Meeting Title: Edge Visibility and Insomnia Proposal Sync Date: 2025-12-09 Meeting participants: Robert Tseng, Zoran Selinger
WEBVTT
1 00:00:49.130 ⇒ 00:00:50.140 Robert Tseng: Hey, Zaron.
2 00:00:50.140 ⇒ 00:00:50.770 Zoran Selinger: Hi.
3 00:00:53.210 ⇒ 00:00:54.140 Robert Tseng: How’s it going?
4 00:00:55.020 ⇒ 00:01:00.310 Zoran Selinger: Yeah, just, trying to make a case for… for Edge,
5 00:01:00.710 ⇒ 00:01:03.870 Zoran Selinger: I don’t know if you saw my comments on the ticket.
6 00:01:04.489 ⇒ 00:01:10.439 Robert Tseng: Not yet, but if you think that’s a good place to start, we can go to that.
7 00:01:10.440 ⇒ 00:01:12.080 Zoran Selinger: Yeah, I think it’s… it’s good.
8 00:01:12.580 ⇒ 00:01:14.100 Robert Tseng: Oh, Monty.
9 00:01:14.100 ⇒ 00:01:19.769 Zoran Selinger: Month to date, 17% more visibility than the Pixel.
10 00:01:19.920 ⇒ 00:01:23.139 Zoran Selinger: So this is specifically segment events.
11 00:01:24.880 ⇒ 00:01:26.430 Zoran Selinger: So, see the table?
12 00:01:28.160 ⇒ 00:01:32.229 Zoran Selinger: So that’s a case for, you know, edge visibility.
13 00:01:32.350 ⇒ 00:01:38.760 Zoran Selinger: Right now, I’m trying to also show a nice
14 00:01:39.530 ⇒ 00:01:42.230 Zoran Selinger: A nice, kind of, golden case.
15 00:01:43.130 ⇒ 00:01:44.150 Zoran Selinger: for…
16 00:01:44.580 ⇒ 00:01:55.539 Zoran Selinger: For tracking, where I want to show how we stitched a person using Edge, where, for example, segment anonymous ID was changed.
17 00:01:56.120 ⇒ 00:02:00.880 Zoran Selinger: But our session ID stayed the same, so we know that it’s the same person.
18 00:02:01.210 ⇒ 00:02:08.340 Zoran Selinger: I also want to make that case. Just searching for a transaction ID where I can see something like that.
19 00:02:08.600 ⇒ 00:02:09.739 Zoran Selinger: At the moment.
20 00:02:10.639 ⇒ 00:02:12.790 Zoran Selinger: Kind of a golden case.
21 00:02:13.290 ⇒ 00:02:19.160 Zoran Selinger: Where we can demonstrate how we would lose visibility without the edge.
22 00:02:19.380 ⇒ 00:02:24.119 Zoran Selinger: Where a person would be reported as a… as a separate person.
23 00:02:24.390 ⇒ 00:02:31.389 Zoran Selinger: And we would lose, basically, the original session, and…
24 00:02:31.650 ⇒ 00:02:35.089 Zoran Selinger: And everything else. So, just trying to make that case.
25 00:02:36.510 ⇒ 00:02:37.800 Robert Tseng: Okay.
26 00:02:38.710 ⇒ 00:02:54.830 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think all of this stuff is totally, like, gonna be reusable. So, I mean, just to kind of… small tangent, but for Insomnia, our scope didn’t get approved. They were just like, oh, I think this is too much, like, this is more than what we were asking for, which is kind of like, well, that just… yeah, this tells me, like.
27 00:02:54.830 ⇒ 00:02:57.270 Zoran Selinger: That’s exactly what they, what they said in…
28 00:02:57.270 ⇒ 00:02:57.630 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
29 00:02:58.520 ⇒ 00:03:03.169 Robert Tseng: If it’s anything less than this, you don’t know what you’re… you don’t know what you’re looking for, which is.
30 00:03:03.170 ⇒ 00:03:14.470 Zoran Selinger: Yeah, but also, you literally took the recording and transcribed it, and basically made it directly from their words.
31 00:03:14.470 ⇒ 00:03:15.120 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
32 00:03:15.460 ⇒ 00:03:16.470 Zoran Selinger: Mehta Shmi.
33 00:03:17.490 ⇒ 00:03:19.419 Zoran Selinger: Nesanimo menemo gustado.
34 00:03:22.210 ⇒ 00:03:28.000 Zoran Selinger: Okay, maybe that gets turned around. They said, are they gonna look elsewhere?
35 00:03:29.010 ⇒ 00:03:36.159 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I mean, they… they… they think that they can find something for less, but I, I, I think my…
36 00:03:36.350 ⇒ 00:03:46.079 Robert Tseng: I’m going one level above her. I’m going… I’m gonna basically send our proposal to the CEO, but, like, I would like to also acknowledge that, like, hey.
37 00:03:46.570 ⇒ 00:04:01.799 Robert Tseng: I… we sent this to, you know, I’ve sent this to your direct report, and she thinks this is too much. Let me tell you why this is not too much, like, so I want to, like, send him a follow-up. So, I won’t say it’s a lost cause yet, I’m just telling you, like, this is… that’s kind of where things are at.
38 00:04:01.800 ⇒ 00:04:07.750 Robert Tseng: But yeah, I think… so with what you’re… with Mitesh, like, I think to me, this is, like, we’re…
39 00:04:07.970 ⇒ 00:04:14.590 Robert Tseng: we’re… we’re, like, figuring out, like… I mean, it’s just… I don’t think people have, like, a paradigm for, like, what…
40 00:04:14.810 ⇒ 00:04:26.620 Robert Tseng: good looks like here. And, and I think that’s why it’s hard for him to, like, have confidence in things, and so it’s totally not a knock on our work. Like, I think we just… this is part of the…
41 00:04:26.690 ⇒ 00:04:41.889 Robert Tseng: yeah, we’re telling… we’re telling the story of, like, what the impact is, like, why this is important and stuff. So, I think that’s really, like you said, it’s a communication block, really, and I’m hoping that we’ll be able to understand his objections and to be able to
42 00:04:42.200 ⇒ 00:04:49.600 Robert Tseng: share, like, to give him… give him the level of confidence that he needs to move to… to… yeah, to, like, trust… trust what we’ve built.
43 00:04:50.890 ⇒ 00:04:54.400 Zoran Selinger: My impression is really that he’s overwhelmed with…
44 00:04:54.550 ⇒ 00:05:05.280 Zoran Selinger: You know, especially if he talks to Stuart a lot. Yeah. Yeah, so he’s overwhelmed with all the different tools that we have.
45 00:05:05.690 ⇒ 00:05:06.320 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
46 00:05:06.630 ⇒ 00:05:12.800 Zoran Selinger: So there is maybe a case where we make it You know, very simple.
47 00:05:12.960 ⇒ 00:05:20.660 Zoran Selinger: Make a case for just focusing on really specific reports in Tableau, for example.
48 00:05:22.100 ⇒ 00:05:29.229 Zoran Selinger: as long as we can convince him that the data in there is correct, I think he would be happy.
49 00:05:29.780 ⇒ 00:05:30.270 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
50 00:05:30.270 ⇒ 00:05:34.740 Zoran Selinger: If he doesn’t have to look at any, any other stuff, And just…
51 00:05:35.490 ⇒ 00:05:39.630 Zoran Selinger: going after one place. I think…
52 00:05:40.900 ⇒ 00:05:47.919 Zoran Selinger: showing the value of Edge, and why it’s… basically, it’s more correct than anything
53 00:05:48.870 ⇒ 00:05:57.500 Zoran Selinger: Anything else, that’s basically out there, is a really, really good, valuable point.
54 00:05:58.650 ⇒ 00:06:04.399 Zoran Selinger: So that’s… that… that is very important. 17% is not a small, small discrepancy.
55 00:06:04.940 ⇒ 00:06:05.560 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
56 00:06:06.500 ⇒ 00:06:14.340 Zoran Selinger: On top of that, just a side note, so these 17% more
57 00:06:14.520 ⇒ 00:06:17.239 Zoran Selinger: visibility on transactions from Edge.
58 00:06:17.790 ⇒ 00:06:25.650 Zoran Selinger: That means, for example, we have, I don’t know, 400, reported, transactions.
59 00:06:25.950 ⇒ 00:06:32.409 Zoran Selinger: And for that 400 reported transactions, we created 400 rows in our tables.
60 00:06:32.590 ⇒ 00:06:34.789 Zoran Selinger: And we have all the information we need.
61 00:06:35.040 ⇒ 00:06:43.639 Zoran Selinger: they receive almost 2,000 events, basically duplicated events, in the segment tables on BigQuery.
62 00:06:43.640 ⇒ 00:06:44.540 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
63 00:06:44.540 ⇒ 00:07:01.659 Zoran Selinger: for the same… for the fewer transactions. So we… basically, there’s also efficiencies in… in… in the warehouse, and significant efficiencies in the warehouse and everything else. So there’s those small things, I guess, as well, that I noticed.
64 00:07:01.660 ⇒ 00:07:20.259 Robert Tseng: I think it’s probably because the change is so drastic, it’s hard for him to know, like, what’s the truth. Like, the swing is too large. I think people can stomach, like, a 5% change better than they can, like, a 30-40% change, right? Like, if you see, like, a variance that large, you question.
65 00:07:20.340 ⇒ 00:07:21.740 Robert Tseng: Both, like, their original.
66 00:07:21.740 ⇒ 00:07:23.019 Zoran Selinger: Yeah, everything. And the real number.
67 00:07:23.020 ⇒ 00:07:31.460 Robert Tseng: Yeah, you just question everything. You’re like, how is this possible, right? So I think that’s probably kind of his state of mind. Like, he just doesn’t know… doesn’t know what to trust, so…
68 00:07:31.460 ⇒ 00:07:34.969 Zoran Selinger: You think a 17% sounds…
69 00:07:35.450 ⇒ 00:07:44.759 Zoran Selinger: is in that… I mean, some days, you see from the comet, some days it was… Some days it’s higher. Yeah, some days it’s higher, yeah. 24%, yeah.
70 00:07:45.070 ⇒ 00:07:48.240 Zoran Selinger: So, I don’t know,
71 00:07:50.260 ⇒ 00:07:57.649 Zoran Selinger: So I was… I was confused initially. I’m looking at the… and the number of… of… of transactions, and I see, what?
72 00:07:57.760 ⇒ 00:08:05.510 Zoran Selinger: Like, we have 250, and they have… and they sent 1,000, 1,100 events.
73 00:08:05.750 ⇒ 00:08:18.169 Zoran Selinger: from segment into the warehouse. Like, what is this? And then I noticed that there’s, like, so many duplicates that I started counting these things and saw exactly what I expected.
74 00:08:18.420 ⇒ 00:08:34.760 Zoran Selinger: I expected, you know, between 10% and 15% discrepancy, but the, like, the average is 17 for those days. So, yeah. Okay, I have here… let’s see… I have a person with 8 sessions.
75 00:08:36.770 ⇒ 00:08:52.069 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so you’ve talked to him, you’re right, there’s, like, two pieces to that. There’s, like, kind of the edge there, kind of tracking, where there’s this 17% improvement. Then there’s also kind of, like, the duplicate transactions and how we’ve been
76 00:08:52.210 ⇒ 00:08:54.650 Robert Tseng: Not transactions, just like…
77 00:08:55.160 ⇒ 00:09:03.559 Robert Tseng: there’s also a reconciliation of, like, some duplicate things from segment. So, not only are we tracking more, but we’re also reducing duplicates.
78 00:09:04.220 ⇒ 00:09:11.929 Robert Tseng: like, two different ways that we’re, like, kind of attacked by how this solves, that maybe he doesn’t understand that dynamic. And then,
79 00:09:12.490 ⇒ 00:09:14.109 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I think with…
80 00:09:14.310 ⇒ 00:09:23.569 Robert Tseng: maybe he also, like, doesn’t see, like, the… how… how this connects to attribution. I don’t know if it’s… is there, like, if there’s… if this is best illustrated, like, we have…
81 00:09:23.690 ⇒ 00:09:34.030 Robert Tseng: in a… in some sort of visual, or… I mean, maybe these numbers are enough, like, I’m gonna take these messages, and I’m gonna basically cut them down, and I’ll send it to them over Slack.
82 00:09:34.210 ⇒ 00:09:48.089 Robert Tseng: So that might help a bit, but but yeah, like, I’m just trying to think… we’re gonna be on that call tomorrow. I’m gonna give him a teaser, like, I’m already gonna tell him, basically, I’m gonna send these messages you put in, in linear, but I’m gonna, obviously.
83 00:09:48.490 ⇒ 00:10:01.150 Robert Tseng: change it down a bit more. And I just want him to come ready to ask questions about anything about how this… how this works, and hopefully we will be able to just, like, kind of ex… explain… explain to him.
84 00:10:01.150 ⇒ 00:10:19.719 Robert Tseng: And I think, ultimately, his decision that he wants to come to is like, okay, even after there’s a 17% improvement, how does that actually change, like, the decisions that he has to make? So, he… like, how does that impact the performance of his team? So I think that’s kind of what he’s… what he’s thinking about, too. For sure. With a 70% increase, like.
85 00:10:19.720 ⇒ 00:10:28.459 Robert Tseng: Does that mean that he can, like, go and target 17% more people, or, like, kind of, like, what’s the impact of that? I think that’s probably one question he’ll ask.
86 00:10:28.460 ⇒ 00:10:44.149 Robert Tseng: And then, you know, does it expose any gaps around his current, kind of, like, paid ad strategy? Like, can we see any performance things that would be reconciled? So I think those are… those are the things we need to be able to speak to as well.
87 00:10:44.520 ⇒ 00:10:49.119 Robert Tseng: Like, I… I don’t know, do you… do you feel like you’d be able to kind of help speak to that?
88 00:10:50.470 ⇒ 00:10:56.370 Zoran Selinger: I mean, we should tie it to… we should tie this 17% with a revenue number.
89 00:10:56.620 ⇒ 00:10:57.060 Robert Tseng: Yes.
90 00:10:57.060 ⇒ 00:11:07.990 Zoran Selinger: I think it’s a very clear point that 70% of the revenue from the normal tools that are out there would be invisible, unattributable.
91 00:11:08.140 ⇒ 00:11:09.520 Zoran Selinger: to his reports.
92 00:11:09.970 ⇒ 00:11:10.580 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
93 00:11:11.000 ⇒ 00:11:13.750 Zoran Selinger: Basically, that’s… that’s what it is.
94 00:11:13.920 ⇒ 00:11:14.530 Robert Tseng: Okay.
95 00:11:14.530 ⇒ 00:11:19.089 Zoran Selinger: 70% of your revenue is invisible to you. Yeah.
96 00:11:19.200 ⇒ 00:11:22.619 Zoran Selinger: Obviously, this is a significant chunk.
97 00:11:22.840 ⇒ 00:11:27.170 Zoran Selinger: And this is a significant chunk, so…
98 00:11:29.180 ⇒ 00:11:37.180 Zoran Selinger: that’s where, where, you know, the big, big deal, comes from.
99 00:11:37.690 ⇒ 00:11:57.369 Zoran Selinger: And obviously, then it’s up to you to make, you know, if you have correct data, who knows what kind of good decisions you can make from them. And obviously, we are going to help them make those. Now, that we have this data, we are going to do a little bit more retribution. I’m just trying…
100 00:11:57.370 ⇒ 00:12:10.070 Robert Tseng: Maybe let him know, like, what are the additional analyses we should be able to do with more confidence now, that, like, we’d be able to help inform his decision. Like, I don’t think he necessarily knows what… what we would… how we can better partner with him, too, so…
101 00:12:10.240 ⇒ 00:12:13.020 Robert Tseng: I think that would be helpful to share with him.
102 00:12:15.770 ⇒ 00:12:16.920 Zoran Selinger: Yeah.
103 00:12:17.890 ⇒ 00:12:24.050 Robert Tseng: Yeah, like, I think, like, yes, we’ve done this setup, like, this tracking has improved by, you know, 7%,
104 00:12:24.070 ⇒ 00:12:39.219 Robert Tseng: But it’s like, okay, like, what’s the… what’s the next… what’s the next step after that? Yes, we can keep adding… I mean, I guess you’re kind of working on other projects, like, on the attribution side. You’re adding in all these channels so that we can better assign attribution to
105 00:12:39.220 ⇒ 00:12:44.230 Robert Tseng: our offline or programmatic channels as well. But then also, like.
106 00:12:44.460 ⇒ 00:13:00.930 Robert Tseng: what kind of analysis does it unlock for us, like, that we’d be able to help him with kind of how he runs his team? Like, you may not know the answer to this now, but, like, I think those are the types of questions that we want to be able to ask him, like, really get… you know, I think that would make, like, this…
107 00:13:00.930 ⇒ 00:13:06.559 Robert Tseng: whole workstream, like, the… how we talk about it more… more valuable as well.
108 00:13:08.160 ⇒ 00:13:12.439 Zoran Selinger: What’s really interesting here is, like.
109 00:13:13.390 ⇒ 00:13:32.720 Zoran Selinger: we are already… we already started feeding existing systems with the attribution from this, like Catalis, and very soon Meta, TikTok, so we are feeding systems from it, but we… now that we are also using identifiers from other systems, it also helps
110 00:13:32.750 ⇒ 00:13:44.450 Zoran Selinger: that system do identity teaching a little bit better, so it’s really nice that it can… we can benefit from others, but it can also feed others. But it can also be a standalone.
111 00:13:44.680 ⇒ 00:13:45.400 Zoran Selinger: solution.
112 00:13:45.400 ⇒ 00:13:46.010 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
113 00:13:46.010 ⇒ 00:13:52.399 Zoran Selinger: Because we do have our own identifiers. So that’s… that’s really cool. So, it…
114 00:13:52.620 ⇒ 00:14:01.910 Zoran Selinger: So, in theory, you can make savings by maybe eliminating some of the third-party solutions that are out there, if you have this.
115 00:14:02.130 ⇒ 00:14:14.349 Zoran Selinger: But it can feed into our existing stack, no problem, and it will both improve custom analysis, but it can also improve those existing systems as well.
116 00:14:14.570 ⇒ 00:14:23.829 Zoran Selinger: increase the accuracy of them and all that. So that’s what’s also really cool about this system.
117 00:14:25.110 ⇒ 00:14:30.830 Zoran Selinger: He told me, so this is not necessarily all about the edge, as well.
118 00:14:30.830 ⇒ 00:14:31.530 Robert Tseng: Yep.
119 00:14:31.530 ⇒ 00:14:39.140 Zoran Selinger: He said he… he… he’s very confused and doesn’t really see
120 00:14:39.490 ⇒ 00:14:47.040 Zoran Selinger: The… it’s not clear to him that… what the result of, like, last two years of… of work on this is.
121 00:14:47.770 ⇒ 00:14:53.230 Zoran Selinger: He feels like this, what you started fixing from the beginning.
122 00:14:53.640 ⇒ 00:14:56.740 Zoran Selinger: Was… hasn’t… haven’t been… hasn’t been fixed.
123 00:14:57.260 ⇒ 00:14:58.370 Zoran Selinger: at all.
124 00:14:59.240 ⇒ 00:15:07.680 Zoran Selinger: That’s how he feels. He told me, like, before you joined, we’ve been working on these for a couple of years, and I feel like we’re nowhere.
125 00:15:09.450 ⇒ 00:15:16.040 Zoran Selinger: And I told them this is very likely, just, an issue of, of,
126 00:15:16.300 ⇒ 00:15:26.609 Zoran Selinger: of communication, and not that… not a feature or… or something that is missing in this work. So… so now we just have to show exactly that.
127 00:15:27.770 ⇒ 00:15:30.670 Zoran Selinger: Hmm. Yeah, that… yeah.
128 00:15:32.080 ⇒ 00:15:41.779 Zoran Selinger: So I feel like, okay, if you started working on this two years ago, he felt like he’s confused and doesn’t trust the data, this is still the case.
129 00:15:41.780 ⇒ 00:15:49.389 Robert Tseng: Probably 10 months ago, but sure, I mean, he’s been around for, like, 6 months. Okay. So, he feels the same way now, I think.
130 00:15:49.840 ⇒ 00:15:55.260 Zoran Selinger: Still. So, yeah. So that’s the… that’s the… the bridge we… we have to cross.
131 00:15:59.830 ⇒ 00:16:03.399 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I… yeah. Well, that’s…
132 00:16:05.850 ⇒ 00:16:11.940 Zoran Selinger: Another point is… If it goes to another vendor.
133 00:16:12.370 ⇒ 00:16:14.759 Robert Tseng: He’s not gonna get something different.
134 00:16:16.770 ⇒ 00:16:18.799 Zoran Selinger: So this edge thing.
135 00:16:18.800 ⇒ 00:16:27.370 Robert Tseng: What they’re gonna do is they’re gonna say, oh, you should let us go and fix your thing, and they’re gonna… they’re gonna change something about it, and it’s not gonna do anything better, yeah.
136 00:16:27.820 ⇒ 00:16:33.179 Zoran Selinger: It’s not gonna do anything. They might misunderstood… misunderstand
137 00:16:33.600 ⇒ 00:16:38.470 Zoran Selinger: The edge layer, and maybe not use it.
138 00:16:38.810 ⇒ 00:16:49.380 Zoran Selinger: Yeah. And just, okay, we… instead of this tool, we prefer this other tool, and they’re going to install it, and they’re not going to get anything different. Really.
139 00:16:49.380 ⇒ 00:16:49.940 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
140 00:16:50.190 ⇒ 00:16:51.670 Zoran Selinger: the…
141 00:16:52.510 ⇒ 00:17:02.160 Zoran Selinger: Now, the edge and other analysis that we’ve done, that’s the differentiating factor, and they… they’re not gonna get it, especially, I mean.
142 00:17:02.340 ⇒ 00:17:07.260 Zoran Selinger: I saw the platform that they were… so these are, like, that’s Freelancer’s platform.
143 00:17:07.430 ⇒ 00:17:15.709 Zoran Selinger: And it’s mostly at professionals. They’re not gonna be… I don’t see, I don’t see people that are going to properly model
144 00:17:15.880 ⇒ 00:17:20.829 Zoran Selinger: The data under… that are going to understand
145 00:17:21.300 ⇒ 00:17:35.060 Zoran Selinger: you know, proper modeling and the whole process. I can’t really comment on that, because I’m not there either, exactly. You can speak about that much more intelligently than I can, but,
146 00:17:35.820 ⇒ 00:17:42.200 Zoran Selinger: I think that’s… They’re not gonna get what they think they are.
147 00:17:43.180 ⇒ 00:17:43.880 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
148 00:17:46.170 ⇒ 00:17:50.000 Zoran Selinger: It seems like it’s campaign managers that are there.
149 00:17:50.550 ⇒ 00:17:56.449 Zoran Selinger: Yeah. On that platform. So I… yeah, I don’t think that’s gonna be… data… People are…
150 00:17:56.710 ⇒ 00:17:58.990 Zoran Selinger: sufficiently data savvy.
151 00:17:59.730 ⇒ 00:18:01.300 Zoran Selinger: To do something with it.
152 00:18:05.400 ⇒ 00:18:07.270 Zoran Selinger: They’re just gonna lose time.
153 00:18:14.050 ⇒ 00:18:17.839 Robert Tseng: Okay. I… yeah, I’m still not, like, sure, like…
154 00:18:18.770 ⇒ 00:18:33.899 Robert Tseng: But yeah, I think setup is only… is one part of it, but, like, the continued analysis that we’d be able to give him support, I don’t… I don’t think we’re… I don’t think we’re very clear on what we can do to help him adopt this, or, like, what decisions he can make off of this as well. I understand
155 00:18:34.460 ⇒ 00:18:36.880 Robert Tseng: like… Yeah, with…
156 00:18:37.170 ⇒ 00:19:00.590 Robert Tseng: if the accuracy is higher, like, as a standalone solution, it’s… it’s better, but it also kind of feeds into these other platforms, and it makes… it makes the… it makes, like, their algorithms better, because they have better, like, understanding of the orders that… that… that we have, or the visitors that we’re… that we have, orders and visitors that we have. So, I understand that part.
157 00:19:00.850 ⇒ 00:19:07.680 Robert Tseng: But yeah, those are just efficiencies on those particular platforms. It doesn’t necessarily help him to, like.
158 00:19:08.740 ⇒ 00:19:23.859 Robert Tseng: make, like, from a CMO’s perspective, like, his dis… he’s… he’s trying to decide what channels to spend on, like, how to maximize, like, LTV over CAC, like, the… like, those are the core marketing metrics that he cares about, right? So…
159 00:19:23.930 ⇒ 00:19:41.969 Robert Tseng: Like, he wants to reduce payback period, he wants to increase LTV, he wants to know how to do pricing, like, I think these are, like, the adjacent things that we need to be able to, like, branch into in order to, like, kind of help… help him make better decisions. I just… I don’t really know how to connect this… I mean, yeah, I…
160 00:19:41.970 ⇒ 00:19:45.350 Robert Tseng: I think that’s… that’s kind of what we have to figure out.
161 00:19:45.530 ⇒ 00:20:01.689 Robert Tseng: like, I think maintenance of this solution is part of it, but if his overall performance doesn’t get better, of course he’s gonna blame the tooling. He’s not gonna own up to the strategy himself, and that’s just, like, that’s kind of like… that’s just what happens in marketing. I feel like I’ve seen it a hundred times, where
162 00:20:01.830 ⇒ 00:20:17.379 Robert Tseng: if the marketing leader is not doing well, he’s gonna blame that he doesn’t have the right tools, he didn’t have this, da-da-da-da. So, like, I… I kinda, like… and maybe this is just the curse of working with marketers, but, like, maybe there’s a way for us to, like.
163 00:20:17.610 ⇒ 00:20:20.660 Robert Tseng: kind of… continue to…
164 00:20:21.370 ⇒ 00:20:32.280 Robert Tseng: measure his performance, to… to give him ideas of, like, what decisions he can make. Like, that’s what I mean by analysis. I think, you know.
165 00:20:32.430 ⇒ 00:20:41.190 Robert Tseng: just to kind of pivot a little bit, and you’re taking on some of the scope to work with Judd on lifecycle marketing. We haven’t spent… we haven’t talked about this yet.
166 00:20:41.630 ⇒ 00:20:42.720 Zoran Selinger: No, no.
167 00:20:43.170 ⇒ 00:21:02.860 Robert Tseng: Yeah, but, like, this to me is an example where, yes, we have a golden customer data set. I want Judd to be able to run better, like, campaigns against, like, his… against what we have. So, that’s also kind of, like, you working with… with Judd, and, like, he doesn’t know what campaigns to run, so we kind of need to strategize around that, if that’s…
168 00:21:02.870 ⇒ 00:21:12.130 Robert Tseng: like, I, you know, I wanted Henry to hand that off to you, because, like, I just kind of want everything marketing, analytics, and tech to come…
169 00:21:12.180 ⇒ 00:21:16.430 Robert Tseng: Come to you. Have you spent much time thinking about that?
170 00:21:17.060 ⇒ 00:21:26.739 Zoran Selinger: haven’t had a chance, I wanted to, to talk to him, and then I lost a day yesterday, and… Okay. And now I’m dealing with this.
171 00:21:27.190 ⇒ 00:21:34.030 Zoran Selinger: On the point of that, on the analysis and using the edge, Obviously.
172 00:21:34.890 ⇒ 00:21:43.030 Zoran Selinger: That’s the ultimate goal. We… we… this is very fresh. We’re still basically setting it up
173 00:21:44.750 ⇒ 00:21:47.269 Zoran Selinger: And we have those OKRs that are…
174 00:21:47.730 ⇒ 00:21:52.350 Zoran Selinger: you know, most… mostly reverse CTL by till the end of…
175 00:21:53.150 ⇒ 00:21:55.920 Zoran Selinger: of this, this month, and then… Yeah.
176 00:21:56.440 ⇒ 00:21:58.790 Zoran Selinger: Obviously, the next step is that.
177 00:21:59.090 ⇒ 00:22:06.410 Zoran Selinger: Right? Yeah. Ryan just included, I don’t know, 10 or 15 different
178 00:22:07.180 ⇒ 00:22:14.380 Zoran Selinger: micro events through the… through the funnels. There’s gonna be a lot of opportunity for… for modeling.
179 00:22:14.560 ⇒ 00:22:18.420 Zoran Selinger: But there’s no plan, for it yet.
180 00:22:18.980 ⇒ 00:22:20.339 Zoran Selinger: It’s going to be.
181 00:22:20.920 ⇒ 00:22:21.290 Robert Tseng: Yes.
182 00:22:21.290 ⇒ 00:22:31.120 Zoran Selinger: like Q1 work is going to be finally using this data. We can’t really give him… give him really fancy analysis on, you know.
183 00:22:31.330 ⇒ 00:22:33.290 Zoran Selinger: 45 days of data.
184 00:22:34.690 ⇒ 00:22:41.840 Zoran Selinger: Or 2 months that we have those tables, right? So, we’re still limited by time, we have to collect it a little bit.
185 00:22:42.190 ⇒ 00:22:48.300 Zoran Selinger: We can still stitch it to all data, and do some, and we will.
186 00:22:48.300 ⇒ 00:23:03.829 Zoran Selinger: But we really, literally just started with this solution. And the more we look at it, the more we see the usefulness of it. So it’s hard to demonstrate, okay, we’re going to give you these insights and these insights.
187 00:23:04.010 ⇒ 00:23:11.510 Zoran Selinger: What we can do right now is, for the sample of time that we have, we see that
188 00:23:12.080 ⇒ 00:23:17.089 Zoran Selinger: We give you 17% more visibility on… on revenue.
189 00:23:18.170 ⇒ 00:23:19.539 Zoran Selinger: And where it comes from.
190 00:23:20.300 ⇒ 00:23:20.650 Robert Tseng: Yeah.
191 00:23:20.650 ⇒ 00:23:24.060 Zoran Selinger: Which is… That’s already significant.
192 00:23:24.490 ⇒ 00:23:28.610 Zoran Selinger: And then everything else ties into that.
193 00:23:32.320 ⇒ 00:23:41.410 Zoran Selinger: I feel like if we ab… I mean, if we abandon this, then we simply… we lost a huge opportunity before we started.
194 00:23:42.610 ⇒ 00:23:44.450 Zoran Selinger: Before we even started.
195 00:23:44.950 ⇒ 00:23:51.370 Robert Tseng: Yeah, I don’t think they’re gonna abandon it. I think he just needs some clarity. We’ll talk about it tomorrow, but okay. Alright, I think,
196 00:23:51.680 ⇒ 00:23:55.230 Robert Tseng: I’m clear on that. Yeah, I mean, I’d like…
197 00:23:56.120 ⇒ 00:24:01.610 Robert Tseng: I’d like you to spend some time, like, kind of figuring out how you’re gonna support Judd,
198 00:24:02.050 ⇒ 00:24:03.680 Robert Tseng: Because I want that to be part of your scope.
199 00:24:03.680 ⇒ 00:24:11.780 Zoran Selinger: I’ll send him a message right now, and insist on meeting this week.
200 00:24:11.780 ⇒ 00:24:14.989 Robert Tseng: Yeah, like, I don’t… I still don’t think she really knows, like…
201 00:24:14.990 ⇒ 00:24:25.750 Zoran Selinger: We have a specific issue, and we kind of… we were kind of talking about that, but I really want to meet and… meet him and kind of get a… get a high-level picture from him.
202 00:24:25.750 ⇒ 00:24:35.440 Robert Tseng: Yeah, like, I don’t… I still don’t think he really understands, like, what customer data we have, so I’d like you to kind of just walk him through the model, let him know our capabilities, and, like.
203 00:24:35.650 ⇒ 00:24:49.099 Robert Tseng: Yeah, just, you know, if you need ideas of, like, the types of audiences to build, like, I mean, we can… I can help you strategize around that. But yeah, I just… I just feel like he’s… he’s not… he’s underutilizing what we’ve… what we’ve built.
204 00:24:49.390 ⇒ 00:24:51.460 Zoran Selinger: Okay, okay, cool.
205 00:24:51.750 ⇒ 00:24:52.590 Zoran Selinger: Okay.
206 00:24:52.940 ⇒ 00:24:53.290 Robert Tseng: Okay.
207 00:24:53.290 ⇒ 00:24:55.950 Zoran Selinger: I’ll meet with him this week.
208 00:24:56.360 ⇒ 00:24:57.000 Robert Tseng: Thanks.
209 00:24:57.720 ⇒ 00:25:13.429 Zoran Selinger: Okay, I’ll try to add more data. We have a tracking meeting with Ryan in an hour and a half, so I’ll be here that whole time and try to add more context for you, for this. Great.
210 00:25:13.430 ⇒ 00:25:25.069 Robert Tseng: Yeah, so, outside of Eden, yeah, I mean, I know you have some stuff with the Ellie thing, seems like they’re not gonna, like, they’re not gonna re-engage until January, so that’s fine.
211 00:25:25.150 ⇒ 00:25:43.889 Robert Tseng: But yeah, on Insomnia, I’m gonna go one level up, gonna send the proposal to the CEO, and then Honey Stinger, wants tracking help, so I’m basically gonna repackage what we sent Insomnia, I’m gonna send it to them. So, there may be an opportunity in the next week to kind of get in front of them, and you can…
212 00:25:43.920 ⇒ 00:25:48.359 Robert Tseng: Right, yeah, we might be able to have you talk, talk to their, to their, to their team as well.
213 00:25:48.520 ⇒ 00:25:49.310 Zoran Selinger: Sure, sure.
214 00:25:49.720 ⇒ 00:25:50.180 Zoran Selinger: Okay.
215 00:25:50.180 ⇒ 00:25:50.520 Robert Tseng: Okay.
216 00:25:51.270 ⇒ 00:25:51.910 Robert Tseng: Alright.
217 00:25:52.350 ⇒ 00:25:54.600 Zoran Selinger: Thanks. Alright. Thanks, Ron. Bye-bye. Bye.