience they’re not going to lead to where you want to go.
205 00:17:21.480 ⇒ 00:17:27.890 Scott_Harmon: which is a a strong, reliable, quarterly income stream
206 00:17:28.089 ⇒ 00:17:30.370 Scott_Harmon: from the agent moving a metric.
207 00:17:36.710 ⇒ 00:17:41.849 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I mean, it makes sense. It makes sense in terms of like, we, even if we yeah, I
208 00:17:42.360 ⇒ 00:17:46.900 Scott_Harmon: Yeah. So if you make hold time, you know, whole time, go down by 10%.
209 00:17:46.900 ⇒ 00:17:47.360 Uttam Kumaran: How much.
210 00:17:47.360 ⇒ 00:17:49.820 Scott_Harmon: They save. They can’t tell you. They have no idea
211 00:17:50.030 ⇒ 00:17:53.230 Scott_Harmon: you don’t know. I don’t know. Nobody knows.
212 00:17:53.620 ⇒ 00:17:59.550 Scott_Harmon: Charging somebody. A percentage of nobody knows is not a good math equation.
213 00:18:00.090 ⇒ 00:18:06.510 Scott_Harmon: If the if if the numerator is a question mark, it’s a it’s bad math.
214 00:18:06.510 ⇒ 00:18:12.260 Uttam Kumaran: Do you think it would be like to play the other side? Do you think it? It could be something based on like
215 00:18:13.500 ⇒ 00:18:19.250 Uttam Kumaran: the number of calls they can handle, and therefore their volume goes up, and there’s like.
216 00:18:21.050 ⇒ 00:18:26.050 Uttam Kumaran: or or, for example, like their every hour is more efficient. So there’s something to do with their salary.
217 00:18:26.490 ⇒ 00:18:28.900 Uttam Kumaran: like, I guess, just to play the other side.
218 00:18:29.717 ⇒ 00:18:32.120 Scott_Harmon: Yeah, I want to be real careful that I’m
219 00:18:32.240 ⇒ 00:18:37.550 Scott_Harmon: them being helpful and useful in this conversation, and not, like, you know, argumentative. So
220 00:18:37.660 ⇒ 00:18:41.200 Scott_Harmon: you can make the case on paper like if we had a whiteboard.
221 00:18:41.860 ⇒ 00:18:44.160 Scott_Harmon: That being more efficient
222 00:18:44.570 ⇒ 00:18:49.829 Scott_Harmon: is a good thing for ABC, right? That it’s financially smart. I’m not arguing that at all.
223 00:18:50.450 ⇒ 00:18:53.959 Scott_Harmon: Like like we could have a we could have a spreadsheet or a whiteboard.
224 00:18:55.030 ⇒ 00:19:06.390 Scott_Harmon: you know, and the obvious benefit of that is, I have to hire less new Csrs. That’s to the obvious and the cost of a Csr burden. Let’s make up the numbers a hundred 10 grand a year, so you know, great
225 00:19:10.080 ⇒ 00:19:14.910 Scott_Harmon: So in in principle, you’re exactly correct, couldn’t agree more.
226 00:19:15.120 ⇒ 00:19:17.750 Scott_Harmon: What I’m telling you is in practice.
227 00:19:18.310 ⇒ 00:19:21.050 Scott_Harmon: If you look at somebody who runs a business.
228 00:19:22.520 ⇒ 00:19:27.300 Scott_Harmon: They don’t want to pay you some a share of somebody they didn’t hire, because they’re not sure like.
229 00:19:27.530 ⇒ 00:19:28.950 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, like.
230 00:19:28.950 ⇒ 00:19:36.540 Scott_Harmon: If I go to Matt, who’s the Cfo and go, we want 10% of the people you didn’t hire last quarter. He’s like, well, wait a minute. I didn’t hire him like.
231 00:19:36.540 ⇒ 00:19:37.640 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah.
232 00:19:37.640 ⇒ 00:19:44.090 Scott_Harmon: What do you mean like like, I don’t have that money in my well, in theory. Yes, you do, because you probably would have so
233 00:19:44.740 ⇒ 00:19:49.289 Scott_Harmon: what it is is. It’s it’s a counterfactual. It’s something that didn’t happen.
234 00:19:49.580 ⇒ 00:19:50.390 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
235 00:19:50.670 ⇒ 00:19:55.850 Scott_Harmon: And unless they’re really, really sure and you know you
236 00:19:55.990 ⇒ 00:20:03.829 Scott_Harmon: you can get, you can become sure if you’re really a good metrics company. But the the other problem is these, they’re not that great a metrics team.
237 00:20:04.510 ⇒ 00:20:05.160 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
238 00:20:05.380 ⇒ 00:20:06.960 Scott_Harmon: Right. So it took about.
239 00:20:07.640 ⇒ 00:20:09.199 Scott_Harmon: You know she worked hard.
240 00:20:10.400 ⇒ 00:20:14.400 Scott_Harmon: She’s their metrics, and their stats are not very good.
241 00:20:14.400 ⇒ 00:20:15.010 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
242 00:20:15.420 ⇒ 00:20:17.820 Scott_Harmon: You know she’s pasting stuff out of 8 by 8.
243 00:20:18.304 ⇒ 00:20:18.790 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
244 00:20:18.790 ⇒ 00:20:22.710 Scott_Harmon: You know they they don’t have you in there right to run their data team.
245 00:20:22.710 ⇒ 00:20:23.350 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
246 00:20:24.650 ⇒ 00:20:28.539 Scott_Harmon: The other thing I would say is, if you’d been in there for a year building a good data.
247 00:20:29.220 ⇒ 00:20:33.900 Scott_Harmon: you know, metrics, dashboards, and data science and like, if if that was all in place.
248 00:20:35.360 ⇒ 00:20:37.099 Scott_Harmon: then you’d have a.
249 00:20:37.100 ⇒ 00:20:37.999 Uttam Kumaran: But I’ll put some.
250 00:20:38.000 ⇒ 00:20:41.340 Scott_Harmon: You’d have a better platform to prove that you saved them money. Right?
251 00:20:41.840 ⇒ 00:20:49.829 Scott_Harmon: You know you. You turn on the agent, and the metric would start changing right. But they can’t even build these matrix. You know, they can’t even pull them together.
252 00:20:50.770 ⇒ 00:20:54.739 Scott_Harmon: So they’re they’re just immature from a data perspective.
253 00:20:55.480 ⇒ 00:21:00.669 Scott_Harmon: And so that’s why you want to make what you’re charging him.
254 00:21:01.610 ⇒ 00:21:06.410 Scott_Harmon: Incredibly obvious, right? Like like.
255 00:21:07.120 ⇒ 00:21:13.030 Scott_Harmon: And again, the thing I’ve I think, is obvious is they say, Hey, look! If we don’t have to call clients back.
256 00:21:13.510 ⇒ 00:21:15.120 Scott_Harmon: We know the value of that.
257 00:21:15.120 ⇒ 00:21:16.849 Uttam Kumaran: It’s really simple. Yeah.
258 00:21:17.110 ⇒ 00:21:21.800 Scott_Harmon: And the other one is this, oh, by the way, thing like, if we, if we sold a new contract.
259 00:21:23.380 ⇒ 00:21:24.749 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I mean for sure.
260 00:21:25.090 ⇒ 00:21:27.690 Scott_Harmon: And you know, a new annual pest contract.
261 00:21:28.480 ⇒ 00:21:35.869 Scott_Harmon: I forgot what ours cost. Hey, frog, what’s our annual ABC test contract cost
262 00:21:37.850 ⇒ 00:21:44.809 Scott_Harmon: our annual ABC. Pest contract cost roughly like when for the pest service, when ABC comes around and sprint
263 00:21:47.210 ⇒ 00:21:50.889 Scott_Harmon: 100 bucks every other month. So so it’s 600 bucks.
264 00:21:50.890 ⇒ 00:21:51.500 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
265 00:21:51.900 ⇒ 00:21:56.059 Scott_Harmon: So every time you know one of those.
266 00:21:56.880 ⇒ 00:22:00.120 Scott_Harmon: Oh, by the way’s happened, it’s worth 600 bucks.
267 00:22:01.640 ⇒ 00:22:04.209 Scott_Harmon: So again, if you make 10
268 00:22:04.320 ⇒ 00:22:07.130 Scott_Harmon: in a quarter 10 more. That’s 6,000 bucks.
269 00:22:12.800 ⇒ 00:22:13.750 Uttam Kumaran: So.
270 00:22:14.390 ⇒ 00:22:22.249 Uttam Kumaran: yeah, I, okay, I see your point. I actually think this is which. And for this one. So the oh, by the way, the upsells. It’s basically like, if
271 00:22:22.720 ⇒ 00:22:25.390 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, the best way to say is like, if they.
272 00:22:25.500 ⇒ 00:22:39.649 Uttam Kumaran: I guess the one thing is we’d have to talk to them about like how to do the attribution, I guess, for both. But let’s say, let’s say for both of these, let’s just talk about what is the revenue impact. So for the 1st call resolution.
273 00:22:39.970 ⇒ 00:22:45.010 Uttam Kumaran: we’re basically trying to establish that if
274 00:22:45.630 ⇒ 00:22:51.779 Uttam Kumaran: the calls where an agent is using Csr is using the agent
275 00:22:51.980 ⇒ 00:22:54.600 Uttam Kumaran: that that 1st call resol like
276 00:22:54.730 ⇒ 00:22:57.779 Uttam Kumaran: we would, should we do a number of 1st call resolutions.
277 00:22:57.780 ⇒ 00:23:00.219 Scott_Harmon: Yes, absolutely. And that’s why.
278 00:23:00.220 ⇒ 00:23:01.640 Uttam Kumaran: Call, resolution.
279 00:23:01.640 ⇒ 00:23:09.980 Scott_Harmon: Because well, we could track both in the dashboard, but the number is important because we can tie a dollar value to each
280 00:23:10.440 ⇒ 00:23:16.800 Scott_Harmon: each. Call each incremental call that we resolved on the 1st 1st phone call.
281 00:23:19.900 ⇒ 00:23:21.380 Scott_Harmon: That’s why.
282 00:23:21.380 ⇒ 00:23:25.640 Uttam Kumaran: That’s the thing. I think it would be helpful to know. What is the what is the
283 00:23:26.000 ⇒ 00:23:31.180 Uttam Kumaran: I guess in in this sense, would this be like? I see the part of this as still as like retention.
284 00:23:31.860 ⇒ 00:23:37.500 Uttam Kumaran: So it would be like, you’re retaining some amount of customer value.
285 00:23:38.300 ⇒ 00:23:47.269 Scott_Harmon: So here’s here’s there’s a there’s a data item we don’t have here which would be helpful. We should ask them. I should have thought about this on our call on Friday, but I didn’t.
286 00:23:47.730 ⇒ 00:23:50.830 Scott_Harmon: So you have to remember that they’re taking
287 00:23:51.540 ⇒ 00:23:58.139 Scott_Harmon: essentially 2 kinds of inbound calls. Actually, there’s there’s 3. But
288 00:23:59.010 ⇒ 00:24:02.450 Scott_Harmon: the first, st the 1st type is somebody calling with
289 00:24:02.600 ⇒ 00:24:06.009 Scott_Harmon: a question or complaint, for example, like, Hey.
290 00:24:06.780 ⇒ 00:24:12.369 Scott_Harmon: you know, I’ve got your pest service, and I just found a scorpion. Wtf, right? That would be a kind of a customer complaint.
291 00:24:12.660 ⇒ 00:24:15.550 Scott_Harmon: or your guy showed up and spray, you know.
292 00:24:15.750 ⇒ 00:24:20.369 Scott_Harmon: Did my lawn and my grass is dead. Right? Those yeah, those would be.
293 00:24:20.490 ⇒ 00:24:23.230 Scott_Harmon: Let’s just call them complaints or problems.
294 00:24:23.560 ⇒ 00:24:28.760 Scott_Harmon: The other kind of call they’re taking are basically new client inquiries.
295 00:24:29.120 ⇒ 00:24:30.029 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, okay.
296 00:24:30.420 ⇒ 00:24:37.660 Scott_Harmon: Like, Hey, I like. They’re literally pre-sales. Calls like, Hey, I saw ABC or my neighbor. I saw the ABC. Truck.
297 00:24:37.860 ⇒ 00:24:42.340 Scott_Harmon: and you know, my neighbor said I should get it. And how much does it cost, or do you?
298 00:24:42.690 ⇒ 00:24:49.210 Scott_Harmon: You know I’d like a quote or or another kind is a new Service request
299 00:24:49.940 ⇒ 00:24:54.289 Scott_Harmon: from from an existing customer. So, hey, I’ve got your pest service.
300 00:24:54.410 ⇒ 00:24:56.420 Scott_Harmon: and I noticed you also did lawn.
301 00:24:56.840 ⇒ 00:25:01.160 Scott_Harmon: and my lawn looks like shit. So how much would it cost me to add? My, so those are.
302 00:25:02.010 ⇒ 00:25:06.019 Scott_Harmon: Those are new, either a brand new client or a new service.
303 00:25:07.790 ⇒ 00:25:16.440 Scott_Harmon: I ask her, or we should ask them again, what’s the breakdown of all the calls between those 2 types of calls being problems with an existing service
304 00:25:16.810 ⇒ 00:25:24.179 Scott_Harmon: or request to add a new service right? But I think more of them are of the second type.
305 00:25:26.350 ⇒ 00:25:27.330 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, okay.
306 00:25:27.520 ⇒ 00:25:32.170 Scott_Harmon: I think I thought originally, and most companies that’s not true. Most companies.
307 00:25:32.530 ⇒ 00:25:36.659 Scott_Harmon: It’s mostly customers bitching. I can’t use this thing. It doesn’t work, you know. That’s.
308 00:25:36.660 ⇒ 00:25:37.410 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
309 00:25:37.410 ⇒ 00:25:41.179 Scott_Harmon: That’s kind of a typical customer. Support is customers where they’ve got some.
310 00:25:41.730 ⇒ 00:25:47.619 Scott_Harmon: you know, some problem that they’re unhappy about. I think they’ve told me before that the majority are of
311 00:25:48.190 ⇒ 00:25:50.520 Scott_Harmon: their new service opportunities.
312 00:25:50.800 ⇒ 00:25:51.760 Scott_Harmon: And
313 00:25:52.750 ⇒ 00:25:59.480 Scott_Harmon: and so, if that’s the case, just for sake of argument, I’ll just make a number 50%. I just made that up.
314 00:25:59.710 ⇒ 00:26:04.430 Scott_Harmon: Well, if half the calls involve a new service.
315 00:26:05.360 ⇒ 00:26:11.319 Scott_Harmon: and let’s just for the sake of argument, say that the value of a new service is
316 00:26:11.540 ⇒ 00:26:13.229 Scott_Harmon: 600 bucks a year.
317 00:26:15.190 ⇒ 00:26:17.030 Scott_Harmon: You’re probably following me.
318 00:26:17.030 ⇒ 00:26:17.760 Uttam Kumaran: Yes, yes.
319 00:26:17.760 ⇒ 00:26:23.639 Scott_Harmon: Very quickly do. And if you say, Look, if I can’t handle the question on the 1st
320 00:26:24.330 ⇒ 00:26:28.379 Scott_Harmon: call, the success drops off dramatically.
321 00:26:30.760 ⇒ 00:26:33.510 Uttam Kumaran: So it’s like A, you have the fcr.
322 00:26:34.360 ⇒ 00:26:42.310 Uttam Kumaran: well, okay. So you haven’t. You have the 1st call resolution in terms of this, which is like a re, which is like a customer retention
323 00:26:43.040 ⇒ 00:26:43.630 Uttam Kumaran: thing.
324 00:26:43.630 ⇒ 00:26:46.580 Scott_Harmon: 1st problem would be retention right? And that’s good.
325 00:26:46.580 ⇒ 00:26:47.250 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
326 00:26:47.250 ⇒ 00:26:56.540 Scott_Harmon: Ultimately you’re going in the right direction, you know, solving a customer problem on the 1st attempt you could argue, and probably successfully. We helped you retain a customer.
327 00:26:56.650 ⇒ 00:26:57.570 Scott_Harmon: and
328 00:26:58.670 ⇒ 00:27:03.390 Scott_Harmon: if I was building a spreadsheet, which I think you’re kind of doing in real time, I’d say, and that has value.
329 00:27:03.520 ⇒ 00:27:08.379 Scott_Harmon: You know that customer is 600 bucks a year to you. Retaining them is worth 600 bucks like.
330 00:27:08.380 ⇒ 00:27:09.190 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
331 00:27:09.190 ⇒ 00:27:14.390 Scott_Harmon: Otherwise they would have, you would have lost them. That’s called attrition. And that’s bad, you know. So that’s a that’s an economic
332 00:27:14.860 ⇒ 00:27:20.839 Scott_Harmon: unit value of you know what’s the value of keeping a customer? 600 bucks a year? Great.
333 00:27:21.440 ⇒ 00:27:28.029 Scott_Harmon: So 1st call resolution. The word resolution means. I kept them.
334 00:27:28.570 ⇒ 00:27:29.420 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
335 00:27:29.730 ⇒ 00:27:34.999 Scott_Harmon: If I had to call them back. My success rate on callbacks is only 25%.
336 00:27:35.980 ⇒ 00:27:40.520 Scott_Harmon: In other words, I usually can’t get them back on the phone, or they’re mad. Or they said, F, you, or whatever.
337 00:27:40.820 ⇒ 00:27:49.070 Scott_Harmon: So so that means that that I set 75% likelihood, I lost them.
338 00:27:51.080 ⇒ 00:27:55.080 Scott_Harmon: and that cost me 600 bucks for each one, and.
339 00:27:55.080 ⇒ 00:27:58.219 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. So that’s that’s the thing that would be interesting to know is like, what
340 00:27:58.700 ⇒ 00:28:07.360 Uttam Kumaran: for? The non, yeah, like, what is the loss rate for the non 1st time. Resolution people that.
341 00:28:07.720 ⇒ 00:28:12.540 Scott_Harmon: It’s I’ve asked him before, right in in calls. I’ve said
342 00:28:13.110 ⇒ 00:28:17.850 Scott_Harmon: what what I basically said is, look, if you’re like everybody else, the callback rate is.
343 00:28:18.030 ⇒ 00:28:28.829 Scott_Harmon: it’s called a callback rate, meaning I can just call them back. And they answer their phone. I said, it’s probably pretty low. It’s my experience. It averages 25 to 30%. And they said, If you’re lucky, is what they.
344 00:28:30.480 ⇒ 00:28:35.450 Uttam Kumaran: So you really need to know, like, what is the churn rate for the folks that
345 00:28:35.600 ⇒ 00:28:42.419 Uttam Kumaran: don’t don’t get an S that don’t get resolved on the 1st call. I don’t. I don’t know whether they have that, but.
346 00:28:42.420 ⇒ 00:28:54.410 Scott_Harmon: Well, we can fill that in for him, though, right? Like, you could literally go. Okay, is your callback success rate 25%. Is that right? Yeah, that’ll be about right. Okay, fine. Well, now, you’ve you got the you got the math you need.
347 00:28:54.410 ⇒ 00:28:55.140 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, okay.
348 00:28:55.140 ⇒ 00:29:01.279 Scott_Harmon: Because because you just say, Look, if we never got a hold of them, they probably churned. That’s the
349 00:29:02.580 ⇒ 00:29:05.159 Scott_Harmon: slight leap of faith, but it’s a solid one.
350 00:29:05.160 ⇒ 00:29:05.910 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
351 00:29:05.910 ⇒ 00:29:12.250 Scott_Harmon: And you know, if they called with a complaint, and you never resolve the complaint, they’re probably going to churn. Right? So that’s the logic.
352 00:29:12.520 ⇒ 00:29:13.500 Scott_Harmon: And
353 00:29:13.820 ⇒ 00:29:19.200 Scott_Harmon: basically the the logic is, you better resolve it while you have them on the phone because they’re mad.
354 00:29:20.750 ⇒ 00:29:24.229 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. And 50% is 50% is horrible.
355 00:29:25.690 ⇒ 00:29:29.940 Scott_Harmon: It’s yeah. And exactly so so. And then the other side, the clients that are calling.
356 00:29:29.940 ⇒ 00:29:33.829 Uttam Kumaran: How do they let these guys? How do they let the customers off the phone like.
357 00:29:33.830 ⇒ 00:29:39.010 Uttam Kumaran: now you’re talk. See? Now, you’re getting it like what? 50% like
358 00:29:39.270 ⇒ 00:29:44.790 Uttam Kumaran: one out of 2 times, someone has to get a call back. And they’re like staring at like a dead possum or something.
359 00:29:44.790 ⇒ 00:29:47.730 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. So the people. So you’ll probably relate to this.
360 00:29:48.300 ⇒ 00:29:54.379 Scott_Harmon: The folks that learned this, and we used to work with them as a client was at, and T. Their their, you know, their mobile service.
361 00:29:54.380 ⇒ 00:29:55.090 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
362 00:29:55.090 ⇒ 00:30:04.329 Scott_Harmon: They finally, you know, duh, it took them like 8 years of data science to figure this out that when people call and complain about their bill. It’s too expensive. I’m going to switch
363 00:30:04.790 ⇒ 00:30:09.429 Scott_Harmon: that if you don’t get them into a new plan on the phone, they churn.
364 00:30:09.430 ⇒ 00:30:11.309 Uttam Kumaran: It’s gone. Yeah, yeah, it’s gone.
365 00:30:11.310 ⇒ 00:30:15.839 Scott_Harmon: Like 95% like they were like, Oh, my God, they’re gone, and it has to be.
366 00:30:15.990 ⇒ 00:30:23.580 Scott_Harmon: It has to be on this call. You can’t call them back next week and go. You know what? We’ve got a better plan for you. Blah blah! You got to tell them
367 00:30:24.330 ⇒ 00:30:26.900 Scott_Harmon: on the call where they’re calling to break up.
368 00:30:26.900 ⇒ 00:30:28.590 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, okay, we have an offer for you.
369 00:30:28.590 ⇒ 00:30:34.010 Scott_Harmon: And guess. So guess what everybody knows. If you call to threaten your cell phone, what do they do?
370 00:30:34.430 ⇒ 00:30:35.679 Uttam Kumaran: They’ll give you an offer. Yeah.
371 00:30:35.680 ⇒ 00:30:40.159 Scott_Harmon: They give you an offer because they know you’re going to leave. So it’s the same principle here.
372 00:30:40.300 ⇒ 00:30:41.380 Scott_Harmon: And
373 00:30:42.960 ⇒ 00:30:46.410 Scott_Harmon: And and saying the value of a retained customer is
374 00:30:46.850 ⇒ 00:30:53.950 Scott_Harmon: is, whatever the value of their their average customer is per year, right? It’ll be a little bit different for pest versus lawn, but
375 00:30:54.680 ⇒ 00:31:01.130 Scott_Harmon: you know you can ask them like, what’s the average contract value annual contract for past and lawn? They’ll tell you. They know that number.
376 00:31:01.360 ⇒ 00:31:04.590 Scott_Harmon: And so now you’ve got
377 00:31:05.740 ⇒ 00:31:14.549 Scott_Harmon: by focusing on 1st call resolution that you’re and you said it perfectly. If you let them get off the phone, you’re probably going to lose them, and they either churned
378 00:31:14.750 ⇒ 00:31:18.180 Scott_Harmon: or you didn’t get the upsell. Same economic pain exactly.
379 00:31:18.180 ⇒ 00:31:19.810 Uttam Kumaran: Economics. Yeah.
380 00:31:19.810 ⇒ 00:31:21.170 Scott_Harmon: Right, like like.
381 00:31:22.600 ⇒ 00:31:23.530 Uttam Kumaran: You know.
382 00:31:24.520 ⇒ 00:31:26.470 Scott_Harmon: You probably lost 600 bucks.
383 00:31:26.940 ⇒ 00:31:32.490 Scott_Harmon: and so, you know, if we make it go up by 30 or 40, or 50, or whatever the number is.
384 00:31:33.380 ⇒ 00:31:36.929 Scott_Harmon: just take it times 600 bucks. That’s an enormous amount of value.
385 00:31:37.370 ⇒ 00:31:43.190 Scott_Harmon: And so now I that that’s kind of why, I think that’s the best one, and I feel like
386 00:31:43.400 ⇒ 00:31:48.139 Scott_Harmon: our agent can have the most direct impact on that. If
387 00:31:48.440 ⇒ 00:31:49.729 Scott_Harmon: you know what I mean, like.
388 00:31:50.060 ⇒ 00:31:57.490 Uttam Kumaran: It’s actually not about the length of time. Average whole time, maybe, like another.
389 00:31:58.000 ⇒ 00:31:59.820 Scott_Harmon: Well, I wouldn’t care about.
390 00:31:59.820 ⇒ 00:32:08.310 Scott_Harmon: because if they get if they get po’d enough, you put them on hold, they hang up, and it becomes 1st call resolution, failure. So.
391 00:32:08.310 ⇒ 00:32:10.250 Uttam Kumaran: It ends up being a failure, anyways. Yeah.
392 00:32:10.560 ⇒ 00:32:15.360 Scott_Harmon: Yeah, if you like, basically statistically, if you let hold times, go up.
393 00:32:15.540 ⇒ 00:32:21.069 Scott_Harmon: then there’s what’s called the abandonment rate, meaning they hand up. They hang up on you. Well, you know, like.
394 00:32:21.710 ⇒ 00:32:22.880 Scott_Harmon: you know. But
395 00:32:23.240 ⇒ 00:32:27.600 Scott_Harmon: the reason the whole times are so long is because they’re just running around trying to get a question answered.
396 00:32:27.790 ⇒ 00:32:31.230 Scott_Harmon: and if the agent’s like right there, and goes.
397 00:32:31.230 ⇒ 00:32:32.090 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
398 00:32:32.090 ⇒ 00:32:35.070 Scott_Harmon: You know. Then you’ll have a dramatic
399 00:32:35.300 ⇒ 00:32:37.570 Scott_Harmon: sure hold. Times will go down. But the
400 00:32:37.690 ⇒ 00:32:45.589 Scott_Harmon: the most important thing is you won’t. You won’t have these abandonments, and your 1st call, your 1st call resolution, like, I would argue, we want 1st call resolution
401 00:32:46.170 ⇒ 00:32:51.289 Scott_Harmon: to be a hundred percent like if I if I was running that business
402 00:32:51.820 ⇒ 00:32:57.169 Scott_Harmon: I would go to a vet and say, Your job is, this, number’s a hundred percent, and if not, you’re fired.
403 00:32:57.610 ⇒ 00:32:58.160 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
404 00:32:59.590 ⇒ 00:33:01.809 Scott_Harmon: Because it’s such a clear economic.
405 00:33:02.480 ⇒ 00:33:11.449 Uttam Kumaran: And it’s not, it’s. And it’s also not like a resolution isn’t possible. For probably most of those cases there probably some stuff where it’s like, like you involve
406 00:33:11.710 ⇒ 00:33:14.310 Uttam Kumaran: people move, or something where you can’t.
407 00:33:15.125 ⇒ 00:33:16.540 Scott_Harmon: And that’s right, a hundred percent.
408 00:33:16.540 ⇒ 00:33:20.410 Uttam Kumaran: But that’s still a is that a resolution like there’s still a resolution there.
409 00:33:20.410 ⇒ 00:33:29.629 Scott_Harmon: It. It would be like like a successful resolution where the answer is no is a little, you know, that should probably be subtracted from your number. But do you offer?
410 00:33:30.090 ⇒ 00:33:38.440 Scott_Harmon: Do you spray for scorpions and Llano? No, okay, you know that was, quote unquote a successful call. It didn’t result in a sale. So you’re going to have to
411 00:33:39.220 ⇒ 00:33:41.249 Scott_Harmon: ultimately filter that out.
412 00:33:42.250 ⇒ 00:33:48.369 Scott_Harmon: But the vast majority of success equals either retained customer or new customer.
413 00:33:48.750 ⇒ 00:33:56.449 Scott_Harmon: and so I I would suggest we just try and keep it focused on on that. The.
414 00:33:56.850 ⇒ 00:34:00.590 Uttam Kumaran: So. Yeah, I guess. How do you see the oh, like the obtw.
415 00:34:00.590 ⇒ 00:34:00.950 Scott_Harmon: Well.
416 00:34:00.950 ⇒ 00:34:01.420 Uttam Kumaran: Part of that.
417 00:34:01.420 ⇒ 00:34:11.759 Scott_Harmon: I just don’t know. I mean, I was wanting you to do a more technical analysis with Miguel, or whomever like. I haven’t even seen how they write them. I don’t know that the agents is gonna be able to really help right away like.
418 00:34:11.760 ⇒ 00:34:12.409 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
419 00:34:12.739 ⇒ 00:34:13.469 Scott_Harmon: Like
420 00:34:14.469 ⇒ 00:34:19.269 Scott_Harmon: that was a new one like I last week was the 1st time I’d heard of that, and so
421 00:34:19.719 ⇒ 00:34:25.529 Scott_Harmon: the problem with it is. The agent now has to be smart enough to know
422 00:34:26.550 ⇒ 00:34:30.830 Scott_Harmon: to tell the assistant to do the oh, by the way, and and
423 00:34:33.880 ⇒ 00:34:39.130 Scott_Harmon: And I just don’t know whether or not our assistant, what that the that, the
424 00:34:39.590 ⇒ 00:34:42.239 Scott_Harmon: that, the way they document them is good enough
425 00:34:42.830 ⇒ 00:34:47.159 Scott_Harmon: for the assistant to be really good at suggesting them. You know what I mean like, how would it know.
426 00:34:48.989 ⇒ 00:34:53.289 Uttam Kumaran: It. It’s tough. Yeah, you you would. Well, even like, how would you?
427 00:34:54.429 ⇒ 00:35:02.829 Uttam Kumaran: even if you knew like, how? How would it intervene in the flow where the Csr would have to say, I want. I now want to upsell.
428 00:35:03.000 ⇒ 00:35:03.590 Scott_Harmon: Exactly.
429 00:35:03.590 ⇒ 00:35:04.160 Uttam Kumaran: Alright!
430 00:35:04.160 ⇒ 00:35:07.229 Scott_Harmon: But we I don’t think I don’t think we’ve really thought of the
431 00:35:07.570 ⇒ 00:35:10.820 Scott_Harmon: of the conversational dynamics in that way, like
432 00:35:11.060 ⇒ 00:35:16.870 Scott_Harmon: we’re thinking of the agent as being 100% responsive. Ask me a question. I’ll answer the
433 00:35:17.580 ⇒ 00:35:19.840 Scott_Harmon: to make it suggest things kind of
434 00:35:21.480 ⇒ 00:35:25.050 Scott_Harmon: just in the flow of a conversation that you didn’t ask about is
435 00:35:25.270 ⇒ 00:35:31.139 Scott_Harmon: certainly, you know we could do it later, but I’m not sure if you could do it in. The 1st version is kind of what I’m wondering.
436 00:35:31.420 ⇒ 00:35:32.120 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
437 00:35:34.400 ⇒ 00:35:36.659 Scott_Harmon: It’s it’s a great idea like.
438 00:35:36.960 ⇒ 00:35:40.490 Scott_Harmon: but maybe we should do it like as some kind of add on or something.
439 00:35:40.990 ⇒ 00:35:41.700 Scott_Harmon: But.
440 00:35:41.700 ⇒ 00:35:47.479 Uttam Kumaran: I mean you would. You would hope that as a like, as a impact to
441 00:35:48.110 ⇒ 00:35:55.509 Uttam Kumaran: like these problems getting solved, there is a larger opportunity for them to do this.
442 00:35:55.510 ⇒ 00:35:57.730 Scott_Harmon: Yes, absolutely.
443 00:35:58.010 ⇒ 00:36:03.349 Scott_Harmon: And I I think there’s a huge win there for us. Let me be clear. I just don’t know.
444 00:36:03.520 ⇒ 00:36:08.290 Scott_Harmon: technically, because obviously, you know I’m not in the middle of the of.
445 00:36:08.290 ⇒ 00:36:15.190 Uttam Kumaran: But also, even if we don’t, it’s we might as well like we could just say, Hey, solving! This leads to this change.
446 00:36:15.190 ⇒ 00:36:17.210 Scott_Harmon: It will, it absolutely will.
447 00:36:17.210 ⇒ 00:36:18.150 Uttam Kumaran: So.
448 00:36:18.150 ⇒ 00:36:18.880 Scott_Harmon: Great Point.
449 00:36:18.880 ⇒ 00:36:19.760 Uttam Kumaran: Why
450 00:36:19.900 ⇒ 00:36:42.640 Uttam Kumaran: I don’t need to explain to them how, if they solve the scorpion issue in 10 seconds, that they can spend the rest of the call being like, Hey, just wanted to let you know we have an off like, if you just get on the phone and you’re getting yet, like what? Okay? So let’s say, for the 50% that get. So for the for the 25%, or whatever they get a second call, and you get them on the phone. There’s no way you’re you’re upselling.
451 00:36:43.420 ⇒ 00:36:49.979 Scott_Harmon: Right. I think you’re. I think that I think we. You’re right in this 1st phase. We ought to probably not make this.
452 00:36:50.200 ⇒ 00:37:00.039 Uttam Kumaran: Too complicated but for for the for the folks that you do get on the call in the 1st 50%, if you’re getting yelled at. Then there’s no way you’re doing an upsell right.
453 00:37:00.300 ⇒ 00:37:00.830 Scott_Harmon: You’re like.
454 00:37:00.830 ⇒ 00:37:02.909 Uttam Kumaran: Like if it if it’s yeah. So.
455 00:37:02.910 ⇒ 00:37:04.130 Scott_Harmon: I think is perfect.
456 00:37:04.600 ⇒ 00:37:15.889 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, yeah, exactly so, so naturally. We should also explain that, hey? If you’re able to solve this in 10 seconds, that gives you more opportunity. And we should actually be able to see this in the data.
457 00:37:15.890 ⇒ 00:37:16.550 Scott_Harmon: Yep.
458 00:37:16.550 ⇒ 00:37:21.020 Uttam Kumaran: Without the direct attribution. And then, maybe, as part of another thing, we say.
459 00:37:21.020 ⇒ 00:37:21.580 Scott_Harmon: Yep.
460 00:37:21.580 ⇒ 00:37:26.750 Uttam Kumaran: If we’re able to boost that. Even more than that, it’s invited this more more aggressively.
461 00:37:26.750 ⇒ 00:37:28.429 Scott_Harmon: I think that’s exactly right.
462 00:37:28.580 ⇒ 00:37:35.269 Scott_Harmon: I think what you’ll find in some phase 2 is as part of the other agent, the one that
463 00:37:35.510 ⇒ 00:37:42.690 Scott_Harmon: creates the knowledge right? You’re going to have to get a little more context around each. Oh, by the way, where?
464 00:37:42.860 ⇒ 00:37:45.680 Scott_Harmon: What kind of clients does this pertain? To what?
465 00:37:45.960 ⇒ 00:37:49.069 Scott_Harmon: What other circumstances have to be true for this to be.
466 00:37:49.320 ⇒ 00:37:55.950 Scott_Harmon: you know, a good offer, right? You need a bunch of additional knowledge when you put the data in which I’m guessing they probably don’t have.
467 00:37:56.390 ⇒ 00:38:05.189 Scott_Harmon: And then what you eventually add on these Csr agents is you add what’s called? It’s not very fancy terminology. It’s called a closeout script.
468 00:38:06.524 ⇒ 00:38:07.099 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
469 00:38:07.100 ⇒ 00:38:10.019 Scott_Harmon: So you know how you get to the part of the call where the calls are ready.
470 00:38:10.020 ⇒ 00:38:10.680 Uttam Kumaran: Survey.
471 00:38:10.680 ⇒ 00:38:17.690 Scott_Harmon: Say, Well, Tom, have I have I satisfied your problem? Is there any you know they ask? This gets they’re they’re real laborious, and yes.
472 00:38:17.880 ⇒ 00:38:22.719 Scott_Harmon: Well, those that they’re running a what’s called a closeout script. So there’s stuff in the screen in front of them
473 00:38:23.050 ⇒ 00:38:28.150 Scott_Harmon: that says on every call before you hang up. You have to ask these 5 questions, and
474 00:38:28.610 ⇒ 00:38:31.980 Scott_Harmon: but normally they’re just. They’re just stupid, right? And
475 00:38:32.570 ⇒ 00:38:37.529 Scott_Harmon: eventually we’ll want to close out script part of the agent that says, Okay.
476 00:38:38.060 ⇒ 00:38:40.180 Scott_Harmon: have I helped you? Yes, okay.
477 00:38:40.490 ⇒ 00:38:47.569 Scott_Harmon: you know. Do you want to hear more about this? Like you? It’s the it’s the literal kind of follow up after you’ve resolved the 1st issue.
478 00:38:48.040 ⇒ 00:38:51.649 Scott_Harmon: But I think we’d have to program our assistant to know to do that.
479 00:38:52.160 ⇒ 00:38:58.389 Scott_Harmon: Yeah, it’s easy to do. We’ll do it later. You know, it’s just a suit. It’s just additional behavior
480 00:38:59.040 ⇒ 00:39:04.779 Scott_Harmon: that you have to, you know, program the agent to do
481 00:39:05.130 ⇒ 00:39:07.030 Scott_Harmon: right now. Our agent won’t have it.
482 00:39:07.210 ⇒ 00:39:07.870 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
483 00:39:12.110 ⇒ 00:39:29.400 Uttam Kumaran: So in terms of so one thing I we need to know from them. And I can like, I’ll I’ll summarize and maybe see if we can talk to Matt and get a little bit of a sense of like what these figures are. But I guess we should talk about like how we want to do the
484 00:39:31.650 ⇒ 00:39:33.139 Uttam Kumaran: the pricing like.
485 00:39:34.780 ⇒ 00:39:38.710 Scott_Harmon: What I would do is I would do a lot.
486 00:39:39.065 ⇒ 00:39:40.130 Uttam Kumaran: Get that first.st
487 00:39:40.320 ⇒ 00:39:43.170 Scott_Harmon: I? Well, you know how we got that great email from Ray.
488 00:39:43.170 ⇒ 00:39:43.880 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
489 00:39:43.880 ⇒ 00:39:49.090 Scott_Harmon: And he said, the value of a customer is 120 bucks, or whatever I forgot what it was, whatever it was.
490 00:39:49.450 ⇒ 00:39:53.090 Scott_Harmon: You know we is. It was that 120 that he made, or.
491 00:39:53.090 ⇒ 00:39:54.259 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. Gross profit.
492 00:39:54.260 ⇒ 00:39:57.930 Scott_Harmon: Okay. So I think from Steven and Steven’s the guy that’ll know
493 00:39:58.310 ⇒ 00:40:13.019 Scott_Harmon: and say, and which service are we starting with Pat? Whatever is it past or long? Okay, so say, look for past. What’s the average annual contract value for past? And he’ll know he’ll know, like, right off the top of. I’d be shocked if he didn’t know the answer.
494 00:40:13.390 ⇒ 00:40:16.599 Scott_Harmon: And and then we can back, build
495 00:40:16.720 ⇒ 00:40:23.120 Scott_Harmon: the little equation right? And then kind of go back and go. Okay, here’s our 1st thought for a quarterly.
496 00:40:23.280 ⇒ 00:40:30.190 Scott_Harmon: our quarterly financial payment stream is going to. We want to start with
497 00:40:31.800 ⇒ 00:40:35.309 Scott_Harmon: with Fcr, and we have these assumptions around.
498 00:40:35.630 ⇒ 00:40:40.490 Scott_Harmon: 1st call is resolved, which is going to, you know, be a function of how much
499 00:40:41.220 ⇒ 00:40:43.270 Scott_Harmon: either a retained or a new
500 00:40:44.320 ⇒ 00:40:48.470 Scott_Harmon: past client. That sounds funny. Past client is
501 00:40:48.700 ⇒ 00:40:49.959 Scott_Harmon: you know what I mean and like.
502 00:40:49.960 ⇒ 00:40:50.650 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
503 00:40:51.000 ⇒ 00:40:56.839 Scott_Harmon: And it it. When you do it that way, it just it like becomes a no brainer like well.
504 00:40:57.140 ⇒ 00:40:58.020 Scott_Harmon: sure.
505 00:40:58.020 ⇒ 00:40:59.000 Uttam Kumaran: Brainer, yeah.
506 00:40:59.000 ⇒ 00:41:03.210 Scott_Harmon: Like you only. And I thought that you could even do that table that same table like.
507 00:41:03.350 ⇒ 00:41:07.129 Scott_Harmon: Okay, for the 1st 50 incremental customers
508 00:41:07.430 ⇒ 00:41:13.427 Scott_Harmon: you pay us? I forgot we did 60%, you know, of of a new customer contract,
509 00:41:16.100 ⇒ 00:41:19.189 Scott_Harmon: you know. So on and so forth. And then for the next, you know.
510 00:41:19.190 ⇒ 00:41:28.699 Uttam Kumaran: Then it’s not. It’s not only that it’s like the lifetime value. It’s like we would. I mean, I I feel like whatever we even throw out, we’ll probably gonna under charge.
511 00:41:29.080 ⇒ 00:41:41.870 Uttam Kumaran: and which is great for them, because it’s not only the fact that you retain the 600, you also potentially retain the opportunity to do upsells for the lifetime of that customer.
512 00:41:41.870 ⇒ 00:41:43.880 Scott_Harmon: That’s exactly. That’s exactly.
513 00:41:43.880 ⇒ 00:41:51.629 Uttam Kumaran: And really be like, if I was being honest, we should. I should get a piece of the how much they spend forever on you guys.
514 00:41:51.630 ⇒ 00:41:54.469 Scott_Harmon: No, no, that’s exactly right, but you will be right. You will
515 00:41:54.470 ⇒ 00:41:56.880 Scott_Harmon: be because some of those customers will.
516 00:41:57.130 ⇒ 00:42:00.440 Scott_Harmon: ie. Not churn right like when they you’ll you’ll
517 00:42:00.570 ⇒ 00:42:06.069 Scott_Harmon: let’s say I’m a client, and I call every year with a complaint about past, and you solve my problem, and I don’t churn.
518 00:42:06.070 ⇒ 00:42:08.209 Uttam Kumaran: Oh, I see, I see. So we will get, yeah.
519 00:42:08.210 ⇒ 00:42:11.900 Scott_Harmon: You’ll you’ll get money from the same client multiple times.
520 00:42:13.860 ⇒ 00:42:17.959 Scott_Harmon: You know. And here’s here’s the overarching thing
521 00:42:18.130 ⇒ 00:42:20.210 Scott_Harmon: that I like about this approach.
522 00:42:20.450 ⇒ 00:42:26.480 Scott_Harmon: If you just generally speaking, there’s a ton of call center metrics, or
523 00:42:27.040 ⇒ 00:42:32.270 Scott_Harmon: can be really hard to make money on, because everybody gets lost in the data, and they don’t know what
524 00:42:32.960 ⇒ 00:42:35.090 Scott_Harmon: the value of the numbers means.
525 00:42:35.090 ⇒ 00:42:35.860 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
526 00:42:35.860 ⇒ 00:42:41.390 Scott_Harmon: If you can be associated with revenue events which is either
527 00:42:41.570 ⇒ 00:42:49.580 Scott_Harmon: keeping somebody from churning, or or cross, selling, or upselling, or winning a new client. Those companies tend to be wildly successful.
528 00:42:50.270 ⇒ 00:42:56.070 Scott_Harmon: and that’s just a very general rule, like, when we started making all our money at at and T.
529 00:42:56.370 ⇒ 00:43:03.039 Scott_Harmon: It was when we were able to to get tied to a reduction in churn.
530 00:43:03.180 ⇒ 00:43:06.760 Scott_Harmon: because churn is like just right off the bottom line.
531 00:43:06.760 ⇒ 00:43:07.380 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
532 00:43:07.870 ⇒ 00:43:10.850 Scott_Harmon: And they’re like, Hey, no problem like we made
533 00:43:11.630 ⇒ 00:43:17.470 Scott_Harmon: at our height. We were making 50 cents for every client call. We resolved that didn’t churn like it.
534 00:43:18.330 ⇒ 00:43:18.980 Uttam Kumaran: Nice.
535 00:43:18.980 ⇒ 00:43:23.940 Scott_Harmon: We made 8 million bucks one year alone from at, and T like it was crazy how much they’ll pay you?
536 00:43:25.640 ⇒ 00:43:36.109 Uttam Kumaran: And this. But this, this category we really haven’t even talked about, which is, and I guess I’d be. Maybe I would I could put this in the email to Steven, too, which is like.
537 00:43:36.450 ⇒ 00:43:40.930 Uttam Kumaran: are these like, if these are more like sale like, is this a.
538 00:43:40.930 ⇒ 00:43:52.159 Scott_Harmon: They are sales. They’re literally sales. This is the part I didn’t understand. I think the majority of calls they’re getting. You should ask for the breakdown. Between these 3 buckets.
539 00:43:52.160 ⇒ 00:43:52.800 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
540 00:43:52.800 ⇒ 00:43:56.100 Scott_Harmon: For a lot of the services. The top of the sales funnel.
541 00:43:57.240 ⇒ 00:44:01.500 Scott_Harmon: The start of the sales process is with inbound calls to the Csrs.
542 00:44:02.760 ⇒ 00:44:09.120 Scott_Harmon: They’re literally they’re literally Bdrs, if you know, we call them Bdrs in our world.
543 00:44:09.450 ⇒ 00:44:10.240 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
544 00:44:10.560 ⇒ 00:44:15.089 Scott_Harmon: And their their job is to go, set up an appointment
545 00:44:15.590 ⇒ 00:44:19.409 Scott_Harmon: with an inspector who will come to your house, and and then
546 00:44:20.000 ⇒ 00:44:22.620 Scott_Harmon: believe it or not, which I kind of found wild.
547 00:44:24.010 ⇒ 00:44:30.600 Scott_Harmon: Then they call the the Csr. Back after the inspection and say, Yeah, I want to go ahead and sign up.
548 00:44:30.840 ⇒ 00:44:34.739 Scott_Harmon: So half half of the work they’re doing is closing new cells.
549 00:44:46.320 ⇒ 00:44:48.719 Uttam Kumaran: So I mean this. Well, we haven’t done any the agent.
550 00:44:49.150 ⇒ 00:44:52.860 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, unless there’s questions about services.
551 00:44:52.860 ⇒ 00:44:57.139 Scott_Harmon: Well, that’s the services thing is problematic. Right? So that’s why that spreadsheet from hell and the.
552 00:44:57.140 ⇒ 00:44:58.200 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
553 00:44:58.200 ⇒ 00:45:03.589 Scott_Harmon: I focus so much on it is because if I, if it takes me 12 or 15 min to figure out.
554 00:45:03.590 ⇒ 00:45:04.250 Uttam Kumaran: Totally.
555 00:45:04.250 ⇒ 00:45:12.429 Scott_Harmon: If that service is available in your Zip code, and Bob’s not on vacation, and all that nonsense, and I hang up. I just lost a sale.
556 00:45:13.200 ⇒ 00:45:14.050 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
557 00:45:14.330 ⇒ 00:45:17.819 Scott_Harmon: And so that’s why that spreadsheet, you know, was so critical in the
558 00:45:19.300 ⇒ 00:45:27.379 Uttam Kumaran: And the nice thing is Fcr sort of spans both. I guess the question for Steven will be, does he? Wanna does he like?
559 00:45:28.100 ⇒ 00:45:30.749 Uttam Kumaran: Will we consider this across all calls.
560 00:45:30.750 ⇒ 00:45:40.439 Scott_Harmon: We absolutely should. Yeah, like, like, I think that the majority of calls coming in, we can argue credibly.
561 00:45:41.270 ⇒ 00:45:44.169 Scott_Harmon: are either retention or a new booking.
562 00:45:47.620 ⇒ 00:45:49.210 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, this is great. Okay.
563 00:45:49.410 ⇒ 00:45:50.340 Scott_Harmon: It’s money.
564 00:45:51.075 ⇒ 00:45:51.510 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
565 00:45:56.090 ⇒ 00:45:59.100 Uttam Kumaran: okay, so let me ask them. And then, oh, my last question was.
566 00:45:59.770 ⇒ 00:46:01.229 Scott_Harmon: I guess I wanna.
567 00:46:01.700 ⇒ 00:46:09.110 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, I I wanna get this sort of deployed with their 2 folks this week and sort of move forward. But we need to have a conversation with them about
568 00:46:09.370 ⇒ 00:46:13.149 Uttam Kumaran: moving this across to other departments, as well.
569 00:46:15.290 ⇒ 00:46:19.649 Uttam Kumaran: We didn’t sort of give them a sense of like. I mean, I know we focused on pests.
570 00:46:20.130 ⇒ 00:46:21.170 Scott_Harmon: I guess.
571 00:46:21.410 ⇒ 00:46:22.479 Uttam Kumaran: We can.
572 00:46:22.742 ⇒ 00:46:23.790 Scott_Harmon: That’s a good point.
573 00:46:24.000 ⇒ 00:46:26.579 Uttam Kumaran: I guess I’m I mean, I don’t know. I’m I
574 00:46:26.820 ⇒ 00:46:35.869 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, the agent won’t work for the other things until we have the data. I guess we could. I could I may. I may bring it up to like, hey? To scale this to other departments. We have.
575 00:46:36.010 ⇒ 00:46:41.359 Scott_Harmon: I’d put a flat fee in. There I go, I mean, I’m just making up a number. But I would say, Look.
576 00:46:42.320 ⇒ 00:46:46.510 Scott_Harmon: we were doing this for past, you know, once once
577 00:46:47.010 ⇒ 00:46:52.309 Scott_Harmon: it’s installed, we have this quarterly success fee that you’ll pay us based on
578 00:46:52.700 ⇒ 00:47:00.239 Scott_Harmon: primarily 1st call resolution great. That’s for all the pest related calls, and when you want us to do another service well, there’s just a 1 time
579 00:47:01.170 ⇒ 00:47:07.039 Scott_Harmon: $5,000 fee to make it up to to take all your get. Get your content.
580 00:47:07.550 ⇒ 00:47:10.889 Scott_Harmon: you know. Put into the system properly and cleaned up, Yada Yada.
581 00:47:11.080 ⇒ 00:47:13.139 Scott_Harmon: but once you’ve paid that, then.
582 00:47:13.660 ⇒ 00:47:20.220 Scott_Harmon: now you’ve got lawn. And yeah, then then that that quarterly features on for lawn, right? So
583 00:47:20.730 ⇒ 00:47:22.270 Scott_Harmon: I don’t know how else I
584 00:47:23.440 ⇒ 00:47:27.030 Scott_Harmon: do it because you’re gonna you know, you’re gonna have some late.
585 00:47:27.030 ⇒ 00:47:33.809 Uttam Kumaran: No, I think that’s it. That’s gotta be it, yeah. And then. And they now know the amount of work that went into this.
586 00:47:34.290 ⇒ 00:47:34.710 Scott_Harmon: Yeah.
587 00:47:36.520 ⇒ 00:47:40.169 Scott_Harmon: And I think we say, look, we learned a lot on the 1st one. So it’s not as high.
588 00:47:40.580 ⇒ 00:47:41.440 Scott_Harmon: right? And.
589 00:47:41.440 ⇒ 00:47:41.940 Uttam Kumaran: Yes.
590 00:47:41.940 ⇒ 00:47:50.260 Scott_Harmon: Some of the work that your team did to create the agent do. The program and stuff is is leverageable to the other services. But a lot of it’s just content engineering. And
591 00:47:50.420 ⇒ 00:47:56.039 Scott_Harmon: and you know, ingesting their documents and blah blah, and that that’s
592 00:47:56.770 ⇒ 00:47:59.450 Scott_Harmon: that’s incremental cost for every new service.
593 00:47:59.800 ⇒ 00:48:06.940 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. And I, I basically want to wrap all of this up into the next contract and sort of.
594 00:48:06.940 ⇒ 00:48:09.890 Scott_Harmon: I get it. Okay, that makes sense to me. So
595 00:48:10.010 ⇒ 00:48:13.219 Scott_Harmon: all it says is the 1st contract, was the proof of concept contract.
596 00:48:13.220 ⇒ 00:48:13.860 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
597 00:48:14.600 ⇒ 00:48:19.239 Scott_Harmon: And it was one time Fee, and we got one proof concept for one service.
598 00:48:19.860 ⇒ 00:48:24.129 Scott_Harmon: But you really can’t deploy it. It’s not a deployable thing. It’s to prove the concept.
599 00:48:24.330 ⇒ 00:48:25.030 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
600 00:48:25.030 ⇒ 00:48:27.769 Scott_Harmon: The the second contract is going to be
601 00:48:28.100 ⇒ 00:48:30.519 Scott_Harmon: okay. You can now start to use it.
602 00:48:31.810 ⇒ 00:48:36.260 Scott_Harmon: and that’s going to be this quarterly success fee for for pest.
603 00:48:37.070 ⇒ 00:48:46.709 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah. And I’m I’m also make it very clear that, like the success we’re maintain, like, there’s maintenance there is like updating it like, it’s not purely profit for us.
604 00:48:46.710 ⇒ 00:48:50.850 Scott_Harmon: Absolutely right like. Look, our ongoing costs are covered in our success. Fee.
605 00:48:51.030 ⇒ 00:48:51.830 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
606 00:48:52.000 ⇒ 00:48:55.570 Scott_Harmon: And you’re going to have to put language in there that says, Well.
607 00:48:55.920 ⇒ 00:49:01.799 Scott_Harmon: if you have certain requests, they may fall outside the boundaries and require you to quote that separately, like
608 00:49:03.080 ⇒ 00:49:05.530 Scott_Harmon: they’re just going to come with you to you with like.
609 00:49:05.700 ⇒ 00:49:10.260 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, we wanna yeah, we need a new system. I guess. I guess that I’ll have to.
610 00:49:10.990 ⇒ 00:49:16.460 Scott_Harmon: Yeah, the trick you’re gonna have to deal with is, are you willing to cover the cost of like the
611 00:49:17.160 ⇒ 00:49:20.169 Scott_Harmon: like? The integration with evolve and dream.
612 00:49:20.340 ⇒ 00:49:21.020 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
613 00:49:21.350 ⇒ 00:49:26.259 Scott_Harmon: Out of a success fee like, because you’re gonna have to do that for this thing to really.
614 00:49:26.880 ⇒ 00:49:27.660 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
615 00:49:28.030 ⇒ 00:49:31.690 Scott_Harmon: Like, how do you? How do you want to get paid for that.
616 00:49:32.580 ⇒ 00:49:34.459 Uttam Kumaran: I guess I would need to like.
617 00:49:35.170 ⇒ 00:49:37.329 Uttam Kumaran: Did they send us the call numbers.
618 00:49:39.530 ⇒ 00:49:41.540 Scott_Harmon: How many calls they take a week.
619 00:49:41.540 ⇒ 00:49:42.540 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
620 00:49:42.540 ⇒ 00:49:44.419 Scott_Harmon: I’m not sure I’ve seen those. No.
621 00:49:45.060 ⇒ 00:49:49.829 Uttam Kumaran: So that’s another thing. I want to get the total I have to look. I I feel like I got.
622 00:49:50.440 ⇒ 00:49:54.430 Uttam Kumaran: I’m not sure if I did get this, but I feel like I got a
623 00:49:55.000 ⇒ 00:50:01.589 Uttam Kumaran: a volume spreadsheet where they did some report. But let me ask also total number of calls.
624 00:50:05.440 ⇒ 00:50:06.760 Uttam Kumaran: probably asking that for that.
625 00:50:06.760 ⇒ 00:50:17.620 Scott_Harmon: Yeah, what I think, what you’re what you’re asking for here to summarize is what I’ll call a top level call breakdown right? Which is what it sounds like. Here’s how many calls we take on average per week.
626 00:50:17.760 ⇒ 00:50:25.659 Scott_Harmon: Those calls break down into the following 2 or 3 buckets. The buckets I suggested right there complaints of existing customers versus.
627 00:50:25.930 ⇒ 00:50:31.140 Scott_Harmon: you know, new new service opportunities, that kind of thing like break them down into the the major buckets.
628 00:50:31.510 ⇒ 00:50:34.810 Scott_Harmon: and then from there, you know, you’ll have the top level
629 00:50:35.220 ⇒ 00:50:37.829 Scott_Harmon: baseline that you need, and then.
630 00:50:40.340 ⇒ 00:50:45.440 Uttam Kumaran: I mean, yeah, I guess I I mean, I would love to bake it all into the success fee
631 00:50:46.770 ⇒ 00:50:49.870 Uttam Kumaran: cause. Then we just don’t have the conversation, but
632 00:50:50.800 ⇒ 00:50:54.969 Uttam Kumaran: I would have to think, or maybe I’ll have to brainstorm a little bit on what could possibly
633 00:50:55.440 ⇒ 00:50:56.909 Uttam Kumaran: go beyond that.
634 00:51:00.060 ⇒ 00:51:01.639 Uttam Kumaran: It just I don’t know.
635 00:51:01.840 ⇒ 00:51:02.620 Uttam Kumaran: It’s purely.
636 00:51:02.620 ⇒ 00:51:05.360 Scott_Harmon: Technical. I just don’t know how much work it’s gonna take.
637 00:51:06.230 ⇒ 00:51:10.009 Scott_Harmon: you know, one of your team members to to do that. I mean, I feel like
638 00:51:10.390 ⇒ 00:51:14.140 Scott_Harmon: eventually, you’re gonna wanna, you know, be able to do it and get good at it like.
639 00:51:14.140 ⇒ 00:51:21.290 Uttam Kumaran: It’s it’s it’s yeah. It’s more of like if the if, if what we’re expecting to get quarterly is high enough.
640 00:51:21.460 ⇒ 00:51:25.799 Uttam Kumaran: That gives me a little bit of like. Okay, we’ll eat it if it comes.
641 00:51:25.960 ⇒ 00:51:29.779 Scott_Harmon: Well that, or if they ask you to do another service, you get us some of out of that.
642 00:51:29.780 ⇒ 00:51:31.640 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, exactly. So.
643 00:51:33.060 ⇒ 00:51:44.199 Uttam Kumaran: And we’re not gonna get it. I’m not gonna get it 100 like, we’re not gonna get it right. Maybe 100 on this one. But I think the other thing. So let me get this stuff. Just let me ask this from Steven, and then
644 00:51:44.310 ⇒ 00:51:47.220 Uttam Kumaran: I’ll maybe in parallel to I can.
645 00:51:47.440 ⇒ 00:51:48.400 Uttam Kumaran: I can.
646 00:51:48.580 ⇒ 00:51:50.420 Uttam Kumaran: I just want to get the ball rolling.
647 00:51:50.650 ⇒ 00:51:52.030 Scott_Harmon: Yeah, yeah, if you.
648 00:51:52.030 ⇒ 00:51:52.950 Uttam Kumaran: Well after.
649 00:51:52.950 ⇒ 00:51:54.560 Scott_Harmon: Send me the draft of your email.
650 00:51:54.880 ⇒ 00:51:55.200 Uttam Kumaran: Okay.
651 00:51:55.440 ⇒ 00:51:58.009 Scott_Harmon: I talk call center language so naturally. And
652 00:51:58.120 ⇒ 00:52:03.429 Scott_Harmon: and I can just make sure. Okay phrase that, you know just rephrasing something. In a way. I think Steven will get it.
653 00:52:04.370 ⇒ 00:52:10.099 Uttam Kumaran: And I’ll I’ll get the volume numbers from you that, too, in parallel, and I’ll build out the scenario.
654 00:52:11.040 ⇒ 00:52:21.399 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah, I I like that. We arrived at Fcr. And I will. I’ll sort of make it clear that like kind of what we went through which is like, look, you have these other metrics, but all of these
655 00:52:21.690 ⇒ 00:52:27.519 Uttam Kumaran: can, or somewhat, or or very meaningfully, affected by Fcr. They are.
656 00:52:27.520 ⇒ 00:52:28.380 Scott_Harmon: That that’s exactly.
657 00:52:28.380 ⇒ 00:52:32.219 Uttam Kumaran: In fact, the fact that you have a whole time at all is is sort of like.
658 00:52:32.830 ⇒ 00:52:39.390 Uttam Kumaran: it’s sort of a measurement of something down like, it’s a derivative measurement. So yeah, that’s what.
659 00:52:39.390 ⇒ 00:52:52.600 Scott_Harmon: Said another way. If we would argue, if you were just doing a normal analytics dashboard, we would argue that Fcr is the the critical success factor. There are metrics that would contribute to that underneath.
660 00:52:53.360 ⇒ 00:52:57.629 Scott_Harmon: like, you know, whole times and all that kind of stuff. But the one you want to track
661 00:52:58.120 ⇒ 00:53:01.940 Scott_Harmon: that impacts your business is Fcr.
662 00:53:02.180 ⇒ 00:53:02.730 Uttam Kumaran: Yeah.
663 00:53:05.620 ⇒ 00:53:10.320 Uttam Kumaran: And then I’ll yeah, I’ll ask a couple of these. Follow up questions. And I’ll obviously say, Yeah, we’re
664 00:53:10.940 ⇒ 00:53:17.289 Uttam Kumaran: we are hoping to assign this on ongoing, ongoing, quarterly success. And then for every additional
665 00:53:17.590 ⇒ 00:53:25.560 Uttam Kumaran: for every additional division we have a, we’re gonna work towards a flat fee model. And
666 00:53:26.300 ⇒ 00:53:34.749 Uttam Kumaran: yeah, I think let’s see if I can. And then I Yeah, I don’t. I don’t know if we’ll say this or not. But I would like this. I would like to be able to have those
667 00:53:34.920 ⇒ 00:53:44.299 Uttam Kumaran: the end fees just get covered. I mean, we could do it 2 ways. We could set something higher, and then, if they don’t go budge, we could say, Hey, we slower. But then
668 00:53:44.410 ⇒ 00:53:49.450 Uttam Kumaran: we we will need some sort of retainer for additional improvements. I don’t know like there’s probably way.
669 00:53:49.450 ⇒ 00:53:53.439 Scott_Harmon: Well, I like, I think, in principle, if if the success fees.
670 00:53:54.020 ⇒ 00:53:55.589 Uttam Kumaran: I would like the success fee to.
671 00:53:55.590 ⇒ 00:53:56.600 Scott_Harmon: Cover it, because.
672 00:53:56.600 ⇒ 00:53:58.119 Uttam Kumaran: Feel pretty good about that, but.
673 00:53:58.120 ⇒ 00:54:01.909 Scott_Harmon: Those should be one time engineering fees like once you’ve built.
674 00:54:02.730 ⇒ 00:54:06.039 Scott_Harmon: You know the Api scraper, or whatever it’s called right for
675 00:54:06.460 ⇒ 00:54:08.720 Scott_Harmon: in theory, that’s kind of done. And
676 00:54:09.420 ⇒ 00:54:12.650 Scott_Harmon: and now you can just it’s a tool in your toolbox, and you can just.
677 00:54:12.650 ⇒ 00:54:17.580 Uttam Kumaran: I also don’t want to be limit. I mean, what I’m gonna tell them is like, I want us to constantly making improvement like.
678 00:54:17.970 ⇒ 00:54:22.500 Uttam Kumaran: I want to just keep improving this over time, making cheaper, cheaper, faster to run.
679 00:54:22.900 ⇒ 00:54:23.980 Uttam Kumaran: And
680 00:54:24.980 ⇒ 00:54:34.050 Uttam Kumaran: yeah, I just want to pass that on and like, make those improvements without having to to renegotiate every time. So that’s for me one of the key things.
681 00:54:35.380 ⇒ 00:54:35.970 Scott_Harmon: Yep.
682 00:54:37.550 ⇒ 00:54:48.509 Scott_Harmon: okay. But well, I think that was productive, and I’m glad we glad we worked through it. Hope it helped. And if you wanna just draft it and send it to me. I’ll give you whatever feedback, and we’ll get it over to them. I think this will work for them.
683 00:54:49.630 ⇒ 00:54:50.670 Uttam Kumaran: Okay, definitely.
684 00:54:51.010 ⇒ 00:54:51.889 Scott_Harmon: Okay. Man.
685 00:54:51.890 ⇒ 00:54:55.539 Scott_Harmon: Okay. Thanks. Scott. Bye.